AGOT Reread- Catelyn

[Spring Bass]

Finally, I re-read the chapter. Here we go:

1. We know that Robb has been trying to hold things together up until this point, although he apparently hasn't approached Maester Luwin. The book describes him as coming "from outside".

2. There is a bit of irony in the fact that after the accident, she pleaded for him to stay, but now Ned said that he had "no choice".

3. This is the earliest example of Cat losing her grip on external reality when one of her children's life is threatened. Early on, in the first page, we see that regardless of what Maester Luwin is telling her, she is thinking about Bran's position, Bran's hair, and the like. The only thing that stirs her to anger is when Luwin mentions the master of horse. She doesn't completely lose her grip; rather, she suddenly stops thinking about various things, and her focus zeroes in.

This is important, because it plays into some of her later decisions; like the arrest of Tyrion, and the sending of Jaime south with a former member of Renly's Rainbow Guard.

4. As mentioned above, Cat may have a hint of manic-depressiveness in her, one that is usually covered over. She is described as laughing hysterically after Bran's wolf saves him, and continuing to do so even as she is bathed, until the point where she simply falls asleep for four days. This is a mirror reflection of her hysteria, and agonized screaming when she witnesses Robb's death, right up until the point where her throat is cut.

The above may not necessarily be the case, though. She is tired, and has had very little sleep. Still, it was an interesting parallel of her reaction at the Red Wedding.

5. Theon's strange statement. He says, "My lady, if it comes to that [armed conflict], my House owes yours a great debt." (pg. 114) This made me wonder if Theon is already trying to position himself to be sent home to Pyke to seek help, or something else. Then again, it may simply be Theon trying to reinforce his loyalty to the Starks with words.

[Tears of Lys]

5. Theon's strange statement. He says, "My lady, if it comes to that [armed conflict], my House owes yours a great debt." (pg. 114) This made me wonder if Theon is already trying to position himself to be sent home to Pyke to seek help, or something else. Then again, it may simply be Theon trying to reinforce his loyalty to the Starks with words.

Or he's saying I owe you one - and not in a good way. Maybe that's what you meant by the "something else." I know on the reread, those words kind of jump out at you.

[Barba]

I like her two quotes in the beginning:

“My son lies here broken and dying, Luwin, and you wish to discuss a new master of horse? Do you think I care what happens in the stables? Do you think it matters to me one whit? I would gladly butcher every horse in Winterfell with my own hands if it would open Bran’s eyes, do you understand that? Do you?â€

Bold part kinda reminds me of Dany's thoughts in her chapter when Maegi doublecrosses her

Catelyn was shaking. It was the grief, the cold, the howling of the direwolves. Night after night, the howling and the cold wind and the grey empty castle, on and on they went, never changing, and her boy lying there broken, the sweetest of her children, the gentlest, Bran who loved to laugh and climb and dreamt of knighthood, all gone now, she would never hear him laugh again.

It is Ironic, but she was right. She went off before He woke up, and she never returned (if you don't Count UnCat as Cat-in that case it might still be possible).

Other than that, Direwolves were howling untill that guy atacked Bran. After that I think that they stopped. Perhaps they sensed something and by their howling kept Cat all freaky.

Theon says: "My house owns yours a great debt". It can be reffered as: "you raised me in a man I became, and I am Grateful. I owe you", and as:"You took me away from my home, you SoB. I owe you". It turns out it was the latter thing.

This chapter, I think, is the first one that makes you hook up with the book. It is all mystery, treason and stuff, and you just want to see what happens next.

Timeline: 8, and 12 days after Ned leaving for KL. And I allways thought that at least first half of book was not mixed with timeline, but it turns out that Tyrion2 chapter happened after Cat3. First timeline mixture :cool: :cool:

[The Adequate Jon]

That line about never hearing Bran laugh again is heartbreaking.

I don't think there was anything sinister behind Theon's line about owing the Starks. His POV in ACOK makes it pretty clear that he intended to help the Starks in their war. He wanted to attack Casterly Rock. Of course, it didn't take much to change his mind.

I like this chapter because it's the first time we see Summer or any of the direwolves kick some butt.

[DBaron]

Cat III

Impressions:

I’ve never really understood why Cat has to go through these extremes. I think my original impressions were that she was a mother driven half mad by grief. On the reread though I am thinking that perhaps she was driven to that state by forces beyond her control, since if she wasn’t by Bran’s side then he would have died. The fact that even she doesn’t understand what is going on, the wolves howling & the cold wind (osha says that gods communicate through the wind), how she says she felt as if a great weight has been lifted, and her complete turn around after it was over are what led me to speculate this.

