Jump to content


  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

About White26

  • Rank

Recent Profile Visitors

559 profile views
  1. I was recommending this book several times there. Wait for Guccio's Baglioni's son.
  2. But then, Ned could say "We had no claim to the throne" so it is not that sure and left open to interpretation.
  3. I also for a long time wondered if there is something behind this line: Robert sat down again. - "Damn you, Ned Stark. You and Jon Arryn, I loved you both. What have you done to me? You were the one should have been king, you or Jon." - "You had the better claim, Your Grace." Could it mean that Arryns and Starks alos have Targaryen blood, some distant marriages, or it only mean that he had the better claim because he was related to Targaryens and they not? In the first outline of ASOIAF there were supposed to be more persons with a claim to Iron Throne. Jamie was supposed to be king after Joffrey killing everyone with better claim than his. So who knows. I also wonder if this line will have something to do with how the show ended...
  4. Don't pay too much attention to family names. They were not a thing in medieval world. Henry I didn't care that his grandson, future Henry II would have different "house name". Henry I didn't have a house name to begin with. Marin knew this yet his world seems more static than real medieval world, yet he found a solution for that. Most obvious is that a heir can choose his mother's or wife's family name so Joffrey Lydden, when married Lannister princess, became Joffrey Lannister and with him began younger, Andal, Lannister branch. So present Lannisters are descendant from Lann the Clever only in female line. There are other possibilities, like you mentioned, "making" cadet branch like Lannister of Darry etc. Joining house names and sigils like house Nymeros Martell. So Martin is aware of real medieval world's fluidity with family names. We call French dynasties Capetians and later Valois but house Valois was in fact the same house as Capetians, descended in male line. We should also remember this line: "I will, ser," said Leobald, and only then raised the matter of Lady Hornwood. Poor thing, with no husband to defend her lands nor son to inherit. His own lady wife was a Hornwood, sister to the late Lord Halys, doubtless they recalled. "An empty hall is a sad one. I had a thought to send my younger son to Lady Donella to foster as her own. Beren is near ten, a likely lad, and her own nephew. He would cheer her, I am certain, and perhaps he would even take the name Hornwood". So with Sansa and Tyrion, their son could take a name 'House Lannister of Winterfell" with Lion and Wolf as his sigil (badass) or name "Lannister Stark" like Martells, or even a Stark name like Joffrey Lydden. Same goes for Velaryons, they could call themselfs Targaryens, there was even a line in Fire&Blood when one of the boys says he is true Targaryen.
  5. Yes and it could be said the same in history, what proof we have that one king is a son of another. There is other good Byzantine example, Leon VI the Macedonian. He wa supposed to be a son of Basil I, founder of a dynasty. Basil was an adviser of Michael III the Amorian whom he assassinated and took the throne. What is interesting, Basil was married to Eudokia Ingerina, former mistress of Michael. It is speculated that Leon VI is in fact son of Michael III, not Basil I. So officially Amorian dynasty went extinct with Michael III but there is a possiblity that it lived on through Michael VI. BTW paralel with Tywin Joanna and Aerys is striking.
  6. If he wins, he will be Aegon VI Targaryen, son of Rhaegar, if he lose, he will be branded as impostor and no one. I could even imagine it would be satisfying to Varys to put a Blackfyre on the throne in disguise. It would be in line with his whole character.
  7. Martin plays there traditional tale of usurpation of identity by a pretendent. There were many examples of it in history starting with Heliogabalus who was presented as illegitimate son of emperor Caracalla but in practice he was only a son of woman related to Julia Domna wife of emperor Septimius Severus. Still his rebellion succeeded and he was officialy a son of Caracalla (oficially Marcus Aurelius Commodus) but after his infamous reign and death, he was called Pseudo Antoninus. Other example is Pseudo Michael VII, Byzantine emperor who was in the hands of Norman duke Robert Guiscard who used him as a pretext to invade Byzantine empire. Real Michael VII was bishiop of Ephesus at the time and was later presented at besieged Dyrrachium to show that the other one is fake. There are many more but Martin based his account on the history of Jean I of France presented by Maurice Druon in The Accursed Kings which I recommend for everyone to read. Basically Jean I was replaced with son of other character, Baglioni, in order to safe his life from poisoning. He was rised as someone else. Then his identity was revealed to him by Cola di Rienzo, so called tribune of Rome which has strong resemblence to Ilirio Mopatis. He went to France but no one took his claim and was soon imprisoned and we never heard of him. This was based on real story although swapping was fictional. So in Druon's novel he was real Jean I, in history he was a fake, like with all of these pretendents who miraculously come to life in time of turbulance. What path Martin went? I don't know and probably I will never know. I agree, because the truth doesn't matter, power resides where people believe it resides. It doesn't mater if he is real or if people and nobles will trully believe he is real. It's all about power and politics, if his claim would be useful for lord then he will follow his claim. I suppose Daenerys will not believe he is real only because he can't prove it and that he stands in her way to the throne, like Aegon II stood in a way of Rhaenyra, how it ended for both of them we know and it will end probably the same for Daenerys and fAegon.
  8. I don't think that it was a "material" i.e. higborn/king blood that made a cost but knowledge of spells and magic to use it and forge valyrian steel.
  9. Not sure with kings but it is possible that Valyrian steel was created with blood sacriface/blood magic, same as dragon hatching.
  10. They will be defeated in the Riverlands I think. This region is special, not considered a kingdom, Harrenhal, battle of the Trident, God's Eye, Isle of Fces, Green Men, Old Stones, Brotherhood Without Banners, Ghost of High Heart. Many things with magical/mystic flavour to them which are all a build up to the Long Night IMHO.
  11. Are you so sure? I have a feeling Timmet will rule the Vale at the end integrating clans with the rest of society.
  12. Not sure if these are minor details or major but anyway: Story behind house Dayne and their connection to the Great Empire of the Dawn. First Long Night in Essos and its causes/what Bloodstone Emperor did. Origins of dragons. Reasons of the doom of Valyria. To see more of the Citadel. Timmet's backstory and his connection to the Arryns.
  13. Commerce was considered a lowborn undertaking in middle ages so I suppose it fits with Martin world as well - "counting coppers" comes to mind. Lannister power was based on land, as all other lords, what gave them adventage were gold mines.
  14. fAegon for sure. Not that he himself my be important as a character, not much chance for him being POV in Winds of Winter, but with him D&D put Dorne and Varys plot lines to the grave.
  15. fAegon and with him other characters, places and plots were cut out - Varys, Arianne, Golden Company, Dorne and Stormlands.
  • Create New...