Jaqen True face

[MidnightAurora]

I was wondering if we as a reader will get to know what Jaqen real name is and what his real face is??

Or does he not have a real face and is the living embodiment of the death god? Aside from the House of Black and White he is the only FLM we meet from a character;s POV. I was also wondering if Jaqen was the same assassin attempt that Dany met in Qarth.

Thoughts??

It seemed like Jaqen developed a fondness for Arya...

I also was wondering if Jaqen saw something in Arya and thus tried to get her to help him while he was stuck in the cage which to me it seemed like he would have been able to get out easily.

It seems like he is an other places pretty quickly to give the gift. Then I was thinking it was only after he swore to the Heart Tree and put his hand inside the mouth that made him scared because I think the old gods knew who he really was and coming for him quickly since he stuck his hand in the tree.

Anyways, I am wondering if we will get to see his true face and know his true name and which character it will be revealed to if at all. Or if there is no face to reveal because as stated above maybe he is the living embodiment of Death.

[Arya'sSanctuary]

I think he has a real face, arya is learning in the house of black and white how to "put on" another's face. While she is there, other FM come and go, so why would JH be the embodiment of death when there are many FM who do the same? I like to think that JH is the kindly man, though I have no proof--other than that the kindly man seems to know so much about Arya Stark ( though that could be the "tells" he and the waif are trying to slap out of her). I'm not sure of the timeline either, if arya and the KM are in Braavos when JH kills pate. What I really wonder is why it is ok for the FM to kill for money, yet JH only gives a life-for-a-life in Harrenhall. I don't understand the FM's ethos. :dunno:

[Death by Cupcakes]

I think he has a real face, arya is learning in the house of black and white how to "put on" another's face. While she is there, other FM come and go, so why would JH be the embodiment of death when there are many FM who do the same? I like to think that JH is the kindly man, though I have no proof--other than that the kindly man seems to know so much about Arya Stark ( though that could be the "tells" he and the waif are trying to slap out of her). I'm not sure of the timeline either, if arya and the KM are in Braavos when JH kills pate. What I really wonder is why it is ok for the FM to kill for money, yet JH only gives a life-for-a-life in Harrenhall. I don't understand the FM's ethos. :dunno:

They kill in return for a similar sacrifice, the way I understand, not for money as such.

But what I don´t really get is is the way Jaqen "moves" around:

He was first "found" in a Black Cell where he was recruited for the Nights Watch. Now, WHY was he in a Black Cell first place? Hardly involuntarily, I would guess. I mean with the ability to change face he could commit the worst crimes and easily get away.

So he went there on his own free will, which rises the question of Varys´ involvement. Did Jaqen intend to GET recruited into the Nights Watch? Seems to be a bit far-fetched and chancey but this is the only sense I can come up with. Who was supposed to be the target there?

And finally the question is why he reappears at the probably farthest place away from the Wall?

[Beathag]

I have trouble with Jaqen's movements too. Perhaps he was in KL to carry out some mission. But to allow himself to be chained up in the Black Cells, and uncomfortably carted off towards the wall is just odd. Maybe FM have to travel in whatever mode gets them to their target. Perhaps the Wall was never his destination, he just had to get north. I assume FM can be killed - perhaps he had to find the safest way to get north. Why he did not just volunteer is odd.

All the reader knows is that Jaqen was stuck at Harrenhal until he repaid his debt to Arya. Then he changes.

Perhaps he worked his way down fulfilling missions.

Now I am going to have to read that all over again.

This is all just guessing. Martin has given us so little information on FM.

[DarkBalerion]

I think Jaqen is just a standard FM that has been hired to do something specific not just a run of the mill assassination. In the prologue of AFFC a character known as The Alchemist is described in a similar way to JH's second face appears in Oldtown and kills Pate after getting the key that apparently opens every lock in The Citadel. At the end of AFFC Sam has reached The Citadel and is introduced to a boy called Pate, so JH is still playing a part in the story, which means there is a chance we could see his real face.

The questions I want answered are:

1) Who hired him? and how did they afford to pay the House of Black and White?

2) Why was he in the Black Cells?

3) What are his plans at Oldtown

The reason he is in Westeros is possibly to do with the NW, he was in the cart heading to the wall and now he has made contact with Sam.

Maybe he is going to use "the skeleton key" to get into The Citadel archives and acquire some information.

What do you think?

[Margaret Ballinger]

1 - The Lannisters maybe or possibly Littlefinger

2 - Who else was in the Black Cells - Ned Stark

3 - To find out about a certain egg from Euron.

