Could Rhaego be alive?

[MasterJack]

Since we never saw his body, and strangely Dany conveniantly never asked to see his body and just beleived everything MMD told her just after she "betrayed" Dany.

and there is a simple rule in every books ever wrote: if you dont see the body, doubt it.

"Her dream came back to her, sudden and vivid, and she remembered the tall
man with the copper skin and long silver- gold braid, bursting into flame."

Because yeah, a targaryen "bursting into flame" could never mean anything else than his death, we can be way more imaginative about any hint of symbolism on this forum.

“He never lived, my princess. The women say He faltered, and Dany saw how the flesh hung
loose on him, and the way he limped when he moved.
“Tell me. Tell me what the women say.”
He turned his face away. His eyes were haunted. “They say the child was... ”

“Monstrous,” Mirri Maz Duur finished for him. The knight was a powerful man, yet Dany
understood in that moment that the maegi was stronger, and crueler, and infinitely more
dangerous. “Twisted. I drew him forth myself. He was scaled like a lizard, blind, with the stub of
a tail and small leather wings like the wings of a bat. When I touched him, the flesh sloughed off
the bone, and inside he was full of graveworms and the stink of corruption. He had been dead for
years.”

Great, our only confirmed witness is MMD who would never ever lie(hmm) about the death of her archenemy's newborn baby. :dunno: oh and some unknown women.



Where is he then? Jhaqo know it. The old crones from Vaes Dothrak has him,

"As swift as the wind he rides, and behind him his khallasar covers the earth, men without number, with araks shining in their hands like blades of razor grass. Fierce as a storm this prince will be. His enemies will tremble before him, and their wives will weep tears of blood and rend their flesh in grief. The bells in his hair will sing his coming, and the milk men in the stone tents will fear his name." The old woman trembled and looked at Dany almost as if she were afraid. "The prince is riding, and he shall be the stallion who mounts the world."

Being The Stallion Who mount the World, these olds crones have a really good reason the take him for themself, they might have judged they would be a better fit to raise the next great Dothraki Warlord. Dany is an outsider and her greatest protector was clearly dying.

Some of these old wise women's servant/follower(the women) who were there when Rhaego was born might have been with the camp followers all along just to get a chance to snatch him away, he is just too important to be "unguarded". They could have just took him and said he would be raised at Vaes Dothrak with the Crones. MMD was there too and would never say "no" to get an oppurtunity to crush Dany even more. See how she wanted so much to be the one to tell the creepy part.

P.S.: Jorah might knew, this could be the "real prophetised treason for love"

"yeah I sent info about you until Quarth" ----- treason for love
OR
"yeah I lied about your baby since I just want you to see me and I dont need any "cockblocker"(sorry for the expression) between you and me." ------- more convincing "treason for love"

We know Dany will visite Vaes Dothrak one more time since the Dauther of Death Prophecy:

Beneath the Mother of Mountains, a line of naked crones crept from a great lake and knelt shivering before her, their grey heads bowed.

At the end of ADWD, she meet Jhaqo.

-She just decided to burn her enemies:
No. You are the blood of the dragon. The whispering was growing fainter, as if Ser Jorah were
falling farther behind. Dragons plant no trees. Remember that. Remember who you are, what you were
made to be. Remember your words.

“Fire and Blood,” Daenerys told the swaying grass


She decided to kill, no more playing the weak queen in front of the harpy and the others, "I ll burn em" kind of attitude.

Then just some seconds later she thinks:
When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east,(QUENTYN) when the seas go dry (DOTHRAKI SEA)and
mountains blow in the wind like leaves (I am at lost here, it could be Drogon,big as he is, coming to save Dany from Jhaqo, since this is the moment Jhaqo begs for his life and trade precious information about Rhaego) when my womb quickens again and I bear a living child(Just had a miscarriage), Khal Drogo will return to me. (Drogo is dead 110% sure but what is the closest thing to him? His son, Rhaego)

This prophecy is almost completed, and the reward his Drogo... or Rhaego.

I think Rhaego could be her "consolation price" at the end of the war against the Others.IMO She wont rule Westeros since she now has an incredibly big responsability toward ESSOS.
Rheago could be waiting for her at the end of the road, and the World he has to mount could be Essos.

FROM NOW ON THIS IS MORE CRACKPOT THAN ANYTHING, so dont take it seriously.

