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Frey family reunion

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  1. I haven’t followed very closely but I’m surprised Warren has been polling so poorly. Any ideas on why?
  2. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 228 and one over the eight

    Technically, the flame is pale, it just takes on the color of the steel in the sword: silvery-blue. Which also indicates that the sword he and Brienne possess in the dream aren't Valyrian blades, which are typically smoky dark grey, Ice included.
  3. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    There were a number of kings further south. Most notably, Storm Kings and Gardner Kings. If Winterfell had a direct parallel in the South, I would argue that it would be Highgarden.
  4. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    I’m reminded of an incorrect assumption I made which I only realized after trying to type in a search term in my ebook copy of the series. I always assumed that Robb’s title was King of the North. But it’s not. It’s King in the North. Perhaps rather than refer to Kings of Winter, its more apt to consider them Kings during Winter. Which makes me wonder if a being a King in the North during Winter is analogous to the title actually given to Jon: Corn King. A sacrifice to bring about the end of a Long Winter.
  5. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    It’s always mystified me why so many assume that the point of this series is some sort of Targaryen restoration story. I assume it’s the Rhaegar Lyanna tease which fits so easily and predictably into a fantasy trope. If anyone has read any of GRRM’s other works should be highly suspicious of this, his tales rarely fit so easily into any tropes. Even if they don’t subvert them, they tend to be messier, darker, more complicated, and yes even more convoluted then they initially appear. It also irritates me that any allusions to Jon as a “King” must necessarily be read as a Targaryen king. Especially since early on in the story we’re told about the Winter Kings who have existed long before the Targaryens ever set foot in Westeros. The fact that so many elements of Jon’s story arc revolves around his place in Winterfell vs the oath he’s taken with the Watch, it seems highly unlikely that at this late stage in the game the author is going to switch gears and substitute the Iron Throne into Jon’s storyline. Or for that matter some nonsense involving dragon riding.
  6. Frey family reunion

    Was Robb drugged?

    Yea I don’t see it mentioned that Maggy or Grandma Spicer were from Asshai. I think the closest clue is that Taena Merryweather’s Myrish accent reminded Cersei of Maggy. But I think it can be argued that all the variations of the eastern accents may sound the same to Cersei.
  7. Frey family reunion

    Was Robb drugged?

    I agree with @John Suburbs that GRRM is certainly at least hinting that there may have been something untoward going on with Robb’s sudden decision to marry Jeyne. Otherwise why give her an ancestor that was known to dabble in love potions? Doesn’t mean that’s what happened, but GRRM is teasing it as a possibility. What’s really interesting about this subplot, is it’s the only example I can think of where there was a fairly major editing of text from the original edition of AFFC (I think that was the book) and the current editions. In the original version Jaime noted that Which was a slightly different description given of Jeyne earlier in ASOS when Cat describes her: Later editions, at least some, excise the description of the narrow hips. I confirmed it when reading a recent hard cover edition at Barnes and Nobles but unfortunately both of my ebook versions reference the narrow hips, so I can’t give the exact quote. Anyway it was an interesting edit. The original discrepancy launched a number of theories that the girl Jaime saw was in reality Jeyne’s sister, and that the Blackfish had snuck the real Jeyne from Riverrun, and perhaps snuck off Robb’s unborn child with them. Also of note. The description of heart shaped face may be another clue. It’s the description given of both Melisandre in the books, and another witch, Shiera Seastar when GRRM gave an artist a description of her. ETA never mind I see that @John Suburbs already referenced it.
  8. Frey family reunion

    Kevan and Pycelle’s death

    I guess the logical question if Griff is a fAegon, then when did Varys decide on this plan? Did he only decide to attempt this after he observed the condition of Aegon's body?
  9. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    It's a good point that Beric is not the monster that Cat is. I suppose it may be because Cat was further gone than Beric was when she got resurrected. So assuming that Jon is dead, it will be interesting to see how long GRRM lets Jon's body sit before he gets raised. If the Jesus parallels continue with Jon than I expect it to be three days. The fact that at the time of Jon's death (if indeed that's what we witnessed) his last thought was: Then my guess is that George plans on returning Jon as a revenant not too dissimilar from Cat, but perhaps not as far gone.
  10. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    Yea, Jon wasn't any different before or after his resurrection in the show was he? This was the delineation in the show where you knew they were completely off script. Once the source material ran out, they resurrected Jon just because they had to and then continued on like his death never happened. I guess he had some wildlings impressed that he came back to life. But that's the only thing of note that I can think of.
  11. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    Possible. We are running out of time.
  12. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    I think GRRM probably has more of a story arc for Cat then just hanging out in the Riverlands killing Freys. And don’t forget that Roose Bolton was the one who killed Robb right in front of her. And now Roose is parked in Winterfell allegedly marrying Arya to Ramsay and making Ramsay lord of Winterfell. Surely that won’t sit too well with Stoneheart. So I definitely see that it’s possible that both undead Cat and undead Jon may turn their sights to Winterfell.
  13. Frey family reunion

    Kevan and Pycelle’s death

    Pcyelle was the one who convinced Aerys to let the lions through the gate, so one can make a decent argument that he is at least partly responsible for the fate of the children, especially if he knew that the Lannisters were planning on betraying the Targaryens. At the very least Kevan gets blamed by association, for being Tywin’s brother and close confidant. But I would assume that Kevan was also probably present during the Sack, although I’m not certain of that.
  14. Frey family reunion

    The Direwolves Of Winterfell: Part 2, Robb and Grey Wind's Bond

    I think the reason that Summer is the first Direwolf to react aggressively to Tyrion, is that almost immediately before the Direwolves enter the hall Tyrion calls Bran a cripple again, and Bran’s not too fond of that word. Then immediately before the wolves come in, Tyrion calls Bran a cripple again: Despite his attempt to be helpful, Tyrion calls Bran a cripple again, which is a “knife through Bran’s heart”. The direwolves come in and Summer picks up on Bran’s anger. The other direwolves then pick up on Summers anger in turn.
  15. Frey family reunion

    Heresy 229 and hitting the refresh button

    It would be interesting wouldn’t it? The fact that GRRM grumbles so much about the HBO show not creating Stoneheart makes me wonder if she plays a vital role until the end of the series, a role that had to be assumed by others, perhaps Arya and/or Sansa. The HBO show kind of teased a conflict between Sansa and Jon over Winterfell (until that like many of their other storylines just kind of fell by the wayside). A more natural conflict, would be undead Jon versus undead Cat. A conflict that started in AGOT and whose repercussions to Jon are continued in ADWD. The only issue is whether there is enough room left in the story to fit this in.
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