Yes, Ned Stark

Yes, the rare Book on Dragons

Some like to believe that Syrio is Jaqen and that he was following her to make sure she was safe. But I have issues with this and I will try to address them by a timeline.

If he was Syrio and went there during Ned's arrest, he was in the Black Cells for at least a few days time, since Ned didn't confess for a few days.

During that time he was in the Black Cells, he had no idea where Arya was or even if she survived and escaped the Keep.

He remained in the Black Cells until Ned decided to confess. Yoren was informed to wait until they could make a big public show of it.

Jaqen was loaded up along with the rest, Yoren was waiting in the crowd and just happened to spot Arya.

Jaqen had no idea that Yoren would spot her, or even recognize her, or decide to help her for that matter.

But Jaqen was already in that wagon, so he was NOT there for her.

When given a task, Faceless Men will stalk their prey for a time to see how best to do the deed, and how close they can get. If Syrio was there for Ned it would make sense he would become the 'dancing master' for Arya to get close to the family. How did Ned find him so quickly anyhow? After Ned's arrest, Syrio disappears, but Jaqen appears within the Black Cells, which is the same level of the dungeons as Ned. Why would he be down there if not for Ned, or even in King's Landing at all for that matter? There was a target there, or he wouldn't have been in the Red Keep. All prisoners are given a choice to join the Night's Watch rather than suffer their punishment, and as Tyrion said "Most choose the knife." When Ned finally made the decision to confess and go to the wall, Jaqen was waiting in that wagon.

So why hire one for Ned? Who wanted him dead and had a lot of money? Tywin had already tried to kill him, and failed. He sent Gregor out into the Riverlands to attack the villages. No, more like he went on a rampage. Tywin knows the Starks well. "The one that passes the sentence..."

Only six Winterfell men remained of the twenty her father had sent west with Beric Dondarrion, Harwin told her, and they were scattered. “It was a trap, milady. Lord Tywin sent his Mountain across the Red Fork with fire and sword, hoping to draw your lord father. He planned for Lord Eddard to come west himself to deal with Gregor Clegane. If he had he would have been killed, or taken prisoner and traded for the Imp, who was your lady mother’s captive at the time. Only the Kingslayer never knew Lord Tywin’s plan, and when he heard about his brother’s capture he attacked your father in the streets of King’s Landing.”

A lot of people like to hate on Sansa for telling the Queen that Ned was sending her back home, thinking that was what got Ned killed, but really? He was dead the moment he left Winterfell. The Old Gods warned him not to go south, they send the Direwolf south, and when it met with the Stag they both died. The stags belly torn out, the wolf with an broken antler in it's throat. Tywin tried to trap and failed because Ned failed to show. Jaime somehow found out from someone *cough* Littlefinger *cough* that Ned was going to be at that brothel, and attacked him there. He was doomed from the start.

After Ned was dead, Jaqen didn't try to escape from the wagon, he stayed in that wagon until Yoren's party was attacked, so he was planning on going further North to his next target. Why walk, when you can sit back and ride? He only stayed with Arya until he paid her back. But he did know who she was, which suggests he could be Syrio.

Jaqen H’ghar your true name?”

“Some men have many names. Weasel. Arry. Arya.”

She backed away from him, until she was pressed against the heart tree. “Did Gendry tell?”

“A man knows,” he said again. “My lady of Stark.”

I don't believe his answer says that Gendry told, and I don't think Gendry would. But anyway, he still left because he had "other duties too." But he showed her his face changing ability, which I don't believe Faceless Men ever do in front of people, so why Arya? He might have had an affection towards Arya and felt sorry for what has happened to her. But if he was Syrio he might have seen that she had skills and promise of being a good Faceless Man.

After he departed Harrenhal he continued North, but he was not headed for the Wall. Also, who would want to kill anyone at the Wall. That place is punishment enough. And Faceless Men are very costly, so the target would have been of some importance. Not too many important people at the Wall.

If someone had wanted to kill Ned, he might also send him out after the two remaining boys at Winterfell as well. Maybe, maybe not. But he was headed North. The Ghost of the High Heart saw him:

"I dreamt of a man without a face, waiting on a bridge that swayed and swung. On his shoulder perched a drowned crow with seaweed hanging from his wings."

