Fender Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Possibly, but as so far (Book Five) they are not very effective if that is their goal. The ones who we saw killing a human were attacked or at least challenged first. Sure, they could have ran, ask for mercy or turn the other cheek (no pun intended).I'd like to mention that Jesus' comment about "turning the other cheek" was completely taken out of context; he had spikes coated with poison on his other cheek.Humans didn't go looking for them in the lands of always winter though did theyThey might've if they'd known they were there and if they could reasonably mount an army that could reach the place without being at a ridiculous disadvantage. But mostly the first one; if they'd known they actually existed, they would at least have made sure that the Night's Watch was properly manned and taken care of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danm_999 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Do we really know if the CoTF supports the humans?All information we have regarding their last contact with the south are ancient bedtime stories. Legends who cannot necessarily be trusted. I'm curious how GRRM will play this out. Right now I also don't believe the Others to be "evil". Humans do some pretty mean things to eachother, just look at Vargo or Gregor. Had it been them who were ordered to kill some NW rangers, you can bet they would torture the survivors for amusement. We've seen no Others doing that sort of thing yet.Leaf seems pretty adamant that COTF are opposed to Wights. Not to mention the ancient records Sam uncovers that COTF gave the Night's Watch hundreds of dragonglass daggers each year.What else are those going to be for, except for killing White Walkers? It seems that the COTF have supported the Night's Watch against the Others for centuries. That the non-expansionist COTF supported expansionist humans tells you the alternative is even more horrifying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FanTasy Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 What!!Who provoked them at the fist??Who provoked them in the prologue of GoT??I gave textual reference in another thread. Royce challenged the one he encountered in the prologue of AGOT, Small Paul attacked the one who killed him with an axe. It is in the text. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danm_999 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Just like humans are evil in they're POVBut humans apparently don't have difficulty finding co-existence with the only other two sentient races; giants and COTF, even if that co-existence is biased towards human interests. The humans and the COTF fought a war, but that war ended with a treaty and humans adopting the COTF gods. The War of the Dawn ended with no diplomacy, in fact the humans, with rumoured help from the COTF, raised the Wall as a bulwark against future aggression, and the COTF provided the humans with anti-Other weapons after the war had ended.In every observable circumstance, COTF and giants have sided with humans against the Others, which demonstrates the Others are fundamentally more genocidal than humans, since they're the only sentient race in Westeros that has failed to achieve any diplomatic recognition or peace with any other diplomatic race. Even humans have managed to stop wholesale slaughter of COTF and giants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpBeyondTheWall Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 I gave textual reference in another thread. Royce challenged the one he encountered in the prologue of AGOT, Small Paul attacked the one who killed him with an axe. It is in the text.True. And by the way, GRRM has told the producers of GOT important events in the series in case something happens to him, so maybe they know something about The Others, that we don't know. Which, back to topic, explains why The Others at the end of season 2 didn't attacked Sam even though they knew he was there. Sam didn't do anything to provoke them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danm_999 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 True.And by the way, GRRM has told the producers of GOT important events in the series in case something happens to him, so maybe they know something about The Others, that we don't know.Which, back to topic, explains why The Others at the end of season 2 didn't attacked Sam even though they knew he was there. Sam didn't do anything to provoke them.The Others that appeared in that season finale also appeared during the day, which is a major no no according to the text. Don't look to the series for canonical confirmation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Last Giant Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I gave textual reference in another thread. Royce challenged the one he encountered in the prologue of AGOT, Small Paul attacked the one who killed him with an axe. It is in the text.Small Paul was running from a battle started by the others!!! In the prologue they were stalked by the others and Royce manned up turned and challenged them.Why is everyone trying to make out the others are nice, they kill everything they see!!!!Actually the only person they havnt killed is Craster a man that shags his daughters and kills his sons, so add shit judge of charchter to the others list of sins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpBeyondTheWall Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 The Others that appeared in that season finale also appeared during the day, which is a major no no according to the text. Don't look to the series for canonical confirmatio.But the cold comes when they come. And when they were coming a huge blizzard was behind them. Still that's not the point, and I know what the books say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpBeyondTheWall Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 We're not saying that they're good