Craving Peaches

I think Ramsay embodies (some of) the fears which make Jon hesitant to take command. Fears such as being an overreaching, grasping bastard who is unfit to lead because of it, who is untrustworthy and will fail everyone and so on. So when Jon overcomes Ramsay, he will overcome these fears and grow into a true leader. It's not that Jon fears Ramsay, more that Ramsay is a reflection of Jon's hidden fears about himself and what he might be, which are holding him back. When he outgrows these fears he will not be so hesitant in accepting the responsibility of command. I think Ramsay's mother was probably the worst influence on him. I always got the sense that she was the one who hammered into him that he was a true Bolton, the Dreadfort was his etc. I think she was most likely involved in (and possibly the mastermind behind) the Domeric poisoning plot.

The relationship between the Dothraki and the Lhazareen. They are said to look quite similar to the Dothraki, but there are some differences. They have similar sounding gods, the Great Stallion and the Great Shepard, one is an animal while the other is a human. I wonder if they were originally part of the same group of people but one part decided to settle while the other continued with the nomadic lifestyle.

I just feel like it would be more compelling if Jon were to fight Ramsay rather than Stannis. To Stannis, Ramsay is just another opponent, just another obstacle on the path to the throne. Meanwhile, the conflict for Jon is personal, and I like the symbolism of Jon defeating Ramsay. I agree that Roose is more interesting overall, but I find the contrast between Jon and Ramsay very interesting which is why I think he should fight him rather than Stannis. If Jon when recovered chooses to go after Ramsay, I don't think he'd need to gather a new army as most of the people going to support him the first time round would still be there...unless something rather drastic happens while Jon is not there. But given how outnumbered the conspirators would be I'm not sure how likely this is. But you could be right. I always thought the main purpose of the attack was so that Jon would learn the hard way that people don't all share his view and also to trigger some sort of change in Jon's character. I think a scenario where Stannis wins but Ramsay escapes and then Jon has to fight him later could be a possible compromise.

To be more specific, according to Jung who came up with the concept, the Collective Unconscious contains instincts and the Archetypes, from my understanding it is inherited recognition of sorts of specific things like the Mother, the Father, the Trickster etc. So Jon meeting Arya could be important to him recognising Azor Ahai, Nissa Nissa and what role he has to play. I am probably not doing a very good job of explaining the Collective Unconscious, so you might want to look it up to get a better idea.

In the vein of the symbolism I would say that Ramsay made Theon repress his own identity, stripped him of his Self, in order to turn him into Reek. Theon's self becomes the repressed part due to Ramsay's actions, which would mean Theon is Reek's shadow. If I were to speculate further, and this is nothing certain, I would think that Ramsay was attempting to enforce the 'Reek' Archetype onto Theon and supplant his Self in order to recreate his lost first Reek. Reek is almost a complete inversion of Theon, meek and timid where he was confident, deferential where Theon was not, having white hair while Theon had dark hair. This is very speculation based but if Jon goes down the dark path it could be that he attempts a similar process but with trying to enforce Arya onto someone else instead, though this is really unlikely. I will think about this more because it is a very good question but for now I would say that, from my understanding, the Collective Unconscious may contain something like ancestral memories. Going by the symbolism again, Jon and Arya's meeting could be followed by (but not necessarily be the cause of) Jon learning his true heritage if he hasn't already at that point.

I don't think that necessarily means that Jon can't kill Ramsay. Just because it hasn't happened before doesn't mean it won't happen. I think it would make more sense than anyone else killing him because there is nice symbolism and the conflict has been brewing for a while. If it's about subverting tropes, the trope has already been subverted. And I don't think the tropes are subverted just for the sake of it, though I could be wrong. I don't see why Jon can't fight Ramsay. It could even cause him to turn to villainy, in which case you would have another instance of a villain killing a villain again.

Well obviously it's all contingent on Ramsay and Jon fighting, I was just speculating on what I feel could be the result from a psychological point. I am inclined to think that Jon and Ramsay will fight because I don't think Stannis will last much longer and I feel it would be more satisfying for Jon to beat Ramsay. He has a more personal stake in that.

