JonCon's Red Beard

This what? The assumption that we believe that women being strong means they have to fight? Please, we're smarter than that. Also, Dany SAVED HERSELF during the Pit scene in the books. She, herself, "threw aside" her bunny ears. She didn't need some havoc happening around. That happened after she realised she was in the wrong place. Drogon was there to help her become something else, not to save her from the evil men who wanted to hurt him.

It's obviously it doesn't happen like that in the books. This happened so Shireen can help them to win Winterfell. Stannis is already going there in the books and Shireen is alive. Will she be burnt? Yes. Not by Stannis. Stannis in the books 6 has said, as Señor de la Tormenta has just quoted: IF I DIE, PLEASE, AVENGE ME AND PUT MY DAUGHTER IN THE THRONE. Really, why would Stannis burn his own fucking heir? What's the point of trying to carry on a dynasty if you kill your own child and chance of surviving?? This is just like Doran sending Trystene to KL. Really, why? He has no more children. What is happening after Doran dies? Who rules Dorne? Will be revealed that Arianne and Quentyn went to Summer Island Camp? This show makes. no. sense. It doesn't matter how much DD try to say "but we were told by George!". This one scene goes against what HAS BEEN ALREADY WRITTEN.

Yo know what? I can cope with HBO/DD believing we the audience are dumb. I cannot, whatsoever, accept that people here believe we readers are plain stupid. We DO KNOW that Shireen will likely die. That's because Martin is not an OMG WHAT A SHOCK! author as HBO make believe. There is a big chance she will die and get burn (which it has been kinda confirmed already, not spoiled). We aren't mad at that. We are mad at the fact that, for whatever reason, maybe to make the whole thing "different", they put Stannis to make it. Because Stannis is a character that WOULD NOT do that. Stannis is not real. But he's a character from a book that has been outlined in a way. This goes against that way. COmpletely.

Amazing. This inept writers are so stupid that they can't make an ambiguous character and they just turn him into "villain".

The fact Shireen dies doesn't mean that's HOW she dies. Sansa's plot is from the books... but not like we've seen it.

At least HBO achieved the impossible: both Dany and Stannis fandoms are kinda united in sorrow.

I waited like four years for this scene and it was all about "saving Dany". I hated HBO with passion. PASSION.

The scene is great if you imagine Drogon is burning HBO writing team.

I think Stannis already earned his show name: Satannis.

I've been telling you all the same since August last year... YOU ALL SHOULD BE LISTENING TO ME MORE OFTEN!

I just text that to an Unsullied friend.

Congratulations, HBO. You managed to fuck up every other character of ASOIAF.

HBO WE GOT IT THIS EPISODE IS ABOUT DRAGONS. Jeez, they can't just infodump the whole thing in ONE episode, for the god of any God.

My stream died... please, Meryn didn't HBO Arya, right?

please don't put Arya in any sexual situation please don't put Arya in any sexual situation please don't put Arya in any sexual situation please don't put Arya in any sexual situation please don't put Arya in any sexual situation please don't put Arya in any sexual situation please don't put Arya in any sexual situation please don't put Arya in any sexual situation

This is not the place for discussion, but... no one is mad at Shireen being burnt. We all are smart enough to have realised is going to happen. It's all about why, how and by who. /end it.

Dorne is one of the most laughable things I've ever seen in my life in TV. Can they all die?

Doran sending his ONLY heir to King's Landing? This is the night for men to simply shoot their heritage on the head and plan to live forever, right?

I'm kinda tired of Elaria going around with a "I'm the Queen attitude". One thing is to be proud of being a bastard.. Another one... whatever.

Here I am... watching this.. mess. And doing laundry.

Exactly.

Definitely. But the point I was making is that Olly will be involved and Olly so far has been shown to be mad at Jon's decisions about the wildlings.

Sam isn't actually "rushed". He has been educated all of his life. He is very prepared for the job he was given at the end, not the one they wanted to give him. In any case, he's been given a job that is more suitable for septons or maesters. Are they also required to be trained in arms? Think this. Sam had a moment of clarity and ran away to the Citadel to became a Maester. Then his father finds out he's there and sends him to the Wall. With this information, you think the Wall had made him train to find what's his skills are? Or would have they send him straight with Maester Aemon because he was useful there?

To be fair, the term steward is not exclusive to the Watch. I think he's more a kind of squire or page for Jon and they're using that name because they use it for the one person who is in charge of attending the Lord, which is what Olly is doing.

Et tu Brute is definitely going to happen. Either is Olly or Marsh or Thorne or Baby Sam. The problem I -and some others have- is the anticipation to the moment and what chain of sequences will get him there. For once, we know already certain facts: the Watch is very aware of the Others being real and a danger. They have lost men fighting against them. This is true in both the books and the show. But, in the books the "Others" are still a abstract concept. They only know stories and tales about them. In the show, otoh, they know they are very very powerful and they are organised. Jon has seen what he can be recognised as a leader. And specially, he knows now what can defeat them and how. In the books, Hardhome is a place of uncertain. The wildlings might or might not die. They could or could have not died. The Others could or couldn't attack. Jon is making a big gamble with a lot of "if"s. In the show, it has been proved that saving Hardhome was the best course of action. In the books, Hardhome is a risk that they are not sure whether is worthy or not. If anything, the only thing we have are Peake's letters and Mel's visions. That and "Dead things in the water" is a bit of a hint of something big happening there, something that is not just wildlings or the Others attacking. It's not just about the wildlings eating each other. They are returning with information. But Jon and Jon only knows this, and he knows it due to an ambiguous letter from a man who can barely express himself properly and a woman he doesn't fully trust (let's put aside the fact that Hardhome was the place where something cataclysmic happened). The Watch has a lot of reasons to distrust Jon, even though they know the Others are real. In the show, the situation is different. As I said above, we don't work with "if"s anymore. Even if the wildlings were not worthy, they returned with things they can use. And they saw the strength of the Others with their eyes (not only Jon, others were there). Going to Hardhome was the right course of action because knowing what they found out about the Others gave the watch advantages (knowledge is power). Also, Jon killed one of them. So, why would they want Jon dead? :dunno: So, what the possibles outcomes could be? For some reason, when Jon and the others return, they say "you know what? we don't believe you. You are lying because you wanted to do this because you like the wildlings, you even fucked one of them". Considering all the things they all have seen, and how Janos Slynt was mocked when he dismissed a supernatural danger, this sound lazy and kinda asspull-ish. Of course, there is the chance the show reset itself on its own development and they go for this route. Another chance is that they realise that the wildlings will eat all of their resources. This is something is discussed in the books when the first group of wildlings arrive. Yet, it's silly. Killing Jon won't solve anything because those hundreds of mouths are still there and considering they're running away from something worst than Winter, they won't say "oh, ok. We'll leave". They outnumber the Watch. (unless Jon leaves them in the different castles of the Wall on his route to CB). And a final one is something that is also in the books. KL sends message to the Wall about how they will help them if they get rid of Jon. Of course, this hasn't been discussed in the show (AFAIR). The thing is that the show has been painfully obvious about how Olly is very displeased with Jon's decisions. Jon has now returned from a mission that has saved them. Olly's reaction to it might be very personal, but it doesn't mean the other members of the Watch agree with it after all the things they know now because of that.