House Velaryon Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 and a shit ton of sql:lol: Baaaa! We always need at least one sheep, you not you? I wanted to be one, but the bastards killed the person who I agreed with most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Thorne Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Sheep? I'm not the one baaa'ing.Either way, I'm sure a fair enough people will see your statement about Jorah claiming a role only makes sense if someone didn't realize the Roleless Innocent role included the phrase listed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Targaryen Posted June 16, 2011 Author Share Posted June 16, 2011 It is day 2.12 players remain: Cersei Lannister, Daenerys Targaryen, Eddard Stark, Jaime Lannister, Jorah Mormont, Khal Drogo, Lord Varys, Petyr Baelish, Renly Baratheon, Sansa Stark, Syrio Forel, Tyrion Lannister.7 votes are needed for a conviction or 6 to go to night.2 votes for Jorah Mormont (Syrio Forel, Sansa Stark)2 votes for Lord Varys (Cersei Lannister, Petyr Baelish)2 votes for Petyr Baelish (Daenerys Targaryen, Khal Drogo)2 votes for Sansa Stark (Tyrion Lannister, Renly Baratheon)1 vote for Eddard Stark (Lord Varys)1 vote for Jaime Lannister (Jorah Mormont)1 vote for Tyrion Lannister (Eddard Stark)1 players have not voted: Jaime Lannister. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Yronwood Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 So not liking people to hint at or play around regarding roles makes me evil? Oh my. You still need to explain why you thought Jorah tried to hint at something. Any reason? Any? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Westerling Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 I see a scheme here. He asks some qusetions to seven different players (counting Ros) and in five cases out seven never proceed discussion, regardless of answers. In two other cases, he insists on Renly answering and feels disppointment with Jorah answer... but doesn't keep pressuring. He looks very interactive, with that many questions, but I think he actually isn't. And I wonder if he is really interested in answers. And both his votes are poorly justified, IMO.Syrio Forel.Some of this is a function of lack of time, not to mention SQL errors (speaking of which... <_<). So far I've largely been reading the thread and posting during free moments at work, which has limited my ability to really get into the flow of discussion. Several of the answers I got I didn't respond do because I didn't feel they were worth pursuing (for example my questions to Arya and Baelish). You are not wrong that I haven't really pressured anyone yet, but I am doing my best given limitations on time and board functionality. So far I've mostly been filing away responses in the hopes of getting more time to think and post about them later. The only response I've gotten that I really didn't like was Jorah's explanation of his trust of Renly, and hey, look where my vote is?Unfortunately, I am not sure how much I will be able to post today, as work will probably be busier than yesterday.eta: I also would like Sansa to explain about the role hinting issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Velaryon Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Oh my. You still need to explain why you thought Jorah tried to hint at something. Any reason? Any?You are not understanding me. I didn't like the statement. I KNOW that all the roles say it. I laughed at that, but I did not like that a player repeated it. This is my feeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Baratheon Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Oh my. You still need to explain why you thought Jorah tried to hint at something. Any reason? Any?I'm not sure I understand you. The way I interpreted Sansa's post about Jorah was that the fact that he repeated that part of the role description was something he might try to point to later in a role claim. Along the lines of "see even at the very start, I was talking about roles." Yes, I know that part about having the worst role was in every role description, including RI. But even so - I think Sansa is saying that hinting at the role descriptions in any way is what she finds suspicious.Honestly, I don't have a problem with Sansa based on any of the role description issues you're going over.That said, I do still want to look into her posts leading up to her Ros vote. But that will have to wait until later, because I'm pretty busy today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Yronwood Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 You are not understanding me. I didn't like the statement. I know this. I still want to know why you didn't like the statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Targaryen Posted June 16, 2011 Author Share Posted June 16, 2011 It is day 2.12 players remain: Cersei Lannister, Daenerys Targaryen, Eddard Stark, Jaime Lannister, Jorah Mormont, Khal Drogo, Lord Varys, Petyr Baelish, Renly Baratheon, Sansa Stark, Syrio Forel, Tyrion Lannister.7 votes are needed for a conviction or 6 to go to night.2 votes for Jorah Mormont (Syrio Forel, Sansa Stark)2 votes for Lord Varys (Cersei Lannister, Petyr Baelish)2 votes for Petyr Baelish (Daenerys Targaryen, Khal Drogo)1 vote for Eddard Stark (Lord Varys)1 vote for Jaime Lannister (Jorah Mormont)1 vote for Sansa Stark (Renly Baratheon)1 vote for Tyrion Lannister (Eddard Stark)1 vote for Why (Tyrion Lannister)1 players have not voted: Jaime Lannister.remember only use Bold when voting. use colours or underine if you want to stress