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Alexis-something-Rose

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  1. Dany didn't give birth to an adult. She gave birth to a baby. I'm not sure how toddler Rhaego is planning on riding a dragon and controlling it, or leading a khalasar when his language skills would be limited. This isn't Baby Yoda. Khal Pono could give a rat's ass about Drogo's son. He wouldn't take him and raise him, he would kill him if he doesn't sell him into slavery first. Rhaego is deader than dead. He is dust. When he died, the prophecy died with him. The end.
  2. I don't know how much that would prove. Alyn Velaryon was almost torched by Sheepstealer, while Nettles whose lineage is extremely ambiguous tamed the dragon and his brother Addam became a dragon rider. Meanwhile, Brown Ben Plumm who has Targaryen blood from about hundred years ago is well-liked by Dany's dragons. I'm pretty much in the minority here, but I don't think the dance 2.0 is happening between Dany and Aegon. And I don't think slayer of lies means that she will be killing Stannis or Aegon. You can also slay a lie by exposing the truth, and I don't think that lie has anything to do with Aegon's paternity, but rather with what Rhaegar thought he was, the PtwP, which is what Mel thinks Stannis is. That's not to say that there will not be friction between them, but I've always had a very difficult time seeing an all out war between Dany and Aegon. I don't think Aegon will be king when Dany arrives in Westeros. I think Euron will be. And I think he's the one who will have a dragon and he will be the one she has to contend with.
  3. I think they are mostly dead. I think the younger girls like Beth Cassel and Joseth's daughters, Turnip, might still be alive, working in the Dreadfort. But I think Palla is dead. I think Old Nan might be dead too, which is just pretty sad if her long life ended in the dungeons of the Dreadfort. So this was a depressing exercise.
  4. I think he will end up with one of Dany's dragons and that he is the one she fights against in this Dance of the Dragons 2.0. That's how he dies, in some air battle.
  5. It's a strong possibility, but it's also an assumption since we know next to nothing about the wildling kings of old and their motivation. The reason I think there could be more to it is because of what we have currently in the story with Mance. The wildlings came together under essentially one "banner" to be led south of the Wall for protection and I don't think that the idea that this also happened under Raymund Redbeard, Bael the Bard, all the way down to Joramun who was in possession of a horn that could allegedly bring the Wall down. Every few hundred years (or thousands maybe?), the wildlings get themselves a king and they try to come south of the Wall.
  6. That the Others were already migrating south? No, there's nothing specific to that in the text. The only thing I can point to is maybe Raymund Redbeard's attempt at invading the north in 226 AC and the Battle at Long Lake where Edwyle's father was killed. This was 7 years before Bloodraven was exiled to the Wall. I think there could be something to the wildlings coming under a king at various points in time and trying to force the Wall, but it's really all speculation.
  7. Fanfic theory? Coming from you? Really? And nowhere in what I wrote talked about a rebellion against the Targaryen. This has nothing to do with Bloodraven organizing some sort of rebellion against the Targaryens.
  8. Dorne will do what Dorne does. Want vengeance. Thing is, Quentyn isn't the only one who died during this mission. Cletus Yronwood died too. His father is at the head of an army right now in the Boneway and I think it's his actions that could end up determining the course of the story for Dorne.
  9. I misunderstood your original statement. I do think Maester Aemon would have tried to prepare Jon as well as he could. It would be interesting is he spoke to him about some of the Targaryen lore for instance and shed light on what they knew or thought they knew. I don't think Bloodraven himself knew all that much about the dragonglass business or how the Others were defeated during the first Long Night. If he had, he may not have needed to go to the hollow hill beyond the Wall to become a decayed tree person and I wonder if the Wall did for his brand of sorcery what it has done for Melisandre's. That said, I think there's a difference between knowing the Long Night is coming and knowing how to beat the Others. All anyone can really do is try to get ahead of it and prepare as well as they can. It's not all that different from what the world is presently going through with the virus.