Here is Dany prophecy of dauther and death, See how this could be all about POST-WAR Dany;

Quote

A little girl ran barefoot toward a big house with a red door.¹ Behind a silver horse the blood corpse of a naked man bounced and dragged.²A white lion ran through grass taller than a man.³Beneath the Mother of Mountains, a line of naked crones crept from a great lake and knelt shivering before her, their grey heads bowed.⁴Ten thousand slaves lifted bloodstained hands as she raced by on her silver, riding like the wind. "Mother!" they cried. "Mother, mother!" They were reaching for her, touching her, tugging at her cloak, the hem of her skirt, her food, her leg, her breast. They wanted her, needed her, the fire, the life, and Dany gasped and opened her arms to give herself to them.⁵

It could be interpretted;
1-Dany returns where she feel home(Essos), weakened after the war(little girl)
2-Even still she is weakened, she leaves westeros will being on the winning side. (Dothraki way, dragging the foe's body being your horse)
3-Jaime/Tyrion(the white Lion) is with her in her trip to Vaes Dotrak in the Dothraki Sea(or he follow her)
4-Dany takes command of the Dothraki, the old crones approve her (and this is here she reunites with Rheago)
5-Dany finally stop Slavery in Essos. (And I assume it will take years, some forshadowing with Olive Trees predicted some 21year if i remember)

Any thoughts?

ETA. added the end of the road part.

[Lord Artos Llyn]

Highly, highly doubtful but if somehow true I for one welcome our new demon-baby Targaryen-heir overlord.

[TheMysteriousOne]

He is dead. As is clearly shown by the HOTU visions.

[Frey family reunion]

Rhaego lives on in Viserion.

[blood of the dragoon]

Have been off the boards for a while, hoping to come back to something original, plausable, and awesome.

Thank you.

[Blueberry Stark]

It always bothered me that Dany didn't see the body. She was out for days, though, so perhaps that explains why, but why didn't she ever ask to see his body, his grave, etc? Also, I always found MMD's description of the baby disturbing, so disturbing that I can't understand why Dany didn't ask more questions, make demands of seeing the body, question those who did, etc. There's definitely something fishy here, but I don't know if I buy that the baby survived or not .... You may be on to something though.

[LifeRuiner]

I've often wondered that, but her miscarriage at the end of Dance convinced me otherwise. Narratively, it has paved the way to the third baby (which is probably the charm). Bringing Rhaego back would make no sense anymore, to me anyway.

[A Northman]

Definitely interesting but what purpose would he serve now?

[Light a wight tonight]

Normally this sort of topic brings out my inner scoffer, but the way this is presented is sort of intriguing. It might get interesting if Jaqo does have the kid, since she's just met up with his khalasar.

[Mad Monkey]

I have to admit, I never really considered Rhaego as a potential Secret Targaryen Scion.

mountains blow in the wind like leaves

Your theory seems solid and well thought-out to me. I'm not sure if it's true but you definitely laid out a case for why it could be true. As far as the bit about the mountains, some have linked this quote with the destruction of the Great Masters' pyramids at the end of the fifth book.

Would Rhaego really be all that helpful though to Dany if she is reunited with him (in terms of conquering Westeros, that is). Yes, he is an heir and his living makes it plausible that House Targaryen can be restored as a dynasty, but she will still need a real army and ships and political alliances and most of those things will have to be done without Rhaego's assistance since he will still be a baby. She can forge an alliance with him and that's about it.

[Lord Artos Llyn]

Would Rhaego really be all that helpful though to Dany if she is reunited with him (in terms of conquering Westeros, that is). Yes, he is an heir and his living makes it plausible that House Targaryen can be restored as a dynasty, but she will still need a real army and ships and political alliances and most of those things will have to be done without Rhaego's assistance since he will still be a baby. She can forge an alliance with him and that's about it.

Well, in real life medieval power struggles just having a (usually male) heir could make or break a claimant's chances of getting support from other factions.

[Melpomene]

I don't think Rhaego is alive - however, I do sense that perhaps Mirri killed the baby herself shortly after birth (With the other couple women involved and kept quiet, or she did it on her own in discretion). She knew this kid had an apparent destiny to rule and conquer, so why not remove it before it had the chance. That baby was the child of the man who ruined her own home and kin, and that baby was in her very arms right now. Why not destroy and hurt the parents, after destroying and hurting you? Mirri, was no doubt in a revengeful state altogether. She already helped bring down Drogo. It wouldn't be unusual if she did something to the baby too. Probably just simply stabbed it, then buried it quickly or tossed it somewhere. It would also fulfill the whole magical requirement to sacrifice in order to "save" Drogo, that Dany had originally wanted.

Afterward, she described his appearance to Dany in order to really rub it in her face. Exagerating how gruesome he was, in order to fully describe in symbolism how nasty the whole family and Dothraki were. Put fear, guilt and doubt into the Khaleesi. Also, probably to prevent Dany from actually requesting to see it. If the baby was allegedly that awful, and detoriated quickly, it might turn Dany off from wanting to see it, therefore preventing her from seeing the real evidence.