and nice and all that... We're saying that they might be "grey" characters doing what they do to support their cause.And if we learn that they're truly evil... still a POV from them would be very interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Last Giant Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Sorry for getting off topic, I would actually love to see a POV from an other, if only to try and learn more about their motives etc, and i suppose we don't know what's going on in the lands of always winter. And I suppose everything about them so obviously points at evil that grrm is just tricking me (not for the first time) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpBeyondTheWall Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 GRRM said we wil know more about the Others and the Lands of Always Winter in the next books, so maybe there is a possibility of an Other POV prologue or epilogue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jabronius Maximus Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 According to GRRM the Others/White Walkers are not dead:"The Others are not dead. They are strange, beautiful...think, oh...the Sidhe made of ice, something like that...a different sort of life...inhuman, elegant, dangerous."So they sound very complex. I tend to think that, if Craster's sons do become others, then there could be some kind of ice version of R'hllorism, where some old Others are like priests that help transform/initiate the newcomers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolorous Ali Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I'd love an Other POV. This will be so awesome, as I support the Others rather than humans. But it's highly unlikely, as they're meant to be the arch enemy and there will be huge spoilers in that chapter, and as for epilogue of ADoS, I think it'll be just a wrap up of about what happens in kingdoms, and people's condition after the war with Others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Last Giant Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I'd love an Other POV. This will be so awesome, as I support the Others rather than humans. But it's highly unlikely, as they're meant to be the arch enemy and there will be huge spoilers in that chapter, and as for epilogue of ADoS, I think it'll be just a wrap up of about what happens in kingdoms, and people's condition after the war with OthersInteresting what makes you support the others over humans?? I take it your not a White Walker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpBeyondTheWall Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 I'd love an Other POV. This will be so awesome, as I support the Others rather than humans. But it's highly unlikely, as they're meant to be the arch enemy and there will be huge spoilers in that chapter, and as for epilogue of ADoS, I think it'll be just a wrap up of about what happens in kingdoms, and people's condition after the war with OthersIMO you can't support a cause that you do not know... That's why we need to know more about the Others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolorous Ali Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 IMO you can't support a cause that you do not know... That's why we need to know more about the Others Well obviously there is thing: humans vs. Others.I don't like humans, so it's the Others for me. Plus I love anything cold and icy, and I have no problem with their morality (whether they have one or not), and the Others are abnormal, even in ASoIaF world, and as I love abnormality I think I'd support them. Of course it matters what they want and what they really are, but I think it wouldn't make me hate them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpBeyondTheWall Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 Well obviously there is thing: humans vs. Others.I don't like humans, so it's the Others for me. Plus I love anything cold and icy, and I have no problem with their morality (whether they have one or not), and the Others are abnormal, even in ASoIaF world, and as I love abnormality I think I'd support them. Of course it matters what they want and what they really are, but I think it wouldn't make me hate them.In the WOT5K I supported Rob because I thought he was the only one who was fighting for the right reasons I support Westeros because I think GRRM has made us so fond of the characters we know that I would suffer if I see them come to such a tragic end (Even though that's more likely to happen) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampire Squid Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I'm of two minds on this question. On the one hand, I'd like to see a POV because, putting aside their apparent genocidal aims (which aren't necessarily total genocide - though I think their living conditions are fundamentally incompatible with humans given Westeros' current technology, it's possible they could be persuaded to stop once they have enough territory to support their population), they're ice elemental necromancers with a nice-sounding language and a different and potentially interesting perspective on things. On the other hand, there's the risk of this mysterious alien culture being a bit pathetic once it's explained.But on the whole I'd probably prefer the existence of either a POV chapter or at least a dialogue just to further damage the concept of inherently pure evil sapient beings. I really hate that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImpBeyondTheWall Posted July 30, 2012 Author Share Posted July 30, 2012 I don't like humansSo are you some kind of extraterrestrial or something??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Piece Maker Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 But to the OP.... GRRM has sent word that there will be no new POV.Where can I find that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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