There seemed to be a lot more ice and fire imagery, and the way Robb was portrayed when he realized there was a fire gave me the impression that fire was somehow something the Starks should fear. Speaking of Robb, I really like the way he was written in this chapter. I think after this chapter he became my favorite Stark.

I can’t believe Ned would still go south, especially given that he had expressed reservations, he knew he couldn’t really change anything, his son is gravely wounded and now his wife is out of her mind. What the hell Ned?

At the end we get reminded of the supposed Lannister plot to kill Jon Arryn subplot, and we get the ‘who attempted the murder of Bran Stark’ subplot is introduced. I was surprised on the reread to see that Cat trusted Theon enough to confide in him her family secrets.

Foreshadowing

I did find it funny that she said she doesn’t care what happens in the stables, even though that is where Bran’s assassin is hiding. I didn’t even notice the sacrificing of the horse foreshadowing, nice catch on that.

Questions:

I thought it was interesting that all the wolves were howling together, and then they all fell silent at once, as if they knew something was going to happen. But only Summer showed up to protect Bran, so where did the other two go?

Was it finally settled that it was Joffery who tried to kill Bran? I know that Jamie at the end of ASOS seems to lead us to that conclusion, or is it still open?

[Barba]

It's closed. Joff did that because he heard his father tell how it is better for kid to die, so joff took care for it. He took his father's knife and gave it to the killer. Later when LF says that he lost that same knife to Tyrion, He's lieing. He lost it to the King.

It is funny how things, IMO, would turn up lot worse if Petyr said the truth. Ned would be thinking his King and friend tried to kill his son.

And, about why only Summer showed up, I assune I have the answer. I think Wolves can sense something's wrong, but they can't see what it is exacly. That is why none of the wolves didn't go to the stables and killed the guy when he was hiding. They sensed something was wrong, and they protected their masters in that time. Each of them his own. It just turned out that Bran was in trouble, and only Summer showed up. :cool:

[DBaron]

Ok. Thanks, I wasn't sure if people were still coming up with crazy theories for it (oh say.... like the wine cup) or if it has been pretty much put to rest.

[Barba]

Catelyn (IV)

Introduced: Moreo Tumitis (Tyroshi sailor, Captain of the Storm Dancer);

Lord Petyr Baelish (Littlefinger, the King’s master of coin, once a ward of Lord Hoster Tully, later granted Harrenhal and named Lord Paramount of the Trident; later still marries Lysa Arryn and is named Lord Protector of the Vale of Arryn);

Lord Varys (the Spider, a eunuch, the King’s master of whisperers, pardoned by King Robert along with Ser Barristan and Grand Maester Pycelle for remaining loyal to the Targaryens during the war; currently missing in KL);

Ser Aron Santagar* (Master-at-Arms of King's Landing, Killed during City riots).

Legends: Maegor the Cruel (3rd of the Targaryen Kings, son of Aegon the Dragon and his sister Visenya, completed the Red Keep and its fortified inner keep later called Maegor’s Holdfast; left no issue);

Visenya (sister of Aegon the Conqueror and Rhaenys, mother of Maegor the Cruel [the marriage of her and Aegon did not foster the Targaryen line, as Visenya’s son Maegor died without issue], bore the Valyrian blade ‘Dark Sister’);

Rhaenys (sister of Aegon and Visenya, mother of Aenys from whom the entire Targaryen line of Kings descended).

Catelyn and Ser Rodrik arrive at King’s Landing and pay the captain of the ship which brought them from White Harbor. When Ser Rodrik cautions Cat that someone may recognize her, she thinks of Littlefinger, and how as a ward of her father, they had been close as children. She remembers Littlefinger challenging Brandon Stark to a duel for her hand in marriage, and Cat had to persuade Brandon not to kill him. Brandon allowed him to yield after scarring him. Cat and Ser Rodrik go to an inn, and then the old knight goes off to find Ser Aron Santagar.

Catelyn is awoken from sleep by knocking at her door. The City Watchmen at the door bear a paper with Littlefinger’s seal on it. Catelyn thinks that Captain Moreo must have given away her location. As she approaches the Red Keep, Cat remembers the stories of how its building was commanded by Aegon the Conqueror, but it was Maegor the Cruel who finished the great keep and had all the builders put to death so that only the Targaryens would know its secrets. She is brought before Littlefinger, and told that she was found by Lord Varys. Littlefinger wants to know why she is in King’s Landing, and offers his help. Varys arrives and unbelievably knows of the dagger Cat is carrying. Cat shows them the dagger, and Littlefinger tells her it was his, although he had lost it betting on Ser Jaime Lannister in the tourney on Prince Joffrey’s name day when Ser Loras Tyrell won the joust. He tells Cat he lost it to Tyrion Lannister.

