The Taxman Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I just want to know where Jamie's reputation as a badass sword fighter comes from... Cause of the "only 1 or two men can beat me in all of Westeros" line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyvasse Khal Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Also, after King Bob's death, Ned had well and truly realised that Lannisters controlled Kings Landing. Of which his daughters were being kept. Any further defiance against Joff's new kingship, win or lose, would have surely resulted in some bad stuff happening to Sansa and Arya. He sacrificed himself to keep them safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currymatic Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Cause of the "only 1 or two men can beat me in all of Westeros" line. Just talk from an arrogant asshole. Ok sorry for going off topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Just talk from an arrogant asshole. Ok sorry for going off topic Backed up by Ser Barristan Selmy, Ser Boros Blount, Brienne of Tarth, Eddard and Torrhen Karstark and a lot more people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currymatic Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Backed up by Ser Barristan Selmy, Ser Boros Blount, Brienne of Tarth, Eddard and Torrhen Karstark and a lot more people.Words are wind. Need...to...see....prooooffff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Words are wind. Need...to...see....prooooffff Brienne, Eddard and Torrhen are very real proof. Two of them so real that they died on Jaime's blade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ours if the Fury Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Jaime is in the riverlands. And the real question is why didn't Eddard demand a trial in general. And Ned isn't really all that great of a fighter regardless Eddard defeated three of the best fighters in the realm, although he had some help... they didnt do much... he isnt that bad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeus_Invictus Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 By his own words Jaime had beaten both Cleganes, Robert in his prime, Arthur Dayne (When he was 17!), and Gerold Hightower. Brienne admits that were he in top condition he would have taken her apart. According to Martin Barristan and Dayne were equally matched as of Robert's Rebellion, but while I could see a master swordsman like Barristan still being in his prime, or close to it, at 47 I doubt the same would be true for a 61 year old Barristan. There is very little doubt that between Robert's Rebellion and him losing his hand he is the greatest swordsman in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ally Cat of the canals Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I don't think Ned ever demanded trial by battle because he was protecting his daughters and it was never really offered to him. He was guilty of treason (I know Joffery isn't the true king but in KL at the time he was seen as by everyone.) Ned was confined to the black cells with only Varys coming to see him Cersei wasn't feeding him let alone offering him a fair trial. He was offered the black and it seemed a very good deal, Ned wasn't an idiot so he must have guessed Stannis wasn't just going to give up his claim, Ned probably would have been pardoned after only serving at the wall for a couple of years in that time he could tell Jon everything. shame it didn't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CassBlackfyre Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Brienne, Eddard and Torrhen are very real proof. Two of them so real that they died on Jaime's blade. Only torrhen died? Brienne AFAWK is still alive, and Eddard died from ser illyn payne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Jaime (along with Garlan Tyrell and Sandor Clegane) is one of three in Westeros who would beat Gregor. All of them would wipe the floor with Ned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Egeman Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 That just makes them both above average. The skill disparity were talking about is just that much.Swordfighting is not just "this is better so he wins." They weren't also just fighting one on one. They were fighting 3 vs 7. And certainly fighting for a defeated dynasty as its last representatives does not help the morale. Losing your friends does not help either. At the beginning of a fight any swordsman can hold his/her ground. If Ned was fighting with ice, it is even harder for Arthur no matter how good it is since Ice is a very light and quick great great sword. Add Howland to the equation and add Arthur's tiredness. It is really believeable.I still think Howland skinchanged into Arthur and that is why he is not leaving the Greywater Watch. Also, GRRM himself said that Ned is average while Jaime is a natural swordsman and Arthur is the best of his time. There should not be any discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Only torrhen died? Brienne AFAWK is still alive, and Eddard died from ser illyn payne Karstark, not Stark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CassBlackfyre Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Karstark, not Stark. oh right right, my bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ally Cat of the canals Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Dayne was the best of all time, Jamie was the best of his time before he lost his hand. I think Selmy's reputation comes from the fact that in battle he is very good and knows to keep his calm he is also a very accomplished swordsman better than any normal knight. To be part of the old kingsguard you had to be unlike now. I wonder what would have happened between Robert and Jamie when Robert was a) in his prime and b) if he really wanted to kill Jamie the same way as with Rhaegar. I think the it would be very close because Robert when angry enough was like a stag charging with so much power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sansa_Stark Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Backed up by Ser Barristan Selmy, Ser Boros Blount, Brienne of Tarth, Eddard and Torrhen Karstark and a lot more people.I believe Barristan is just talking about his natural talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I believe Barristan is just talking about his natural talent. Might be - but the others are definitely about his skill and how dangerous he is prior to losing his hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Currymatic Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 I believe Barristan is just talking about his natural talent.This. It just confuses me that GRRM wouldn't give Jamie a background like Barristan if he wanted me to believe he was this great swordsman. All you get is second hand opinions. He killed Lord Karstark's sons? How do we know those two were even remotely good with a sword? He parried a couple of The Smiling Knight's blows? Ok...good job. Ahh we could go on and on but we are hijacking this thread so message me if you want to continue this nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ally Cat of the canals Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Exactly I can't imagine the Karstarks were rich enough to afford all the training Jamie had from his early life and the kingsguard. The would have had some training no doubt but they aren't exactly Dayne. Also we know from Jamie's POV that he did find it hard fighting Brienne I know he was weak and all but no-one has ever said she was the greatest sword fighter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gneisenau Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Jaime is in the riverlands. And the real question is why didn't Eddard demand a trial in general. And Ned isn't really all that great of a fighter regardless Ned whooped Arthur Dayne's ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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