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Could the Others be a Red Herring


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#1 Maester2chainz

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:21 AM

A lot of people on this forum believe there will be an ultimate show down with Jon and Dany vs the Others or Dany vs Jon, Bran, COTF, and the Others.

 

Could the Other's just be a red herring to destract from the ultimate battle for the throne in the final book.

 

I believe that the Other's will be defeated by the end of The Winds of Winter and possibly even before Dany arrives to Westeros. I mean really they melt when hit by obsidian, couldn't Westeros just chip some obsidian off the daggers or current arrow heads and make just the tip of all their arrows with obsidian. I think they will be defeated slightly easier than most of us think.

 

I believe then that after the Others are defeated, Jon or Bran will learn to weild their power and use it to take back the North.

 

I am sorry I can't quote, but there is both a dream scene where Dany is battling and her enemies are armored in ice.

Jon also has a dream scene that he is armored in black ice holding a flaming sword.

I believe that Jon is AAR and will defeat the Others, but then harnesses their power hence his ice armor.

 

Ultimatley it will be Dany vs Jon.  After R+L=J is revealed half the realm will rally to him and he will also have a lot of recognition by defeating hte OThers. Dany will be conquering. Many will bend the knee to her because of her dragons and foreign army. After learning of/ defeating the fake Aegon, she most certainly won't believe Jon is the real deal.

 

I believe the final book will play out like Aegon's landing..... foreign invaders conquering the realm with dragons, but this time the North WILL resist instead of bending the knee.

 

 

Sorry if there is spelling or Grammar mistakes--- no coffee yet :leaving:



#2 Ser Humfrey

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:26 AM

Nice theory I hope this isn't the case I'd like the others to torment the world. Then finely get defeated. Some cool way

ETA : As for dany I hope she takes over all of essos and stays there to me that would be. The most surprising thing.

Edited by Ser Humfrey, 11 October 2013 - 08:31 AM.


#3 Shadwell

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:27 AM

I fear that the Others are not the deadly Plague, a lot of People think.

On the other Site, their "Invasion" hasent even begun jet and in TWOW they HAD TO DO SOMETING!!!



#4 AegonTargaryen

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:27 AM

I like this post I think it's very interesting. Many have wondered if the battle for the Iron Throne is completely futile to the grand story because the true story is about the invasion of the others, and this seems like it would sort of reconcile the showdown with the others and the Iron Throne storyline. 

 

With that said, I feel that it might be a bit anti-climatic if the others are too easily defeated. 



#5 TheTowerOfJoy

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:31 AM

They were literally the first antagonists introduced in the series.  I doubt they are a Red Herring.



#6 Shadwell

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:31 AM

 

 

With that said, I feel that it might be a bit anti-climatic if the others are too easily defeated. 

Absolutly, I found it already terrible when Sam killed one of them :bang:



#7 Ser Humfrey

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:35 AM

Absolutly, I found it already terrible when Sam killed one of them :bang:

Really I thought it ironic.

ETA: And don't for get they don't have much obsidian. Stanis was going to send it down by the boat load but can't till he gets on the iron throne. So it's not like the white walkers are just going to walk right into another dagger of dragon glass any time soon.

Edited by Ser Humfrey, 11 October 2013 - 08:39 AM.


#8 DarkAndFullOfTurnips

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:38 AM

The only reason to believe they're not immediately important is because so much god damn time has passed since we first see them just North of the Wall that it seems as though they're doing nothing but picking off helpless folk about as far from the wall as they were in the prologue of the very first book.



#9 Ser Humfrey

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:41 AM

The only reason to believe they're not immediately important is because so much god damn time has passed since we first see them just North of the Wall that it seems as though they're doing nothing but picking off helpless folk about as far from the wall as they were in the prologue of the very first book.


Got to get that undead army some how?

Edited by Ser Humfrey, 11 October 2013 - 08:43 AM.


#10 Maester2chainz

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:44 AM

I like this post I think it's very interesting. Many have wondered if the battle for the Iron Throne is completely futile to the grand story because the true story is about the invasion of the others, and this seems like it would sort of reconcile the showdown with the others and the Iron Throne storyline. 

 

With that said, I feel that it might be a bit anti-climatic if the others are too easily defeated. 

I'm not saying it's going to be anti climactic, I'm just saying this could be the climax of TWOW.



#11 Sansa_Stark

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:44 AM

I think AAR is a red herring. But not the others. Didn't GRRM say he hates the whole chosen one types at one point or did someone just make that up?