In any case, surely someone such as Jorah, her own personal knight, would have noticed a couple of sketchy people sneaking off with a bundle very soon after the birth, unless he was in on it for some reason. Additionally, why on earth would Mirri, and/or the other women (Perhaps even the other rape victims) help another enemy? Mirri's home was in the middle of two warring Khals, and when one wins they raped and pillaged everything. Khal Jhaqo is no different. He is also a raping, murdering, pillaging figurehead that would go attack Lamb Men. It would be strange to rage against one Khal and his family, and not against another. Highly doubt Jhaqo would be trustful enough if they had made a deal, like "I'll bring the baby to you if you leave my people alone" Mirri wouldn't be that blind to willingly believe his words or promises. Especially with her own foreshadowing abilities.

Plus, Jhaqo became Drogo's enemy, and Dany's. There are solid reasons why the baby being dead would benefit Jhaqo more than alive - 1) Khal Drogo was proven to be weak, and so his son would be weak too in that philosophy. So might as well that the kid died. Or, 2) If the kid survived, he could be a threat to Jhaqo in many ways (Now that Dany is her own Khaleesi and queen) and create possible future events like revenge. So, if anything, Jhaqo would want to kill the kid. Why raise a weak and/or threatening kid as your own, when you can make and raise your own strong sons, without risk of conflicts amongst them or concern for the outcome of a weak child of a disgraced Khal?




On a personal level, I don't really want another Targ to suddenly pop up after confirmed death. We already have Aegon doing it after many years of being thought deceased, do we really need another? And if the whole Jon theory is true and he somehow becomes revealed, that would be another one. I mean my goodness, after so long Dany suddenly gets two nephews and a son suddenly showing up? I don't know, just seems a bit much.

Also, I kind of like it if Dany continues via her own merit and skills. After all the work, hard lessons and suffering she has been through, a baby boy suddenly shows up and makes things super easier, and makes her more important only because she has a boy and not because she is important based on her own value and status seems bleh to me.

Anyhoo, the vision she has had already of him in HOTU also appears to confirm him dead.

[Kate Poem]

Some time a go I thought Rhaego - girl lives and she will become White Mare Who... etc. etc.

Now I don't know. Nobody saw her/his body, Mirri and these unknown women could lie...

Everything is possible.

[Muggle]

It always bothered me that Dany didn't see the body. She was out for days, though, so perhaps that explains why, but why didn't she ever ask to see his body, his grave, etc? Also, I always found MMD's description of the baby disturbing, so disturbing that I can't understand why Dany didn't ask more questions, make demands of seeing the body, question those who did, etc. There's definitely something fishy here, but I don't know if I buy that the baby survived or not .... You may be on to something though.

Dany has never had a mother figure, So she is overly trusting to mother figure types. Look at the green grace for another example.

God forbid if she ever met the Queen of Thorns.

[First of My Name]

I always found this an interesting but somewhat far-fetched theory, but the way the OP presented it is warming me up a little to this.

If Dany has a child out there (he would be, what 1 year old now? 1,5?) then that would solve some prophecies involving her and advance the plot a lot. But it just feels a bit, I dunno, off. I felt that Dany's story arc was supposed to go a whole other way, and it felt like it was building up to other things than Rhaego's return. (Then again, this is GRRM, it's how he rolls)

Question: would the reveal of Rhaego being alive not have been a better way to finish off Dany's arc in ADWD? It would only have taken ten pages to have her meet the khal and then seeing Rhaego, at most. If Rhaego's reappearance is where the story is headed, would'nt it have made more sense for him to be reintroduced at the end of ADWD? It's more of a turning point for Dany's arc than her catching up with the khalasar.

Last, when MMD says 'He had been dead for years.' I don't get that sentence, what's up with it?

[Blueberry Stark]

Yes, the "He had been dead for years" line is cryptic, and I've never known what to make of it other than maybe MMD is suggesting that the baby was fated to die. As in, he never stood a chance of surviving, had been dead for years. However, that interpretation of the line isn't satisfying somehow.

[First of My Name]

Yes, the "He had been dead for years" line is cryptic, and I've never known what to make of it other than maybe MMD is suggesting that the baby was fated to die. As in, he never stood a chance of surviving, had been dead for years. However, that interpretation of the line isn't satisfying somehow.

I agree, it just seems odd to put in there. Maybe it will make more sense after the series is finished.

[Muggle]

You put forward a decent argument, and I'm half convinced this could be a possibility...

Oh, and as for ''mountains blow in the wind like leaves'' my suggestion is that when the Mountain gets his borrowed head knocked off for the second time by Sandor.

I'd have to take a closer look at the wording around when he falls first before I'm a bit surer of that though.

How can a knight she has never met dieing be apart of her proph? At least quent come to meet her....

[First of My Name]

How can a knight she has never met dieing be apart of her proph? At least quent come to meet her....

That is the qualm I have with the prophecy referring to Gregor. There is also the possibility of Gregor flying out of the moon door, but I think the prophecy means something much closer to Dany's arc.

[Marwi]

I've been convinced he put his dead son on the pire.. didn't the sacrifice need three lives to wake up three dragons? They're after the dead souls, not her..