Theory: The Storm God represents the CotF (fixed quoting issues)

[J. Stargaryen]

Great OP. I really love the stuff about Nagga's bones being ancient weirwoods. I'm kind of surprised there are so few comments.

I always felt like there was some connection between the Storm God/Stormlands, Drowned God/Iron Islands and the CotF due to the hammer of the waters. When you look at the geography of Westeros it's clear that each god is tied to an area right next to where these events supposedly took place. And of course these events were said to be initiated by the Children.

I had a thread of my own recently that touched on implied foreshadowing resulting from the duality of the Storm God and Drowned God that might be of some interest. - Link

[SacredOrderOfGreenMen]

Bomping this awesome post.

[SacredOrderOfGreenMen]

For me the best part of this theory is the explanation it provides for the long and particular enmity between the Ironborn and the North; why Asha feels that the "trees hate us all, deep in their wooden hearts" and it just fits with the way GRRM explains and feels about such fantastic myths as sea dragons.

I it pretty much makes everything fit together: the culture of raiding, of being forbidden to draw sustenance from the earth (who else feels that floods dragged what was once fertile soil into the ground?) and thus "We Do Not Sow", the legend of the Grey King, the putting out of the fire, the Hammer of the Waters....

Awesome, awesome theory and I am on board.

[Mithras]

First Men forgot their original religions and started to worship the trees after the Pact. We see that a similar thing happened in the Iron Islands during the Andal invasion. The Andals were assimilated into the native First Men culture.

The question is, is there any ancient relic of the original religion of the First Men they had in Essos among the practices of drowned god religion or in the Sisters?

Or the First Men adapted the religion of the CotF living in the proto-Iron Islands and the arrival of the Andals further distorted the religion?

There are varying historical accounts about the timing of kingsmoots and the Iron Islands. I don’t think those accounts were dropped without any purpose. Perhaps we are supposed to make an estimation about the date of the shattering of Iron Islands into what it looks like today. After all, there were rock kings and salt kings in many isles and they chose the high king among them. Therefore, kingsmoots should be an after-Hammer phenomenon.

[Game Of Thrones]

The question is, is there any ancient relic of the original religion of the First Men they had in Essos among the practices of drowned god religion or in the Sisters?

Or the First Men adapted the religion of the CotF living in the proto-Iron Islands and the arrival of the Andals further distorted the religion?

The Sistermen religion and the Drowned God religion are almost certainly relics of the original First Men religion. It is ridiculous that the CotF would have worshiped the sea, when they call themselves those who sing the songs of the earth. I think all CotF believed in the Old Gods, and the reason the IB and Sistermen do not worship the Old Gods is because there were no CotF there (the Sisters) or because the CotF had already been massacred before the Pact (II).

Note: The First Men of the Stormlands seem have kept to their original gods. There's a lot of myths that relate to the First Men in the Stormlands (Durran's Defiance, Rain God)

[Mithras]

The Sistermen religion and the Drowned God religion are almost certainly relics of the original First Men religion. It is ridiculous that the CotF would have worshiped the sea, when they call themselves those who sing the songs of the earth. I think all CotF believed in the Old Gods, and the reason the IB and Sistermen do not worship the Old Gods is because there were no CotF there (the Sisters) or because the CotF had already been massacred before the Pact (II).

Note: The First Men of the Stormlands seem have kept to their original gods. There's a lot of myths that relate to the First Men in the Stormlands (Durran's Defiance, Rain God)

I have a belief that the CotF had a different faction, perhaps thos who sing the song of the sea. Perhaps the Iron Islands were shattered much before the arrival of the First Men during an inter-CotF conflict.

[Game Of Thrones]

I have a belief that the CotF had a different faction, perhaps thos who sing the song of the sea. Perhaps the Iron Islands were shattered much before the arrival of the First Men during an inter-CotF conflict.

If so, why would they have weirwood groves, instead of magical kelp forests?

[House Volton]

The Drowned God Followers Say "What Is Dead may never be killed, only rises stronger"

Many Faced God followers say "Valar Morghulis"

Old Gods of the North have many faces too. CotF are fatalistic about their approach to life (talking about extinction of their's and other species)

It's only fittng that both gods have different view towards death.

[SacredOrderOfGreenMen]

The Sistermen religion and the Drowned God religion are almost certainly relics of the original First Men religion. It is ridiculous that the CotF would have worshiped the sea, when they call themselves those who sing the songs of the earth. I think all CotF believed in the Old Gods, and the reason the IB and Sistermen do not worship the Old Gods is because there were no CotF there (the Sisters) or because the CotF had already been massacred before the Pact (II).

Note: The First Men of the Stormlands seem have kept to their original gods. There's a lot of myths that relate to the First Men in the Stormlands (Durran's Defiance, Rain God)

Wind is what's used to create waves.

We know that the Greenseers can use a breeze or a breath of wind to "talk" to people through the weirwoods.

The Hammer of the Waters is an established and not unlikely Westerosi tradition.