something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Pommingham Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Man cersei why you got to steal all my thoughts?Eta except I am not busy today once I get back so I'll be doing that sansa reread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Velaryon Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 I know this. I still want to know why you didn't like the statement.I can't make you understand. Personally, I would rather keep doing my reviews than repeating myself over again. I am done with this conversation, it is too disruptive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Thorne Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 You are not understanding me. I didn't like the statement. I KNOW that all the roles say it. I laughed at that, but I did not like that a player repeated it. This is my feeling.Ah ha, a second lie, everyone knows mod humor isn't funny. By claiming to laugh, you've proven yourself dishonest.Kidding. I can sort of accept the idea that you're just claiming not to like any early discussion of roles. I don't buy it, but I promise to feel extra guilty when we all end up in spoiler heaven and I find out it was a big misunderstanding.Right now though, it still looks very suspicious. Despite that, I'm removing my vote from you, because I have a stronger feeling you're a symp, and I think that an innocent CF when we lynch you will end up derailing the investigation.I want to look over all of Sansa's interactions, to see who her masters could possibly be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Wythers Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Er, thanks, but I actually asked about my case on Dany, not on Syrio. Ok, probably not case but resume...You mean this?Daeneris:Votes Eddard for having longest bandwagon, then Varis for same reason.A lot of posts explaining and defending herself. Closer to deadline, names me, Petyr and Jorah as main suspects, all for attacting herself. Votes Baelish. Trusts Jayme because of his question about FMs number.Countinues defending.Agrees with Varis' case on Eddard, would vote him.Asks Eddard if he suspects somebody but Sansa. Asks Khal why he don't want to lynch Jaime.Votes Ros. I completely don't understand why so many players refused to vote Daeneris at the end of the day. Yeah, initial cases on her might be weak, but for all the day she did nothing. 35 posts and onewith a contribution. And this contribution is OMGUS, whether she admits it or not. Extremely suspicious.ETA: er, crossposted with two last Dany's posts. I don't think these make her looking much better, though. She dousn't want Sansa out of suspect pool and she doesn't want to lynch because of possible symp connection. It's... too general thoughts.Other than the paragraph that I did answer to I feel it does little other than state facts that one can not really argue with, but as you point out it doesn't really constitute a case. I suggest you cease to chronicle Daenerys' actions like an old Maester talking about the heroes of yore and point out what it is about them that you find suspicious.I started my review with Jorah. First thing I want to point out is his first post, it very much mirrors the list of roles posted at the start of the game. I absolutely hate people who role hint with their first post. They have set themselves up for a possible role claim later on. It has been my experience that FM and symps are a lot more likely to do this (at least this obviously)I kind of see where you're coming from with this, but at Tyrion and others point out it's a feeling which doesn't really have anything to sustain it.He then disappears for 14 hours only to come back and sat he is too tired to post.When he does comeback, it has now been 24+ hours. Again he says he only has a little time, make a poor case on me.His "big" post about everyone. He does his best to "middle of the road" just about everyone and his opinion that responding to cases is pointless? :This I just don't understand. I read it as "if you act too innocent, then you are likely am FM faking it? is that what you are saying?Jorah is very much a middle of the roader, low poster, easy target finder, fake claim setter upper evil person.I re-read Jorah myself. I agree with some of what you're saying but I think all in all I think you make a poor point. Jorah is a low poster, but he's not alone in that august company, and though he hasn't been very vociferous about his opinions (as tends to happen with low posters), there's nothing in your case which strikes out as really suspicious, which means you're just talking generalities here. The case is pretty empty. You might want to re-read other players to see if you find anything more concrete. And that's enough coaching for the moment. This is Littlefinger's work!What I did find suspicious about Jorah in my re-read was his attack on Jaime. He points out how Jaime trusts the strong players and attacks Tyrion (a safe target, and one which would allow him to appear original). This may not be an entirely unfair point, but at the same time he makes it Jorah is dropping his case on Daenerys to attack a player who is apparently a rookie. What is more, he's placing a completely useless first vote on a player with a paragraph long sentence. His own actions are vastly more suspicious than what he's accusing Jaime of! All the links work fine for me and this one takes me directly to your post #192. What I am saying is that pehaps it is a clue to your masters, both named that you can see they are both on the Dany lynch.A rather puzzling