#12 DarkAndFullOfTurnips

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:46 AM

Got to get that undead army some how?

There are like a million wildlings North of the Wall before aDwD and even still there are plenty.



#13 Agamemnon

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:53 AM

A lot of people on this forum believe there will be an ultimate show down with Jon and Dany vs the Others or Dany vs Jon, Bran, COTF, and the Others.

 

Could the Other's just be a red herring to destract from the ultimate battle for the throne in the final book.

 

I believe that the Other's will be defeated by the end of The Winds of Winter and possibly even before Dany arrives to Westeros. I mean really they melt when hit by obsidian, couldn't Westeros just chip some obsidian off the daggers or current arrow heads and make just the tip of all their arrows with obsidian. I think they will be defeated slightly easier than most of us think.

 

I believe then that after the Others are defeated, Jon or Bran will learn to weild their power and use it to take back the North.

 

I am sorry I can't quote, but there is both a dream scene where Dany is battling and her enemies are armored in ice.

Jon also has a dream scene that he is armored in black ice holding a flaming sword.

I believe that Jon is AAR and will defeat the Others, but then harnesses their power hence his ice armor.

 

Ultimatley it will be Dany vs Jon.  After R+L=J is revealed half the realm will rally to him and he will also have a lot of recognition by defeating hte OThers. Dany will be conquering. Many will bend the knee to her because of her dragons and foreign army. After learning of/ defeating the fake Aegon, she most certainly won't believe Jon is the real deal.

 

I believe the final book will play out like Aegon's landing..... foreign invaders conquering the realm with dragons, but this time the North WILL resist instead of bending the knee.

 

 

Sorry if there is spelling or Grammar mistakes--- no coffee yet :leaving:

The Others will not be defeated so easily, there are not even that many of them. A hundred? More than a thousand seems unlikely because the most we have seen at one time is 6, they have legions of undead though and that is why they are still in the north, to consolidate their zombie horde for one giant rush at the wall. They apparently stopped over in Hard Home to get some fresh levies. Also when the wights show up most likely the NW will panic and shoot all their obsidian at the first wave and watch it harmlessly stick into them while the popsicles are laughing safely out of range. Obsidian doesnt do squat on wights, only others and they will stay in the background, maybe even in mist form while the battles go on.

PS Jon's dream just said black armor it never said the armor was ice IIRC



#14 KingofSothoryos

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:56 AM

Truth to told, this is really the only real question I still have about the books. Are they an epic fantasy novel with chosen ones coming out just in time to defeat a threat of apocalyptic magnitude or is it something different, a fictional political drama that examines human character against the temptations of power, hidden under the guise of a fantasy novel. I'm sure it could be a little from column A and a little from column B. But if the Others are not the central conflict of the story, then it would truly move beyond being categorized as a fantasy story!

#15 Consigliere

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 08:58 AM

PS Jon's dream just said black armor it never said the armor was ice IIRC

 Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his fist.



#16 TheTowerOfJoy

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 09:21 AM

 Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his fist.

Black Ice could be a description of Obsidian (ie Dragonglass), FWIW.



#17 gamegeknee

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 09:51 AM

Got to get that undead army some how?

 That and they have to find some way to get past the wall.  Those two things are probably what they have been doing all this time. 



#18 Lord of Tree Tower

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:13 AM

Absolutly, I found it already terrible when Sam killed one of them :bang:

Sam accidentally killed an other, and frankly its meant to develop him as a character that grows. More so to demonstrate how competent Jon is as a leader (he makes those around him better). Sam's problem is that he was essentially neglected and abused by his father, which makes him have 0 confidence. Jon is changing that.  Just because Sam got lucky, doesnt mean that the Others are easy to kill. We cant forget the damage they did at the Fist of the First Men. Certainly not a red herring - not only are they the first antagonist of the books, but their presence is legendary in Westeros for the havoc that they bring. 



#19 Tetrarch42

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 12:39 PM

According to GRRM the true conflict lies with the Others, he said: "And it is important that the individual books refer to the civil wars, but the series title reminds us constantly that the real issue lies in the North beyond the Wall. Stannis becomes one of the few characters fully to understand that, which is why in spite of everything he is a righteous man, and not just a version of Henry VII, Tiberius or Louis XI."

 

Straight from the horse's mouth, so to speak, the Others aren't a red herring.


Edited by Tetrarch42, 11 October 2013 - 12:39 PM.


#20 Gurkhal

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 12:44 PM

I really hope its a Red Herring, because they aren't by far as interesting as the Game of Thrones.