Moqorro's Dragons: the Fates Are Three (analysis)

[TheSeason]

 

Hello All! This is my first post to the forums after some months of lurking and reading many awesome theories and essays. My first post is… not exactly a theory, but more an analysis of Moqorro's Dragons as conveyed to Tyrion in Dance. I've seen many interpretations of who Moqorro's "dragons" are, but I've yet to come across this take on the "prophecy"/fire-vision; apologies if I am wrong and this has already been discussed, I'm new here. [TLDR at bottom.]

Moqorro's Dragons: The Fates Are Three

 

So… To start, the extended quote, for sake of some important context and indispensible symbolism, color-coded for emphasis (emphasis red for War for Dawn and for R'hllorism and Interpretive Prophecy, emphasis green for Tyrion; emphasis purple for Dany and for Political Impositions upon Prophecy):

 

All about the Olives (Tyrion, A Dance with Dragons, 478-9)

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When the evening prayers had ended and the ship's crew had once again dispersed, some to their watch and others to the food and rum and hammocks, Moqorro remained beside his nightfire, as he did every night. The red priest rested by day but kept vigil through the dark hours, to tend his sacred flames so that the sun might return to them at dawn.

Tyrion squatted across from him and warmed his hands against the night's chill. Moqorro took no notice of him for several moments. He was staring into the flickering flames, lost in some vision. Does he see days yet to come, as he claims? If so, that was a fearsome gift. After a time the priest raised his eyes to meet the dwarf's. "Hugor Hill," he said, inclining his head in a solemn nod. "Have you come to pray with me?"

"Someone told me that the night is dark and full of terrors. What do you see in those flames?"

"Dragons," Moqorro said in the Common Tongue of Westeros. He spoke it very well, with hardly a trace of accent. No doubt that was one reason the high priest Benerro had chosen him to bring the faith of R'hllor to Daenerys Targaryen. "Dragons old and young, true and false, bright and dark. And you. A small man with a big shadow, snarling in the midst of all."

"Snarling? An amiable fellow like me?" Tyrion was almost flattered. And no doubt that is what he intends. Every fool loves to hear he's important. "Perhaps it was Penny you saw. We're almost of a size."

"No, my friend."

My friend? When did that happen, I wonder? "Did you see how long it will take us to reach Meereen?"

"You are eager to behold the world's deliverer?"

Yes and no. The world's deliverer may snick off my head or give me to her dragons as a savory. "Not me," said Tyrion. "For me, it is all about the olives. Though I fear I may grow old and die before I taste one. I could dog-paddle faster than we're sailing. Tell me, was Selaesori Qhoran a triarch or a turtle?"

The red priest chuckled. "Neither. Qhoran is… not a ruler, but one who serves and counsels such, and helps conduct his business. You of Westeros might say steward or magister."

King's Hand? That amused him. "And selaesori?"

Moqorro touched his nose. "Imbued with a pleasant aroma. Fragrant, would you say? Flowery?"

"So Selaesori Qhoran means Stinky Steward, more or less?"

"Fragrant Steward, rather."

Tyrion gave a crooked grin. "I believe I will stay with Stinky. But I do thank you for the lesson."

"I am pleased to have enlightened you. Perhaps someday you will let me teach you the truth of R'hllor as well."

"Someday." When I am a head on a spike.

 

 

Snipping the quote down to begin with, I'll have a look at the vision itself as relayed by Moqorro to Tyrion:

 

"Dragons… Dragons old and young, true and false, light and dark. And you, a small man with a big shadow snarling in the midst of all."

…

"Perhaps it was Penny you saw. We're almost of a size."

"No, my friend."

 

The first way to interpret this vision is a literal and in-universe reading: Moqorro sees in his nightfire a series of dragons—of six types—and then a vision of Tyrion, perhaps himself a dragon, perhaps not—it is insinuated that it was not the shadow of a "dwarf" that Moqorro saw when he says that Tyrion's "shadow" could not be mistaken for Penny's. Perhaps it was a lion's shadow or a gargoyle's or a dragon's: all creatures that Tyrion repeatedly has been associated with throughout the text, perhaps including in Daenerys's vision in the House of the Undying—"a white lion ran through grass taller than a man"—as well as Quaithe's warning to Dany of those (currently traveling to Meereen) to beware—"lion and griffin."

So, this would include a vision pertaining to Tyrion (of indeterminate shadow) and dragons: one "old" (Bloodraven?), one "young" (Dany), one "true" (Jon), one "false" (Aegon), one "light" (Varys, being "Brightflame" Targaryen?), and one "dark" (Illyrio Mopatis, being Blackfyre of maternal descent?), with poor old true light Maester Aemon (Targaryen) utterly forgotten alone on the Wall once again!!! That way, six dragons plus one lion makes seven persons of import to the prophecy.

Except… "snarling in the midst of all…" The above interpretation as yet cannot place Tyrion in midst of Bloodraven's machinations in the Game of Prophecy. Whoops. Well, there's still time, I suppose, for they two to come into some contentious contact, as Tyrion has already done so with all the other dragons mentioned thereafter (I have included Dany in this list not only because Tyrion is currently outside of Meereen and trying to get the Second Sons to turn coat and carry him to Meereen's court, but also because Tyrion has likely inadvertently triggered a war between Dany and Aegon "Young Griff" with his advice to the latter on the pole boat struggling toward Volantis. Dance.)

Still, a very viable and in-universe applicable (thus far) interpretation of "Moqorro's Dragons," and therefore worthy of all due consideration. I'd like to put forth another option, in addition to this one…

 

Three Heads Has the Dragon

Dragons… Dragons old and young, true and false, light and dark. And you, a small man with a big shadow snarling in the midst of all.

 

There are only four people involved in my secondary interpretation of the above vision: three dragons and one (unwittingly?) vicious white lion casting a big (scary) shadow over them all. That is, the author's choice of conjunctive here may have meaning and purpose to the narrative and theme of the overall work.

Thus I've come to the conclusion that the vision may pertain to three dragons: the dragon old and young, the dragon true and false, and the dragon light and dark. My interpretation of the prophecy is as much for the reader as it is for the characters in-narrative, and plays heavily upon the themes established for each of the characters named within it, beginning with A Game of Thrones and culminating (thus far) in A Dance with Dragons. I think the symbolism and motifs inherent in the interpretation make it that much stronger, likelier, and more meaningful.

 

Daenerys Targaryen, Old and Young

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From the moment we meet Daenerys in Game, she is a character struggling with a particular conundrum: is the old way of life (even, as yet, being a life she as never known!) more meaningful and valuable than the new by its virtue of simply being "older"? She finds herself caught, again and again between history and the future, between tradition and progress, between old dreams and the new.

Her yearning for "home" in her very first chapter highlights this dilemma and establishes her evolving story arc throughout the series. Will she cling to what once was or will she make her own way in the world? When she weeps to Viserys that she doesn't wish to marry Khal Drogo but only wants to "go home," she thinks of her house with the red door (for the first time of many), where she was happiest and safest in her childhood, but Viserys immediately presumes "home" to be a place Daenerys has never even seen and barely knows about (the Red Keep with its uncomfortable Iron Throne), and demands to know how they are to go home without an army.

After being sold to Khal Drogo as his child wife and sex slave (and developing a severe case of Stockholm Syndrome), Dany's dilemma only grows. She experiments with being a Khaleesi, as it affords her both a false sense of security and the only taste of power—albeit indirect, tenuous, and utterly unreal—that she has ever known. Her brother, Viserys, meanwhile, clings to "old" Westerosi ways, such as refusing to change out of his stinking, sweat-stained silks for more appropriate grass vests and sandsilk trousers, and scoffs at and degrades Dany's "new" way of life and her "new" peoples, the Dothraki.

After the death of Khal Drogo, Dany reinvents herself again and again—from Khaleesi to Mother of Dragons to Breaker of Chains to Queen of Meereen with her "floppy ears," and more. It is fitting that Dany's Meereenese arc climaxes in her outright rejection of the new way of life amongst the new peoples that she herself claimed by force and established against her subjects' will! Instead, she turns back to her roots, to the "old" ways of House Targaryen (she thinks, her only education about Westerosi and Targaryen history coming from the unreliable, biased, and bitterly romanticized stories her brother told her, due a combination of an unstable childhood with limited resources and a growing sense of denial and willful ignorance despite her newly acquired and almost unlimited resources as a queen!) of Fire and Blood, because "dragons plant no trees."

During this series of transformations, moreover, Dany in effect becomes a youthful crone, of sorts, following the stillbirth of her deformed son Rhaego and her interactions with the maegi Mirri Maz Duur. She reflects upon this herself in Meereen whilst preparing for her political marriage to Hizdhar zo Loraq. When Meereenese traditions require that she permit her prospective bridegroom's female family members to inspect her reproductive parts (one of many Meereenese traditions she scorns and rejects outright, disdainfully referring to any public respect she must show them as "wearing her floppy ears" so she might be "queen of the rabbits."), Dany wonders to herself what might happen were they to carry out such an inspection of her fertility and find that she—widely touted as one of the most beautiful women in the world—is "withered" and dried up and infertile/dead inside, like an old crone.

Is it not fitting then, that Dany is the first named Targaryen that we meet and swiftly becomes (to her knowledge, and most of the world's as well) the last Targaryen? She is the "old" Targaryen dragon, the only one remaining by the end of Dance whose heritage and "blood of the dragon" has never been questioned, despite her youth and inexperience and broad learning curve (as exhibited repeatedly during her many self-reinventions).

Jon Snow, True and False

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Like Dany's descriptor above, Jon Snow's serial narrative arc has been largely concerned with trueness and falseness—in name and identity and heritage, in matters of oath and vow and duty, even in his very human nature (being a powerful, if untrained and sometimes reluctant Skinchanger)! From the first, Jon Snow must walk a fine line and find an impossible to attain or maintain natural medium between trueness and falseness, between truth and lie, between letter or spirit of the duty he has taken upon (and sometimes has had foisted upon) himself. Is he a Stark or a Targaryen, a man or a wolf, an oath-breaker or an oath-keeper? Perhaps a bit of both? Is it even acceptable (to himself, to others, to the idealized and romanticized notions and memory of "his father's honor," upon which he himself is by-and-large accused of being "the only stain," no matter how unreasonable and cruel it is to castigate and censure the child for his father's sins) to be or become not one or the other but some unnamable, indeterminate, bemusing muddle of both?

His storyline begins with the question—posed as mystery, not only to the reader, but also to the story universe and, most importantly, to Jon Snow himself—"who am I?" and—forgive the pun—snowballs from there. By Westerosi custom, so-called illegitimate children are precluded from carrying the family name, and are thereby required to be named in honor of a place or are not permitted to carry any name at all; moreover, these children, once "acknowledged" by their fathers, are routinely given the insulting—and otherwise prejudicially damning—style "Bastard of [Place, customarily castle name]" so as to demarcate them from birth as untrustworthy and dangerous pseudo-highborn baseborn children (this, standing in stark opposition to the demarcation of name for trueborn children, as if by some fluke of parental status and circumstance at the time of conception the child may be made false in nature and value). Thereby, the so-called illegitimate child's name is a brand in Westerosi custom, and no more can its taint be removed or hidden than the demon mask burned into Ser Jorah Mormont's face upon his enslavement on Slaver's Bay so any potential slave owners or -handlers might beware the inherent threat he poses to the men who seek to abuse and exploit him. By proclaiming him "bastard" and "baseborn," Ned Stark stole not only Jon Snow's birthright (whatever it was, which is beyond the scope of this discussion) and his heritage (whether one accepts RLJ-theory reading, it is imperative to remember that a child's heritage is passed on by the mother as well as the father, so either way Ned Stark has raised Jon Snow in a state of culture-deprivation) but also denied him the identity of his manhood, in so far as his identity as a man has been shaped, colored, and affected by his status as a "bastard" to his detriment; Jon Snow must fight for the basic human right that Ned Stark's other children enjoy, for example: Robb Stark—if not permitted the positive light his father's reputation might cast on him—is at least afforded the dignity to determine his own reputation by the grace of a "blank slate" provided to him on the virtue of being an unknown variable. The status Jon Snow must endure when meeting strangers hinges, on the other hand, upon the question: are you a son of Ned Stark, or are you just the bastard? That is, implicitly, are you true or are you false?

This is a powerful thing to steal from a person, the basic human dignity that every person ought to enjoy and the neutrality of the unknown variable status that should be replaced only upon judgments of his own actions and statements. Instead, the child is forced to grow up and live—not only in a state of willfully crafted ignorance and deprivation—in the shadow of someone else's choices, cruelly judged and actively punished and abused for them. This "shadow of doubt" and the aspersion by association endured during the developmental stages of life, will thereafter color and at times even perforce define choice, action, and identity the child's own, felt as a taint upon his own head instead of as an abuse suffered.

Jon Snow's arc, upon the initial presentation of this mystery and dilemma, soon forces him into an unnecessary quandary and thereafter a false dichotomy. Ned Stark's bewildering failure to prepare for Jon Snow's future and prosperity—despite arming him with an "almost-noble" education and upbringing that otherwise he shall never be permitted to utilize, let alone to his benefit—unfairly winches him into the position to either willfully exile himself in what amounts to a prison workforce or willfully exile himself into the unknown (Catelyn Tully Stark's vicious demand that he cannot stay at his home if his father is not present to enforce the right of residence, and Ned Stark's out-of-character, vile refusal to provide for and protect his son from outside forces that would bring him to great harm—it cannot be forgotten that a fourteen-year-old boy was being shipped into exile as a "disposable conscript soldier" alongside murderers and rapers to fight to-the-death dread, daring, and experienced wildling raiders—at least, at this point, Gared "the deserter" has been executed and the Watch and the Starks have been warned of his encounters north of the Wall; he, an experienced ranger, was unlikely to have so quailed following a routine encounter with wildlings after having spent fifty years upon the Wall for his crimes!). Given so few options, Jon Snow chooses to join the Night's Watch as a child, by oath forsaking rights and privileges—some of which he does not even realize he may be entitled to; but Ned Stark does, and again sends him forth in a state of willfully-crafted ignorance and deprivation, a problem with a rather simple solution: tell him the truth before letting him take his vows—without ever really knowing what that means.

In the Night's Watch he is faced with the first of many unattainable ideals which will form the bedrock of his character arc: care about the realm enough to fight and die for its prosperity and protection from external threat—but never care about the realm enough to fight and die for its prosperity and protection from internal threat! The nonsense of this moral paradigm is further highlighted by the ridiculousness of the state of affairs on the Wall, the internal ignorance and confusion of the Watch's actual purpose, traditions, and vows, and the external ignorance in north and south, replete with mockery of Watchmen, the Wall, and the very real threats from the far north, fallen to the wayside in favor of human warfare, corruption, and self-indulgence.

Are the wars of the realm always an unnecessary distraction from the wars to the north? Ironically, no. Sometimes putting down a rebellion or seating a leader in power who respects or acknowledges the importance of the Watch is a risk the Watchmen must take, otherwise a slow destruction is assured them (perhaps due a combination of long, devastating war that cripples the realm in its hour of need and the deliberate/negligent degradation of the Watch, its aims, and its resources).

Such dilemmas and false dichotomies are the keystone of the Jon Snow arc: how might he become just enough Free Folk to remain an honorable Watchman… how he might balance the letter with the spirit of his oaths to protect the realms of men, such that he now becomes just enough a Watchman to protect and provide for the Free Folk in their hour of need… how can Watchmen protect the realm by taking no part so as to remain unbloodied for other wars to come when taking no part might well result in the devastation of the realm they are meant to protect, such that the realm can no longer withstand the foe when the other wars are upon them... how can the Watch make much-needed resourceful friends in the realms of men when they insist upon forced neutrality so as to make no foes?

