direwolf_of_white_fangs Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 I just wanted to say I agree Martin saves most of the plot for the second half of the books, but the book that does not follow this structure is GOT, not SoS. let's not go into this discussion though since it's a FfC forum.The red wedding happens halfway through aSoS...aGoT although a lot of action happens before the end the main event (NEd's death) only happens at the end too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YuvalTheVal Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 The red wedding happens halfway through aFfC...aGoT although a lot of action happens before the end the main event (NEd's death) only happens at the end too.The red wedding happens in the second half, 700/1128.But of course the *main event* happens near the end, that's the nature of stories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
direwolf_of_white_fangs Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 The red wedding happens in the second half, 700/1128.But of course the *main event* happens near the end, that's the nature of stories.A little rule of three, high school maths and we find that page 700 in aSoS is equivalent to 62% of the the book. That's pretty much middle-ish to me.Ned Stark's death on the other hand takes place at the last hundred pages in aGOT. So i don't know how is that aGOT is the black sheep of the last pages climax rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YuvalTheVal Posted November 29, 2012 Share Posted November 29, 2012 A little rule of three, high school maths and we find that page 700 in aSoS is equivalent to 62% of the the book. That's pretty much middle-ish to me.Ned Stark's death on the other hand takes place at the last hundred pages in aGOT. So i don't know how is that aGOT is the black sheep of the last pages climax rule.I didn't say it's the black sheep of the last pages climax rule, I said it's the black sheep of the second-half action rule. it's paced more wisely, without an uneventful moment from beginning to end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_saxon Posted December 1, 2012 Share Posted December 1, 2012 Wow. I just finished asos and all of affc that I've so far read is the bonus "preview" cersei chapter at the end of asos. I don't see how people think asos was fast-paced. To me it was either "excellent" or mind-numbingly slow, depending on the chapter. So to hear that by comparison affc is a slow read? Ugh. However, that little cersei preview at the end of asos was pretty good, fast paced. I saw the name of the preview chapter and thought "I'd rather read the pov of a privy through this whole time frame than cersei". But savoring how she is tortured on the inside as Ser Gregor is tortured bodily, is some sick relief. Watching her uncle basically rip her apart verbally all the while "speaking the truth of it" was good stuff. And zombieCat back for vengence- yes! Also, I will gladly read about the harsh realities of peasant life in times of war than about some absurdly detailed garment that some idiot character is wearing. Or about how well buttered the buttered radishes bathed in boiled goatsmilk with a dash of dornish rumsauce procured when the great chef of dorn was actually a cook-conquerer wedded to a shy girl from Ipamena from high-born though humble roots whos line goes back to the andals where is said this particular rumsauce has its origins. Noooooooooooo :stillsick: Those are chapters where I put my hand on my head and say to the book, "GRRM, I love ya man, but your killin me!". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
direwolf_of_white_fangs Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Wow. I just finished asos and all of affc that I've so far read is the bonus "preview" cersei chapter at the end of asos. I don't see how people think asos was fast-paced. To me it was either "excellent" or mind-numbingly slow, depending on the chapter. So to hear that by comparison affc is a slow read? Ugh.However, that little cersei preview at the end of asos was pretty good, fast paced. I saw the name of the preview chapter and thought "I'd rather read the pov of a privy through this whole time frame than cersei". But savoring how she is tortured on the inside as Ser Gregor is tortured bodily, is some sick relief. Watching her uncle basically rip her apart verbally all the while "speaking the truth of it" was good stuff.And zombieCat back for vengence- yes! Also, I will gladly read about the harsh realities of peasant life in times of war than about some absurdly detailed garment that some idiot character is wearing. Or about how well buttered the buttered radishes bathed in boiled goatsmilk with a dash of dornish rumsauce procured when the great chef of dorn was actually a cook-conquerer wedded to a shy girl from Ipamena from high-born though humble roots whos line goes back to the andals where is said this particular rumsauce has its origins. Noooooooooooo :stillsick: Those are chapters where I put my hand on my head and say to the book, "GRRM, I love ya man, but your killin me!".Good job. You got that far. GRRM is indeed an american Tolkien of sorts. Just get ready for some slower pace in aFfC and beggining of aDwD. Things begin to heat up again only halfway through Dance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_saxon Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Good job. You got that far. GRRM is indeed an american Tolkien of sorts. Just get ready for some slower pace in aFfC and beggining of aDwD. Things begin to heat up again only halfway through Dance.Where I think GRRM is better than Tolkein though is that it is easier for one to skim through GRRM without missing much. With Tolkein, too much skimming and your missing something important. So GRRM's unnescessarily long descriptions of things that have absolutely no bearing on the story are easily skipped through until one finds the meat of a chapter. He makes susbtantive material easy to find. Conversely one may savor those long descriptions at will. It kind of gives the reader more control over the pace of the story its self. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azureguy Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 This one is definitely harder for me to get through. The short reason for that is Brienne. Her chapters bore me to tears. Not to mention how long the chapters are, you feel like you are getting nowhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain of Castamere Posted December 4, 2012 Share Posted December 4, 2012 i also found Feast somewhat clumsy to read compared to the intenseness that was Storm. But it was still good enough and the notion that no jon, no tyrion, no dany was present troughhout the book and the hope that in Dance there would be all the more from them made me read trough the book as fast as the other booksAlso the end of Feast is a great pleasure to read!about some absurdly detailed garment that some idiot character is wearing. Or about how well buttered the buttered radishes bathed in boiled goatsmilk with a dash of dornish rumsauce procured when the great chef of dorn was actually a cook-conquerer wedded to a shy girl from Ipamena from high-born though humble roots whos line goes back to the andals where is said this particular rumsauce has its origins. Noooooooooooo Those are chapters where I put my hand on my head and say to the book, "GRRM, I love ya man, but your killin me!". :Di loled!i know what you mean, but im still reading those details.They enhance the world quite a bit for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_saxon Posted December 5, 2012 Share Posted December 5, 2012 i also found Feast somewhat clumsy to read compared to the intenseness that was Storm. But it was still good enough and the notion that no jon, no tyrion, no dany was present troughhout the book and the hope that in Dance there would be all the more from them made me read trough the book as fast as the other booksAlso the end of Feast is a great pleasure to read! :Di loled!i know what you mean, but im still reading those details.They enhance the world quite a bit for me.I am trying to take this one slow, though I'll admit to skimming through some paragraphs I find boring or too detailed. I often come back to those paragraphs at the end of their chapter, or if there is a turning-point in the chapter its self. A good example of skimmed paragraphs was towards the end of asos where Lysa, Sansa, and Little Finger have their little "falling out"; the long bit on page 1107 describing the singers background I skipped entirely as I found it to ruin the flow of that chapter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
direwolf_of_white_fangs Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 Honestly, in Feast if you remove the bit where lisa, littlefinger and sansa have their "discussion" and the Cersei ending the rest of the book you can throw it away. Go read some Tolkien...Being generous maybe I can add the Dornish part with myrcella and darkstar as one of the important points...still...But worry not. Things get back into perspective reading Dance. I'm on page 608 of Dance and I tell you it is worth reading every paragraph of Feast before Dance. At least with me I got back to my old pace of reading lots out of sheer enthusiasm, of wanting to know what happens next before going to bed.Especially halfway through the book where some action begins to take shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain of Castamere Posted December 6, 2012 Share Posted December 6, 2012 as I found it to ruin the flow of that chapter.yeah, true enough.I also have this multiple times where im reading a chapter and i know that something interessting is about to happen right now and im eager to read it but then martin loses himself in some overly detail description of someones smallclothes... and im like "come to the point, man!!".. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bunkerchip0460 Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Greyjoys FTW. I love their stories. Still reading AFFC but loving every minute. Samwell is also a great character to hear from now and again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quiet Isle Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 For those having issues with this one ...The first time I read AFFC, I'll admit it read it too fast, and with reading too fast and having this sudden explosion of characters, I was overwhelmed, but I powered on and read it a matter of days and hated it.It now stands up very well to rereads. Yes the beginning is slow, but you also have to remember that GRRM didn't plan to write most of this stuff, he was going to gloss over it in the 5 year gap. Still not my favorite book in the series, but definitely much better on rereads. Lots of creepy little details to pick out and the new characters aren't so bad the second third or whatever time through. I too was trying to get through it. difficult. I reread a large portion of it last night and I kept hitting myself in the head saying you were an idiot. this is BRILLIANT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_saxon Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 Well I am through the first few chapters and though I don't feel the burning need to pick up the book every time I get a spare moment, I am enjoying the read. I think people have to look at AFFC as a new storyline with new characters within the same series. Thats really what it seems like so far. It kind of has to be taken on its own, unlike the first three books which was a continous storyline involving the same characters. I can see why people have issues with this book- they want to see the story they started progress, not see a dozen new stories begin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor The Andal Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I'm just starting the book and I am worried that I won't find these new characters interesting. I could deal with it if there were tyrion chapters, but I am willing to dive in and try to enjoy these new characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elyrica Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 It took me longer to read this one too. For me it was because I dreaded what might happen with Cercei having her own chapters and all. After how the previous book ended, I thought it quite scary not knowing how my favorite characters where doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_saxon Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I'm just starting the book and I am worried that I won't find these new characters interesting. I could deal with it if there were tyrion chapters, but I am willing to dive in and try to enjoy these new characters.I think we gotta trust GRRM to not suck. Despite my really harsh criticism of parts of asoiaf, GRRM has NOT disapointed so far, and I don't expect him to start. I am finding the new characters exciting and their storylines at least somewhat interesting. My fear is that these new characters which I am starting to like as much as the old, aren't simply left hanging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_saxon Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Also, I thought nothing was really supposed to happen in this book. Already Jon is making some major political moves- something I absolutely did not expect. I am enjoying this book a lot and really expect not only to continue to, but that my enjoyment will increase as I go. I know Cersei and the Freys have something coming for them, I can't wait to read it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignacio Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 AFFC is more appealing if you like the intrigue and political maneuvering whereas SOS is more action-packed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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