  10. Bloodraven was with the Night's Watch for almost 20 years. 13 of those were spent as Lord Commander. I don't see how he wouldn't have gone to Winterfell, especially if Winterfell was central to the first Long Night. The men of the Night's Watch like Denys Mallister and Qhorin Halfhand both knew Rickard Stark, because they mention him to Jon. There seems to be continuous interaction between the Starks and the Night's Watch. We don't know that Bloodraven didn't share anything with Aemon. Maester Aemon was well aware of the PtwP and the War for the Dawn. The interaction between Maester Aemon and Jon on page was very limited. We don't know what Aemon and Jon discussed, but Aemon did tell Jon that knowledge is a weapon and to arm himself well before he rides forth into battle. He did leave him the book with that passage on Lightbringer, which tuned Jon to the knowledge that the sword is not real. We don't know what more things he left for him or what he might have told him that we don't know yet.
  11. 1. Fuck D&D and the horse they rode on. I cut my losses before the end of season 4. 2. The thread isn't about Bloodraven specifically. If you choose to focus on him, that's fine. I think he's someone who made some really terrible mistakes that are going to be very costly. I am thinking about Euron specifically here and the Damphair TWoW sample chapter. But this thread has nothing to do with that. If you wanna start a Bloodraven is an agent of the Great Other who is trying to corrupt a little boy thread, or whatever, then by all means. Leaf says that Coldhands was killed a long time ago. This was written in the text for some reason. Anyway. Like I said the purpose of the thread was not to look at how evil Bloodraven is. I was trying to look at "southern ambitions" from a different angle, one that I never saw brought up or discussed.
  12. Pretty much. That's not to say that there couldn't have been some ambition on Rickard's part, but I think the crux of the whole thing was to try and prepare the north for what's coming. So yes, I think that Bloodraven may have been forthcoming with Edwyle who started making plans. I think it's just extremely easy to forget that Bloodraven spent 20 years on the Wall and was in very close (or closer proximity) to Winterfell during that time.
  13. When I read stuff like this (and it's really nothing against you personally) and it feels like the OP completely failed at what it was trying to convey in the first place. All I was trying to say was that Bloodraven was in the north at the same time his kinsman, a man who shared his Blackwood blood, was the head of Winterfell, which I think is really important to the overall story and what was going on in the north during Edwyle and Rickard's time as lords. This isn't about Bloodraven being a master manipulator. It's about the possible knowledge that he might have imparted to his kin who are responsible for the north and the realm's first line of defense before he disappeared beyond the Wall. There are things happening with the Starks that are happening with the Targaryens around the same time, including all those betrothals they're making outside their own bloodline. That said, Benjen is not Coldhands. GRRM answered that question years ago, so you need to go back to drawing board. Bloodraven is the ends justifies the means sort of person and that doesn't seem to have changed during his life as a tree. I'm not sure it makes him evil, but having single-minded focus on something is not great either, especially if he ended up making the big oopsie that gave us Euron Crow's Eye.
  14. It's possible. I don't doubt the Tully tree has some Blackwoods in it. Question is, how far back it goes. I think the Stark tree does yield some of the answers we're looking for, especially when we manage to somewhat line up the date/time. We have 226 AC as a starting point for House Stark. When I was looking back at some of the things we know from the time of Aegon V, one of the other things that stood out to me was that Daenora Targaryen was the daughter of a Alys Arryn with Rhaegal Targaryen. That Alys Arryn could possibly have been Jasper Arryn's sister (he named his only daughter Alys), which would make Daenora Jon Arryn's cousin. She married Aeron Targaryen and was the mother of that Maegor, making that boy Aegon V's nephew. And even Alys Arryn wasn't Jon Arryn's aunt, we still have very fairly recent ties between House Arryn and House Targaryen making it even harder for me to believe that the Starks, the Arryns and the Tullys were fomenting some sort of a rebellion against the Targaryens.