The question of humanity and humanitarian endeavors (and if the Night's Watch itself is not an ancient humanitarian endeavor, what is it?) is further underscored by his loving relationship with Ghost (his direwolf "wife" and companion) and yet the reluctance and confusion he experiences as that bond grows stronger. "I am not a wolf," he proclaims, with the taste of blood watering his mouth as result of sharing Ghost's hunger for "red meat." Unwittingly skinchanging, he complains of the stench of a Watchman's "unwashed breeches" and "the overpowering musk" of the Giant in his party. Certainly, he appears to be rather self-conscious of the comments circulating the Wall about him, calling him "a warg" and "a beastling," more wolf than man, to the detriment of Night's Watch cohesion, and any policy he might hope to implement regarding Free Folk (who embrace and respect, if sometimes fear skinchangers) on the Wall and the Gifts. Yet, despite all reluctance and confusion, upon his betrayal and murder, Jon Snow cannot help but cry out and reach for the one companion he knows to be his unwavering and true friend, whispering his name as he falls dying in the snow—a deliberate allusion to Rhaegar dying upon the Trident, whispering Lyanna's name, and the mystery and question of identity that so bitterly began Jon Snow's arc and quest for his own manhood.

Aegon Targaryen VI/"Young Griff", Light and Dark

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From his very first mention in Game, Aegon "Young Griff" Targaryen's storyline has revolved around the question of his identity and legitimacy—is he red or is he black, is he light or is he dark, and does it even matter? Whether ("Brightflame") Targaryen or Blackfyre or Mummer's… a dragon is a dragon, of the blood of Old Valyria, of the blood of the dragon, of the line of Aegon the Conqueror.

Young Griff cannot turn out to be the Promised Prince—the dragon itself—but he is a dragon, nonetheless. If he is not Rhaegar Targaryen's son and heir rescued via method of sacrifice of the Pisswater Prince… it is imperative to remember that Aegon "Young Griff" Targaryen also is not another in a long series of selfish usurpers, but merely a victim and a pawn of older, more powerful men with their own agendas (a child slave, in effect, much the way that Dany herself started out), who began their abuse of him when he was far too young to understand that he was being abused and that his identity was being forcibly and systematically stripped from him (another "Reek" one might argue, although the method of his brainwashing would have been less violent if no less psychologically devastating!).

Although Dany herself takes an immediate aggressive and antagonistic view of Aegon in Clash (following her trip to the House of the Undying… trees) and becomes increasingly obsessed with traitors, treasons, and usurpers, thus setting herself up to war with him from a (willfully ignorant) moral high ground, the reader must be more careful to realize that the Mummer's Dragon is merely the puppet and that it is the Mummer himself who is the monster, which therefore may shift the moral righteousness to Aegon "Young Griff" Targaryen in any confrontation between them (at least initially).

It is too soon into Aegon "Young Griff" Targaryen's arc to discuss his arc in any more depth, I think, so I'll leave off here with the above considerations.

Snarling in their Midst

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Tyrion's relationship with the abovementioned three dragons is described as possibly antagonistic—even if unwittingly so—and dangerous. The potential threat of a Lannister circling three young dragons cannot be understated in itself, a dynamic that goes back only a single generation and yet has undeniable impact upon and meaning for the destinies of Houses Targaryen, Stark, and Lannister as well as the remainder of Westeros (at the very least; the fate of Essos and the War for the Dawn may well be determined upon the strength of Stark-Lannister animosity due to Lannister aggressions and war crimes against House Targaryen!).

The Starks started a devastating war because of Ned's lingering distrust of House Lannister stemming back to the slaughter of Rhaegar Targaryen's eldest children during the Sack of King's Landing; and with Jon Snow (who not only inherited his father's body frame, melancholia, disposition and mannerisms, but also may look a little more like his father despite characteristic Stark complexion than we readers have been led to believe, judging by authorial choices such as Maester Aemon's blindness, Ghost's unique appearance, etc., and upon Ned Stark's behavior: his absolute and bewildering failure to plan for Jon's future despite providing him an education and upbringing he seemingly would never have opportunity to utilize, his refusal to so much as house a fourteen-year-old child in King's Landing even if there was no place for him at court—certainly, he had the means to do so, his willingness to send him to the Night's Watch, his eagerness to hide him from anyone who knew Rhaegar personally, and more) constantly in his face and on his mind alongside the rest of Rhaegar's children, it only highlights the sheer impossibility for Ned to take a step back to approach his Lannister "problem" with rationality and needful distance from his emotional biases and triggers. Symbolic surrogates like sixteen-year-old Loras Tyrell (an odd blue rose amongst the green and gold of his House) only worsen this dilemma and Ned's tendency to short-circuit when addressing matters of Lannister treachery, Robert Baratheon's "Targaryen grudge madness," imperiled children, and Targaryen vulnerability in the new regime.

Tyrion Lannister is a man uniquely empowered by the new regime (alongside the remainder of his family, and Jaime and Cersei Lannister, and their children, especially) and the Stark-led War of Five Kings both—otherwise Tywin Lannister would have continued hiding him away, either in Casterly Rock or in insulting positions far-beneath his capacity and capability; the war in the Riverlands and Jaime Lannister's rashness (first in assaulting Ned Stark in King's Landing, which forced him to flee the city—he cannot be accountable for not knowing Tywin's thoughts, which were never shared with him, about luring Ned Stark into an ambush—and then in riding against Riverrun, to be captured and imprisoned) act to whittle the active agency of Lannisters in positions of power who Tywin might rely upon to carry out his will (Ser Kevan Lannister acts as his sounding board and a needed resource in the war effort, so it appears Tywin was loathe to part with him when another viable option presented itself), and he cannot trust Cersei in King's Landing to control or contain Joffrey's impulses and follies. Tyrion appears as the only choice, and he proved himself capable of some political maneuvering in his escape from the Eyrie, vindicated in trial-by-combat, and in persuading the mountain clans to fight for him. In King's Landing, then, Tyrion Lannister proves himself again a hundred times over, saving the city from Joffrey's cruelties, Cersei's ineptitude, and Stannis Baratheon's incursions upon the Blackwater. In typical fashion when Tyrion's contributions are considered, he receives neither praise, thanks, nor even acknowledgement for his efforts—not only is he ignored as the major contributor in saving the city from Stannis Baratheon on equal footing with the Baratheon sackers, going so far as to lead sorties personally when the Hound quails from the fires (that is, the Lannister-Tyrell host relied wholly upon deception in its endeavor to quash the Baratheon host, but Tyrion had to face them upon more solid ground once his initial wildfire deception succeeded only in part to stymie the foe), but also he is blamed for the cruelties and ineptitude of Joffrey and Cersei Lannister, portrayed as "a twisted little monkey demon" pulling the strings of a child and a woman and making them dance to his vile delights, when in fact it is the purported innocents who are the true monsters in the city's suffering.

After attempting to stomach these slights and insults to his name and honor, and watching the cowardly Joffrey (who happily fled the battle and complained of the destruction of his ships—never once thinking of the men sailing them), his vain sister, Cersei (who called Joffrey back, causing riots, and drank herself into a vicious temper in the keep, and would have burned the city to the ground with her ill-thought wildfire scheme), and his glory-hound father, Tywin (who would have failed utterly if not for other people's efforts and a bit of freak luck—Tyrion, Littlefinger, Edmre Tully's thwarting of his attempted-crossing westward, Renly's Ghost—yet assumed almost all the credit for his own) receive all the recognition he deserves, Tyrion finally sours completely upon yet again being blamed as the monstrous mastermind of a crime he did not commit against the valiant, noble, innocent Joffrey. His farce of a trial culminates in a near-conviction upon the strength of lies and innuendo and misrepresentation, and this is highlighted in the final witness to stand against him: Shae, the camp follower he carried to King's Landing and kept as paramour, the whore he foolishly fell in love with, convincing himself of a sweeter lie instead of accepting a bitter truth (as he once counseled Jon Snow never to do).

When his second attempt to escape a kangaroo court in a trial-by-battle fails him (and Prince Oberyn Martell), and he finds himself facing certain death, his brother Jaime comes to renew his faith in his family by rescuing him from the pit his own father and sister knowingly falsely consigned him to. Or so he thinks. Jaime soon quashes his last hope in his own when he reveals yet another bitter truth: his wife, Tysha, gang-raped by an entire Lannister garrison and Tyrion himself on his father's orders, so as to teach him a lesson about class and status, was an innocent victim all along. Tyrion's entire Tysha arc revolves around the theme of blaming the victim, with Tyrion taking some small solace in his part in the event from Tysha's informed conniving and blame; suddenly, with this one bitter truth, Tyrion must face the question of whether he really is the monster everyone proclaims him to be. His role in the gang-rape is shifted beneath his feet from that of victim—his father made him do it, and perhaps she even a little bit deserved to be punished for conniving after Lannister gold and breaking his young heart in the process—to perpetrator—she was utterly innocent, she was the only person outside of family (Jaime, Gerion, perhaps others) who loved him for him, and he repaid her with betrayal most foul!

Facing this bitter truth, Tyrion outright loses the will to live, going so far as to collect poisonous mushrooms for the purpose of committing himself to suicide. He is more monster than man, a coward who rapes his own wife, stands by whilst an entire garrison rapes her, insults her with coin as the price for her suffering, and thinks her repaid for breaking his heart… The rest of the world was right about him after all; he wants to make an end. He lives more out of habit than desire, even after he finds his supposed renewed purpose in life when Illyrio Mopatis directs him toward Aegon "Young Griff's" party in the wilderness, with the aim of making a "Targaryen" restoration and reclaiming Casterly Rock for his own. The lie of this mission is evident in the mushrooms in his boot, however. He still clings to the possibility of death, toying with it, and the concept of "going out with a bang!" as he traverses the globe alongside an ambitious "dead" prince.

It is not Aegon's mission that renews Tyrion's desire to live or gives him purpose in life, then, which highlights that although Tyrion may profess friendship and even an alliance with the dragons in Moqorro's visions, his true thoughts, feelings, actions, and purposes may in fact remain neutral or outright counter to theirs. Further highlighting that Tyrion's purposes may be ultimately (even if unwittingly) antagonistic and violent is the irony in his disposal of the mushrooms: just as he decides he wants to live (free or slave, with purpose or without), Tyrion's final action with the mushrooms is to deprive someone else of that selfsame right to choose for themselves and agency to fight for that choice! He wants vengeance against Nurse, his overseer and slave-handler, and instead of attacking in a manner that affords Nurse the right to fight for his life and proclaim his choice with self-defensive agency, Tyrion strips Nurse of any choice and chance. He not only poisons him with mushrooms once meant for himself, but also he does so whilst pretending to take care of him when he was at his weakest and most vulnerable! Nurse caught the bloody flux, and he was so hated and cruel a man that no one would risk themselves to take care of him in his hour of need. Tyrion wanted "to repay a debt" of violence to Nurse… but he did so by feigning friendship.

This is the same vile way his father sacked King's Landing and slaughtered Rhaegar's children and the last Targaryen heirs – one of which may or may not have been Aegon "Young Griff" himself! This is the same reprehensible way his brother, Jaime, slew Mad Aerys on his throne, as well… A smile to the face, cooing comforts in a bleak hour, and a sword in the back when the guard comes down…! One wants to believe Tyrion's proclamations of friendship, that it really is "all about the olives" for him, but his family's modus operandi when dealing with the apotheosized Targaryens and even some of his own aggressive and violent actions might belie the intention in the end. Certainly, he has proved of some help to Jon Snow, Aegon, and even Daenerys (if nothing else, he will turn the Second Sons to the side of Meereen—if to save his own skin—to help win the battle against the Slaver Alliance), but the three dragons needs must beware; it is yet to be determined whether that advice will be ultimately beneficial to them despite seeming or being initially so, and there is no guarantee Tyrion's advice will not soon turn in intent if given in future.

 

This brings me, at last, to Tyrion's place in the prophecy, which can be overlooked because it is revealed not necessarily through the prophecy itself, but rather in context of a fully-quoted passage: 

 

A Stinky Steward

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Tyrion's first actions in the above passage once joining Moqorro beside his nightfire are to perch gargoyle-like across the fire to warm his hands against the night's chill. The emphasis upon positioning—squatted; across from—and extraneous detail "warmed his hands" is itself sufficient, thereby insinuating "the night's chill" is of especial significance… may give insight in his role to play in the vision of the dragons dancing.

Tyrion squatted across from him and warmed his hands against the night's chill.

The next sentence when read in this indirectly revealing context may give us some clue as to any possible motive behind the antagonism and aggression that might come about during the dragon-dance:

 

Moqorro took no notice of him for several moments. He was staring into the flickering flames, lost in some vision.

Tyrion is once again ignored whilst someone is consumed in visions of dragons—people of seemingly more import than he—as their flames flicker and dance. Certainly fearsome dragons might draw any sane man's attention, but in doing so, someone of equal import to the dragons themselves goes overlooked and unremarked. This will not be the first time that Tyrion finds his contributions diminished, disallowed or discredited, or outright denied altogether… but Tyrion has finally acknowledged his own inherent value when he decided that living was no habit, but his desire, and concluded he must rid himself of the mushrooms if he meant to progress from his rock-bottom and regain some of his lost-and-stolen dignity and manhood. Tyrion proclaims himself his own person with that choice and act, and he is no longer willing to go unheard, abused, mocked, and discredited or disgraced. He now expects his due, and will take it if denied him rather than meekly ask to be awarded that which is rightfully his; this is evidenced in his claim despite dispossession of Casterly Rock, when previously he asked Tywin to acknowledge and respect him as heir, and was thoroughly humiliated and degraded as well as denied his birthright and legal rights in answer. What will happen, then, if his contributions are again downplayed, his efforts unrewarded, his reputation or honor besmirched and mocked, and his counsel and aid met with ungrateful disregard? What happens, when his expectations, grounded in newfound sense of self-respect, are cruelly crushed or even met with willful ignorance or selfish vainglory, and credit is refused to be given where credit is due?

 

Does he see days yet to come, as he claims? If so, that was a fearsome gift.

Prophecy, we have seen time and again, is a fearsome thing indeed, if no gift in itself. It encourages irrational, dangerous, and self-serving determinism in all those who believe in it, and may be in some way self-fulfilling in nature. Prophecy (a kind of sorcery) is "a sword without a hilt" we are warned, and after luring one into a false sense of security will bare its teeth and "bite your prick off[,] every time." That does not stop characters from seeking out and utilizing this fearsome gift for their own ends…

Perhaps Tyrion will find some novel use for it as well, using his wit and any books he's read as resource to manipulate someone who wholly believes in prophecy and destiny… If so, would even he escape the tricky, treacherous nature of the gift, forgetting for a moment that it is more like "a half-trained mule" that shall "kick you in the head" the moment you come close enough, thinking you had found some worthwhile use for it.

 

After a time the priest raised his eyes to meet the dwarf's. "Hugor Hill," he said, inclining his head in a solemn nod.

Here, the context may reveal a little more of Tyrion's motivation should he turn antagonistic. His entire life, the world has treated him more "dwarf" than man, and never lets him forget his condition. Should those who are supposed to be most grateful to and respectful (if not, perhaps, admiring) of him fail to meet his expectations in this regard, after he has given them useful counsel (in good faith), and in some way belittle him again, Tyrion is unlikely to forgive such slights, as once he perforce turned the other cheek again and again.

I think it curious that the one time Tyrion is identified in the passage, he is given the "bastard" name Hill—despite the fact Moqorro surely knows who he is—once again denying him his birthright and his dignity. Here he is "the dwarf" and a "Hill" rather than allotted the honors and basic human dignity he feels entitled to (rightly so!). It may strengthen the interpretation of the line above, where he is overlooked in favor of the dragons and their contributions and importance to the prophecy. That Tyrion's part to play in the war to come is in no way outlined in the vision itself, but must be revealed through context in the expanded passage, makes even the reader party to this diminishment and denial. As readers, we are so focused on identifying the dragons (or dragon's heads, it being unclear thus far) that we mostly forget about the one man already identified as party to that vision and his place (his role, his contributions) within it!