Balon Greyjoy fell from a bridge in a storm. Euron Greyjoy was in possession of a dragon's egg. He told Victarion that he threw it into the sea during one of his dark moods. The theory is that he gave it to Jaqen a payment. If this is true then he didn't completely lie to his brother, since he paid to send Balon into the sea.

There is a rare book at the Citadel on dragons. And now Jaqen is there.

[stateofdissipation]

I think Jaqen is just a standard FM that has been hired to do something specific not just a run of the mill assassination. In the prologue of AFFC a character known as The Alchemist is described in a similar way to JH's second face appears in Oldtown and kills Pate after getting the key that apparently opens every lock in The Citadel. At the end of AFFC Sam has reached The Citadel and is introduced to a boy called Pate, so JH is still playing a part in the story, which means there is a chance we could see his real face.

The questions I want answered are:

1) Who hired him? and how did they afford to pay the House of Black and White?

2) Why was he in the Black Cells?

3) What are his plans at Oldtown

The reason he is in Westeros is possibly to do with the NW, he was in the cart heading to the wall and now he has made contact with Sam.

Maybe he is going to use "the skeleton key" to get into The Citadel archives and acquire some information.

What do you think?

Who hired him is linked to who he was sent to kill

We know from kingslanding it was never discussed. So the person that did the hiring was able to fund it without involving other characters. That limits it to Varys, Illyrio, and Littlefinger.

Varys and Illyrio come from Bravos and would know where to go. Littlefinger seems to have some knowledge of the Faceless Men. (complains about price at the small council and remarks on their efficiency to Ned,)

Jaqen was in the black cells because he wanted to be there and was headed to the wall because he wanted to be. The fact that Jaqen continued north from god's eye to Harrenhal after his release adds to the idea that he meant to be heading in that direction. That would tend to suggest that his target was at the wall.

The next time Jaqen is seen is in Oldtown. There are only twi charactera that were at the Wall when Jaqen was headed there and then in Oldtown: Sam and Aemon.

From KL only Varys and Illyrio might wish to get rid of Aemon. He was a possible complication to making a Dany puppet. Sam's father was not fond of him and couldi have sent a FM to put him out of his misery.

Faceless Men do not steal. The idea that the alchemist wants something from the citadel was floated by Pate. Pate was not the sharpest tool in the shed. He had failed to earn a single link. He also was largely in charge of taking care of the decrpit and deranged former maester in charge of ravens. Pate was far from reliable or clever.

Faceless Men are neither run of the mill nor assassins. They are priests. Their price is always high or dear but always within the means of the person asking if they are willing to make a sacrifice. That is not the mark of a for profit organization, The faceless men are true believers and servants of the manyfaced god. They do not see death as a penalty but a natural part of life and a merciful end to suffering. Their contract killings are a sacrament to their god.

That being said JH will use the skeleton key and somebody will not wake up in the morning.

[DarkBalerion]

On a side note. For Arya to change her face she had to put a dead persons face on top of hers, does that mean that FM carry peeled off faces in their pockets? Or is Arya's method just for beginners?

[Ashara's daughter]

Whoever hired him had to pay a lot, FM take 2/3 (or 1/3?) of your wealth and something that's dear to you, which means only a select few could afford him. Who he was sent there to kill is a big mystery but we know he failed, which is odd for a faceless man....therefore, I have this theory that he was not hired, but sent there by the FM themselves and not to kill someone.

Jaquen was in the dark cells, which places him in proximity of the dragon skulls, from which it could be assumed that he was trying to learn something about dragons, he could've also gone to Pycelle's room or anywhere information about dragons could be hidden about the red keep. Then we see him in Oldtown which is known to have rare books about dragonlore, how to control them, their weakness, etc. Thus it could be concluded the FM are trying to learn something about dragons. This leads me to 2 conclusions first, Euron Greyjoy talks about tossing a dragon's egg into the sea but it's speculated that he really used it to hire the FM to kill Balon, in which case the FM own a dragon egg and are looking for ways to hatch it. The second is they were either hired by Illyrio to kill the dragons or just see the existence of dragons a threat and want to kill them, the theory that the FM caused the doom of Valyria could fit into this.

As to Jaquen's true face, I have no idea which character that we know he could possibly be for his true face to matter. Perhaps Syrio?

[Crowzeye]

As it's widely speculated that FM were involved in the Doom of Valyria and it's dragons that gave them their power. Might be they are scared of Dany's dragon's and want them gone again.

[atiggerx33]

1 - The Lannisters maybe or possibly Littlefinger

2 - Who else was in the Black Cells - Ned Stark

3 - To find out about a certain egg from Euron.

