Imp Beyond the Wall

On second thought I may have been wrong to criticize Jaime and Brienne. Jaime for turning his cloak then turning it back, and Brienne fro "whitewashing" Jaime's write up in the white book. I think I was too hasty. IIRC Jaime never claimed to have abandoned Cersei or to have sworn himself to Jon or Dany. He said he would honor the Lannister pledge to make common cause against the Army of the Dead. Pledge fulfilled. While I feel that Brienne writing "returned to save the capital from destruction" is way to generous, it is not strictly a lie. And what went on between Jaime and Brienne personally is nothing she is obligated to put in the white book. Honor intact. I was mad about a lot of things and Jaime and Brienne caught some collateral trash talk. I hold out hope that whatever goes down with LSH does not dishinor either of them. Book Brienne has had nothing but bad breaks and Book Jaime has more potential for redemption that Show Jaime ever did. .

Except for the fact that Arya ultimately lived, I hated everything after the death of the Night King. Tyrion Turncloak and Aegon Queenslayer faced no consequences. Lannister soldiers were having their throats cut in the street, but the regicide and his co-conspirator are held in custody until the Nuremberg Trial in the dragon pit? Yeah, that makes total sense. In the end even Drogon was disloyal. He should have pushed the Kinslayer of Winterfell onto the Iron Throne and melted him right along with the chair. That was supposed to be his mother. Aegon should have been toast. Is it supposed to be enough that he took the body away to eat it in private? The 3 Eyed King suddenly got a shitload of personality after being unanimously acclaimed ruler by a bunch of strangers. Unless those guys have been watching the show since the beginning, several of them shouldn’t really know Bran from a face on a weirwood tree. But sure, this random child can be king in the immediate aftermath of the costliest war in the history of the realm. He is a Stark after all. Bran's transformation back to a regular dude was ridiculous. The Oathbreaker Queen Blabber-Mouth in the North, finally got the crown she has wanted since episode one (well,not the exact crown, she ratted out Ned to be Joff’s Queen, not Queen of the North). But anyway, Gingers can go back on their word without repercussions, it is known. Kellyanne Conway of Tarth betrayed her famous honor by whitewashing “The Kingslayer” in the white book. Jaime taught Brienne to lie, so it wasn’t all for nothing. The jocular little meeting of the small council was sickening, all’s well that ends well I guess…“Wasn’t it all so funny Bronn?” I liked Bronn before they turned him into an ass. In the end Sam doesn’t even write the stinking book. Maester Whoeverthefuck writes it, and Sam just helps with the title. So who fills in the truth about R+L=J, and the origins of the Night King and fake Baratheon-Lannister Twincest spawn, and every other secret known only to a small group of insiders? How does this other dude illuminate all that, or is this “Song of Ice and Fire” book just another BS “official history” book at the Citadel that doesn’t cover all that really happened? Speaking of the Tarlys, does anyone think for a second that if Randal Tarly had taken Daenarys prisoner and she responded to a demand to renounce her claim with, “Never!”, that he would have hesitated to take her head off? Show Tarly was a nasty piece of work and book Tarly is far worse. Book Tarly might have executed her for having the audacity to raise her voice to him. Sam was well rid of him. There are probably other quibbles but these are the ones that stick out after one viewing.

The slavers that she liberated the unsullied from, kidnapped, gelded and terrorized children, mentally and physically for years and probably deserved worse than what they got. The people that Dany crucified were also child murderers. This show treated Daenarys's fall with less sympathy empathy than it did Stannis and Melisandre's murder of Shireen. They made sure to give Daenarys no possible justification or ambiguity, just blood lust, and megalomania and madness. Then try to justify it by saying, "Look she was always like this." BS. Dany could be ruthless but she was never evil. No more than Arya. Her arc was very similar to Arya. "Evil people deserve what they get and I cannot be bothered about the letter of the law. I have toe power to do something and I am going to do it." Good people can do horrible things when faced with hard choices. Dresden or the A-Bomb. Let Daeny go buck wild total war, but don't make her do it after Hitler is dead and after the Japanse have surrendered to MacArthur. I am sorry, that turned it into crap. I could accept that Aegon the Queenslayer/Kinslayer felt he had to stop what the Khaleesi might do next, but turning her into Darth Dany was BS. Re-writing history to make the Breaker-Of-Chains arc evil, and foreshadowing madness, is sick.