 

"Have you come to pray with me?"

"Someone told me that the night is dark and full of terrors.

At first I wasn't certain about including this quote in my analysis, but I decided that it is important, especially if my plain speculation about Tyrion attempting to use prophecy as a tool pans out. Here I found myself reminded of Tyrion's interaction with (Benjen and) Jon Snow in Game, when he belittles Jon Snow's future and contributions at the Wall as "defending the realm from grumpkins and snarks." It puts one in mind of a man mired in forces he cannot comprehend, but possibly meddling with and attempting to master them anyway (I think this is a fate that will befall all four parties of the vision I outlined, and has already affected Jon Snow and Daenerys, at least, so I am in no way singling Tyrion out here.) to his detriment, and, perhaps, even leading to his death. Tyrion is mocking Moqorro here, but in the end, the joke's on him.

 

What do you see in those flames?"

"Dragons,"…. "Dragons old and young, true and false, bright and dark. And you. A small man with a big shadow, snarling in the midst of all."

Despite Cersei's attempts to kill him based upon the Valonqar prophecy, I believe this is Tyrion's first encounter with prophecy in action, and as such he lacks the wary regard he should feel. Note that Moqorro doesn't volunteer the information in this vision, but it is Tyrion's curiosity that leads him into hot water, so to speak. He doesn't take any of this seriously, but if not to be wholeheartedly embraced, prophecy (and even some aspects of R'hllorism) must be respected at least. Tyrion is in the same position as ten-year-old Cersei Lannister, it appears, too arrogant and ignorant to know better than to bestir a sleeping ("dreaming") prophet!

 

"Snarling? An amiable fellow like me?"

This is the most obvious impression one gets that Tyrion's role in this vision is ultimately antagonistic. It also subtly implies that this aggression may be in part unwitting or have roots in an initially "friendly" relationship that goes sour (much like Tywin and Aerys, and even Jon Arryn/Ned and Robert, before him). Tyrion characterizes himself as "amiable," but that has never really been the case; Tyrion has always been an outwardly agreeable, but ultimately dangerous friend or ally to have. His amiability is his cloak, and furthermore it is the reason so many people feel they can safely walk all over him without incurring his wrath and revenge. He's no more than an amiable dwarf, a drunken little lecher, competent but unwilling to demand his honors and rights and defend his reputation, even to the death. We as readers know this not to be the case, but should we remove ourselves a few steps from his inner monologue we might easier see how others regard him in-universe: as someone to mock, rebuke, and walk all over without fear, someone you can take from and not fear he will come looking for you afterward.

Tyrion's reputation and outward personality are much like Littlefinger's, I believe, which is why a vile, cowardly little worm like Janos Slynt thought even he could get away with calling him "Imp!" to his face; which is why Lancel Lannister, upon coming into his own after years of abuse at Robert Baratheon's hands, felt confident making the same mistake; which is why even the singer Symon Silver-Tongue thought he could get away with blackmailing "the Lannister dwarf" without repercussion, a tactic he never would have attempted with any other Lannister or lordling (let alone the Hand of the King)! All three soon met their comeuppance at "the Imp's" hand, cruel, cold fates or (in Lancel's case) lingering humiliation and abuse…. But there was a reason they presumed themselves on equal footing with him in the first place, and I think it was as much his amiable cloak and shield as his dwarf "bastard" status in House Lannister. Will any of our dragons, then, make the same arrogant mistake?

 

Tyrion was almost flattered. And no doubt that is what he intends. Every fool loves to hear he's important. "Perhaps it was Penny you saw. We're almost of a size."

"No, my friend."

This passage further highlights the significance of Tyrion's role in the vision, which may soon be juxtaposed with the insignificance he feels in regards to his recognition for his contributions. Tyrion has always wanted to be loved and respected, but he will at least settle for being flattered. This is exemplified by his conversation with Tywin Lannister following his recuperation after the Battle of the Blackwater. He expected the city (if not the realm) would finally love, admire, and respect him after all of his efforts to keep them safe and unmolested, to repel another vile sack (the likes of which his own father perpetrated against the city years before, and which the city still remembers with dread and heartache a decade-and-a-half later—evidenced by the lack of turnout for Tywin's state funeral, as well as the lack of regard and respect those who did turn up showed his remains; to be held in comparison with the lack of send-off his remains were given by the city when Ser Keven Lannister carries him home to Casterly Rock as opposed to the send-off Ser Loras Tyrell receives when riding off to capture Dragonstone in hopes of saving the Reach from the Ironborn fleet).

Instead, he awakes to find everyone else has already taken all the credit for saving the city—even a ghost!—his own family foremost amongst them despite how their contributions (mostly) pale in comparison to his own, and that he has gone overlooked, ignored, and denied, alone in his dark, dank little cell. He has already been removed from the Tower of the Hand, furthermore, and not even afforded a room to recuperate therein, which was the least respect he deserved, and is hidden away from the city. He awakens, moreover, maimed and mocked for his battle scars, unlike any other man injured in that battle, who at least could expect to be respected and pitied for any injuries sustained at battle—a wound earned, no less, when defending himself from the treacheries of Joffrey and his Kingsguard. And, the final insult upon injury, when he asks his father to treat him with the respect he deserves, and acknowledge his birthright and legal rights, he finds himself mocked, denied, humiliated and dehumanized. He meekly turned away to nurse his quiet hurts, as he has done all his life.

Having reclaimed his self-respect and his power to choose and to act after a long flirtation with suicide and defeat, Tyrion will not meekly turn away again. One way or another—as man or as monster—he will have what he deserves, what he feels owed to him, what he desires for his own. Respect and honors are the least of that. He has seized his own inherent value with his own two hands whilst facing the dilemma of a bleak fate (slavery) or death. He will not be denied, he will not be mistaken for another… Whosoever dares grind his expectations under heel had best beware thereafter!

 

"No, my friend."

My friend? When did that happen, I wonder?

I also debated inclusion of these lines, but think them important as well, if only because they bespeak the confusing nature of nascent friendship. Moqorro is most likely calling Tyrion a friend solely as a figure of speech, but that need not necessarily be the case. Tyrion's internalized response is otherwise extraneous if it has no impactful meaning upon the context. Tyrion knows Moqorro is using a turn-of-phrase, and yet he thinks to himself "when did that happen" as if willfully misunderstanding the context. If included for the readers' sake, however, this otherwise extraneous detail takes on meaning and purpose. It bespeaks to the confusion his "amiable" exterior might engender to anyone who might fail to look beneath the surface… He is a dangerous friend to have in any case, but taking a closer look is imperative to naming him friend or foe. Those who fail to do so, taking him only at face value, will not recognize the danger until too late… like Janos Slynt and Lancel Lannister and the singer, Symon Silver-Tongue.

 

"You are eager to behold the world's deliverer?"

Furthermore highlighting the issue of significance or insignificance that underlies Tyrion's character arc, we have the only named personage of Moqorro's vision—a man oft forgotten, overlooked, denied—set side-by-side with the other unnamed parties of the vision. The dragons are almost immediately heralded as "the world's deliverer," given agency and purpose and significance, whereas Tyrion "snarling in the midst of all" is afforded only a vague, uneasy sense of antagonism.

Calling him "a small man with a big shadow," then, might take on new meaning. Is he small of stature or small of person, and because of that casting a very large shadow upon the dragons in the vision? Considering that dragons in flight are themselves primarily identified as a shadow, dread and dark and disempowering, we may then come to greater understanding of the impact Tyrion's role has in this vision. He casts the shadow that dread shadow-casting dragons themselves should beware.

 

The world's deliverer may snick off my head or give me to her dragons as a savory.

Not to beat a dead horse, but this again reinforces the aggressive and antagonistic nature of Tyrion's relationship to the dragons. It also, perhaps, hints that the dark, treacherous path he might take could only lead to his own misery and misfortune in the end. The dragons might eat him up!

 

"Not me," said Tyrion. "For me, it is all about the olives. Though I fear I may grow old and die before I taste one."

And the painful, tragic irony of the situation is that Tyrion once harbored sweet, peaceful ambitions and desires. If only he could have stayed in his cottage with Tysha forever… With the gang-rape of Tysha, however, Tywin Lannister propelled him down a wearying, fateful path. That event may be the singular most traumatic in Tyrion's life, and it cannot be understated that its impact was to convince Tyrion that he was inherently unlovable. After many attempts, Tywin Lannister finally achieved his goal, and it will have a terrible influence on his fight for recognition and respect now that Jaime's lie has been laid bare to him. Now that Tyrion has claimed his inherent value and reclaimed his agency at his lowest (enslaved and suicidal whilst fugitive in exile and reeling from heartbreak and trying to kick his various addictions!), he will likely sooner fight to the death for what honors and rights he believes due to him than meekly roll over the next time someone slights him (even if the slight is perceived).

From this position of passive aggression, Tyrion must put aside all thoughts and hope of peace. When looking for slights, after all, one shall sooner or later find them.

 

Tell me, was Selaesori Qhoran a triarch or a turtle?"

The red priest chuckled. "Neither. Qhoran is… not a ruler, but one who serves and counsels such, and helps conduct his business. You of Westeros might say steward or magister."

King's Hand? That amused him.

And finally we come to Tyrion's role in the vision, the manner through which he claims any and all agency, authority, and power, the weapon with which he will act—for benefit of the dragons, for detriment of the dragons, for benefit of himself, at long last… Tyrion was never meant to be a leader, a ruler. He has the mind—and (once) possibly the heart as well—to be a worthy ruler, but he lacks the weight of stature.

That's not a dwarf joke, so pardon the unintended pun. Tyrion does not have the resources to make a powerful impression upon the subject masses. That pretty much amounts to he doesn't have the looks for it, which is tragic and pathetic, but true nevertheless. He will never seem kingly to enough people at the right time to be a king.

That does not mean he cannot be an invaluable "behind-the-scenes" ruler and a trusted member of the king's advisory board, those people whose (publicly) un-lauded efforts contribute to making the king seem the kingly ideal at a glance…

 

"And selaesori?"

Moqorro touched his nose. "Imbued with a pleasant aroma. Fragrant, would you say? Flowery?"

"So Selaesori Qhoran means Stinky Steward, more or less?"

"Fragrant Steward, rather."

Tyrion gave a crooked grin. "I believe I will stay with Stinky. But I do thank you for the lesson."

This, however, leads to the ultimate impact Tyrion has as a counselor… the impact feeling unlovable has had on Tyrion's character and character arc…

The name of the ship carrying Tyrion to his destiny is meant to be called fragrant or flowery. It's meant to have a positive impact—upon Tyrion and the dragons, the world's deliverer, and thereby the world itself. But will it?

Tyrion calls this ship "the Stinky Steward" simply because it does stink. It reeks of feces and bilge water and sweaty men in musty cramped quarters and fishy, salty air. It's a terrible place to live, a floating gutter or Petri dish, you might say.

Even so, it was named with pleasant, even admiring, intent. In an instant—and with a joke, he who has been the butt of so many cruel ones—Tyrion strips it of any positive impact. It becomes a foul, stinky ship named for a foul, stinky steward… that is, King's Hand.

 

"I am pleased to have enlightened you. Perhaps someday you will let me teach you the truth of R'hllor as well."

"Someday." When I am a head on a spike.

What fate then, might walking such a dangerous, treacherous path lead to, but that Tyrion does end up with his head upon a spike when all is said and done?

Someday, when I am dead, Tyrion tells Moqorro, I will let you tell me the truth of R'hllor… but as a reader I find myself left with a somewhat uneasy feeling. The phrase "the truth of R'hllor" reminds me uncomfortably of Christian proselytizing. What is the truth of this faith, in the end, what does it boil down to at long last if not… God, at least, loves you. R'hllor, in the eyes of R'hllorists, fights an eternal war against the cold and the dark and death, but what is only implicitly stated is that non-divine life itself alone (so, human beings and all living creatures) are the beneficiaries of this war, and otherwise would be wiped out without this divine intervention against the Great Other. A single conversation would never convince Tyrion of his self-worth and inherent value where so many conversations contributed to his low self-esteem in the first place, but one conversation might have helped wrench open the door to a better future and a possibility of happiness founded upon the man he is rather than what he deserves…

In the end, Tyrion decided he wanted to live, but he failed to think about how he wanted to live thereafter. He forgot the most important variable of the equation, the one that makes it a life worth living. And as a result, he is still seeking without for his happiness and satisfaction when he should be looking within. Casterly Rock won't make him happy; Tysha won't make him happy; Lanna won't make him happy either; a lordship or position of power or fame and recognition from people who mocked and loathed him previously when they thought they could get away with it… won't make him happy. Finding internal value and peace on the other hand… Let us hope he doesn't die before he gets to taste that olive after all.

 

Quaithe's Warning

Quaithe's warning to Dany helped inform my new interpretation of Moqorro's vision. She says:

 

The glass candles are burning. Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon. Remember the Undying. Beware the perfumed seneschal.

 

What to make of this? I think it is, in part, the first iteration of the vision Moqorro relays to Tyrion above!

 

The glass candles are burning.

We know of four glass candles located at the Citadel and a trial young hopefuls are expected to perform in final testing to become Maesters. There are assuredly other glass candles in the world, but these four stand out. They were brought to the Citadel from Valyria, are collected "together" in one place, are part of an arcane ritual that Maesters of the Citadel have carried out for thousands of years even after forgetting its true purpose and turning away from magic altogether, and one of them is shown (not only said) to be burning, permitting the readers a unique glimpse into this magic and ritual. They are made of obsidian and are "slender as a sword," with sharp edges that cut fingertips when touched. They burn but do not consume any fuel. Their light has a unique effect on color and contrast, which may be beneficial to combat the Others. They come in different colors.

At the Citadel, there are three black candles and one green. I believe this symbolizes the three dragons (Daenerys, Jon Snow, Aegon "Young Griff"—the three Targaryen descendents) and Tyrion Lannister, "snarling in the midst of all." I would furthermore be curious to know whether Serra died in childbirth when Aegon "Young Griff" came into the world, since he would otherwise be the only outlier in this group; significantly, Aegon Targaryen VI, Rhaegar and Elia Targaryen's son, would not meet this seeming "criteria" to be one of the dragons, since Elia survived his birth, if barely.

Soon comes the pale mare…

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Quaithe's message addresses Dany only, but I do not think it is meant only for her. Dany's pale mare might well be the bloody flux, but Jon Snow and Aegon shall, perhaps, also see a disease heralded by a pale mare as well; it seems Grey Plague shall soon break out in Westeros, no less, carried either by Jon Connington (Aegon's camp) or Shireen Baratheon (Jon Snow's camp), perhaps both. An outbreak of disease in both latter camps, however, seems likely and has been heavily foreshadowed.

 

And after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon.

Here is an iteration which outlines on the surface interpretation a few people Dany alone must be wary of (whether such warning is to her benefit or detriment is difficult to say in terms of Quaithe's intent, but it is evidenced that such warnings and prophecies have had only a detrimental impact upon Dany's psyche, making her distrustful and expectant of treasons and traitors): Victarion/Euron Greyjoy (the kraken), Archmaester Marwyn (the dark flame, who will bring more magic and prophecy into her life upon reaching her!), Tyrion Lannister (lion), Jon Connington (griffin), Quentyn Martell (the sun's son), and Aegon "Young Griff" (the mummer's dragon).

 

ETA, An Addendum: Despite my first interpretation of this passage, it may not be a warning for Dany alone at all! Interestingly, one can find similar potential "threats" in both the Aegon "Young Griff" and Jon Snow plot arcs, each appropriately fitting into the descriptors above.

