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Durran Durrandon

The Long Night and the Great Summer

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Hodor is the world, and Bran is (and I'm not kidding in the slightest) the stallion who mounts the world. I'm not sure if you've heard me explain this one, Durran... Here's the very very short version. It goes back to the main inspiration for greenseers and weirwood trees - Odin and Yggdrasil. The word Yggdrasil can be translated several ways - it can mean "Odin's Horse" or "gallows tree." Odin himself hung on the tree for nine days  in order to "see the runes," which enabled him to do magic - specifically, astral projection. Odin also had an actual horse that was not the tree called slepnir, which also enabled him to perform astral projection. Additionally, the tree was also a part of Odin or a manifestation of Odin, and so he uttered the words "I sacrifice myself to myself." The Yggdrasil tree, then, is an astral-projection horse which is a tree and also a part of Odin himself. A weirwood is an astral projection tree which is a part of the greenseer, and it allows him to "mount the world," in the sense that his spirit can span the universe. 

The last bit relates to the horned lord and the stallion. The constellation known as the stallion in the south is called the horned lord in the north. In one scene, Jon watches the stallion mounts the sky, while in another the horned moon rides the sky, something like that. The "horned lord" is, I believe, a reference to Garth and the Green Men, the first greenseers who dropped the Hammer. They were the horned lords, and also the first "human" greenseers - the first stallions who mounted the world with astral projection trees. 

In other words, the reason the prophecy of the stallion who mounts terrified the Dothraki seeress is because the stallion is no Dothraki savior. His khalasar will cover the world, which arakhs shining like razor grass - sounds like Others with ghost grass swords - remember the ghost grass is like milkglass and glows in the dark with the spirits of the damned. So that's what I belive she is seeing in that stallion prophecy, and that means Bran is essentially playing the role of stallion who mounts. Thus he is the one mounting Hodor as the world. 

Are we sure razor grass equals ghost grass? In which of your essays do you go into this in more detail?

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Are we sure razor grass equals ghost grass? In which of your essays do you go into this in more detail?

it's in a half finished essay I haven't put out yet. And no, I'm not at all sure that ghost grass and razor grass are the same, but the imagery is similar... Take a look at the stallion prophecy and see for yourself. I do have a lot of text quotes and whatnot to support these ideas, of course, although it may sound strange when I throw it all out real quick like that. Here's a good article about the Yggdrasil stuff: http://www.ancient-origins.net/myths-legends-europe/norse-legend-world-tree-yggdrasil-002680

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Notice the similar language:

Down in the Shadow Lands beyond Asshai, they say there are oceans of ghost grass, taller than a man on horseback with stalks as pale as milkglass. It murders all other grass and glows in the dark with the spirits of the damned. The Dothraki claim that someday ghost grass will cover the entire world, and then all life will end.”  (AGOT, Daenerys, Jorah speaking)

And here:

“As swift as the wind he rides, and behind him his khalasar covers the earth, men without number, with arakhs shining in their hands like blades of razor grass. Fierce as a storm this prince will be. His enemies will tremble before him, and their wives will weep tears of blood and rend their flesh in grief. The bells in his hair will sing his coming, and the milk men in the stone tents will fear his name.” The old woman trembled and looked at Dany almost as if she were afraid. “The prince is riding, and he shall be the stallion who mounts the world.”  (AGOT, Daenerys)

 

I've used to color to show the similar ideas in the two passages. 

The buildup to the prophecy is also quite interesting... we have a one-eyed seer, lots of references to darkness and eyes of darkness... smoke rising to the stars a couple of times (sorry Durran)... the reference to stars as horses (to be ridden? what about riding comets?)... and the we the stallion himself is associated with thunder, and a storm... and is that a prominently featured warhorn?  Check it out:

The oldest of the crones, a bent and shriveled stick of a woman with a single black eye, raised her arms on high. “Khalakka dothrae!” she shrieked. The prince is riding!