Let's see what the impact this reveal has on future book series and the spin-offs to come. He may wish he ha kept it secret and sold his books first.

Is Martin not a writer? I do not absolve him of guilt for this travesty. It makes since that Sherman burned Atlanta arguably to shorten the war and break the resolve of the rebels. But if Lincoln had sanctioned it after Appomattox, what would it have been then? Or if Truman had dropped the bomb after MacArthur received the Japanese surrender? I know war is hell. I have no illusions about good guys and bad guys, But there isn't much grey area here. A conqueror is going to conquer, but this was a wanton act of cruelty by a crazy person. So, if you like this, bully for you. I know a lot of Daeny haters are gleefully and gloating right now. If this is where Martin has been heading this whole time, he should have kept this ending a secret. I have been dying to give him my money so I could read the rest. Now, I am not sure if I care whether he ever finishes. The Khaleesi could be a hard ruler, it is a hard world. But she tried to be just. I am not arguing that every decision was right, but you could see what was going on. She has never been crazy. I really thought that Martin was another Tolkien, but perhaps he is just another M. Night Shyamalan. You have a right to see it how you see it.

I am still so angry I can barely talk about this. I think they wanted to go out with another "Red Wedding" level shock and they ruined the show to get it. The biggest betrayal of Daeny was by the writers. They totally distorted the Khaleesi to get this result.

True. I never really criticize the writers too much because I think that that is where "busted-fan-theories go to die, but the battles this season have been about as logically consistent as your average game of "green army men." I won't say "realistic" because the blood, gore and charred flesh has been top notch.

How many times did they "fake" kill Arya in the episode? And to paraphrase Fletcher from the Outlaw Josey Wales, "I don't want to hear Cersei dead, I want to see Cersei dead." The demise of Cersei and Jaime was awful. Are they going to be digging themselves out of rubble next week?

I still think that Cersei has significant amounts of Wildfire. The question is where. The Red Keep seems suicidal, but she is mad. She may burn the citizens of KL rather than be taken. Daeny's victories in Essos involved infiltration and guile, they may go to that well again. There has been lots of set-up about Tyrion and Varys and the secrets of the keep. It may not come to a frontal attack. Cersei's advantage seem too overwhelming for that.

The Iron Bank also has the wherewithal to provide the requisite deus ex machinations.

It is not inconceivable that someone has reached out to Daario or that news has reached to the Second Sons. I am hoping that Dorne shows up and that someone rallies the Riverlands. We used to get hints the Howland Reed and the Crannogmen would eventually show up but that hasn't happened. I honestly don't see how a frontal assault on KL could possibly succeed without many more troops.

I had a thought, Perhaps this has been brought up before. If SHOW Beric Donderion's purpose was the save Arya so she could kill the Night King, is it possible that BOOK Donderion saves unCat Stoneheart so that she can either kill or help kill the Night King? If anyone could approach unnoticed among the wights and WWs Stoneheart could. It would be fitting if she were the one to save Bran.

Sandor: I would never have raped you. Sansa: I believe you. (places her hand on his) The rest was fluff. We don't disagree about the meaning, but I think the writing was weak and undermined the moment, that's all. The hound is not eloquent but he has a soul (again). I am not a D&D basher, far from it, but, I do think this is one scene where they could have done better. She can still tell the joke about feeding Ramsey to the hounds. She can still tell Sandor that her journey made her strong, but the words"broken in rough" never needed to be said. IMO..

I thought that sounded really off as well. The crux of his comments were. "I hope you know that when I invited you to leave Kings Landing with me, whatever else happened, rape was off the table!" But I think that was lost in an attempt to show, "Hey look the hound is still rough and gruff, see, look at how clumsy his reunion with Sansa is!" I think they under served both characters in that exchange.

I think it was happenstance. Grey Worm sent her ashore for her safety but it did not work out. I love that Missandei, the gentlest soul in Westeros was as brave and as fierce as he Little Bear in her last moments. I hope that somehow when her evil giant falls that there is some echo of her "Dracarys." I will not shed a tear if the Red Keep is burned to a cinder. Those supporting Cersei are as weak and corrupt a the wise masters of Meereen. The brother fucker who they gleefully and somewhat sadistically marched through the streets, reveling in her humiliation, and one mass murder later they turned around and put her on the Iron Throne. Daenys should offer them on last chance to walk away from Cersei. I don't know that she has the power to destroy them en masse but she doesn't OWE them any more mercy than that.