Note: For Dany this appears to be three bad or disingenuous advisors with ulterior motives (Marwyn/Moqorro, Tyrion, Jon Connington) and three potential thieves of her dragon "children" and the Iron Throne both (Victarion, Quentyn, Aegon/Young Griff), each of whom masquerades as potential mates (bridegrooms) and one of whom masquerades as close family (Aegon/Young Griff, not Quentyn Martell, though he attempts to re-establish past alliances).

 

Aegon "Young Griff"

Kraken: Euron Greyjoy (currently reaving in the Reach, which Aegon hopes to rally)

Dark Flame: Septa Lemore (possibly a Shadowbinder and maybe a Red Priestess) or Moqorro (should his journey see him westward into the Stormlands as opposed to eastward to Meereen)

Lion: Cersei Lannister (the current controller of the throne, who he'll clash with in taking King's Landing--possibly his burning city from the Undying prophecy below?)

Griffin: Red Ronnet Connington (JonCon's cousin, whose family "inherited" his titles and estates, after JonCon was exiled; remember: Kevan Lannister confronted him on his "(dis)loyalty" after Griffin's Roost was taken, his family is taken hostage, and, previously, Jaime punched him on the nose for insulting Brienne, who was an ally--potential mate--he approached in bad faith)

Sun's Son: Arianne Martell (currently on her way to negotiate, presents herself as potential bride) or Darkstar (possibly Oberyn Martell's secret son?) or even Alleras/Sarella Sand (Oberyn Martell's daughter, currently in Oldtown)

Mummer's Dragon: Jon Snow (? By believing himself a "bastard" and a "Stark" both, he is in fact masquerading as another man!)

Note: Curiously, we also have here three potential threats to Aegon "Young Griff's" claim to the Iron Throne (Euron Greyjoy, Cersei Lannister, and Jon Snow!) and three allies that may come in bad faith or be otherwise detrimental to the cause (Septa Lemore/Moqorro, Red Ronnet Connington, and (Arianne) Martell), being ultimately more trouble than they're worth.

 

Jon Snow

Kraken: Theon Greyjoy (who aided and supported Bolton rule of the North by giving credence to the "Arya Stark" lie, which ultimately led to Jon Snow's murder) or Asha Greyjoy (who still controlled Deepwood Motte and the Stoney Shore)

Dark Flame: Melisandre (A Red Priestess and Shadowbinder)

Lion: Jaime Lannister (who, if Lady Stoneheart is involved, may make his way north sometime soon; regardless, at the time, Jaime Lannister does prove himself a foe to Jon Snow in his efforts to put down the remains of Robb Stark's northern and Trident kingdom—that Direwolf banner is flying for somebody.)

Griffin: Jon Connington(?)

Sun's Son: Arnolf Karstark or his son (whose sigil and motto is the Sun of Winter, and who he has and shall again come into contentious contact with regarding both Alys Karstark's wedding to the new Magnar of Thenn, Sigorn, and advice to bolster the Stannis Baratheon attempt to take Winterfell and rally the North, decrying the elder Karstarks traitors to the cause)

Mummer's Dragon: Aegon "Young Griff"(?)

Note: I have the most trouble making sense of the warning as it pertains to Jon Snow. There appear to be three clear threats to the rally of the North (Greyjoy, Lannister, Karstark), and three possible threats to the prophecy and status of the Promised Prince (Mel, who supports Stannis and hopes to make Shadowbabies with Jon Snow for Stannis's benefit, JonCon who is rallying for Aegon instead of Jon Snow, and Aegon himself, who does not know who he really is, inadvertently claiming Promised Prince status alongside that of Rhaegar's son and last surviving heir), which only indirectly threaten his claim to the Iron Throne. Personally, I'm most uncertain about inclusion of Jon Connington and Aegon "Young Griff" in this warning, so if anyone has any other ideas about that, I'd love to hear them!

 

Note: I'm liking the possibility that Septa Mordane is a Shadowbinder and perhaps also a Red Priestess (though not necessarily) because I do believe each of the three dragons will have a Red Priest/Shadowbinder in their "services" or inner circle—so that would be Quaithe (a Shadowbinder who counsels Dany and has a great impact upon her despite their limited contact otherwise) and possibly Moqorro (should they meet); Septa Mordane/Moqorro (should her stretch marks indicate Shadowbinding as opposed to flesh-and-blood children; should his journey blow him back west and into the Stormlands as opposed to eastward to Meereen); and Melisandre (who Jon Snow has unwittingly—mostly—already co-opted from Stannis Baratheon)

 

A secondary interpretation, however, makes this an iteration of Moqorro's Dragons. Whether this is purely for benefit of the reader is difficult to say, since it is the history of Lightbringer (widely available in-universe and to Dany herself—in Essos!) that informs the interpretation in the first place.

 

The Sun's Son

The Red Sword of Heroes was first forged and tempered in water (shattering), and then in a lion's heart (splitting), and then in Nissa Nissa's heart (its mother's soul and blood) (successfully and fully forged). As such, the first half of each set pertains to Jon Snow, Dany's nephew, the Promised Prince in the prophecy, with "kraken" representing water, "lion" representing lion's heart blood, and "the sun's son" bespeaking the successful third forging of Lightbringer, with Rhaegar assuming his customary fiery/solar symbolism, Lyanna her customary lunar symbolism, and Jon Snow being their son, a literally promised prince.

 

The Mummer's Dragon

It is unfortunate that once again Aegon is being defined by who he is not, but there it is. If Jon Snow is the successful third forging, Aegon "Young Griff," by nature of his (not truly his) claim of being Rhaegar's firstborn son Aegon VI, is held in comparison and opposition to the first (Aegon VI) and the former (Jon Snow), therefore identified by a quality he lacks (not the promised prince), and unwittingly so (the mummer's dragon).

As such, his identification in the triad is a little trickier and murkier. Dark Flame and griffin and mummer's dragon. A hero is tempered in fire as opposed to water in the first forging—a black fire; he is tempered in the heart of a griffin as opposed to a lion—Jon Connington is compelled to accept him despite doubts because of love for his "father" Rhaegar; and he is tempered in the heart of a falsehood (that Elia, who survived childbed and thus did not sacrifice her life for the forging of Aegon VI, and not Serra, who possibly died in childbed** and therefore did sacrifice her life for the forging of Aegon "Young Griff," is his mother) in his third, final, and successful* forging—resulting in a mummer's dragon. A dragon still, but not that dragon.

*Aegon "Young Griff" by virtue of being a dragon, then, was in fact successfully forged. I would not even be surprised to learn that he had two older siblings, making him the third-born child (perhaps Daario is one sibling, with his blue hair like Aegon and yellow silks and (tri-)pronged beard like Illyrio Mopatis?). He stands alongside both Dany (third-surviving child whose mother died in childbed with her; she's actually sixth-born taking all live births into account) and Jon Snow (Rhaegar's third child, if Lyanna's first, whose mother died in childbed with him) and Tyrion (third-born child whose mother died in childbed with him). A mummer's dragon is still a dragon; it is Dany who assumes the negative association with the concept, but the reader need not make the same aggressive and antagonistic assumption. In any case, poor Aegon "Young Griff" is the victim here, not another "usurper" willfully trying to steal the Iron Throne from "rightful" Targaryen heirs; and in the end, we readers must be careful to wholly reject the concept of legitimacy that inherently values or devalues a child based upon the marriage construct—Young Griff, therefore, is a Targaryen too, for all intents and purposes, blood magic included!

**There is some textual evidence that Serra died of Grey Plague; however, I believe this to be an ingenious lie (on part of the character, and a skillful red herring on the part of the author). This statement is made by Illyrio Mopatis--a known liar--to Tyrion Lannister during his attempts to sway him to join Aegon "Young Griff's" cause (the same bold-faced lie-riddled conversation as "black or red, a dragon is a dragon" in reference to the Golden Company's uncharacteristic acceptance of the "Targaryen restoration" contract--a contract "writ in blood."). I think what is happening here is that Illyrio Mopatis lies to Tyrion in a truly dramatic and disquieting way, "I have her hands in my bedroom, her hands that were so soft..." so as to so disturb the comman man's (delicate) sensibilities in order to shut down that line of questioning. It is a truly skillful way of doing so, actually, and would in fact divert attention from any possibility that Serra died in childbed, as many young women did, because the natural next question or thought is "with whom?" and Illyrio Mopatis cannot risk such an inquiry spoiling Aegon's chances before his campaign even gets under way. It is not the claim that Serra died of Grey Plague that immediately ceases any further inquiries, however, but the cleverly creepy addition of "I keep her hands in my bedroom, her hands that were so soft in life..." that makes the listener halt in revulsion and bewildered caution, as the natural inclination is to nauseatedly wonder just what he is keeping her hands in his bedroom for. By implicitly grossing the listener out with his (disturbingly fond) innuendo (a seeming physical impossibility, least ways, upon objective scrutiny of the implicit claim, as it would appear likely he would soon catch the Grey Plague himself!), he skillfully changes the subject whilst simultaneously making his companion think they have chosen to end the conversation on that topic or begin a new one.

 

Remember the Undying.

 

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This is the trickiest part of the warning to interpret, I think. I believe the Undying are trees (the ebony trees with blue leaves from which Shade of the Evening is produced, and which grew in a massive, magical grove at the House of the Undying), using visions and acolytes to effect their ends. Dany is required to drink Shade of the Evening in order to have this vision-"quest" experience, just as Bran Stark must eat acorn paste to access the Weirnet. The Undying have human subjects whereas the Weirwood uses Children of the Forest (and some select humans) to carry out their bidding and effect upon the world.

The House of the Undying appears to be solely a trap—Dany is tricked three times before she "meets" the Undying Ones and is attacked by them—that uses a mixture of visions, tricks and deception, and outright force to gather a continuous source of blood and human meat (just as the Weirwood, CoTF, and Greenseers like Bran or Skinchangers like Varamyr all practice cannibalism to strengthen their powers) for their own ends. So, the Undying wanted to consume Dany…

Quaithe, then, is warning Dany that the persons named in her vision will do likewise. I think this includes Jon Snow and Aegon "Young Griff" and the secondary interpretation as well. If there is a second Dance of the Dragons, Jon Snow—Dany's actual nephew—may choose to join sides with his brother (Young Griff) to in part "avenge his father" (as he yearned to do way back in Game following Ned Stark's execution, an unexpectedly ominous line in this regard), which may be the sweetness in Dany's Undying vision of the blue rose (sweetness more often is used in Song symbolism as concealing some stench, corruption, or poison, which lures one into a false sense of security); it will be truly ironic and bittersweet then, when Dany finally comes into contact with the family she's yearned for, because that family may well seek brotherhood and companionship and solace with someone "not" his brother instead of her. If Aegon—and even Jon Snow—ends up "stealing" (that is, bonding with) two or even all three of her (dragon) children for their own, then, this encounter will be all the more poignant and heartbreaking for her.

 

 

Beware the perfumed seneschal.

And this, kept in line with Moqorro's vision, speaks of Tyrion Lannister. I know, I know, he was already covered in the "lion" part of the speech, so now it feels clumsy! Except… including him only in the abovementioned once again diminishes his significance, impact, and role as a party to the vision. He's just one of a list of people to beware above; here, he's so important he gets his own line, and it reveals the amiable, mentoring manner in which she needs must fear him as well. No, Tyrion is not perfumed literally… but he's the most important King's Hand in the narrative (above and beyond even his father, Tywin Lannister or Eddard Stark), and he did have his nose chopped off, and… there was that bit about the stinky steward. Har!

 

 

[TheSeason]

 

Wait, what was that, about Remember the Undying?(Daenerys, A Clash of Kings, House of the Undying Ones)

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Viserys, was her first thought the next time she paused, but a second glance told her otherwise. The man had her brother's hair, but he was taller and his eyes were a dark indigo rather than lilac. "Aegon," he said to a woman nursing a newborn babe in a great wooden bed. "What better name for a king?"

"Will you make a song for him?" the woman asked.

"He has a song," the man replied. "He is the prince that was promised, and his is the song of ice and fire." He looked up when he said it and his eyes met Dany's, and it seemed as if he saw her standing there beyond the door. "There must be one more," he said, though whether he was speaking to her or the woman in the bed she could not say. "The dragon has three heads." He went to the window seat, picked up a harp, and ran his fingers lightly over its silvery strings. Sweet sadness filled the room as man and wife and babe faded like the morning mist, only the music lingering behind to speed her on her way.

…

Beyond the doors was a great hall and a splendor of wizards. Some wore sumptuous robes of ermine, ruby velvet, and cloth of gold. Others fancied elaborate armor studded with gemstones, or tall pointed hats speckled with stars. There were women among them, dressed in gowns of surpassing loveliness. Shafts of sunlight slanted through windows of stained glass, and the air was alive with the most beautiful music she had ever heard.

…

A kingly man in rich robes rose when he saw her, and smiled. "Daenerys of House Targaryen, be welcome. Come and share the food of forever. We are the Undying of Qarth."

"Long have we awaited you," said a woman beside him, clad in rose and silver. The breast she had left bare in the Qartheen fashion was as perfect as a breast could be.

"We knew you were to come to us," the wizard king said. "A thousand years ago we knew, and have been waiting all this time. We sent the comet to show you the way."

"We have knowledge to share with you," said a warrior in shining emerald armor, "and magic weapons to arm you with. You have passed every trial. Now come and sit with us, and all your questions shall be answered."

She took a step forward. But then Drogon leapt from her shoulder. He flew to the top of the ebony and weirwood door, perched there, and began to bite at the carved wood.

 "A willful beast," laughed a handsome young man. "Shall we teach you the speech of dragonkind? Come, come."

…

A long stone table filled this room. Above it floated a human heart, swollen and blue with corruption, yet still alive. It beat, a deep ponderous throb of sound, and each pulse sent out a wave of indigo light. The figures around the table were no more than blue shadows.

…

"I have come for the gift of truth," Dany said. "In the long hall, the things I saw… were they true visions, or lies? Past things, or things to come? What did they mean?"

…the shape of shadows… morrows not yet made… drink from the cup of ice… drink from the cup of fire…

… mother of dragons… child of three…

"Three?" She did not understand.

… three heads has the dragon… the ghost chorus yammered inside her skull with never a lip moving, never a breath stirring the still blue air… mother of dragons… child of storm… The whispers became a swirling song… three fires must you light… one for life and one for death and one to love… Her own heart was beating in unison to the one that floated before her, blue and corrupt… three mounts must you ride… one to bed and one to dread and one to love…. The voices were growing louder, she realized, and it seemed her heart was slowing, and even her breath… three treasons will you know… once for blood and once for gold and once for love…

"I don't…" Her voice was no more than a whisper, almost as faint as theirs. What was happening to her? "I don't understand," she said, more loudly. Why was it so hard to talk here? "Help me. Show me."

… help her… the whispers mocked… show her…

Then phantoms shivered through the murk, images in indigo. Viserys screamed as molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth. A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him. Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman's name…. mother of dragons, daughter of death… Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow. A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd. From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire… mother of dragons, slayer of lies… Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness… mother of dragons, bride of fire…

Faster and faster the visions came, one after the other, until it seemed as if the very air came alive. Shadows whirled and danced inside a tent, boneless and terrible. A little girl ran barefoot toward a big house with a red door. Mirri Maz Duur shrieked in the flames, a dragon bursting from her brow. Behind a silver horse the bloody corpse of a naked man bounced and dragged. A white lion ran through grass taller than a man. Beneath the Mother of Mountains, a line of naked crones crept from a great lake and knelt shivering before her, their grey heads bowed. Ten thousand slaves lifted bloodstained hands as she raced by on her silver, riding like the wind. "Mother!" they cried. "Mother! Mother!" They were reaching for her, touching her, tugging at her cloak, the hem of her skirt, her foot, her leg, her breast. They wanted her, needed her, the fire, the life, and Dany gasped and opened her arms to give herself to them…

But then black wings buffeted her round the head, and a scream of fury cut the indigo air, and suddenly the visions were gone, ripped away, and Dany's gasp turned to horror...