[Barba]

No comments by anyone. :cry:

And it's not boring chapter at all. We get Varys AND Littlefinger - two of the sneakiest bastards in the series - in the same chapter.

On the beginning - Moreo and Storm Dancer - Does this ship appear later in the seies?

We hear storm got them by Dragonstone. Could it be the storm Bran saw in his dream?

She thinks about how Moreo sold her. I bet her payment of oarsmen (and her refusal of giving thair whole payment to him) had something to do with it. But, I also wonder who did he sold it to. Varys or Littlefinger? I know Littlefinger says:"Lord Varys knows all", but in CoK, when Tyrion got into KL and Varys found out about Shae, he got in that inn by himself. It makes me wonder if LF found about it first.

With line:"Lord Varys knows all", we are made belive nothing can be hided from him. I always assumed he does some kind of magis, especially when he says little birds told him. By that line I think Martin wants his new reader to get some kind of mystical impression about Varys sources.

LF and Varys both come out as kissasses. Varys more and LF less, but you can sense false modesty they have even here, in their first apperance.

Varys also says something like:"It's good to see you after so many years". When did they met before. Maybe at the wedding of Cersei and Robert? Does anyone know?

After Varys asks about the Dagger, she is stunned and asks about ser Rodrik. He says Ser rodrik came and asked Aron Santagar about certain Dagger. Littlefinger knows nothing about any Dagger. I think this is where Varys found out about Cat being in town (from Ser Rodrik), and i think Moreo sold his info to LF. After that Varys probably informed LF, but Gold Cloacks were already on the move.

After Varys cuts himself, LF says: "Nothing hold an edge like Valyrian steel." I think this is what Bran thought in his first chapter after seing his father killing that guy with Ice.

At the end we learn LF lost his knife when Jaime lost joust to Loras. He says Half court backed Jaime. He says he lost his knife, Cersei lost Esmerald, and Jaime 100 Dragons. He lies about loosing it to Imp. We can get a clue he lied after in Hand's tourney when Renly bets against ser Jaime, wins and says says something like:"I wish Imp was here. I would make more money." That proves Tyrion's line:"I never bets against my familly."

Comments anyone?

[oba]

We hear storm got them by Dragonstone. Could it be the storm Bran saw in his dream?

I never considered that. Interesting.

LF and Varys both come out as kissasses. Varys more and LF less, but you can sense false modesty they have even here, in their first apperance.

I particularly liked Varys' exaggerated handling of the dagger and his reaction to getting cut by it. Even first read-through I thought he was laying it on rather thick. Now, it sticks out like, well, Vary's sore thumb.

Varys also says something like:"It's good to see you after so many years". When did they met before. Maybe at the wedding of Cersei and Robert? Does anyone know?

Possibly there, but IIRC, Ned mentions that the last time he saw Cersei, Tommen was still nursing at her teat, etc.

After Varys cuts himself, LF says: "Nothing hold an edge like Valyrian steel." I think this is what Bran thought in his first chapter after seing his father killing that guy with Ice.

I think it crops up a few more times. We really get hit over the head with the fact that nothing holds an edge like Valyrian steel.

We can get a clue he lied after in Hand's tourney when Renly bets against ser Jaime, wins and says says something like:"I wish Imp was here. I would make more money." That proves Tyrion's line:"I never bets against my familly."

I remember when I first read that, I started suspecting Renly of having some involvement in Bran's death.

I like the chapter. I'm a big Catelyn fan, and I think that this chapter highlights the fact that she had sound reasons for going to KL herself. Sending a raven is obviously out of the question. Even if she'd sent Ser Rodrik and a few trusted men, there's a huge difference between a master-at-arms and the Lady of Winterfell who's Hoster Tully's daughter to boot.

It's just more of Cat's rotten luck that LF and Varys have their own agendas (LF in particular).

[Barba]

Possibly there, but IIRC, Ned mentions that the last time he saw Cersei, Tommen was still nursing at her teat, etc.

Then it was probably during tourney at Lannisport after Greyjoy rebellion because of the Timeline

[oba]

Then it was probably during tourney at Lannisport after Greyjoy rebellion because of the Timeline

If Cat was with Ned at the time to which Ned was referring, I would think Lannisport would me very likely. That being said, I'd think it more likely that Ned and Cat went on to King's Landing with Robert (possibly adding to Stannis' bitter feelings towards Ned ) rather than that Varys went to Lannisport.