[House Volton]

"You burned usssss....., You killed usssss" Davos after the battle of the Blackwater heard this whisper in the sea

He thought that the Seven were angry after burning of Sept in Dragonstone but probably the Old Gods are angry at burning of heart tree of Storm's End

[Game Of Thrones]

"You burned usssss....., You killed usssss" Davos after the battle of the Blackwater heard this whisper in the sea

He thought that the Seven were angry after burning of Sept in Dragonstone but probably the Old Gods are angry at burning of heart tree of Storm's End

We know that Bloodraven can't speak to his siblings, even though he wants to. Unless the CotF are infinitely more powerful than BR, I seriously doubt that that was real and not a hallucination. Remember, Davos has been starving for days.

[Game Of Thrones]

Great OP. I really love the stuff about Nagga's bones being ancient weirwoods. I'm kind of surprised there are so few comments.

Me too...

[House Volton]

Well can't really say but here is the quote :

'Perhaps it was only wind blowing against the rock, or the sound of the sea on the shore,

but for an instant Davos Seaworth heard her answer. “You called the fire,” she

whispered, her voice as faint as the sound of waves in a seashell, sad and soft. “You

burned us . . . burned us . . . burrrned usssssss.”

“It was her!” Davos cried. “Mother, don’t forsake us. It was her who burned you, the red

woman, Melisandre, her!” He could see her; the heart-shaped face, the red eyes, the long

coppery hair, her red gowns moving like flames as she walked, a swirl of silk and satin.

She had come from Asshai in the east, she had come to Dragonstone and won Selyse and

her queen’s men for her alien god, and then the king, Stannis Baratheon himself. He had

gone so far as to put the fiery heart on his banners, the fiery heart of R’hllor, Lord of

Light and God of Flame and Shadow. At Melisandre’s urging, he had dragged the Seven

from their sept at Dragonstone and burned them before the castle gates, and later he had

burned the godswood at Storm’s End as well, even the heart tree, a huge white weirwood

with a solemn face.'

[Game Of Thrones]

Well can't really say but here is the quote :

'Perhaps it was only wind blowing against the rock, or the sound of the sea on the shore,

but for an instant Davos Seaworth heard her answer. You called the fire, she

whispered, her voice as faint as the sound of waves in a seashell, sad and soft. You

burned us . . . burned us . . . burrrned usssssss.

It was her! Davos cried. Mother, dont forsake us. It was her who burned you, the red

woman, Melisandre, her! He could see her; the heart-shaped face, the red eyes, the long

coppery hair, her red gowns moving like flames as she walked, a swirl of silk and satin.

She had come from Asshai in the east, she had come to Dragonstone and won Selyse and

her queens men for her alien god, and then the king, Stannis Baratheon himself. He had

gone so far as to put the fiery heart on his banners, the fiery heart of Rhllor, Lord of

Light and God of Flame and Shadow. At Melisandres urging, he had dragged the Seven

from their sept at Dragonstone and burned them before the castle gates, and later he had

burned the godswood at Storms End as well, even the heart tree, a huge white weirwood

with a solemn face.'

Yeah, but IMO it's a hallucination.

[J. Stargaryen]

Me too...

I definitely think your OP warrants more discussion than it has generated so far. Lots of times the threads with the most comments are very argumentative, though. For example, an OP will present an idea, someone will disagree, someone else will disagree with that person and so forth. This is a pretty good OP, so it doesn't leave a ton of room for argument. At least not so far.

[Mithras]

If so, why would they have weirwood groves, instead of magical kelp forests?

Weirwoods are the best external hard drives to store vast amount of data. The speculative Children of the Sea might still make use of weirwood trees.

[WilliamWesterosiWallace]

"You burned usssss....., You killed usssss" Davos after the battle of the Blackwater heard this whisper in the sea

He thought that the Seven were angry after burning of Sept in Dragonstone but probably the Old Gods are angry at burning of heart tree of Storm's End

If so, can we start assuming that the Old Gods are above time, and that the Weirnet can talk to people in the past and future, and all it needs is a person strong enough to wield it? I mean, we have the tree, sapling and stump quote from someone I forgot who, it is kind of logical to assume that the Weirnet is also timeless.

[Game Of Thrones]

Weirwoods are the best external hard drives to store vast amount of data. The speculative Children of the Sea might still make use of weirwood trees.

I don't think it's logical to believe in a CotS when we don't really have evidence supporting the idea.

And how do we know that weirwoods are the best external hard drives? For all we know, weircoral might be superior....

[Game Of Thrones]

If so, can we start assuming that the Old Gods are above time, and that the Weirnet can talk to people in the past and future, and all it needs is a person strong enough to wield it? I mean, we have the tree, sapling and stump quote from someone I forgot who, it is kind of logical to assume that the Weirnet is also timeless.

Yes, the CotF can probably see the future, but I doubt that they can speak to those in the future. Remember, BR can't speak to Shiera or Bittersteel or Daeron.

[Mithras]

I don't think it's logical to believe in a CotS when we don't really have evidence supporting the idea.

Farwynds have the tradition of wearing the skins of sea animals. I think CotS might be the equivalent of sea elves whereas CotF are the counterpart of wood elves.

And how do we know that weirwoods are the best external hard drives? For all we know, weircoral might be superior....

Silver seaweeds are mentioned a lot.