 

In the first paragraph quoted, Rhaegar misidentifies Aegon VI as the promised prince; however, in doing so, he has conveniently brought together in our minds (thereby identifying) the two heads of the dragon of which he speaks: the promised prince (Jon Snow), and the mummer's dragon (Aegon Young Griff, VII). He then meets gazes with Dany and proclaims that "there must be one more" because the dragon has three heads, thus identifying for us the third head of that dragon: Dany herself. The paragraph closes with Rhaegar playing his harp, ostensibly to play the song that Elia asked for and that he declared was already written: the song of ice and fire that belongs to the prince that was promised and/or the three-headed dragon; sadly, the song appears to function as a lullaby as well, which only puts one in mind of how painful a topic this must have been for him, worsening his depression (not an obsession, per se, but a symptom).

In the next paragraph, the Dawnian heritage of the three-headed dragon comes to light. Dany meets the Undying (as they prefer to appear, dressed as her ancestors). This heritage and history is revealed in their attire: ermine (the winter white furry dragon) and red velvet (the Targaryen red dragon) and cloth-of-gold (the cloth-of-golden co. mummer's dragon); gemstone-studded armor (Rhaegar's rubies, Rhaegar's children—of which, Dany herself might one day have been included, had things gone according to his plan; that is, he never suspected she had been conceived, but likely would have been left with the task of raising her if he'd succeeded in his aims); the hats of "starry wisdom" and the emerald armored warrior; sunlight slanting through stained glass; and, perhaps, the most beautiful music she'd ever heard might well be Rhaegar's as well, it is not hard to imagine, or the music customarily heard in the Great Empire in the Dawn.

A Dawnian wizard king greets Dany here, and proclaims that her arrival was long awaited. For a thousand years, he claims, the dragons were heralded, and we sent the comet to show them the way. They purport to have secret knowledge to share, magical weapons to arm the dragons with, and might teach the speech of dragonkind so as to tame those "willful beast(s)" she has hatched. You have passed every trial, he tells her… and yet Drogon belies the deceptive nature of the Undying when he reveals to Dany another, hidden in the ebony-and-weirwood door.

In the antechamber, Dany meets the Undying closer to what they really are: a disembodied human heart, blue with corruption, yet alive still, and beating ponderous throbs whilst casting eerie indigo light and shadows upon the world. Beneath the sweetness, the poison.

I have come seeking truth, Dany proclaims, but she is now skeptical of the nature of the visions she witnessed in the previous rooms. What were they, she asks; the shape of morrows not yet come, they answer: a drink from the cup of ice, a drink from the cup of fire, for you are a child of three—that is, one child of three.

When Dany doesn't understand, she asks for clarification, and they mock her with prophecies and visions. Each third of the prophecy pertains to one of the dragon heads, with each set constituting a complete prophecy. The dragon has three heads, the dragon is the eye of the storm. The dragons shall light three fires, ride three mounts, and know three treasons. The dragons are children of death, are slayers of lies, are bride(grooms) of fires…

Then the visions culminate by revealing Dany's own part to play, the first time that the Undying speak to her as a singular person and not one of a set. They are either attempting to corrupt or outright consume her here, and use the visions to their benefit. Most of the visions pertain to Dany's time in the Dothraki Sea because it is during this time that she is reborn as Khaleesi and shall be reborn again as the Stallion that Mounts the World (the crones). However, the vision culminates with the "Mhysa!" event as a way of luring her into a false sense of security and vulnerability, a title and experience which she initially embraces, but—thanks due to Drogon's intervention, as in Meereen—soon turns to horror; she must utterly reject the Mhysa to become the Stallion, the devourer of worlds.

 

A note: drink from the cup of ice… drink from the cup of fire…

Could the cup of ice be acorn paste and the cup of fire be shade of the evening, the blood fruit by which the vision of morrows to come is bestowed upon mortal men in the first place? Here we have more evidence of the Blood Betrayal (the betrayal and cannibalism of one man against another) that is the bloodied fruit of the trees eternal. In attempting to ascend to godhood, these practitioners partook of a truly forbidden fruit and were punished with the exile from the garden of edenos into the dark and dangerous wilderness beneath the trees. The blood fruit, then, tastes foul upon first bite but grows sweeter the more one partakes as their powers increase. However, it cannot be understated that the sweetness of this blood fruit is only concealing the corruption and poison beneath… and although prophecy may at first glance seem an alluring and fearsome gift and weapon to wield, inevitably it turns upon all those who seek or attempt to wield it, repaying them in kind for tasting the blood fruit of morrows that was never meant to be theirs.

 

[TheSeason]

For the sake of clarity, I'll snip the quote above for the analysis of the prophecies/visions:

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…the shape of shadows… morrows not yet made… drink from the cup of ice… drink from the cup of fire…

… mother of dragons… child of three…

"Three?" She did not understand.

… three heads has the dragon… the ghost chorus yammered inside her skull with never a lip moving, never a breath stirring the still blue air… mother of dragons… child of storm… The whispers became a swirling song… three fires must you light… one for life and one for death and one to love… Her own heart was beating in unison to the one that floated before her, blue and corrupt… three mounts must you ride… one to bed and one to dread and one to love…. The voices were growing louder, she realized, and it seemed her heart was slowing, and even her breath… three treasons will you know… once for blood and once for gold and once for love…

Viserys screamed as molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth. A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him. Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman's name…. mother of dragons, daughter of death… Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow. A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd. From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire… mother of dragons, slayer of lies… Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness… mother of dragons, bride of fire…

 

It appears that the Undying speak to Dany as if they are speaking to all three of the dragons envisioned. Dany herself may be the mother of dragons, but she also remained one child of three. When they tell her this, she clearly doesn't understand, and they restate: three heads has the dragon. With that in mind…

 

Three fires must [they] light… one for life and one for death and one to love… the child[ren] of death…

1. Dany: a fire lit for life… Viserys screamed as molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth.

 

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Viserys's golden crown. In this moment Dany becomes both a kingslayer (she believed Viserys to be her king!) and a kinslayer, but she does so with perfectly understandable impulse (to the readers, if not the gods; and what kind of gods forbid kinslaying if it precludes self-defense anyway?). Viserys proved himself a danger that cannot be tolerated when he bared steel against her (and against her pregnant belly, no less) and threatened to cut her unborn child out of her unless he received payment for his sister-slave, as Khal Drogo promised. The fire lit for Rhaego's life, then (another instance of a death paying for a life, which may be why there was so much blood magical power in Rhaego's sacrifices—first for Drogo and then for the dragons upon the pyre) would be the fire lit beneath the kettle where the golden medallion belt was melted into Viserys's crown.

2. Aegon: a fire lit for death… A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him.

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Most interpretations have this as what Rhaego might have been or the Stallion that Mounts the world. I think the image is deliberately misleading in this way, as what it may actually show is Aegon VI Targaryen how he might have been whilst simultaneously portraying him in same position as Aegon "Young Griff" Targaryen, with Bittersteel's banner ablaze behind him. This is the moment when Aegon "Young Griff" at last casts off the lies he was forced to live and instead proclaims his own identity. That's why it's in the "children of death" section. Young Griff was born when Aegon VI was murdered, Aegon Targaryen was reborn when the Golden Company signed their "contract writ in blood" at his expense… He needs to cast aside these lies (if not publicly, then at least privately) before he can become a man of consequence. This fire therefore, may be a banner that Aegon burns when he learns/accepts the truth of his parentage, which turns Bittersteel's red winged-horse into a fiery stallion. In doing so, he would be "putting Aegon Targaryen VI" (his symbolic brother?) to rest at long last.

Why Bittersteel's banner rather than the Golden Company's? Bittersteel still lives on (through the Golden Company, and other active parties) as the cornerstone of the Blackfyre Rebellions. He is the founder of the Golden Company, with the express purpose of putting forth future rebellions. And worst of all, his legacy has otherwise cruelly tainted Aegon Young Griff's own!

The problem with raising Aegon Young Griff as an unwitting and unwilling pawn in their Blackfyre Rebellion plot, however, is that they must perforce rear him to love and respect Rhaegar and Elia's memory. That means Rhaegar and Elia are the only parents this child has ever known, the only parents (outside of JonCon) he then might think could have loved him for him. Theirs is a powerful legacy, and I cannot imagine Aegon Young Griff would ever be a party to tearing it down. Even after learning the truth, his family will remain red in his heart and mind. How poignant would it be, then, if the latest keystone Blackfyre prince (a victim in his own right), deliberately put to rest any hope of the Blackfyre Usurpation, at long last… because he loved his Targaryen family that much?

 

3. Jon Snow: a fire lit to love… Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman's name…

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Before long, Jon Snow has to be reborn in his own name and with his own identity and power, just like Aegon above. This, of course, means coming to terms with the truth of his parentage, heritage, and place in the world (as a dragon/promised prince if not as king in any regard as we know it). In doing so, he will have to light a fire (maybe even start a war) to his parents' love (even if his parents weren’t in love with each other, they certainly loved him) and everything that means. He will have to burn down the myth of Robert's Rebellion at long last before he could even think to build something up out of his own truth—he will have to find the courage to do what Ned Stark never could (in telling a painful truth to a pathetic man). If there is an actual fire here, it may well be Jon Snow's funeral pyre.

 

[TheSeason]

 

Three mounts must [they] ride… one to bed and one to dread and one to love… the slayer of lies...

1. Dany: a mount ridden to bed… Glowing like sunset, a red sword was raised in the hand of a blue-eyed king who cast no shadow.

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Dany's silver that mounts the world. The impact of her marriage to Khal Drogo cannot be understated. Without this marriage, Dany may have remained a frightened, abused, vulnerable woman for the rest of her life. No power, no dragons, no fire and blood. She becomes a khaleesi upon marrying Khal Drogo, and learns what power and authority are. Khaleesi—this is a title she claims still years after, when she is a widow, an exile, a queen of Meereen… Khaleesi, furthermore, is the title that she at long last goes back to when Drogon flies her into the Dothraki Sea; thinking to go forward you must go back, and not if I look back, I am lost.

It is in the Dothraki Sea, and as a Khaleesi, that Dany will fulfill her own part of the prophecy: the Stallion that Mounts the World (I'm wary of entertaining any notion, then, that Dany is the fiery stallion in Aegon's part of the prophecy, especially because I think it important that each triune pertain to each dragon's own story, but I cannot rule it out as yet). In accepting a skewed interpretation of her house words (Fire and Blood bespeaking Valyrian blood magic, I think, and not hiss, hiss, kill, kill! like most people, and some Targaryens themselves, presume) and fulfilling the Stallion prophecy, Dany becomes one dangerous dragon head. Stannis Baratheon (and all others proclaiming themselves Azor Ahai Reborn) beware!

2. Aegon: a mount ridden to dread… A cloth dragon swayed on poles amidst a cheering crowd.

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The mummer's dragon. Somewhat harder to pin down, Aegon's mount might be either Jon Connington (not like that) or the Golden Company and/or the ships he sailed to Westeros… or, we have yet to meet Aegon's dread mount. I'm going with a mix of JonCon and ships, here… Aegon thinks he's sailing to Westeros at long last to reclaim something that was brutally stolen from his family and him (Aegon VI eventually was entitled to the throne, and was even briefly king when Aerys died!), but instead he will likely come to learn of something else of vital import that was stolen from him—willfully, maliciously, and by his own parents too, his story arc being inverse to Jon Snow's. This wretched kid is sailing straight into heartbreak bay!

The lie told proclaiming him Aegon VI furthermore promotes an additional, unwitting lie… At one point, Rhaegar thought Aegon VI was the Promised Prince. Soon after Aegon's birth he learned he was wrong, but he never got the chance to tell anyone. I do believe there is some portion of our many War for the Dawn prophecies that pertain solely to Aegon "Young Griff's" part to play in it, but I've yet to identify it myself (any thoughts? If Dany is the Stallion aspect and Jon Snow is the Promised Prince aspect… again, where does Aegon fit in? Are they all Azor Ahai aspects or is that Azor Ahai/Last Hero aspect meant to pertain solely to Aegon?).

3. Jon Snow: a mount ridden to love… From a smoking tower, a great stone beast took wing, breathing shadow fire…

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Ghost. Following the assassination attempt, Jon Snow's dying thought is of Ghost and cold, which Varamyr's prologue alerts the reader hints at his reaching for Ghost in his final moments. I mentioned before how the manner Jon dies—falling face first in the snow, whispering Ghost's name—hearkens back to how his father died on his knees upon the Trident, crying out his mother's name. The allusion is bittersweet and poignant. Up to that point, Jon Snow has been flirting with rejection of his powerful union with Ghost—declaring "I am not a wolf," and being reluctant to explore the full extent of his skinchanging abilities, feeling quietly self-conscious of his "marriage" to his direwolf and the vile names his black brothers call him behind his back: warg, beastling. In his dying moment, then, he forgets all self-consciousness, reluctance, and wariness and wholeheartedly embraces Ghost and his own (wolfish) nature and identity, no longer willing to be defined by parameters he did not choose for himself, and giving in to a feeling and experience he secretly yearns to embrace and explore in depth. Whilst Jon Snow is "mounting" Ghost, where will be his body? Most likely locked in an ice cell, freezing something fierce.

Upon his rebirth, Jon Snow becomes some sort of scary ass "dragon-wolf" thing and assumes the identity otherwise known as the Promised Dragon. Um. Beastling, he is. The tower in question is, of course, the tower of joy where he was born and promised both, and where he had so much stolen from him, even by those he loves… Why is the tower smoking? Well, two options: either Eddard used wildfire (some went missing from King's Landing where Mad Aerys was planning his… funeral pyre) to bring the tower of joy down with so few men on hand, or Jon Snow is just steaming mad when he wakes up, as dragon-wolves tend to be, and he starts "breathing fire" all over the place to cow any dissenters right quick.

 

 

Three treasons must [they] know… once for blood and once for gold and once for love… the bride[grooms] of fire…

1. Dany: a treason for blood… Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars.

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The treason for blood would most likely be the "blood betrayal" of Rhaego, consuming him in the ritual to revive Drogo, and yet again on the funeral pyre to "birth" the three dragons Rhaegal, Viserion, and Drogon. Dany was told outright that she would have to play a blood price—only death pays for life—and the only time she hesitated was when she thought it would be her death to pay for life. Mirri Maz Duur brought forth a horse to deceive her into complacency, but really this was a lie Dany told herself, and tragic Rhaego paid the price. No horse the world over is equal to a man… and she was perfectly happy to kill another—any other—if it meant reviving Drogo and restoring her to power.

I know people will complain that Dany is the only active perpetrator of a treason in this interpretation, and the boys are both victims (I don't really like it either, but…). I do think it fits with Dany's current story arc… becoming the dragon of death as it were, especially if she's really as mad as I suspect she is (but madness need not be part of it).

Anyway, riding her silver to bed is a pretty good way to conceive a child. That she later betrays that child to a cruel death (not that I imagine he would have long survived birth anyway, dragon-baby hybrid and all) is just tragic. One way or another, she must come to terms with the fact that she traded Rhaego for three dragons, and it wasn't a fair and worthwhile trade.

 

2. Aegon: a treason for gold… A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly.

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The treason for gold is the lie that Varys, Illyrio Mopatis (and Serra), and the Golden Company told to poor little Aegon/Young Griff when they decided to enact (and keep up) the lie that he is Aegon Targaryen VI so as to carry out their Blackfyre-Brightflame rebellion. Beneath the gold the bitter lie might as well be their motto, for all the good it does poor Aegon. Who might find himself faced with the unenviable task of bespeaking the treasonous lie and breaking the boy's heart, even confessing his own pathetic part to play in the sordid affair? Jon Connington, who so desperately wants him to be Aegon VI that he shuts out all doubt or evidence to the contrary until it is too late or too impossible to deny any longer.

