The Dragon has Three Heads (Aegon, Jon, Dany) + Who is Quaithe & Azor Ahai? (Theory)

[Jon's Queen Consort]

-We have just as many details about Jon being the son of Ned and Wylla, or the thrilling tale of how baby Aegon was saved by Varys, or that Cersei was fucking moon boy. Why don't we believe these things? Because there are very good reasons not to.

-Nobody would have given a damn? If Ashara just disappeared? You can't be serious?

-We might not know the reason yet. There's lots of material to come. For example, Before we find out Robert has a bloodthirsty longing to kill all the Targs, there's not really any reason to think Ned would hide Jon. But then more material comes and answers present themselves.

-Minor nitpick, but we actually do; Patchface was there.

Actually we don't. We don't know where Wylla gave birth to Jon or how she got pregnant. For Ashara we know what happened jumped from the Tower in the sea.

-Yes nobody, because Ashara was just that beautiful but with no great importance. She wasn't the Lady of the Rock for example who disappears and nothing happens.

-We are talking about what we know so far not about what would happen if X was like R or Z didn't existed. Plus I don't believe that Robert's reaction is unreasonable.

-Because the way we see Patch he can be able to testify that? Has Patch ever said that Cassana and Steffon were in t heship? No. So they obviously faked their death and live in Essos.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

<snip

Second - are Ned's children only wolfseed as opposed to wolves? Not Starks? By that logic, everyone Targaryen since Aegon II isn't a true Targaryen, since he was half-Targ, half-Hightower. Also, Tyrion is Tywin's son, so it's a moot point.

The difference though is that Ned's children are legitimate. They carry the name. That tends to matter in these books, to the characters at least.

I agree that Tyrion is Tywin's son, but the books are setting it up to look like he could be Aerys' son. To the other characters that will make a difference, especially if he shows up riding a dragon.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

<snip

-We are talking about what we know so far not about what would happen if X was like R or Z didn't existed. Plus I don't believe that Robert's reaction is unreasonable.

-Because the way we see Patch he can be able to testify that? Has Patch ever said that Cassana and Steffon were in t heship? No. So they obviously faked their death and live in Essos.

:eek: That certainly says a lot.

Just because we haven't read that Patchface has confirmed their deaths doesn't mean he hasn't. There are still two books left. Your attempt to apply logic defies everything we actually know about the characters in question, and actual logic. Quit while you are behind.

Tormund's-Member, I suggest you take my new approach to this issue: some statements do not deserve the compliment of rational opposition.

I'm done tilting at windmills for the day.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

:eek: That certainly says a lot.

Just because we haven't read that Patchface has confirmed their deaths doesn't mean he hasn't. There are still two books left. Your attempt to apply logic defies everything we actually know about the characters in question, and actual logic. Quit while you are behind.

Tormund's-Member, I suggest you take my new approach to this issue: some statements do not deserve the compliment of rational opposition.

I'm done tilting at windmills for the day.

Yet afaIr by your logic, the fact that we haven't yet someone who can testify that Ashara died makes it obvious that Ashara is alive. So same thing, since we have no one to testify that Steffon and Cassana died they must be alive.

[Lady Blizzardborn]

Yet afaIr by your logic, the fact that we haven't yet someone who can testify that Ashara died makes it obvious that Ashara is alive. So same thing, since we have no one to testify that Steffon and Cassana died they must be alive.

No. We have Patchface to testify to that. My logic makes distinctions between events where there are/would have been a ton of witnesses, and events that no one seems to have seen.

Also, unlike you, I can see how Ashara being alive or at least not having killed herself exactly when they say she did could serve the plot. Another distinction you miss with your constantly throwing out as examples characters who could tell us nothing.

You are using syllogisms, which are pretty much the lowest form of logic in existence. If you're unable to go beyond that level of reasoning you might find it easier to just ignore me.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

No. We have Patchface to testify to that. My logic makes distinctions between events where there are/would have been a ton of witnesses, and events that no one seems to have seen.

Patch is bonkers who sings creepy songprophecies. How do we know that he has testified anything or had the menta capacity to do it?

Do I actually believe that it happened? No. Yet the fact is that it’s idiotic to say that because we haven’t seen someone yet he doesn’t exist at all.

Also, unlike you, I can see how Ashara being alive or at least not having killed herself exactly when they say she did could serve the plot. Another distinction you miss with your constantly throwing out as examples characters who could tell us nothing.

I work with the signs we have and those signs say that Ashara is dead. In order to not be real it needs to explain how she faked that, why she had to faked her death and not just disappear, what it will add to make the story simpler and things in the text that may lead to the conclusion that Ashara is alive. I see nothing at all except of the wishful thinking of some people. Ashara could always use the “septa” or “silent sister” excuse or simple disappear. She wouldn’t had created a *death* like that because it’s not logical. If you want to slip under the radar to draw even more attention to yourself is idiotic and create quite the opposite result. In other words you do simple things and not extravagant.

So, the way she *killed* herself is illogical and have many details. This means that there was a witness could be Allyria. Does the fact that we haven’t seen the witness yet means that there isn’t one? Heck no.

You are using syllogisms, which are pretty much the lowest form of logic in existence. If you're unable to go beyond that level of reasoning you might find it easier to just ignore me.

I don't see why I have to waste the grey cells for something so simple. So why should I should speak seriously about something that there is nothing that can change my opinion? Also as I recall back at #5 it wasn't me who started the discussion.

[Ben zo Xand]

Patch is bonkers who sings creepy songprophecies. How do we know that he has testified anything or had the menta capacity to do it?

Do I actually believe that it happened? No. Yet the fact is that it’s idiotic to say that because we haven’t seen someone yet he doesn’t exist at all.

I work with the signs we have and those signs say that Ashara is dead. In order to not be real it needs to explain how she faked t hat, why she had to faked her death and not just disappear, what it will add to make the story simpler and things in the text that may lead to the conclusion that Ashara is alive. I see nothing at all except of the wishful thinking of some people. Ashara could always use the “septa” or “silent sister” excuse or simple disappear. She wouldn’t had created a *death* like that because it’s not logical. If you want to slip under the radar to draw even more attention to yourself is idiotic and create quite the opposite result. In other words you do simple things and not extravagant.

So, the way she *killed* herself is illogical and have many details. This means that there was a witness could be Allyria. Does the fact that we haven’t seen the witness yet means that there isn’t one? Heck no.

I don't see why I have to waste the grey cells for something so simple. So why should I should speak seriously about something that there is nothing that can change my opinion? Also as I recall back at #5 it wasn't me who started the discussion.

Jon's Queen Consort. She is right (Lady Blizzardborn) All her reply's to your arguments are legit and you should heed her advice an ignore her in the thread and save your precious grey cells... I will only say this to add to her point. You are too closed minded. In all your reply's you state to KNOW your arguments. She reply's stating possibilities, even for her being wrong. Most logical people will assume and be critical thinkers, you are not. If you can't find a possible reason as to why Ashara Dayne will fake her death... then there it's not point in wasting ANY brains cells trying to give you one.

No one its trying to change anyone's opinion. We are just conversing... Only oneself can really change someone's opinion. If you aim to change someone's else opinion then you are at a loss...

I meant that with love from all my heart :).

[Jon's Queen Consort]

You are too closed minded.

Maybe. I am calling it cautious and not wishful thinking. If I see something that is illogical I will not say that is logical just because I want to believe that it is. Ashara being alive is illogical.If in the TWOW there were actual signs that Ashara could be alive then I will reconsider it. But for now there is nothing to even suggest that I am wrong.