speculation. And an idle one. It's also the first time you mention this second master. Pray tell me about him so that I might better serve him! A skillful symp doesn't want to be too obvious. Especially one with so silver a tongue.As skillful as I might be, the main problem about your case is that it isn't obvious at all. What you say and what was written just don't match without utterly unsupported leaps of logic. Which means you're grasping. As I said, it's just Lady Cersei's case with a powdered wig and a different name attached to it (which is why it makes very little sense).You are misrepresenting my argument. It is not that you were "saving" Tyrion, as he was in no danger. Instead it effectively ended further discussion about him and left your master's well-suited to be off the lynch train for D2 analysis.I'm afraid you'll have to flesh this out a bit with some quotes and such, because as it stands it is nonsense. Though I thought it extremely likely Ros would be lynched I had no way of knowing how the final hour would develop. I am a Master of Secrets, not blessed with green dreams! Had you wanted to discuss Tyrion you should have removed your vote on Ros, which you quickly cast as soon as it seemed the tides of war were unfavorable to her, and asked to discuss Tyrion. If I want not to mention something 'tis enough that I remain silent. Convoluted ploys are like dancing bears. Amusing to look at but they tend to fall on their ass. This reminds me of your day one post against Sansa. Evidence may be hard to come by, but an innocent has no reason to color reality as you do. As a story-teller you transform your windmills into giants, your herds into armies and your crones into princesses. I smile in amusement, yet I don't suspend my disbelief.Polly wants a cracker. :)*Gives Eddard a cracker*As you correctly point out, you should look at Tyrion. It makes little sense to make a case filled with points against me and then vote for someone else whom you haven't even gone and re-read properly. You should have asked Lady Cersei to do Tyrion too :PAs a deference to Lord Eddard I inform you that I shall leave in about 15 minutes to attend business of my own. It will likely take me 4 or 5 hours to return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Velaryon Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Is "Symp Hunter" a hidden role given to half the players? I have not seen so much symp talk since, well, ever.edit: have/half Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Yronwood Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 I'm not sure I understand you. The way I interpreted Sansa's post about Jorah was that the fact that he repeated that part of the role description was something he might try to point to later in a role claim. There was no way he might use it for later roleclaim. No way. It was in all roles.Well, if you are a symp, it's shame you've outed yourself just to defend a killer who have buried her grave already. Too bad. I trusted you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Pommingham Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Okay, I'm back. Sansa reread forthcoming, but I don't think her disliking Jorah's worst-possible-role line is worth anything. Tyrion, I believe Sansa's been trying to say that she just thinks it's scummy to open with a line that points out that he has a role (albeit the worst possible role). I think Sansa's barking up an imaginary tree, but I don't think she's suspicious in doing so. What I find suspicious is that she built a case on our least active player.Jorah is very much a middle of the roader, low poster, easy target finder, fake claim setter upper evil person.JORAH I STILL EXPECT YOU TO DEFEND YOURSELF. But anyway:I don't think he's been that hugely middle-roading.Low poster sucks, but is not a sign of evil.Targets on D1 were easy. It was Dany or Not-Dany.I do not think there was a fake-claim set-up there.So it's kinda a wussy case, really. Given that the very headstrong Cersei has been harping on Jorah's case, and that he's barely around, I'm quicker to accuse Sansa of finding easy targets rather than Jorah. It is, in fact, this case that makes me want to reread Sansa. Which I will do. After I eat--priorities, you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Dalt Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Petyr Baelish:First real post of the game and it's a vote on me. I have no problems with this vote at this stage. It's what I wanted.To what end?This post was made in response to the fact that I changed my vote from Eddard to Varys because Eddard no longer had the most votes. To me, he seems fine with the fact that I changed my vote yet he's still voting for me because I voted Eddard while posting something negative about Sansa. It should be clear at this point that I was just jumping on bandwagons depending on who had the most votes yet he has kept his vote on me even after this post. It was clear that you were jumping on bandwagons. I suppose you cold have been applying the vote the biggest train policy retroactively to cover the weirdness of your non vote on Sansa, who knows? I didn't like it. Changing your vote to Varys didn't change the fact that your unexplained Eddard vote while suspecting Sansa in the same post was weird.as.hell. You don't like what Sansa does? Put some pressure on Sansa. Good enough to earn an enthusiastic vote from me on day one. His next post. This part I think is misrepresenting what I was doing. But that's my opinion.You said yourself that you were voting the biggest train. How was I misrepresenting what you