Yes, Ned Stark

Yes, the rare Book on Dragons

Some like to believe that Syrio is Jaqen and that he was following her to make sure she was safe. But I have issues with this and I will try to address them by a timeline.

If he was Syrio and went there during Ned's arrest, he was in the Black Cells for at least a few days time, since Ned didn't confess for a few days.

During that time he was in the Black Cells, he had no idea where Arya was or even if she survived and escaped the Keep.

He remained in the Black Cells until Ned decided to confess. Yoren was informed to wait until they could make a big public show of it.

Jaqen was loaded up along with the rest, Yoren was waiting in the crowd and just happened to spot Arya.

Jaqen had no idea that Yoren would spot her, or even recognize her, or decide to help her for that matter.

But Jaqen was already in that wagon, so he was NOT there for her.

When given a task, Faceless Men will stalk their prey for a time to see how best to do the deed, and how close they can get. If Syrio was there for Ned it would make sense he would become the 'dancing master' for Arya to get close to the family. How did Ned find him so quickly anyhow? After Ned's arrest, Syrio disappears, but Jaqen appears within the Black Cells, which is the same level of the dungeons as Ned. Why would he be down there if not for Ned, or even in King's Landing at all for that matter? There was a target there, or he wouldn't have been in the Red Keep. All prisoners are given a choice to join the Night's Watch rather than suffer their punishment, and as Tyrion said "Most choose the knife." When Ned finally made the decision to confess and go to the wall, Jaqen was waiting in that wagon.

So why hire one for Ned? Who wanted him dead and had a lot of money? Tywin had already tried to kill him, and failed. He sent Gregor out into the Riverlands to attack the villages. No, more like he went on a rampage. Tywin knows the Starks well. "The one that passes the sentence..."

Only six Winterfell men remained of the twenty her father had sent west with Beric Dondarrion, Harwin told her, and they were scattered. “It was a trap, milady. Lord Tywin sent his Mountain across the Red Fork with fire and sword, hoping to draw your lord father. He planned for Lord Eddard to come west himself to deal with Gregor Clegane. If he had he would have been killed, or taken prisoner and traded for the Imp, who was your lady mother’s captive at the time. Only the Kingslayer never knew Lord Tywin’s plan, and when he heard about his brother’s capture he attacked your father in the streets of King’s Landing.”

A lot of people like to hate on Sansa for telling the Queen that Ned was sending her back home, thinking that was what got Ned killed, but really? He was dead the moment he left Winterfell. The Old Gods warned him not to go south, they send the Direwolf south, and when it met with the Stag they both died. The stags belly torn out, the wolf with an broken antler in it's throat. Tywin tried to trap and failed because Ned failed to show. Jaime somehow found out from someone *cough* Littlefinger *cough* that Ned was going to be at that brothel, and attacked him there. He was doomed from the start.

After Ned was dead, Jaqen didn't try to escape from the wagon, he stayed in that wagon until Yoren's party was attacked, so he was planning on going further North to his next target. Why walk, when you can sit back and ride? He only stayed with Arya until he paid her back. But he did know who she was, which suggests he could be Syrio.

Jaqen H’ghar your true name?”

“Some men have many names. Weasel. Arry. Arya.”

She backed away from him, until she was pressed against the heart tree. “Did Gendry tell?”

“A man knows,” he said again. “My lady of Stark.”

I don't believe his answer says that Gendry told, and I don't think Gendry would. But anyway, he still left because he had "other duties too." But he showed her his face changing ability, which I don't believe Faceless Men ever do in front of people, so why Arya? He might have had an affection towards Arya and felt sorry for what has happened to her. But if he was Syrio he might have seen that she had skills and promise of being a good Faceless Man.

After he departed Harrenhal he continued North, but he was not headed for the Wall. Also, who would want to kill anyone at the Wall. That place is punishment enough. And Faceless Men are very costly, so the target would have been of some importance. Not too many important people at the Wall.

If someone had wanted to kill Ned, he might also send him out after the two remaining boys at Winterfell as well. Maybe, maybe not. But he was headed North. The Ghost of the High Heart saw him:

"I dreamt of a man without a face, waiting on a bridge that swayed and swung. On his shoulder perched a drowned crow with seaweed hanging from his wings."

Balon Greyjoy fell from a bridge in a storm. Euron Greyjoy was in possession of a dragon's egg. He told Victarion that he threw it into the sea during one of his dark moods. The theory is that he gave it to Jaqen a payment. If this is true then he didn't completely lie to his brother, since he paid to send Balon into the sea.