Jon Connington had one final dying wish, that he might succor and support Rhaegar Targaryen's son and see him returned to a position of power and security, but instead he was lured into a vile calumnies and treacheries, with Aegon "Young Griff" to pay the price.

3. Jon Snow: a treason for love…. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness…

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The Promise! A lie told for love, to protect, but treason nonetheless. Beloved Ned Stark is the perpetrator here, and possibly Lyanna Stark alongside him (although I have my doubts about that). Even though the lie was told to protect him, it robbed Jon of something powerful and necessary (just the same as Aegon was robbed in the treason for gold) and informed his identity from a state of ignorance, deprivation, and aspersion.

It was the Promise itself that resulted in Jon Snow being exiled to the Wall to unknowingly forsake any family, birthright, heritage, and more that he was otherwise entitled to. I doubt Ned Stark would have agreed to send him to the Wall (certainly not so young) if he hadn't that secret weighing upon him and any worries about what Jon might choose to do with the knowledge should he learn of it; nor would Catelyn have denied him access to his own home because she blamed him for being born, just the latest in her vicious series of child abuse he was forced to endure, nor, perhaps, would Maester Luwin have gotten away with trying to send him to the Wall to die in cruel exile (I am of the camp that Luwin always suspected the truth and that Benjen likely found out as well, which coincides with his departure to join the Watch).

The sweetness of the flower is as ominous for Jon Snow in such a reading as it may be for Dany in others, because he must come to grips with a lot of painful truths about the rebellion, about his parents, and about Ned Stark as well—who protected him physically from Robert Baratheon's uncontrolled wrath, but at great cost to an innocent child whilst simultaneously shielding a grown if pathetic man from uncomfortable truths! We can never know if Robert could have manned up because no one ever required him to. The tragic irony is, Ned Stark's nephew may well have been the solution to the dilemma they were faced with at that point—a king who loathed and rejected his crown before it was even sat on his head, a rebellion based upon lies and corruption that should sooner come to light than be buried so it might fester further, the very real dichotomy between legal succession and might makes right rules of conquest and usurpation….

 

 

An addendum: I don't know why, but I'm sorely tempted to switch around the last two titles, such that the "slayers of lies" fall last and the "bride(grooms) of fire" fall in the middle. That is my natural inclination to associate treasons with lies and, ahem, mounting with weddings… It requires some convincing myself that it can fit the way it is, so I'll understand a reader's reluctance! But it is only upon coming to know their treasons that the dragons marry themselves to their causes. The mount (and lies that must be slain) are how they get there, but are not the upshot in themselves.

ETA: to be clear, Stannis is Dany's mount (but it is not sexual/romantic in association in the least!) with, perhaps, Bittersteel and his Golden Company (his aims) standing for Aegon's mount, and Ghost becoming Jon Snow's (none of the mounts being sexual, each being transformative and perhaps even emotionally devastating--whether that emotional devastation is ultimately constructive or destructive, then, relies solely upon the rider.).

ETA: Addendum 2.0: it is important to note that whilst the visions Dany sees prior to "meeting" the Undying are pertinent to the downfall of House Targaryen and its dynastic powers and aims, the visions which she sees after and during her "meeting" with the Undying all pertain to the rise of House Targaryen and its dynastic rebirth in Westeros. It seems the prophecy of the three-headed dragon is in some way unique to and reliant upon the blood of House Targaryen even prior to the Doom, leading to its rise in Westeros, its fall in Westeros, and its rebirth in cycle. As such, even Blackfyres, bastards, and all other "dragon seeds" of House Targaryen must be taken into account as uniquely Targaryen in magical/prophetic terms (which rules in rather than eliminates Aegon VI "Young Griff" from consideration for such purposes) as these are human constructs and thus in no way can we rely upon them in our interpretation of these primal and utterly inhuman sorcerous/prophetic forces (whatever they may be). That is, just as Gerris Drinkwater (and some readers) mocked Quentyn Martell for thinking a literal dragon would care in any way about the social constructs of marriage and legitimacy--which technically provided him with "the blood of the dragon" of "Old Valyria"--we must also chide ourselves for any reliance upon such factors in determining Aegon VI "Young Griff's" status in like manner.

 

Three Heads Has Trios

Quote

 

One time, the girl remembered, the Sailor's Wife had walked her rounds with her and told her tales of the city's stranger gods. "That is the house of the Great Shepherd. Three-headed Trios has that tower with three turrets. The first head devours the dying, and the reborn emerge from the third. I don't know what the middle head's supposed to do. Those are the Stones of the Silent God, and there the entrance to the Patternmaker's Maze. Only those who learn to walk it properly will ever find their way to wisdom, the priests of the Pattern say. Beyond it, by the canal, that's the temple of Aquan the Red Bull. Every thirteenth day, his priests slit the throat of a pure white calf and offered bowls of blood to beggars.

Today was not the thirteenth day, it seemed; the Red Bull's steps were empty. The brother gods Semosh and Selloso dreamed in twin temples on opposite sides of the Black Canal, linked by a carved stone bridge.

 

 

Trios of the Three Heads seems a god of clear symbolic surrogate for our three-headed dragon. The first head (Dany, the world serpent/stallion dragon) devours the dying, the third head gives (re)birth to them (Jon Snow, the corn king dragon), and… poor Aegon/Young Griff is again stuck in the middle with some confusion as to his purpose and place. This is a kid who cannot catch a break! But, at least, his destiny doesn't seem so predetermined?!

The Patternmaker's Maze and the particular (proper) path one must walk if one hopes to come to wisdom is referential of the House of the Undying Ones and the quest "for truth" that Dany undertook therein. Although she walked the path properly, she was denied wisdom in the end, only to be mocked with prophecy and visions of morrows, which have had only a devastating impact upon her psyche.

We are further provided some Mithraic imagery in the habits of worshippers of Aquan the Red Bull, and then the passage concludes with Gemini imagery—which I believe all the twinning prose that have driven some to the conclusion that Jon Snow has a twin actually pertain to the pseudo-twinning of Aegon "Young Griff" and Jon Snow in future when they align together (that is, the prose is more appropriately reflection prose than twinning, with the boys being mirror—inverse—images of each other, in character as in plot arc). I cannot (as yet) see how they might be literal twins. If they are pseudo-twins, however, that may give us some additional insight into the purpose of the middle head in this allusion, with Aegon reflecting more of Jon Snow's purpose in his own but balancing it out with some hint of Dany's as well.

 

ETA: Three-Headed Trios

 

A lot of people on the various forums seem to have some confusion as to the nature and purpose of the second/middle head of Three-Headed Trios and what it means, so I’ll add this info in to give a much clearer picture (I hope) in effort to help:

The second head of Trios is the head of the Preserver. Trios is representative of the triune deity often found in real world religions, for example: Christianity (Catholicism in particular, the religion in which Martin was reared, and which has found itself represented in various ways throughout this series) and Hinduism.  The three aspects of the triune deity are the Creator, the Preserver, and the Destroyer.

In Christianity, this is represented by the Father (the Creator), the Son (the Destroyer—of sin, of death, he being the breaker of the sacred seals and the warrior who shall return again to cleanse Creation during the Apocalypse), and the Holy Ghost/Spirit (the Preserver—of the integrity and spirit of Creation, the inspiration of prophets and priests and saints, etc.).

In Hinduism, this is represented by Brahma (the Creator), Vishnu (the Preserver), and Shiva (the Destroyer), who are the supreme deities of the faith.

For ASoIaF, Three-Headed Trios, in reflecting real world triune deity, reveals the spirit and purpose of the various arcs of the three heads of the dragon: Jon Snow (the Creator—the Corn King, the Prince that was Promised), Aegon “Young Griff” (the Preserver—the Mummer’s Dragon), and Daenerys (the Destroyer—the Stallion Who Mounts the World—who wears Dothraki war bells in her hair the way Shiva wears skulls in his!).

Aegon “Young Griff,” then, shall be responsible for preserving the spirit and unity of Westeros itself, repairing many of the tears in the fabric of its soul caused by the War of Five Kings (these tears being represented by the four pieces of Robert’s final decree that fluttered to the foot of the Iron Throne when Cersei Lannister tore “Ned Stark’s paper shield” apart). How fitting it is, that Aegon “Young Griff” is represented in prophecy by a cloth dragon on poles swaying amidst a cheering crowd. He becomes the fabric of Westeros itself (beloved Rhaegar’s beloved son stitching together the rents in the Westerosi soul that Tywin—and Tyrion—Lannister’s style of warfare in particular—mass destruction for the sake of mass destruction, despite it offering no strategic or tactical value and has only symbolic meaning to satisfy their immense spite and bruised ego—and rapid degradation of Westerosi values—Ned’s beheading on Baelor’s Sept steps, Freys, Boltons, Stannis Baratheon, Kinslaying, Kingslaying, reactionary rise and support of Sparrows and BwB—has torn asunder). This is incredibly important, as it brings differing factions together, shines a new light upon Dany’s future invasion for the average Westerosi and reader both, and has a huge impact upon the human response to the White Walker invasion from the North and the coming of the Long Night. If Aegon “Young Griff” can heal the soul of Westeros even in part and unite differing or even warring factions under a single banner, why then cannot his “brother” Jon Snow take up that banner at a crucial moment in his war against the Others? Might people rebel against his “aunt” Dany for “causing” another Dance of the Dragons, especially considering the likeliest components of her invading forces? How will this alter Dany’s view of Westeros and the Westerosi, and her never-ending quest to find a “home” of her own? Will she and Jon Snow and the remnants of Aegon “Young Griff’s” loyalist forces be able to put their differences aside to reunify against the Others, or will Aegon “Young Griff” and Dany’s Second Dance of the Dragons have shattered them apart beyond all hope of repair, even in the face of the ultimate destruction? Or will Westeros find itself caught in a pincer move, between Others invading from the North and Dany invading from the South, with humans caught in the middle—once again trapped in the Riverlands? And what a bitter twist it would be, for Aegon “Young Griff” to be successful in the Preservation of Westeros and its values only for this hard-won victory to be laid waste, with the coming of Daenerys the Destroyer (the Stallion that Mounts the World).

 

 

TL;DR: Moqorro's Dragons are three; the lion is one stinky steward. Quaithe's warning to Dany is the first iteration of "the dragons are three; the lion is one stinky steward." Trios of the three heads is half of this iteration, with Dany (the world serpent/stallion dragon) devouring the dying, Jon Snow (the corn king dragon) giving (re)birth to man, and poor confused Aegon "Young Griff" (the mummer's dragon) stuck awkwardly in the middle, wondering what he's meant to do. The glass candles of the Citadel are another representation--three black (Dany, Aegon "Young Griff," and Jon Snow) and one green (Tyrion). And the House of the Undying elaborates upon this concept, especially as it concerns Dany's character and prophecy arc (the Stallion, the devourer). 

 

[TheSeason]

IDK what's going on with the strikethrough that just randomly appears through my text. I've editted it like five times, and still no luck! Sorry!

ETA: Fixed.

[Hos the Hostage]

The font is too small to read (I'm viewing this using firefox in my PC). I don't see any strikethroughs, though.

[TheSeason]

On 02/18/2016 at 2:30 AM, Hos the Hostage said:

The font is too small to read (I'm viewing this using firefox in my PC). I don't see any strikethroughs, though.

Really? Sorry! It shows up just fine in my window. I did manage to get the random strikethrough out, but did not edit the last comment because I wasn't certain if that was just what I was seeing or no. Will see what I can do about the font. Thanks for letting me know.

[dornishdame]

Wow! What an interesting, thorough and well-thought out analysis! I love the connections with the different prophecies Daenerys hears and what Moqorro says. It would be interesting to see if they all turn out to be part of the same thing. And I agree that there may very well be a link between the Shade of the Evening and the Weirwood paste - I think I have seen some theories that they are inversions of one another? Regardless, both seem to bring on true visions. 

On 1/26/2016 at 7:54 AM, TheSeason said:

So, this would include a vision pertaining to Tyrion (of indeterminate shadow) and dragons: one "old" (Bloodraven?), one "young" (Dany), one "true" (Jon), one "false" (Aegon), one "light" (Varys, being "Brightflame" Targaryen?), and one "dark" (Illyrio Mopatis, being Blackfyre of maternal descent?), with poor old true light Maester Aemon (Targaryen) utterly forgotten alone on the Wall once again!!! That way, six dragons plus one lion makes seven persons of import to the prophecy.

Except… "snarling in the midst of all…" The above interpretation as yet cannot place Tyrion in midst of Bloodraven'smachinations in the Game of Prophecy. Whoops. Well, there's still time, I suppose, for they two to come into some contentious contact, as Tyrion has already done so with all the other dragons mentioned thereafter (I have included Dany in this list not only because Tyrion is currently outside of Meereen and trying to get the Second Sons to turn coat and carry him to Meereen's court, but also because Tyrion has likely inadvertently triggered a war between Dany and Aegon "Young Griff" with his advice to the latter on the pole boat struggling toward Volantis. Dance.

I tend to think that the breaking down of the six is thus:

Old - Aemon; young - Daenerys; true - Jon; false - Aegon; light - Varys; dark - Illyrio.  Given that Tyrion is described as being in the midst of all, it makes sense to me that the six are all people that Tyrion has met or will meet soon. He has met Aemon and Jon in the North/at the Wall, Varys in KL, Illyrio in Pentos and Aegon on the Rhoyne. He is now moving towards Meereen to meet Daenerys. While I think it would make for an interesting on-page encounter, I don't believe Tyrion and Bloodraven will ever meet. As for the light and dark, I think you have it on point. Aerion spent years in Lys (where Varys is from, and also, conveniently, Serra Mopatis) and probably fathered children there. It is Illyrio that intrigues me, though. It is clearly stated that the Blackfyres are extinct in the male line, but says nothing of the female. The only daughter we specifically know the name of is Calla, wife of Bittersteel. If Illyrio was descended from them in the female line, it might explain the influence he has over the Golden Company and his writ in blood statement. I have to admit, I like the idea of Aegon combining three proto-Targ lines in one person. I also tend to think his name was always Aegon, and that he was named after Aegon the Conqueror - from whom all three lines claim descent. 

[TheSeason]

On 03/23/2016 at 11:34 AM, dornishdame said:

Wow! What an interesting, thorough and well-thought out analysis! I love the connections with the different prophecies Daenerys hears and what Moqorro says. It would be interesting to see if they all turn out to be part of the same thing. And I agree that there may very well be a link between the Shade of the Evening and the Weirwood paste - I think I have seen some theories that they are inversions of one another? Regardless, both seem to bring on true visions. 

I tend to think that the breaking down of the six is thus:

Old - Aemon; young - Daenerys; true - Jon; false - Aegon; light - Varys; dark - Illyrio.  Given that Tyrion is described as being in the midst of all, it makes sense to me that the six are all people that Tyrion has met or will meet soon. He has met Aemon and Jon in the North/at the Wall, Varys in KL, Illyrio in Pentos and Aegon on the Rhoyne. He is now moving towards Meereen to meet Daenerys. While I think it would make for an interesting on-page encounter, I don't believe Tyrion and Bloodraven will ever meet. As for the light and dark, I think you have it on point. Aerion spent years in Lys (where Varys is from, and also, conveniently, Serra Mopatis) and probably fathered children there. It is Illyrio that intrigues me, though. It is clearly stated that the Blackfyres are extinct in the male line, but says nothing of the female. The only daughter we specifically know the name of is Calla, wife of Bittersteel. If Illyrio was descended from them in the female line, it might explain the influence he has over the Golden Company and his writ in blood statement. I have to admit, I like the idea of Aegon combining three proto-Targ lines in one person. I also tend to think his name was always Aegon, and that he was named after Aegon the Conqueror - from whom all three lines claim descent. 