Cat also thinks she hasn't seen Renly since he was Bran's age or so (about the age he would have been at Robert's wedding).

I'm too lazy to look up what Ned's thinking when he meets the other members of the small council.

Who knows? It might have been at Robert and Cersei's wedding, after all.

[Barba]

Just occured to me. If you consider - there always must be a stark in winterfell (from Cat 2), then Cat and Ned never did leave winterfell together.

Wich gives me another hint. Maybe Winterfell was destroyed during CoK because (oldest Stark in there was Bran 9-Minor) there was no stark in there at the time.

[oba]

Just occured to me. If you consider - there always must be a stark in winterfell (from Cat 2), then Cat and Ned never did leave winterfell together.

Interesting, but (see below) I don't think the age of the particular Stark really matters.

Wich gives me another hint. Maybe Winterfell was destroyed during CoK because (oldest Stark in there was Bran 9-Minor) there was no stark in there at the time.

[The Adequate Jon]

There's a line where Cat is thinking about how the Red Keep was built that hints that Varys may be a Targaryen, or it may be foreshadowing that he is a Targaryen supporter. I'm paraphrasing: Maegor had all of the builders of the castle killed so that the secret passages of the Red Keep would only be known to the Targaryens. Later we learn that Varys knows most of the secret passages of the Red Keep.

[Barba]

Catelyn V

Introduced: Lord Jason Mallister (Lord of Seagard, bannerman to the Tullys, had slain 3 of Rhaegar’s bannermen on the Trident);

Patrek Mallister (son of Lord Jason Mallister, one of Robb's battle companions);

Masha Heddle* (innkeep at the Crossroads);

Marillion* (a bard, later framed by Littlefinger for the murder of Lysa Arryn).

Catelyn and Ser Rodrik enter an inn at the Crossroads on the way back to Winterfell. They are not recognized since they look like road-weary travelers. When they go down to the common room for dinner, they are accosted by the singer Marillion. As they eat, Tyrion arrives with his two men and Yoren. Tyrion would not have noticed Cat had Marillion not jumped up to declare a performance in Tyrion’s honor. When Tyrion notices Cat, she decides to play her hand. She asks some of the men in the room if their lords are true to her father, Lord Hoster Tully. The Brackens, Freys and Whents are all represented in the room. She then tells how Tyrion was a guest in her home, and had sent an assassin to kill her son. A dozen men draw swords and help Cat take Tyrion captive.

EDIT:Comments:

In this chapter is mentioned for the first time that Edmure hates singers becouse once a singer bedded a girl he liked. It was Tom of Sevenstreams.

There is mention of roads. The road to Riverrun is easy ride. The road to Eyrie is wild and Dangerous. It might reflect on the fact that she took the Dangerous path.

[The Adequate Jon]

The first time I read this chapter, I was still not sure about Tyrion. I thought the end of the chapter was pretty cool, with all the Tully bannermen standing up for Cat to arrest Tyrion. Now when I read it, I'm like, "Don't be stupid Cat! Let Tyrion go and get yourself to Winterfell!" She even thinks to herself early in the chapter, "It must not come to war....They must not let it."

Some foreshadowing: Rodrik remarks to Marillion that the gods frown on the gambler. At the end of the chapter, Cat takes a huge gamble that doesn't pay off.

This is a very important chapter. Cat's decision to arrest Tyrion sets in motion just about everything that happens in the rest of the book.

[The Adequate Jon]

Catelyn (VI)

Introduced: Ser Donnel Waynwood (knight of the Vale, son of Lady Anya Waynwood; later succeeds Ser Brynden as Knight of the Gate);

Ser Brynden Tully (the Blackfish, Knight of the Gate, brother of Lord Hoster Tully, uncle of Catelyn and Lysa Arryn, later commander of Robb’s outriders, then Castellan of Riverrun);

Lord Nestor Royce (High Steward of the Vale, Keeper of the Gates of the Moon, cousin of Bronze Yohn from a lesser branch of House Royce, his house later raised to hereditary status as Keepers of the Gates);

Mya Stone (a girl in the service of Lord Nestor, bastard daughter of Robert Baratheon [the first he fathered]);

Lady Lysa Arryn* (of House Tully, third wife of Lord Jon Arryn, mother to Robert Arryn, sister of Catelyn Stark and Ser Edmure Tully, niece of Ser Brynden Blackfish);

Lord Robert Arryn (sickly young boy, Lord of the Eyrie, Defender of the Vale, Jon and Lysa Arryn’s son; called Sweetrobin by Sansa);

Ser Vardis Egen* (Captain of the Guard, prior Captain of the Hand’s Household Guard);

Maester Colemon (maester and counselor to House Arryn).