  15. No, this is not a thread about how it's all Bloodraven's fault! (sorry this is all bolded, but it's written on a different document and for some reason copy/paste insists that this has to be bold). I hope this is semi-coherent. Was "southron ambitions" really about Rickard Stark having different ambitions for his House? Was he really looking to rise against House Targaryen? Or was it something else entirely? The thing is, and as a rule of thumb, the first answer provided in a mystery or a “mystery” is rarely the real answer or the full answer. Who is Jon’s mother? Catelyn thinks it’s Ashara Dayne, but we get introduced to Wylla, and the fisherman’s daughter. Who was the Knight of the Laughing Tree? Bran believes it was the little crannogman. Was Rhaegar really trying to recreate the conqueror trio of Aegon? This is what Dany thinks. Were the marriages Rickard Stark was arranging for his children really born out of ambition or was it something else? For me, there was always something off with this. I know the speculations about checking the power of the Targaryens (a House that no longer had dragons, and was dwindled) or rebelling against the crown. Well that rebellion sure took a long time to happen, didn’t it? And it didn’t happen because one of the members of this so-called alliance was brutally executed alongside his heir. It happened because Aerys called for Ned and Robert’s heads. And even after Jon Arryn called his banners, Hoster Tully stayed well out of it. He joined the fray only after Jon Arryn agreed to marry Lysa. So yes, I think the fostering of Ned in the Vale, Brandon’s betrothal to Catelyn didn’t have all that much with countering the Targaryens. Lyanna’s own betrothal to Robert, the app says that the marriage proposal came from Robert and that Rickard accepted it. We don’t know what his plans were for her, if he had any at that point. And Ned at 18-19 years old was not even betrothed yet. So those plans for his second born son are a complete mystery. Things sort of started to click into place when I looked at the Stark family tree. It’s an incomplete family tree, or at least not detailed to the level of the Targaryen one. But there is something extremely interesting about it and that’s the marriage of Melantha Blackwood to Willam Stark. Two children are born from that marriage, Edwyle, who was Rickard’s father, and Jocelyn, who was married off into the Vale and gave us those Vale cousins Catelyn mentioned to Robb in ASoS, after he makes his intentions on legitimizing Jon Snow and naming him his heir clear to her. We don’t really know when Edwyle was born, but he would be a contemporary of Egg and Betha Blackwood’s children, if not a very close kin depending on what Betha and Melantha were to each other. We know his father died at Long Lake in 226 AC when Raymund Redbeard and his wildlings breached the Wall, and we know his uncle, Artos the Implacable became his regent (he is the lord with the statue in the crypts). We don’t know if he died before Edwyle turned 16 or after. It’s a bit of a handicap trying to figure out ages when we don’t have much to go in the first place, but if he was born the same year his father died, at the latest, then he would have reached his majority by 242 AC. Edwyle Stark was a half-Blackwood child. This is the very interesting part of his character, I think. In 233 AC, a Great Council was called to determine succession. Bloodraven had Aenys Blackfyre beheaded after he promised him safe passage. Bloodraven is sent to the Wall to cool his jets for the rest of his natural life. Bloodraven is a Blackwood, same as the Lord of Winterfell. They are kinsmen. This is where things become interesting, imo. Bloodraven spent close to 20 years on the Wall, and 13 of those years were spent as Lord Commander. He would have had plenty of opportunity to travel to Winterfell and sit with the half-Blackwood lord of Winterfell. Did Bloodraven go into the crypts? That’s where Bran opened his third eye and reached Jon while he was in the Frostfangs, so there must be some sort of power there that's equivalent to a weirwood. Incidentally, this is as good a place to hide Dark Sister as any, if Bloodraven knew he would be going beyond the Wall to not return. Did he visit the godswood? Theon saw Bran’s face carved into the weirwood in A Ghost in Winterfell, ADwD 46. We know he hears his name whispered when the leaves rustle. Something similar happens in the weirwood vision Bran had of his father. What if Bloodraven told the Lord of Winterfell certain things? What if he passed things he knew on to him? What if this lord who shared his blood was receptive to what Bloodraven had to say and even troubled by