A few weeks ago, I read some very interesting and well thought out observations by user @chrisdaw on Jon's symbolic relationship with Ramsay, and these made me think that Ramsay could be considered Jon's Shadow. For those who are not aware, the Shadow in psychology is the repressed side of the Self, all of the ugly parts of yourself you reject and don't (want to) acknowledge. As chrisdaw pointed out, Ramsay seemingly embodies everything Jon strives not to be, being a treacherous, murdering, thieving bastard who has actually usurped the rights of his trueborn sibling if Roose's story about Domeric is anything to go by, conforming to all the negative traits ascribed to bastards, etc. But on the inside Jon shows some similarities to Ramsay. Jon does desire Winterfell, his thoughts speak of how much he wants it. But though he doesn't acknowledge this in his waking moments, on a perhaps unconscious/subconscious level he wants Winterfell as Ramsay seeks the Dreadfort, as indicated by the dream where he kills Robb. Deep down he would like to do exactly as Ramsay does, kill Robb so he can get Winterfell, as Ramsay has killed Domeric to get the Dreadfort. And in his dream, he does not fight with his usual style, but is hacking and slashing wildly and brutally...Just like the way Ramsay fights. Also of note is that during the dream Jon is armoured in 'black ice', a hint that he is acting as his Shadow wishes. The way in which Jon and Ramsay react to their bastardry is also important. Ramsay denies being a bastard, killing a man who calls him 'Lord Snow' and styling himself as the trueborn heir to the Dreadfort. Ramsay reacts externally and violently to suggestions of his bastardry. In comparison, Jon on the outside seems more unaffected by being called and treated as a bastard, but on the inside, it is something that affects him, he may feel insecure about it. What will this relationship mean for Ramsay and Jon's likely confrontation? Going by some of the psychology things, Jon will have to acknowledge these repressed immoral desires in some way, so that he can integrate his Shadow in order to not be so controlled by it any longer. So, I would suspect that his physical fight with Ramsay would be accompanied by or lead to some sort of realisation, whereupon Jon will no longer feel insecure about his bastard status. Chrisdaw suggests that Jon would realise that he was nothing like Ramsay when he confronts him, so he wouldn't fear taking command anymore and would become a better leader. To quote chrisdaw: Another possibility is that Jon's insecurities over being a bastard disappear when he discovers he is no longer a bastard, if it is revealed to him that R+L=J and they were married. Similarly I think this would ease his hesitance to take charge, although it could also result in him having a new Shadow that he needs to overcome. However, depending on the timings Jon may fight Ramsay before the reveal, in which case I would think it would be close after that he learns of his true parentage. If defeating Ramsay means that Jon successfully integrates his shadow, then after the fight Jon should see significant growth as a person and perhaps as a character as well. Following the Integration theme I think Jon's next meaningful encounter could possibly be with Arya. After the shadow, the next step is the Collective Unconscious, which I think Arya fits quite well. She is of many faces, like the Archetypes that are in the Collective Unconscious. The Collective Unconscious can also be represented by the Anima/Animus, the female aspect of the male personality/vice versa, as appearance wise Arya is notably similar to Jon. There is, of course, the possibility that Jon's integration of the Shadow fails. Instead of him integrating the Shadow, the Shadow could integrate him. If so Jon could take a turn for the worse...

I agree. Unless it is confirmed Jon's conception was needed to save the world or something Rhaegar's plan will go down as one of the stupidest in my opinion. Aside from his awful military strategy when dealing with the rebels, what was he expecting when he ran off with the already-betrothed daughter of a great house? Rhaegar's Plan in his mind: 1. Lyanna Stark is needed for my prophecy baby. To seduce her, I will pass over my wife and crown her as Queen of Love and Beauty, no one will care about this even though she's already betrothed. 2. I'll run off with Lyanna, leaving behind my wife and kids, still with no thought to what her relatives would do. (Oh no a massive war has started In part due to my actions!) 3. I will conceive child with Lyanna. (Now I'll deal with those pesky rebels, except I'll make sure to completely squander my advantageous battlefield position and then die in combat with Lyanna's scorned fiancé.) 4. Lyanna gives birth to prophecy baby. Profit...except I'm dead now. So is most of my family. Oh well!

Maybe, but I'm not sure if just the presence of the lemon tree is enough to go on. Anyone wealthy who liked lemons could've had one imported. Dorne seems to be the primary supplier of lemons to Westeros, but I would think lemons could be grown elsewhere as well. What I don't understand is that if they were being helped by the Dornish then, why did the aid stop? The operation seems quite discreet, surely Doran could have sent them money even if he couldn't have his associates physically care for them anymore.

Couldn't it just have been any wealthy citizen of Braavos who imported a lemon tree?

I don't mind it that much but it feels a bit...unnecessary? I thought Cersei's pride, vanity, greed, jealousy, cruelty and pettiness were serving fine as motivators for her character and decisions without the paranoia-inducing prophecy reveal.

That is true but it doesn't mean he necessarily has to help the Targaryens, just that he shouldn't take action against them to get revenge on what Aerys did.

But couldn't he have his revenge on the Lannisters without the Targaryens on the throne? That would make things easier but I don't think it's the only option.

I still don't understand why he wants to help the family that held his sister and uncle hostage, and the family who slaughtered thousands of his countrymen, to regain their throne.

I have no doubt that Euron is exploiting them all. Euron seems quite intelligent compared to the rest of the Ironborn. However he makes up for his lack of stupidity by being crazy. He himself may turn out to have delusions of grandeur.

So I was doing a quick search and one of the candidates suggested for the oily black stone is uraninite, which apart from being radioactive also contains lead, so I conclude that the Ironborn, or at least whoever sits on the Seastone Chair, is being poisoned.

I'd find it so funny if he was telling the truth and no one believes him. They all attack and die due to their dumb plans and stupidity, meanwhile my man Gylbert Farwynd is living the high life on Bermudos or whatever he calls the new land.

And Theon was away from the Islands the longest... Victarion is so stupid I find him entertaining. The others are just stupid.

I feel like Robb's deal with the Freys in the first place was a bad deal and very one sided. They get a royal marriage and betrothal in exchange for doing what they were legally and morally obliged to do by default, coming to the defence of their liege lord Hoster and not impeding his allies. And Robb has to take the deal because somehow the Twins are the only bridge there?

I rank her ever so slightly higher because she realises the Old Way is stupid.

Apart from being drowned like the others Euron is also consuming a lot of Shade of the Evening, which can't be good for his mental stability.

The stupid thing with the Ironborn is, that unlike the Dothraki who have their barbarous ways rewarded because everyone chooses to pay them off rather than fight them, the last several successive attempts of the Ironborn to restore the Old Way have all ended badly and yet they still keep trying to make it work. It's so stupid. Only Asha and around 2 other people seem to realise this.

Each time they drown themselves and then get resuscitated the brain damage gets worse.

Do you think they're so stupid they can't see their own hypocrisy? Or do they just not care?