There is a rare book at the Citadel on dragons. And now Jaqen is there.

This is one of the best and most well thought out theories I have heard thus far. I also took that Gendry did not tell Jaqen who Arya was, but could never figure out how Jaqen knew. Arya was more careful than that, even if he had figured out she was a girl, that would in no way conclude to him that she was Arya Stark if he had never met her. It therefore makes a lot of sense that he was Syrio.

However, I don't think the Lannisters ever wanted Ned dead, except for Jaime and Joffrey. Jaime always does his own killing, it's stated numerous times, he would not have paid the FM, and Joffrey does not have the means to do so without so much gold going missing, plus it's seen the stupid people he hires to commit his murders (the cutthroat sent after Bran). The FM are very expensive, and I don't think Tywin would hire them it would be too costly to do so, plus he wanted to trade for Tyrion, it wouldn't be in his best interest, unless he wanted to get rid of Tyrion, but there are much cheaper ways for him to kill Tyrion. I don't think Cersei would have done it either, she councils Joffrey to let him take the black, she could have just told him to have Ned killed. Jaime was not yet taken, or if he was Cersei did not yet know, so that could not have been her reason for sparing him. She believed Tyrion was still captured at the time, as she is surprised when he shows up alive in King's Landing, so she could have seen killing Ned as a way of getting rid of who she believes to be the valonqar as well.

[MegaTechPC]

Some amazing theories on my favorite character JH! If what Margaret said turns out to be true then I have an even greater and new found respect for GRRM and his writing. That is a long and convoluted setup that has been going on since nearly the first book for a character that is barely even fleshed out. It amazes me the things he's set in motion and the plans/plots he's had to keep up with from so many different characters. The man is truly a genius.

[Hielo y Fuego]

Sam's father was not fond of him and couldi have sent a FM to put him out of his misery.

No need for this at all. If Randyll Tarly wanted Sam dead, he wouldn't have bothered in sending him to the Wall. Sam would've had that hunting "accident" that his father warned him he would have, should he refuse to take the Black. Furthermore, sending an FM (and more importantly, covering their fee) to get rid of someone like Sam would be overkill.

Jaqen was at Oldtown to do Pate, just as the AFfC prologue shows. No need to overthink this.

[Keltess]

Maybe I am just too enthralled by the books, but GRRM does like to drop hints and clues. Look at the descriptions of the man Jaqen (who was from Lorath but obviously had ties to Bravos, the faceless man coin) transforms into in front of Arya. His hair becomes dark and curly he has a prominent hooked nose and a GOLD tooth. although GRRM often talks of brown , green , or rotting teeth this is the only mention of a gold tooth. Now read the description of Daario Naharis flamboyant even for a Tyroshi with long dark curly hair ( it grew ) a hooked nose and a gold tooth, (mentioned more than once). Coloring his hair and beard and his fine clothes were part of his disguise. Jaqen does have a certain flair to his persona also. Both men were attractive and skilled with arms. Jaqen was a Mercenary in Westeros, and a ruthless Sellsword when he arrives on the scene at Yunkai. It is still possible time wise that he was in Kings Landing to attempt to kill, most likely Robert , then when Robert died, Ned Stark was the power to be dealt with. He had time to then go kill Balon Greyjoy. Proceed across the Narrow Sea and he arrives at Yunkai. He kills two of the Second Sons captains to instill confidence in Daenerys, moving him in to her circle of Captains and Advisors very quickly. All of the actions taken above could be for Daenerys' benefit. All of these Characters were from the " Free cities" I am very disappointed in the choice of actor for Daario or maybe just the costuming/makeup. Nothing Flamboyant about him, he looks like all the other men at arms. Nothing in particular to set a young girls heart a flutter. I wonder if the whole affair between them will make it to the HBO version.

[MegaTechPC]

Interesting theory but Daario's personality is NOTHING like that of Jacquen's. True, Jacquen could've been playing a role at Harrenhall but I think its a major stretch to think Jacquen = Daario...

[Keltess]

A Personality is put on much easier than a completely different face. You would want to act differently in a different situation to make the face convincing. Arya does not have the same personality as "Mercy" that she did as " Salty". again the physical transformation that Jaqen undergoes sounds much like the appearance of Daario minus the flashy clothing and hair. From Lorathi to Bravossi. I ask you to read the descriptions of the two men and compare. And Thank You for responding to my post !