it? I know, it's a lot of what ifs. On the other side of Westeros, interesting things are also happening. In 239 AC, Duncan Targaryen also a half-Blackwood and who would be a contemporary of Edwyle, marries Jenny of Oldstones. And she brings with her to court the Ghost of High Heart. An albino woman, with red eyes, possibly with the blood of the children of the forest, touched by the old gods, has accurate dreams and visions lands in Targaryen court. Bloodraven leaves court and his family behind. He is replaced by a woman who is similar in looks to him, and has prophetic dreams some six years later. He ends up in the north where he and the lord of Winterfell (and the Warden of the North) are kin through their Blackwood lineage. Now, two other things of note in the Stark tree. The first reported marriage outside of the north was Cregan Stark’s to Alysanne Blackwood. Then we have to wait until Beron Stark marries Lorra Royce to see another one. Their son Willam marries Melantha Blackwood (1st or 2nd wife, I don’t think we know). So we have two consecutive marriages with brides brought from outside the north. Then we get two more marriages, but these ones, it’s a Stark female who is sent away from the north. And both marriages seem to happen under Edwyle’s watch. The first marriage is his sister’s Jocelyn. She is married into House Royce of the junior branch and we know her daughters married into Houses Waynwood, Templeton and Corbray, giving Rickard cousins there. Anya Waynwood could very well be his cousin. The other marriage is that of Edwyle’s niece, Branda. She was married off into House Rogers of the Stormlands. We know next to nothing about House Rogers, but these are two southern marriages that were made while Edwyle was the Lord of Winterfell. So whatever was going with Rickard’s so-called ambitions, marriages outside the north started in earnest during his father’s time as lord. Edwyle marries into House Locke, the southernmost House of the north, discounting the Neck. There just don’t seem to be Stark marriages with the Neck. House Locke seems to be a knightly House if we go by the other two members that we know of, Ser Mallador Locke and Ser Donnel Locke. And they seem to keep the old gods, if we go by all the time Sybelle Glover used to spend in her godswood or by what Lord Ondrew Locke had to say about the snows and the cold. So House Locke could be a north meets south type House, where they adopted some southern traits, but stick to the main traditions of the north. If Edwyle was marrying his sister and his niece into southron Houses, then why didn’t he bring a bride for his son from the south? I actually have an answer for that! If we line up dates according to what’s given us in relation to House Targaryen, then Edwyle’s only child, his son Rickard, would have married around the same time as Aerys and Rhaella, or within two years of them, since Brandon was born in 262 AC. We know that they were married off by their father because the Ghost of High Heart told him that the Prince that was Promised would come from their line. And it’s not like she would have been wrong on that account. Rickard married his cousin Lyarra. Lyarra Stark is as close to a sibling as Rickard had. The Starks don't fuck their siblings (no matter how hard some want to believe it), but they will marry their cousins, their uncles and their aunts. What if we are following the same scenario here? The Ghost of High Heart took Bloodraven’s place at court, but Bloodraven is at the Wall until 252 AC. Rickard and his future wife would have been born before Bloodraven became a tree wizard person. What if the same scenario that applied to Aerys and Rhaella and their marriage also applies to Rickard, Lyarra and their marriage. If Jon Snow is the Prince that was Promised (or one of), then yes, the Prince that was Promised would be coming down from their line, through Lyanna. Heck, unless there’s something special about Catelyn’s blood, the next greenseer has come from their line, through Ned. All grandchildren are wargs, and if we go with the notion that Lyanna is Jon’s mother, then it means that Brandon and Benjen’s children would have been wargs as well. I’ve always had the impression that there was a lot more to Rickard than southern ambitions, and that he might have known a thing or two about the Long Night and this whole Prince that was Promised business, but I never looked at him and his father sharing blood with Bloodraven or even considered that Bloodraven would have traveled to Winterfell and interacted with the Starks (and Old Nan) or walked the halls of Winterfell or spent time in the crypts and the godswood. Bloodraven is so little mentioned in