“He is riding!” the other women answered. “Rakh! Rakh! Rakh haj!” they proclaimed. A boy, a boy, a strong boy.

Bells rang, a sudden clangor of bronze birds. A deep-throated warhorn sounded its long low note. The old women began to chant. Underneath their painted leather vests, their withered dugs swayed back and forth, shiny with oil and sweat. The eunuchs who served them threw bundles of dried grasses into a great bronze brazier, and clouds of fragrant smoke rose up toward the moon and the stars. The Dothraki believed the stars were horses made of fire, a great herd that galloped across the sky by night.

As the smoke ascended, the chanting died away and the ancient crone closed her single eye, the better to peer into the future. The silence that fell was complete. Dany could hear the distant call of night birds, the hiss and crackle of the torches, the gentle lapping of water from the lake. The Dothraki stared at her with eyes of night, waiting.

Khal Drogo laid his hand on Dany’s arm. She could feel the tension in his fingers. Even a khal as mighty as Drogo could know fear when the dosh khaleen peered into the smoke of the future. At her back, her handmaids fluttered anxiously.

Finally the crone opened her eye and lifted her arms. “I have seen his face, and heard the thunder of his hooves,” she proclaimed in a thin, wavery voice.

“The thunder of his hooves!” the others chorused.

You just never know with those potential "others" double-entendres... but setting that aside, what I see here is a man who is a stallion who mounts the world... and a khal riding a comet would be doing something like that, or perhaps a magician that steers a comet. If the "greenseers" really did drop the Hammer of the Waters (which was a moon meteor according to my research), then that means they must have crashed the comet into the moon. This is exactly what I think Azor Ahai / the BSE did - I think he was a "green man" / greenseer who transformed with fire magic, perhaps the first to do so.  

I'm giving you the summation of many different converging lines of research, so bear with me a bit if everything doesn't make sense at first. I followed a totally different line of inquiry to arrive at the idea that AA was a greenseer, the one remembered as dropping the Hammer; then by researching Yggdrasil, I realized that the stallion that mounts the world is a greenseer using Odin's Horse, the Gallows Tree; then I looked back at this Stallion prophecy and found all the Long Night imagery (the horn, the one eye closing, the smoke rising, the bronze birds, the reference to stars as celestial mounts, a thunder and a storm of something that covers the earth and means death, the shining weapons). Then, and only then, did I remember that "the Stallion is the Horned Lord," and I looked up the horned moon quotes about riding the sky... 

There's another line of inquiry also, involving the idea of "the Old Ones." I believe the Old Ones were the original greenseers / green men, and I think those underground dirties of the "Old Ones" on the great and holy Isle of Leng are part of it. That's a whole mother tangent though, probably have to save that for an essay. 

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A couple other things I forgot:

Odin also sacrificed one eye to gain magical sight, just like Bloodraven and just like the one-eyed Dothraki seeress. This ties into the "Gods Eye" symbol, represented in the sky by the sun - moon conjunction which looked like an eye. It was blinded or closed, as the seeress closes her eye here. 

Odin hangs himself on the gallows tree, which is a lot like Bloodraven being interwoven into the tree throne. Both are hung on the tree to perform magic. You'll recall that one of the Stepstones, where the Hammer of the waters fell, is called Bloodstone; the other is "Grey Gallows." Dunk competes as the "Gallows Knight," and his other sigil is a falling star next to a tree (greenseers pulling down stars). 

Thers a further tie-together between the trees and space in Yggdrasil, and indeed all mythological world trees. The roots of the world tree are the underworld, the trunk the earth realm, and the branches are the heavens. Thus the weirwood tree allows the greenseer to astrally project their awareness thought the cosmos, and affect the heavenly bodies perhaps. You'll notice that the wisdom of the old gods and greenseers is communicated to people by the rustling or whispering of leaves, while the starry wisdom is whispered by the stars. Also, George uses things in the branches of the tree - the leaves which are like bloody or burning hands, and the black as night ravens - to represent the moon meteors. Many scenes support this IMO.