Thanks for responding. I'm glad you enjoyed it.

I'd also be interested to see if we ever get a definitive answer as to whether or not some of the prophecies we've read thus far are linking back to a core prophecy, thought, or event to come (I think so, but I also think it's possible it'll never be made clear in the text either way, because Martin has a tendency to leave many of his prophecies open-ended or hanging--which can be a good thing, in itself, as well, letting the reader puzzle out the various ways it might be interpreted).

I agree about the Weirwood and Ebony trees. As far as I've read them, they're... semi-inverse? It's difficult to put them on a binary scale, because I read them as the Tree of Knowledge (Weirwood) and the Tree of Life (Ebony) from the Garden of Eden(os). Weirwood Paste (I imagine it has some other, more flowery name... Mist/Light of the Morning, maybe?) and Shade-of-the-Evening work in similar ways, to "dissolve the caul" from one's (third) eye, granting visions. Weirwood Paste has "red veins" running through, and may well contain actual veins of a human sacrifice. SotE, on the other hand, is a strange (indigo) blue liquid... much like the "beating human heart, blue with corruption" that Dany sees later in the final chamber; instead of the vein, the (blue) blood itself?

Their effects are similar as far as we know, starting foul and ending seeming-fair, as both Bran and Dany describe their experiences. However, I do wonder if, aside from this superficial similarity, there is a divergent property we've yet to be made aware of, in keeping with the themes of "knowledge not meant for man" (weirwood) and "(immortal/extended) life not meant for man" (ebony) that may factor into their storylines later (or may have already done, with the reader overlooking it) as we come to understand more of its unique qualities. Either way, they are the "drink from the cup of ice... drink from the cup of fire" that the Undying Ones spoke of, in their "human" form. Both forbidden trees tie neatly into the theme of the blinding of the God's Eye, with practitioners reaching for godhead at the expense of the deity itself.

It's interesting that you think Aemon is the old dragon. So far I disagree, but this is a thought I'll have to consider further, and maybe make a note of the possibility above. Most often, I see people link the old dragon back to Bloodraven, who himself assumed a dragon (albino) as his personal sigil. He's a Great Bastard who associated himself with his family, claiming them and his place amongst them, in a sense, whereas Maester Aemon thrice disavowed himself of his name and birthright (first in the Citadel vows to become a maester, second when the Grand Council offered him the throne and the High Septon himself promised to absolve him of his vows, and third upon joining the Night's Watch). After thrice disavowing himself in this way, then, it seemed rather fitting to me that he is the Forgotten Targaryen Prince, even in prophecy, as he made a distinction between himself and the rest of his family, and three is such a significant and perhaps even magically powerful number in the Songverse.

I'm also not certain that simply meeting Tyrion is the qualifier here, although if you're correct, then Maester Aemon certainly fits the bill whereas Bloodraven himself does not. It seemed to me that a dragon had to be party to the song of ice and fire as well as to have Tyrion snarling in the midst of (him) to meet the requirements for the vision/prophecy. Otherwise, there are some other possible dragons that must/might count amongst their number--at the far end of the spectrum, even Robert, Stannis, and Renly, being Targaryen descendents through Rhaelle could count (unless it is their refusal to be party to that family, with Robert's choice and/or accepting of it, that removes them from the running; and, of course, then, even people like Shireen, Edric Storm, and Gendry could follow from them, although I must admit, it feels a bit silly!) or perhaps even Prince Viserys (since it might be sufficient if Tyrion, visiting his family in the Red Keep in his youth, bumped into Prince Viserys or had an introduction). And this is getting far too slippery, I know, which is why I initially thought the qualifier "snarling in the midst of all" was so significant, helping the reader to trim the fat, so to speak.

Even so, Aemon himself is a much fairer contender than the others I countered with, so to get back to him... If I'm seeking for any contention between Aemon and Tyrion, I think the possibilities are rather slim, and need the modifiers "direct" or "indirect," to start with, as well as "War for the Dawn" or "Race for the Iron Throne" or "Night's Watch Business" to categorize.

1. Aemon called Tyrion "a giant come amongst us here at the end of the world," which Tyrion presumes is a compliment, but there's nothing in the text to indicate that it was meant to be. Despite being rather one-sided, with one man thinking himself complimented and the other not bothering to correct him, it counts, just barely, as a direct contention in the War for the Dawn slot, with "at the end of the world," meaning not only the Wall itself, but, possibly literally "the end of the world!"

2. Aemon rebukes Tyrion for the cavalier and at times mocking attitude he takes toward the purpose and state of the Night's Watch. Tyrion promises to tell his sister to send help north, knowing nothing will come of it, and not bothering to explain the state of affairs in the south. Direct contention, possibly War for the Dawn related or Night's Watch Business related.

3. Aftershocks. The rest is all indirect hypothetical situations I can think of, such as Aemon having a lingering influence on characters interacting with Tyrion, which might cause some contention between them (e.g., Jon Snow, a likely party to the vision/prophecy above, interacting with and growing antagonistic with Tyrion because of Maester Aemon's prior advice). It's a stretch, but... It could fall into any of the three categories.

Anyway, it's a lot to think of, and will take some time to parse out. Thanks for pointing Aemon out to me, since I went ahead with Bloodraven as there appears to be a major consensus amongst readers that it's likely him, and as well he's still living, and not only able to but also likely to contend with Tyrion at some point (indirectly, of course! I don't expect Tyrion to show up in his cave, but Bloodraven is mentoring/guiding major players--Bran, Jon Snow, Jaime, possibly even Brienne, Arya, and Sansa, too. Maybe others I forgot about. He's got sticky fingers, Bloodraven!).

Illyrio Mopatis is an intriguing character, and I think you've got it right. I never considered who might be Aegon's maternal Blackfyre ancestors, but I like the idea of Bittersteel (it may even tie in more neatly with the possibility that it is his banner in Dany's vision) and Calla. Talk about a contract writ in blood! The man who founded the Golden Company needs you to put his heir on the Iron Throne, and if you dare say no, you'll have to look his golden skull in the eye(sockets) every day and own your shame!

I also like the idea of Aegon combining the "Brightflame" Targaryen line, the main Targaryen line, and the Blackfyre Targaryen line of the family all in his wee person. He has his own triune going. I'd look forward to seeing more (magically powerful) threes from him.

I agree that Aegon's given name is most likely "Aegon." Sorry if I confused you with the Aegon "Young Griff" stuff, but I wrote it that way to keep him a distinct person from Aegon VI (who I do not believe him to be), as the poor kid already has enough of an identity crisis coming his way, and I thought it prudent to give him his own, unmistakeable name, until such a time (if ever) that we learn his surname. His family did a number on him in that regard, I thought, but the reader doesn't have to.

Again, thank you for the comments. You've given me a lot to think about, especially as it concerns Maester Aemon! :-}

[dornishdame]

16 hours ago, TheSeason said:

Thanks for responding. I'm glad you enjoyed it.

I'd also be interested to see if we ever get a definitive answer as to whether or not some of the prophecies we've read thus far are linking back to a core prophecy, thought, or event to come (I think so, but I also think it's possible it'll never be made clear in the text either way, because Martin has a tendency to leave many of his prophecies open-ended or hanging--which can be a good thing, in itself, as well, letting the reader puzzle out the various ways it might be interpreted).

 

 

I agree - and it would be interesting to see if there is any relation to the prophecies made by Daenys the Dreamer.  Given it was her prediction of what was to come that saved House Targaryen from the Doom of Valyria, we know that there is reason to trust what she says.  I would love to know what other prophecies Daenys made during her lifetime! That said, the prophecy regarding The Prince that was Promised seems to pre-date that - perhaps some of the prophecies made to Daenerys could be related to this?

16 hours ago, TheSeason said:

I agree about the Weirwood and Ebony trees. As far as I've read them, they're... semi-inverse? It's difficult to put them on a binary scale, because I read them as the Tree of Knowledge (Weirwood) and the Tree of Life (Ebony) from the Garden of Eden(os). Weirwood Paste (I imagine it has some other, more flowery name... Mist/Light of the Morning, maybe?) and Shade-of-the-Evening work in similar ways, to "dissolve the caul" from one's (third) eye, granting visions. Weirwood Paste has "red veins" running through, and may well contain actual veins of a human sacrifice. SotE, on the other hand, is a strange (indigo) blue liquid... much like the "beating human heart, blue with corruption" that Dany sees later in the final chamber; instead of the vein, the (blue) blood itself?

It is interesting that the two colors mentioned are red and blue, given that we associate red with fire and blue with ice (I'm thinking of the blue eyes of death of the wights).

16 hours ago, TheSeason said:

Their effects are similar as far as we know, starting foul and ending seeming-fair, as both Bran and Dany describe their experiences. However, I do wonder if, aside from this superficial similarity, there is a divergent property we've yet to be made aware of, in keeping with the themes of "knowledge not meant for man" (weirwood) and "(immortal/extended) life not meant for man" (ebony) that may factor into their storylines later (or may have already done, with the reader overlooking it) as we come to understand more of its unique qualities. Either way, they are the "drink from the cup of ice... drink from the cup of fire" that the Undying Ones spoke of, in their "human" form. Both forbidden trees tie neatly into the theme of the blinding of the God's Eye, with practitioners reaching for godhead at the expense of the deity itself.

This is an intriguing idea - one I have to say that I really like. I also like the idea of Bran as Ice and Daenerys as Fire - and perhaps that is reflected in what they consume in order to bring on these visions. 

16 hours ago, TheSeason said:

It's interesting that you think Aemon is the old dragon. So far I disagree, but this is a thought I'll have to consider further, and maybe make a note of the possibility above. Most often, I see people link the old dragon back to Bloodraven, who himself assumed a dragon (albino) as his personal sigil. He's a Great Bastard who associated himself with his family, claiming them and his place amongst them, in a sense, whereas Maester Aemon thrice disavowed himself of his name and birthright (first in the Citadel vows to become a maester, second when the Grand Council offered him the throne and the High Septon himself promised to absolve him of his vows, and third upon joining the Night's Watch). After thrice disavowing himself in this way, then, it seemed rather fitting to me that he is the Forgotten Targaryen Prince, even in prophecy, as he made a distinction between himself and the rest of his family, and three is such a significant and perhaps even magically powerful number in the Songverse.

I'm also not certain that simply meeting Tyrion is the qualifier here, although if you're correct, then Maester Aemon certainly fits the bill whereas Bloodraven himself does not. It seemed to me that a dragon had to be party to the song of ice and fire as well as to have Tyrion snarling in the midst of (him) to meet the requirements for the vision/prophecy. Otherwise, there are some other possible dragons that must/might count amongst their number--at the far end of the spectrum, even Robert, Stannis, and Renly, being Targaryen descendents through Rhaelle could count (unless it is their refusal to be party to that family, with Robert's choice and/or accepting of it, that removes them from the running; and, of course, then, even people like Shireen, Edric Storm, and Gendry could follow from them, although I must admit, it feels a bit silly!) or perhaps even Prince Viserys (since it might be sufficient if Tyrion, visiting his family in the Red Keep in his youth, bumped into Prince Viserys or had an introduction). And this is getting far too slippery, I know, which is why I initially thought the qualifier "snarling in the midst of all" was so significant, helping the reader to trim the fat, so to speak.

I could very well be wrong - prophecies are made throughout the series, and it is often not until later that we understand their meaning - take the prophecies of the Ghost of High Heart regarding the Red and Purple Weddings, for example.  Hopefully Winds will answer some of our questions in this regard. 

As for my recognition of the old as Aemon............I did previously consider, as you did, that Bloodraven was the old and Jon the young; Daenerys the true and Aegon the false (I think we are essentially agreed on Illyrio and Varys as the light and the dark).  It is logical to link Jon and Bloodraven and Daenerys and Aegon.  I changed my mind mostly because of Jon and Aegon - Jon is presented as not a Targaryen, and Aegon as one, and yet the opposite is more likely to be the truth.  That is why I feel the two go more naturally together - Jon, brought up as Bastard of Winterfell and anything but a Targaryen; Aegon, brought up as a Targaryen in hiding . And yet, I believe it will be Jon rather than Aegon that will turn out to be Rhaegar's son in truth.  And, at the same time, although Bloodraven is legitimized - along with the rest of his bastards - by Aegon IV on his deathbed, he is not a Targaryen by birth - he is a Rivers.  Daenerys and Aemon, however, are Targaryen by birth. 

As for Tyrion's link, I do think that him snarling in the midst of all suggests some sort of acquaintance with those mentioned. There has to be some link between Tyrion and these six people, and I cannot locate such a link between him and Bloodraven.  As I have said, I could very well be wrong. But, at the moment, this is where my thinking is. 

16 hours ago, TheSeason said:

Anyway, it's a lot to think of, and will take some time to parse out. Thanks for pointing Aemon out to me, since I went ahead with Bloodraven as there appears to be a major consensus amongst readers that it's likely him, and as well he's still living, and not only able to but also likely to contend with Tyrion at some point (indirectly, of course! I don't expect Tyrion to show up in his cave, but Bloodraven is mentoring/guiding major players--Bran, Jon Snow, Jaime, possibly even Brienne, Arya, and Sansa, too. Maybe others I forgot about. He's got sticky fingers, Bloodraven!).

Illyrio Mopatis is an intriguing character, and I think you've got it right. I never considered who might be Aegon's maternal Blackfyre ancestors, but I like the idea of Bittersteel (it may even tie in more neatly with the possibility that it is his banner in Dany's vision) and Calla. Talk about a contract writ in blood! The man who founded the Golden Company needs you to put his heir on the Iron Throne, and if you dare say no, you'll have to look his golden skull in the eye(sockets) every day and own your shame!

I also like the idea of Aegon combining the "Brightflame" Targaryen line, the main Targaryen line, and the Blackfyre Targaryen line of the family all in his wee person. He has his own triune going. I'd look forward to seeing more (magically powerful) threes from him.

I agree that Aegon's given name is most likely "Aegon." Sorry if I confused you with the Aegon "Young Griff" stuff, but I wrote it that way to keep him a distinct person from Aegon VI (who I do not believe him to be), as the poor kid already has enough of an identity crisis coming his way, and I thought it prudent to give him his own, unmistakeable name, until such a time (if ever) that we learn his surname. His family did a number on him in that regard, I thought, but the reader doesn't have to.

Each time I do a re-read, I pick up on more and more Bloodraven symbolism. I am not entirely sure he is to be trusted, but he certainly has links into multiple character arcs - particularly Bran and Jon.  

I have - at various points - considered multiple versions of the Blackfyre theory for Aegon, but am now decided (for the moment anyway!) on this Bright Blacksteel theory, as I call it! It unifies a number of theories, although I am not entirely convinced on Varys being the brother of Serra - I find it a bit too tidy. That said, I do think they are related; though this does not necessarily need to mean brother and sister. 

For me, the idea of a contract writ in blood..........the aim of the Blackfyres and the Golden Company was to return to Westeros and place a king of Blackfyre blood on the throne.  As much as Illyrio speaks of dragons being dragons regardless of color, a contract writ in blood suggests a link to the Blackfyres and the reason for the original members of the Golden Company being in exile.  Calla is the only Blackfyre daughter we actually know the name of, and she was the wife of Aegor "Bittersteel" Rivers - I think the fact her name is the only one we know has to mean something.  That said, I am not sure that we will ever know for sure who Aegon is. After all, over 500 years on, we still debate exactly who 'Perkin Warbeck' was. Perhaps the same open question will be left on Aegon's identity.  

And you didn't confuse me with the Aegon/Young Griff stuff!  Identity is such a huge theme in the series, and Aegon's arc has a healthy dose of it.  

