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Andrew Umber

House Type

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On the Wiki the houses are broken down into categories



Knightly (Masterly for the North)



The great houses are obvious, but how do you know which houses to put in Noble and which in Knightly? Is it based on the person who heads the house being termed Lord in conversation and others being termed Ser (or Master?)

If that is the case, shouldn't the North have a category listed as Knightly/Masterly, because Cassel is listed as Masterly yet we know it is headed by Ser Rodrik. Also plenty of Norther houses seem to follow the 7 so there would probably be more.

This http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Houses_of_Westeros has some houses that are listed as 'other' yet here

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Category:Knightly_houses they are listed as knightly. What caught my eye was the Fossoway house and cadet branch. The cadet branch (green = new barrel) is listed as knightly and the original is listed as 'other'. I'd think the original would be knightly as well if not noble.

ALSO, with The Reach being described as the pinnacle of Chivalry as far as cultural recognition, it is surprising to see so many 'other'

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Most information about the status of the house (lord vs knight) comes from the appendices of the books. For instance Gerold Dayne is explicitly called the knight of High Hermitage (Appendix of A Feast for Crows). For others, if the head of the house is called "Ser" we have taken this to mean that the house is knightly

That there was never made a knight / master category for the North is probably because the title "Master" is never explained in the books nor (as far as I know) has Martin explicitly stated that this is the Northern equivalent of Knight.

About the red apple Fossoway the reason the status of the house was unknown lies in the Hedge Knight book. Ser Steffon Fossoway is promised a lordship if he joins the cause of the accusers. It is never stated if he got it. As Maekar grieved for his brother and realized his sons lied (and their cause thus was not right) he may have chosen not to reward Ser Steffon.

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Welcome to the Forum! :cheers:

I think Masterly is a term that can include knights if need be. Given that knights are in the minority, it's not really worth bothering with a term change. I think it depends on legal rights.

Other, I'm not totally sure what this means. But I'd assume that they are sworn to at least one overlord before the regions head. It could just be a place filler for houses that aren't clear.

TBH I think the wiki is a little convoluted. As far as I know GRRM hasn't made a specific description of what they mean. Also if you search by house type, there are only; Extinct, Knightly and Noble.

Also things may have changed between D+E and present day. Robert took lands away from those who fought against him, this was customary. He may have reduced the Fossoways perhaps?

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