were doing? Explain it to me.However, the big thing about this is that on the last post, he seemed fine with my strategy and now he's keeping his vote on me for that strategy. And of course, my responses haven't felt genuine, which is something incredibly subjective. It feels like he flipped on his last post to keep his vote on me, which is the biggest train by about 3 votes at that point.Look who's misrepresenting now ;)Where did I imply that I was fine with your strategy. I wasn't. At all. Let me ask you this. What problem do you have with voting the largest train early in the game? Or is it not the fact that I voted for the largest train but that I pointed out one post that I didn't like of Sansa's? If that's the case, why would it better serve me to vote for her?Voting the biggest train especially when it is populated largely with RP votes doesn't strike me as productive. Not that early in the day, anyhow. It's somewhat understandable if you don't have any bad vibes on other players, however, as I've said, you suspected Sansa and voted Ed. [Day 2 posts:The Ros mob didn't bother you enough to comment yesterday. When you made your post to Syrio explaining the possible contradiction in your posts, Ros had 6 votes. You weren't a suspect at that point so you could have at least commented. Also, why does the Ros mob bother you? You say it does but give no reasons why you actually are bothered by it. I was at work. It was supposed to be a slow day, but it got busy. I finally finished up and had what I free time that expected to last well through the end of the day. I skimming and catching up. I responded to Syrio, was trying to get a handle on the Ros mob that had popped up while I was away. She seemed more new than guilty to me, but I figured I must have missed something and was reading through carefully. Then then work needed my immediate attention again (hence the back in 15 min comment). the rest is history.And lets be honest, you didn't lead the Dany mob. You made a vote and then reiterated that you'd keep your vote. You did nothing to push the Dany mob. Don't misrepresent your own actions.I was the first serious vote on you. You said it yourself. Wish I'd been able to be more active and compelling so you could have hung instead of Ros, but I was out in front. :kiss: Hmm. Ok. You agree with Cersei's case. You find it compelling. Why? What was so compelling about it?Varys' flip-flopping on Tyrion's feelings of you and shuffling you around in his tiers with good reason given. I think he realized that you are his symp. Go ahead and be dismissive (again) about symp theories this early in the game, but goddamn! Is anyone else seeing this? Cersei makes good points but quotes a lot so she's a chore. Why post that? Does that make her suspicious? Not in and of itself. I haven't noticed anything suspicious yet, but come day three or four nobody is going to want to reread her and that's a problem. You now feel better about me than Varys. Why? Because I make self defense posts? What about my early actions? Do you still find those suspicious?Why I find Varys more suspicious than you has nothing to do with you looking more innocent and everything to Varys looking guilty. Your actions are still seem as suspicious as day 1 actions get.What solid points has Renly made? The only points that I can remember is the fact that he thinks there are multiple people protecting Varys. Do you agree with those?Not that there are multiple people protecting Varys, just that Varys makes sense as FM whether we suspect Sansa or you. Didn't put much stock in it when I read it the first time, but upon reread, it was an insightful thing to say at that point in time.At this point, the only person you really find suspicious is Varys. You like me a lot better than you did yesterday and you find no one else suspicious. You like Renly's conspiracy theory against Varys and you like Cersei's points. There are a couple people that are suspicious. I'll do my teirs shortly. I don't like you better today. I like Varys less. He is my main suspect, but by no means my only suspect.ETA-Gah! Crossposted over half the page. Work+Slowtyping+SQL= :tantrum: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Yronwood Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Tyrion, I believe Sansa's been trying to say that she just thinks it's scummy to open with a line that points out that he has a role (albeit the worst possible role). Oh.I understand this, from the beginning.But I still need an explanation why Sansa thought Jorah's post pointed out that he had a role. Great question nobody answered yet. Evidently, Sansa herself failed to explain this completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Velaryon Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Oh.I understand this, from the beginning.But I still need an explanation why Sansa thought Jorah's post pointed out that he had a role. Great question nobody answered yet. Evidently, Sansa herself failed to explain this completely.I never thought he had a role. I thought he was setting himself up for a possible future claim.So are you his symp or what? You even said the rest of my case was ok, but instead of us talking about him or my case, we have talked about this.**I really felt left out of the symp hunting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Thorne Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 I never thought he had a role. So now you're claiming that you were voting to remove a person without a role? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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