 

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A couple other things I forgot:

Odin also sacrificed one eye to gain magical sight, just like Bloodraven and just like the one-eyed Dothraki seeress. This ties into the "Gods Eye" symbol, represented in the sky by the sun - moon conjunction which looked like an eye. It was blinded or closed, as the seeress closes her eye here. 

Odin hangs himself on the gallows tree, which is a lot like Bloodraven being interwoven into the tree throne. Both are hung on the tree to perform magic.

 

Yup, I got both of those. In fact you can tie a more universal asceticism for magic theme here. Bran is crippled, but then becomes the most powerful warg of the Stark pack. The crone has one eye reminding us of Odin's wisdom. I see all that there, even the Gods Eye.

I do like the idea of extremely powerful greenseers steering comets. I don't know if I am 100% sold, but it is a great idea, and it is plausible. The Hammer of the Water could be by an earthquake, with the hammer referring to the water itself, but the image of a  falling celestial body as a hammer striking the water, causing a tidal wave, makes sense. I'll give all this high plausibility.

I think you may be overlooking something obvious regarding the Stallion (Mare?) that Mounts the World.

Finally the crone opened her eye and lifted her arms. “I have seen his face, and heard the thunder of his hooves,” she proclaimed in a thin, wavery voice.

“The thunder of his hooves!” the others chorused.

Fierce as a storm this prince will be.

Daenerys Stormborn <------

 

I also noticed you counted the storm and the ocean as similar concepts. I believe the Ironborn would gut you on the spot and drop you into the ocean for heresy. for saying that. The association of the Storm God with fire is albeit a bit of a revision for George. He originally said the Drowned God brought fire up from under the ocean. Later he back tracks and has the Grey King trick the storm god into throwing lighting at him and stealing the fire from where the lighting struck a tree or something. The point being that fire is associated with the Storm God. The colors of the Damphairs are blue, green and grey, I believe. They and the Drowned God associated by Moroqo (sp?) with the the Great. Other. Granted, I know that many of these association are largely horseshit (a commodity only valued by the Dothraki as a source of fuel for fires.) Let me clarify. I mean Melisandre declaring every god other than Rh'llor a demon is horseshit. These "gods" are all personifications of magical forces. Nonetheless, I think you are associating the Stallion who Mounts the World with the wrong magical forces.

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Actually I'm aligning the SWMTW with greenseer magic, not ice or fire or sea or storm. I am familiar with the fire / storm (air) alignment and the storm / sea antagonism, certainly. I highlighted the storm and the flood because in catastrophic terms, the storm brought the flood. The storm was a firestorm, but it also brought cold and darkness by turning the lights out. All the elements are involved here. Oh and good Ironborn joke :) 

I think you tend to agree with me (correct me if I'm wrong) and others that ice and fire magic ultimately have their origins in greenseer magic, twisting or corrupting greenseer magic, etc. The Others have always shown signs of coming from the trees and from greenseers, IMO, and my research into fire sorcerers shows the same. At Dany's alchemical wedding and in many other bonfire scenes, the flames woken from burning wood take the form of fiery sorcerers or fiery dancers or both, and I think the message is that burning wood stands for greenseers that transform via fire as Mel has, and the result is dancing fiery sorcerers. The horned moon is also associated with dancing, a related concept. 

Dany still shows signs of being the stallion, although the Odin angle clearly indicates Bran. She's the one who thinks she might be able to fly on dragon back and touch the comet; in ADWD she flies on dragon back and imagines touching the moon. These actions are meant to be associated with extremely powerful sorcery and that is indeed where I see Dany's arc headed. I predict Dany will become the full incarnation of a Valyrian sorceror, or if you prefer, a "fire seer" or "redseer." Her arc and Bran's have so many parallels - as many as she and Jon - and so these are the two I am keeping my eye on for future comet steering. Also, I am pretty sure that if the comet was steered, it was done via sound, specifically the horn. The horn is even called "dragonbinder," and if comets are dragons... "cometbinder." This makes it the horn of Joramun also, as it woke the giants in the earth and WILL be responsible for taking down the Wall - but not directly, but by summoning / binding a comet. And that horn will soon be in Dany's hands. What will happen when she blows it? 