First Mentioned: Mychel Redfort (youngest son of Lord Horton Redfort, squire to Ser Lyn Corbray; his house descended from the First Men; later knighted and married to Ysilla Royce of Runestone).

Only Catelyn, Tyrion, Ser Rodrik, Bronn, Marillion and Ser Willis Wode made it through the Mountains of the Moon and are being escorted by Ser Donnel Waynwood to the Bloody Gate. Cat notices how Bronn and Tyrion have become friends. They meet Ser Brynden Tully at the Bloody Gate, and he and Cat hug each other. The Blackfish had been close to all the Tully children, including Ser Edmure, and even Petyr Baelish, until he left Riverrun after Lysa and Cat’s weddings due to a long feud with his brother, Lord Hoster. Ser Brynden warns her that her sister is unstable, and very afraid. They pass the Bloody Gate, where a dozen armies had dashed themselves to pieces during the Age of Heroes. Ser Brynden is troubled by Robert Arryn being Lord of the Eyrie, for he is too weak to sit his father’s seat. And Lysa is courting suitors for her hand in marriage, but he believes she intends to rule until Robert comes of age. After passing through a valley surrounded by the mountains, they reach the Gates of the Moon and meet Lord Nestor Royce. Catelyn intends to rest there until morning, but word came down from the Eyrie that her sister demands her to make the trip immediately. Both Cat and Ser Brynden are angered by her sister's demands.

Mya Stone takes Cat up the long trip to the Eyrie, passing the 3 waykeeps: Stone, Snow and Sky. Mya tells Cat about a squire she loves, Mychel Redfort, but Cat knows his family is highborn and will never consent to their son marrying a bastard. After taking mules to reach Sky, Catelyn will continue no further by foot, and is taken up in a basket by winch. Cat is brought to her sister’s quarters, and Lysa is polite until Ser Vardis and Maester Colemon depart. Then she yells at her sister for bringing Tyrion to the Eyrie, to drag her into Cat’s quarrel with the Lannisters. Cat replies that it was Lysa who sent her the letter naming the Lannisters as murdering her husband. Lysa is scared, wants nothing to do with war, and is near insane. When Robert Arryn comes out of his room, holding a doll, Cat thinks to herself ‘Jon Arryn’s son?’, incredulously. The child is scared by what Cat is saying, and Lysa placates him by allowing him to suckle at her breast, even though he is six years old. Lysa feels the child is strong, thinking her husband’s statement on his deathbed ‘the seed is strong’ was referring to his son. Robert Arryn wants to see Tyrion, "the bad man", fly.

[Barba]

couple of thoughts:

Nice chapter, with description of eastern road, bloody gate, Gates of the Moon, road to the Eyrie, and Eyrie itself.

Cat saw Lysa last time 5 years ago, while Robert was less than a year old. Do we have any Idea where it was, and what was the occasion. 2 hapter before when she met varys we assumed she saw Varys last time in Lannisport After Greyjoy rebellion. Now I'm not so sure. rebellion was 8-9 years before, and it seems to me she met her sister after that. I assume she saw Varys then too.

Thoughts?

[Barba]

Catelyn VII

Introduced: Ser Morton Waynwood (knight of the Vale, heir of Lady Waynwood).

Legends: Alyssa Arryn (thousands of years ago watched her husband, brothers and all her children die, yet shed not a tear in life; instead, the waterfall that would not reach the Vale was Alyssa’s tears in death).

Ser Rodrik is informing Catelyn of Ser Jaime hosting an army at Casterly Rock, and how her brother Ser Edmure had commanded Lords Vance and Piper to guard the pass below the Golden Tooth. Ser Brynden, disgusted by Lysa’s behavior, has resigned his post and intends to return to Riverrun, but agrees to accompany Cat to Winterfell. Before the trial of Tyrion, Cat is speaking with Ser Rodrik about the sorry shape Lord Robert is in, and how he needs to be fostered to learn discipline. Maester Colemon, overhearing, tells Cat that Lord Arryn agreed. Robert Arryn was to be fostered at Dragonstone, but Cat tells him he is mistaken, that Robert was to be fostered at Casterly Rock, but the Maester is sure of Jon Arryn’s plans to foster the child with Lord Stannis. The trial begins, but Bronn, though lightly armored, kills Ser Vardis Egen because of his speed and superior skills. Tyrion is allowed to leave the Eyrie with his life, but Lysa will provide no escort for him through the Mountains of the Moon…