I am mocking Cersei's twisted mothering, not trying to make a literal point.

Yes, Jon Arryn's discovery on Cersei's to-mah-tos set the new wars in motion. Ned had successfully buried the truth of Robert's rebellion and the realm was at relative peace.

Tomato, To_mah-to.

I absolutely do not. I think that look between Euron and Qyburn was Qyburn confirming Cersei's lie. Or Qyburn confirming to Euron that he has lied to Cersei. Either way a think Cersei is already Mad with guilt overr her dead niece and nephews, and I think that a phantom baby is part of her psychosis. IMO.

The minute Jon said he was not riding Rhaegal I should have known the dragon was doomed. I see no sense in Jon separating from Ghost. They act as if there is no bond whatsoever between Jon and ghost. I know they are playing down the warg bond on the show, but still, Jon seems quite indifferent and that is rings like a false note to me. Daeny gets a raw deal. Over and over she is expected to absorb blow after blow with equanimity and generosity and immediate perfect understanding. She has put everything on the line for this war and still her northern allies, distrust her, dislike her and clearly only half-heartedly support her claim if at all. Now that the north is safe they are ready to disband. No credit and no loyalty. I don't mean credit for winning or losing the battle, i mean earned loyalty. The north seems quite happy to use up her armies, "Wham bam, get the fuck out of the North!" Which by the way is still a hereditary monarchy even if Daeny dissolves the seven kingdoms. It will not a constitutional republic with equal rights for the small folk. Even Smaller Finger (aka Sansa) is actively undermining her. Jon who probably does lover her has also been using her from day one. They both know it. She is absolutely isolated and I don't see where she alienated anyone so much as, with the exception of the people she brought from Essos, they are just more concerned with their own issues. In the game of thrones rival claims equal intrigue. Varys and Tyrion began scheming the very moment they found out. Daeny was right, Jon should have kept his mouth shut. Ned did not even tell Cat. That should tell you something. Once sitting on the Iron Throne things might be different, but in the middle of the war? IMO so far Daeny has tried to be wise and tried to be good. If she seems paranoid, well people have never NOT been trying to kill her. Her entire life has been lived in real jeopardy. Any misstep going back to her childhood with Viserys could have resulted in her death. She may yet prove crazy. She hasn't so far. She deserves a moment to sort things out. Jorah, most of her army, two dragons and a challenger for the throne, is a great deal to process in a short time. She has been on the run all her life because she is a Targaryen a since the death of Viserys, the LAST Targaryen, as far as anyone knew. To judge her as if she were just Daeny the stuck up blonde girl is just Daeny hate. I hate to see Missandei go. She is genuinely good and the most beautiful woman on the show, IMO. Good for jamie and Brienne but I see it going differently in the books. I hope Arya does kill Cersei, or my Sandor kills Cersei and Arya kills Gregor for killing Sandor. I have always liked Bronn but he was a dick last night. Not saying he acted out of character, he is a mercenary through and through, but he has never been a twat before.

Daeny gets criticized for being imperious and acting entitled, "mad queen" and so on, but really all along her journey any sign of weakness could have been disastrous. I like seeing that she backs up her claim with actual courage. She fights at the head of her army. Granted that is easier of the back of a huge dragon, but once she was thrown off she did not crumble. She fought by Jorah's side. It was heroic. I think it should be acknowledged.

Arya was badass, but she always is. Lyanna Mormont was fierce to the end, good on her. Melissandre in spite of all her child burning fanaticism did come through and buy Winterfell time. I hope that some of the Daeny hate will die down now, when the Khaleesi fell of her dragon she picked up a dragon glass sword and stood her ground. Brienne would have been proud.

Tyrion's song.

I predict they will learn and eventually be quite formidable.

Many of those who died for Jon so far have been Wildlings, there are many castles on the wall to hand out to the Wildlings. The other loyal houses have ancestral lands. I don't think Jon was wrong to give the Karstarks and umbers another chance.