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And as for the varying accounts of where the Grey King obtained fire - there are three different accounts which all sound different but really are not. In addition to the 1.) Drowned God carrying a burning brand from the ocean and 2.) Grey King stealing fire via the Storm God's thunderbolt, we also have the idea that 3.) Grey King possessed Nagga's fire as a living thrall. Now, if we consider that (the following are hypothesis) 3.)the sea dragon was a moon meteor which triggered a flood, the 2.) thunderbolt is the falling meteor, and the 1.) drowned God is the drowned moon goddess, we can see these three ideas as part of the same story. The fire brought from the ocean by the ancient Ironborn is the meteorite steel, and this finds a manifestation in the stories of the ancient Ironborn who carried blck weapons that drank the souls of those they slew. Lightbringer was a black sword made from a moon meteor which drank Nissa Nissa's blood and soul, and I think these ideas are talking about the same thing. There's corroboration for the burning brand being a falling star in a Jon chapter of ACOK, where he and Stonesnake scale the Skirling Pass. They describe the watch fire in the pass as a red fallen star, and then Jon says he'll throw down a burning brand when they reach it. Burning brand = fallen star. As for lightning, well, lightning comes from Storm God Zeus's Mjolnir, his lightning hammer. From Gods 'Hammer' - lightning. And the sea dragon - she drowns whole islands. That's a comet impact for sure, one that triggers floods and earthquakes. 

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Oh and that also takes is right back to the Storm Lords - men who wear antlers on their head. They are recalling the greenseer horned lords too, and rightly associate him with stealing something from heaven and provoking a tsunami of divine wrath. 

When Renly or Robert don their antlered helms, they are described as "a giant" and "a horned god." That's the idea - taller than average horned men who were god-like, and who brought the storm. But then Renly is murdered by "Azor Ahai's" shadowsword, only to reappear as 'resurrected Renly' at the battle of the Blackwater, where his antlers fun gold with flame and he leads an "army of demons in steel." I think this is George giving us a glimpse of what Azor Ahai truly was - a greenseer converted by fire. 

I see George using a modified version of the Oak and Holly King idea here. Basically, think of these guys as twin brother Garths, one green and one red. They kill each other like the oak and holly King. They die and resurrect in various ways. Garth is the traditional horned God of Cerrunos tradition, while Azor Ahai is more like the baphomet idea of a horned deity. 

What about ice? Well, there might be three Garths, actually. There are three Baratheon brothers, and three Garths in the Nightwatch as well, and I think they are meant to paralleled. I won't go into that here but it stands to reason. The trident has three forks - red, green and blue - to match fire, greenseer, and ice magic. If some greenseers turned to fire, some probably did so with ice as well, perhaps one to counter the other. The Garths in the NW act out very interesting roles, with one helping to murder Mormont and two of them fighting each other. It might be a thing. 

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I think you tend to agree with me (correct me if I'm wrong) and others that ice and fire magic ultimately have their origins in greenseer magic, twisting or corrupting greenseer magic, etc. The Others have always shown signs of coming from the trees and from greenseers, IMO, and my research into fire sorcerers shows the same. At Dany's alchemical wedding and in many other bonfire scenes, the flames woken from burning wood take the form of fiery sorcerers or fiery dancers or both, and I think the message is that burning wood stands for greenseers that transform via fire as Mel has, and the result is dancing fiery sorcerers. The horned moon is also associated with dancing, a related concept. 

I'm not sure that I totally did before 30 seconds ago, but I will agree, now. It sounds like a strong interpretation of things I have had in my head.