the main series that sometimes I forget he exists. Even in his interaction with Bran, I tend to forget who he was or what he is to Bran. Even the choice of maester for Rickard is interesting. A bastard Hightower. The Hightowers are said to have dabbled in alchemy, necromancy and other sorceries. They might even be in possession of a glass candle. If Barristan Selmy knew about the Ghost of High Heart’s prediction about the Prince that was Promised coming from Aerys and Rhaella’s line, then the odds that Lord Commander Gerold Hightower knew this information is more than plausible. He was present when Rickard and Brandon were executed and he died at the ToJ doing what he considered to be his duty. Sure, Rickard could have been doing what he was doing partly for ambition, but I think it had more to do with safekeeping the north and preparing it when the Long Night fell once more. Hoster Tully would never abandon his precious little Cat in her time of need. The riverlands can send food and soldiers. And I don't think Robert Baratheon for all his faults would abandon Ned in his time of need. Lyanna wouldn’t abandon the north either. Maester Aemon is on the Wall, so he’d have the Targaryens covered, plus this is right up their alley. Before long, this would become a massive undertaking to protect the realm. I think Rickard held knowledge from his father, so whatever Winterfell had forgotten, as Jojen put it, perhaps they were remembering. But he died and whatever he knew died with him. I do however think that Maester Walys is still out there somewhere, perhaps in Oldtown. If anyone knows the whole truth of the so-called southern ambitions, he would. I just don't think it's a coincidence that Blackwoods marrying Starks and Targaryens is a coincidence or that Bloodraven ending up on the Wall while a half-Blackwood man is the head of House Stark and the Warden of the North is a coincidence. I think there's something important happening here.
  16. There's nothing. There's a lot of Ser Denys, but Elbert is mentioned as Elbert only. Oddly enough, I can't even find him in the app of Ice and Fire.
  17. You can add to that Bran's dream about Ned being in the crypts, following his death, and his sadness over Jon.
  18. Sure. He very well could end up wielding Dawn, but Ashara doesn't have to be his mother for that. It's possible that Dyanna Dayne was placed in the Targaryen tree for that reason. Jon was basically one degree removed from her while he was around Maester Aemon.
  19. Was the dragon scared or was the dragon stopped? If ice can't cross the Wall to go south, maybe fire can't cross the Wall to go north.
  20. Tywin never promised anything, Tyrion did. The answer is in the text. Gregor scares the shit out of everyone and Oberyn has no proof that Gregor did the crime. Amory Lorch is dead and can't deny that it wasn't him and that's exactly who Tywin blames for the deaths of Elia and the kiddos. And we don't know if Tyrion even named Gregor Clegane in the letter he sent Doran in ACoK. In his conversation with Varys in ACoK 17, Tyrion IV, Tyrion tells Varys that he promised to deliver his sister's killers, alive or dead, as he prefers. If Tyrion only talks about Elia's killer without naming names and the Martells assume it's Clegane, then that's on them. And it seems to me like this is exactly how it played out. "Very well, as you ask so pleasantly. The Red Viper is not going to be pleasant, I fear . . . nor will be content himself with Ser Gregor's head alone." "All the more reason not to give it to him." "Not to . . . ?" Tyrion was shocked. "I thought we were agreed that the woods were full of beasts." "Lesser beasts." Lord Tywin's fingers laced together under his chin. "Ser Gregor has served us well. No other knight in the realm inspires such terror in our enemies." "Oberyn knows that Gregor was the one who . . ." "He knows nothing. He has heard tales. Stable gossip and kitchen calumnies. He has no crumb of proof. Ser Gregor is certainly not about to confess to him. I mean to keep him well away for so long as the Dornishmen are in King's Landing." (Tyrion VI, ASoS 53)
  21. I've just gone over the passage with the mention of Dawn and yes, it is not specifically mentioned as being at the Redgrass Field. I stand corrected.
  22. Dawn was used in battle at the Redgrass Field. I imagine we will find out more about that in FaB v.2.
  23. I'll add a number 4 to this. There are those who absolutely want to see Jon the next wielder of Dawn. If he is AA and Dawn is in fact the real Lightbringer, then it has to end up in Jon's hands somehow. Being a Dayne through Ashara squares that circle.
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