 

Dany still shows signs of being the stallion, although the Odin angle clearly indicates Bran. She's the one who thinks she might be able to fly on dragon back and touch the comet; in ADWD she flies on dragon back and imagines touching the moon. These actions are meant to be associated with extremely powerful sorcery and that is indeed where I see Dany's arc headed. I predict Dany will become the full incarnation of a Valyrian sorceror, or if you prefer, a "fire seer" or "redseer." Her arc and Bran's have so many parallels - as many as she and Jon - and so these are the two I am keeping my eye on for future comet steering. Also, I am pretty sure that if the comet was steered, it was done via sound, specifically the horn. The horn is even called "dragonbinder," and if comets are dragons... "cometbinder." This makes it the horn of Joramun also, as it woke the giants in the earth and WILL be responsible for taking down the Wall - but not directly, but by summoning / binding a comet. And that horn will soon be in Dany's hands. What will happen when she blows it? 

I still don't like a new comet smashing into the remaining moon, but the horn idea goes along way towards making me like it more.

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Oh and that also takes is right back to the Storm Lords - men who wear antlers on their head. They are recalling the greenseer horned lords too, and rightly associate him with stealing something from heaven and provoking a tsunami of divine wrath. 

When Renly or Robert don their antlered helms, they are described as "a giant" and "a horned god." That's the idea - taller than average horned men who were god-like, and who brought the storm. But then Renly is murdered by "Azor Ahai's" shadowsword, only to reappear as 'resurrected Renly' at the battle of the Blackwater, where his antlers fun gold with flame and he leads an "army of demons in steel." I think this is George giving us a glimpse of what Azor Ahai truly was - a greenseer converted by fire. 

I see George using a modified version of the Oak and Holly King idea here. Basically, think of these guys as twin brother Garths, one green and one red. They kill each other like the oak and holly King. They die and resurrect in various ways. Garth is the traditional horned God of Cerrunos tradition, while Azor Ahai is more like the baphomet idea of a horned deity. 

What about ice? Well, there might be three Garths, actually. There are three Baratheon brothers, and three Garths in the Nightwatch as well, and I think they are meant to paralleled. I won't go into that here but it stands to reason. The trident has three forks - red, green and blue - to match fire, greenseer, and ice magic. If some greenseers turned to fire, some probably did so with ice as well, perhaps one to counter the other. The Garths in the NW act out very interesting roles, with one helping to murder Mormont and two of them fighting each other. It might be a thing. 

Red, green, and blue are all over the place. This was the first place I noticed it.

"A large ragged sheepskin was tossed across the papers. Arya had started to roll it up when the colors caught her eye: the blue of lakes and rivers, the red dots where castles and cities could be found, the green of woods. She spread it out instead. THE LANDS OF THE TRIDENT, said the ornate script beneath the map. The drawing showed everything from the Neck to the Blackwater Rush. There’s Harrenhal at the top of the big lake, she realized, but where’s Riverrun? Then she saw. It’s not so far . . ." Clash 871

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The Long Night was caused by the planetary rotational shift to the very edge of the Goldilocks zone .

Do you mean orbital shift? How would you explain the tales of the Sun hiding its face then?

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I'm not sure that I totally did before 30 seconds ago, but I will agree, now. It sounds like a strong interpretation of things I have had in my head.

I still don't like a new comet smashing into the remaining moon, but the horn idea goes along way towards making me like it more.

 

By all means, continue to brainstorm alternative ideas or variant ideas. I've got to keep pursuing the leads that I am seeing, but if you have a gut feeling about a different version, you should follow it and see where it leads, just as you've done here with the axial tilt ideas. If we all keep groping around in the dark were bound to find some light-switches. 

The idea of the stallion who mounts being a greenseer makes me recall that Danny has a nice little slice of Blackwood blood in her veins. If Mel is the daughter of Bloodraven and Shiera, she too is part Blackwood and may being tapping into greenseer magic as well as fire magic, to the extent that they are even different things. 

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