[TheSeason]

On 03/27/2016 at 8:17 PM, dornishdame said:

I agree - and it would be interesting to see if there is any relation to the prophecies made by Daenys the Dreamer.  Given it was her prediction of what was to come that saved House Targaryen from the Doom of Valyria, we know that there is reason to trust what she says.  I would love to know what other prophecies Daenys made during her lifetime! That said, the prophecy regarding The Prince that was Promised seems to pre-date that - perhaps some of the prophecies made to Daenerys could be related to this?

You mention Daenys the Dreamer! I find the teases about Daenys to be pure torture... Five books in, I'm eager for some more substantial clues to the prophecy mystery of the series (and Marwyn the Mage has liked her via "Signs and Portents" to Rhaegar's "song of Ice and Fire" that Aemon links to "the bleeding stars" prophecies) so I can start putting together some sort of rational answers (instead of just... my gut instinct is leaning this way or that way, which is pretty much where we are in this regard ).

The Promised Dragon prophecy, I believe to be more of a prophecy set. The most ancient of the prophecies is the most vague and confusing, but over the ages, as more prophecies come along (because the event itself is coming closer) they become more specific. So it goes from vague and bizarre and possibly nonsensical--e.g. "There will be a war. A war for the dawn!"--to slightly less so--e.g., "The dragon will fight in the war for the dawn! The dragon with three heads, reborn amidst salt and smoke!"--to still utterly useless, but getting there--e.g., "The dragon with three heads is promised. His is the song of Ice and Fire! His is the War for the Dawn!"--to a little less useless, and starting to whittle it down to specifics--e.g., "The Promised Dragon will be born of this royal bloodline [This may be why Aegon the Conqueror became Aegon the Conqueror!]! The Promised Dragon, the dragon with three heads..."--to scary specific, and far more dangerous--e.g., "The Promised Dragon, the dragon with three heads, shall soon be born! Say, you should marry your son and daughter (ew!) who despise each other (eep!), because only their bloodline can produce him! Oh, and don't forget: the promised dragon must be a prince as well!"--to just plain creepy dangerous--e.g., "You will have three children. Your son is the Promised Dragon, the dragon with three heads, whose song is Ice and Fire. You must become a warrior, and oh--even if neither of you want to, you need to marry and make a baby, because he'll be the one. If you don't have a baby with this woman, well... the War for the Dawn will be lost! Humanity will be doomed! The fate of the world depends upon you making a baby with this woman (whether either of you want to or no)! He'll be the promised prince!" I see Daenys the Dreamer as being somewhere in the middle-end of this prophecy set regarding the War for the Dawn/Promised Dragon, etc. (? the Stallion the Mounts the World prophecy, the dragons "returning" prophecies are not possible either without the Targaryen escape of the Doom.), and hope we'll get a clearer picture of what her prophecies actually stated, since they seem to be a huge part of the prophecy set and the story arc unfolding.

Daenys's prophecies so far appear to be as trustworthy as the Ghost of High Heart's [and who's "ghost" is she really? Currently, I'm leaning toward she's actually "the shadow of Summerhall" that was haunting Rhaegar, and maybe he is the one who first named her "the ghost" -- Jenny's "ghost," or one of them, at least, per his song, which appears to be "the song of Ice and Fire" that he plays to Aegon VI and Elia in the House of the Undying, which may be an accounting of the prophecies the Ghost relayed to him, at Summerhall. An interesting question is when she made her move from Summerhall to High Heart, then--and I'm currently supposing she made this move on purpose to lure Rhaegar into the absconding with Lyanna Stark!

He set out for the Riverlands at this time, when previously he'd met the Ghost at Summerhall for years, "with only his harp for company," as "even the Kingsguard did not attend him there" (and I take this to mean that they accompanied him along the road, but he left them behind when he stayed overnight at Summerhall ruins, as Dragonstone/King's Landing is a long road for the crown prince to travel all by his lonesome; this accounts for the companions--six--he took with him that fateful time, including two Kingsguard (Dayne, Whent) and his personal squire (Lonmouth). It was the absconding itself, then, that changed the rules (which would account for a Lonmouth=Lem Lemoncloak familiarity with and disdain for the Ghost and her prophecies, he being the only member of his group to have prior experience with such/her, even more so than Thoros of Myr, and he may even be the one who showed the Brotherhood the cavern hideout under High Heart, having lived there for near a year before, with Rhaegar and Lyanna's party, trapped in enemy territory in the Riverlands--why no one could find them, just like no one can find the Brotherhood!--until they took the river down to the Quiet Isle, then ferried to Saltpans--it being smaller than Maidenpool, perhaps? Unless it was at Maidenpool, at the seat of his squire (Mooton) that he turned for aid--and then commandeered a ship out to the Summer Sea (Starfall), leading north into the Prince's Pass to the Tower of Joy (where Ned encountered at least the Kingsguard he slew, and perhaps Lyanna and Jon also. This is so far unclear to me, it being a fever dream, and all .). Rhaegar then likely took the Rose Road north, through Bitterbridge (this being the path Renly takes on his way to King's Landing) where the war had not yet come (war was in the Stormlands, along the King's Road; Storm's End was under siege, and many Houses had given their loyalty over to Baratheon, so I doubt this was the optimal road for him to travel when the Rose Road was open and not in a war zone!)

We are seeing a lot of characters relive the actions/paths that fateful party took (the Brotherhood/Stoneheart/Arya/Jaime/Brienne... all showcase the importance of hiding in plain sight in the Riverlands, and all have--or soon will!--encountered the cavern of High Heart; some of them may even encounter the Ghost herself!); and Renly gives us the likeliest and safest path Rhaegar rode north to King's Landing; Aegon "Young Griff" reenacts the siege of Storm's End--with success, being inverse of the Tyrell failure; Arya and Brienne both showcase how to escape the wartorn Riverlands, downriver to the Quiet Isle, and onto a ship (whereas Arya had few options, but her "iron coin" gifted from Jaqen H'gar, to get her out of the danger zone, Rhaegar, with his two Kingsguard to "vouch" for his identity--not that he really needed it; could he be any more recognizable? Not only a noble celebrity, but of the "Valyrian god!" variety!--could simply commandeer any ship he pleased; Robb Stark and Balon Greyjoy showcase this for us with their seizures of the Myraham, and Stannis Baratheon and Balon Greyjoy showcase this by impounding any ship to steer too close to their islands, and even Jon Snow gets into the commandeering business--following in Papa's footsteps!--by impounding the Lyseni (Sallador Saan's stormtossed ships) ships that limp on into Eastwatch-by-the-Sea as property of the Night's Watch (with the sailors sailing them!)...

And all of this is a terrible digression, I know. Beg pardon as I get back to my point... which is, the events of the rebellion, insofar as Rhaegar's actions at that time (most likely of all, he was seeking out the Ghost because--he thought--he'd just fathered the Promised Dragon, and had hit a major roadblock concerning Elia--the Virgin Mary figure of this prophecy, again, so he thought--who would die in bearing him the necessary(?) third child that the Ghost prophesied--to him, at Summerhall--that he must have; he probably needed to discuss the prophecy with her--must I have this child with my wife even if it kills her?!--and likely found, to his great dismay, he'd carried along the true "Virgin Mary" of his Promised Dragon prophecies (having either 1. rescued Lyanna from herself, her attempt at running away like to get her killed, per Mel's "grey girl on a dying horse, fleeing to (him) for protection)" and, ironically, Lyanna most likely was seeking out Rhaegar (her protector at Harrenhal, per the Knight of the Laughing Tree incident!) in the first place, but probably expected to do so at Dragonstone or King's Landing... she had to get there first, though, which meant taking the meandering path (per Mel's description of the vision to Mance/Rattleshirt) around the God's Eye, until winter smacked the realm in the face and nearly killed her in the process, or 2. in the process of rescuing her with intent to return her to safety (Harrenhal, Riverrun, etc., which meant back to her father and her unwanted marriage to Robert Baratheon, which she'd fled in the first place), she forced him to carry her on his meandering path to Dragonstone/King's Landing to petition the king to stop the wedding (likely by throwing his treason at Harrenhal in his face; and she need not even know about "the southron ambitions" plot, but only about his actions regarding the Knight of the Laughing Tree to do so!), which may account for any testimony that he abducted her (he may have had to chase her down at some point, like Arya tried to flee on horseback from the Brotherhood, who intended to ransom her back to her family anyway) when he didn't, or 3. a bit of both!)) were perhaps far more orchestrated than we previously thought.

(I, like Lem Lemoncloak, do not trust the Ghost of High Heart! Did you notice the crass and cavalier attitude she took to the Red Wedding, Lady Stoneheart (the woman who was a fish), and to Sansa's abduction (being framed for Kingslaying so Littlefinger could abduct her) even in Arya's presence? She cackles as she says, "for there's to be a wedding," as if she finds it all terribly amusing! Could you imagine the moment should Arya put it all together, exactly what those prophecies were about? The horror! And worst of all, she knows who Arya is, knows she'll never see many of her loved ones again (and if she should meet Stoneheart--for god's sake! D-:) ), knows the path all this heartache shall drive her down, and Arya may even remind her a little bit of Lyanna, since they look so much alike! Not to mention, if her move to High Heart was specifically to instigate the meeting of Rhaegar and Lyanna on the God's Eye (as I believe) so they might make together the Promised Dragon... As if she could not have been upfront with him about it? The same kind of prophecies she's giving in the narrative, cryptic and confusing when they need not be!--e.g., "for there's to be a wedding," as if she did not know exactly what was going to happen there--are the same kind of prophecies she would have given Rhaegar. So, if she thought him--and his child(ren), and Lyanna Stark, of course--so terribly important, and if she's a crusader for the Promised Dragon/War for the Dawn--which Rhaegar believed in, and believed was important, and made it one of his top priorities!--why should she treat what seems to be a "like-minded ally" like this? "What good are dreams?" Lem says, and he's most likely right.)]

On 03/27/2016 at 8:17 PM, dornishdame said:

It is interesting that the two colors mentioned are red and blue, given that we associate red with fire and blue with ice (I'm thinking of the blue eyes of death of the wights).

I find it interesting that the colors are inverse of our initial understanding of their associations (weirwood, ebony; ice, fire).

That is... Red, being associated with fire and blood magic, is also the color of the weirwood tree, the "tree of knowledge." The weirwood trees then consume--and yet also retain that which they consume (knowledge)--as "fire consumes!"

On the other hand, there's blue, being associated with ice and cold/mist magic, the color of the ebony tree, the "tree of life." The ebony trees then preserve--and yet do not appear to maintain that which they preserve (life), thus the rotting aspect of the wights and the Undying Ones!--as "cold preserves!"

ETA: The ironwood trees (described as "burning blue" and longer than usual, and which may be a good deterrent to wights) may actually be ebony trees. The Yronwoods, then, may maintain a special grove of them, in the south, as a weapon to fight the Others and their "demons" during the Long Night, which explains the significance of the Yronwood family, enhanced by their words, "We Guard the Way."

[The map and the Great and Lesser Houses, their keeps, and their words together all make a curious statement; I've been trying to puzzle it out for a while now. Certainly, it appears the Great Houses have some connection to the "twelve companions" who fought the War for the Dawn with the Last Hero. First, then, I suppose, it important to parse out the oldest houses, possibly with foundings lost to legend: Stark--Winterfell, Dayne--Starfall; High Hermitage, Durrandon (during, enduring(?) Brandon)--Storm's End, Gardener -- High Garden, Casterly(?) -- Casterly Rock?, Hightower(?)--Hightower... as well as some other curious cases, like Arryn (Air in) -- the Eyrie (the (god's) eye with its moon door where people are customarily forcibly plummeted to the earth to die!); Blackwoods -- Raventree; Yronwood -- Yronwood Castle, guarding the Boneway, called Warden of the Stone Way and Master of the Green; the Royces -- Runestone (arms black iron on bronze engraven with runes!) and Gates of the Moon....]

On 03/27/2016 at 8:17 PM, dornishdame said:

This is an intriguing idea - one I have to say that I really like. I also like the idea of Bran as Ice and Daenerys as Fire - and perhaps that is reflected in what they consume in order to bring on these visions.

Although I too like the idea of Bran being associated with ice and cold/mist... I'm so far wary of that urge to slide him into that slot.

We've seen Bran associated with two(?) kinds of magic primarily: green magic and "raven/crow" magic. He's a greenseer and a skinchanger, one to be enthroned upon a weirwood (presumably), and not only uses the weirwood to see and learn, but also reaches through the weirwoods to those he wishes to bless (Jon Snow, primarily, with Theon coming up second; this is only in narrative, however; in the backstory, we may be seeing a lot more of Bran's interaction/interference than we realize--such as the Knight of the Laughing Tree incident). Furthermore, it is likely that Bran reaches back into both his own (present, in narrative) and Jon Snow's dreams from some point in the future (Jon's wolf dream in which weirwood!Bran opens his third eye for him, gently, much unlike the way the Three-Eyed Crow opened his own third eye, an endless dreaming horror, pecking his skull and brain, "fly or die!" and Jaime "the things I do for love" Lannister shrugging away the suffering inflicted on him when he threw him from the tower to die!)

This power to reach through the weirwoods and into dreams may be either green magic or something else, since it appears to be a power that Bloodraven lacks despite many attempts to do so, and some of Bran's dreams (perhaps even including the Three-Eyed Crow aspect of it?) may be drawing on another source of magic entirely (difficult to tell at this point), which is why I separated them (green magic and "raven/crow" magic) out despite my uncertainty on the matter.

So far, however, we have not really seen Bran associated with the things we know to be "icy" magic--like the wights or the Others--and agents of "icy" magic appear to be hunting him, regarding him as a threat. Despite his alignment with "Winterfell" and "Winter is Coming" and "Kings of Winter," etc., we have not seen Bran as clearly aligned with Ice and Cold magic as we have seen Daenerys aligned with Fire and Blood magic, so I'm still wavering on that one.

On 03/27/2016 at 8:17 PM, dornishdame said:

I could very well be wrong - prophecies are made throughout the series, and it is often not until later that we understand their meaning - take the prophecies of the Ghost of High Heart regarding the Red and Purple Weddings, for example.  Hopefully Winds will answer some of our questions in this regard. 

As for my recognition of the old as Aemon............I did previously consider, as you did, that Bloodraven was the old and Jon the young; Daenerys the true and Aegon the false (I think we are essentially agreed on Illyrio and Varys as the light and the dark).  It is logical to link Jon and Bloodraven and Daenerys and Aegon.  I changed my mind mostly because of Jon and Aegon - Jon is presented as not a Targaryen, and Aegon as one, and yet the opposite is more likely to be the truth.  That is why I feel the two go more naturally together - Jon, brought up as Bastard of Winterfell and anything but a Targaryen; Aegon, brought up as a Targaryen in hiding . And yet, I believe it will be Jon rather than Aegon that will turn out to be Rhaegar's son in truth.  And, at the same time, although Bloodraven is legitimized - along with the rest of his bastards - by Aegon IV on his deathbed, he is not a Targaryen by birth - he is a Rivers.  Daenerys and Aemon, however, are Targaryen by birth. 

As for Tyrion's link, I do think that him snarling in the midst of all suggests some sort of acquaintance with those mentioned. There has to be some link between Tyrion and these six people, and I cannot locate such a link between him and Bloodraven.  As I have said, I could very well be wrong. But, at the moment, this is where my thinking is. 

So could I! Lol. So far, this is all mostly speculation. We need more information, desperately!

Bloodraven as old and Dany as young is a curious interpretation, actually. Or even the inverse! Bloodraven, so ancient he appears to be a corpse, whose soul has mostly "gone into the trees," is in effect quite the young dragon by virtue of being part weirwood! That is, he's an "acorn/sapling dragon" (very young) as opposed to being a "stump dragon." Lol! Dany, on the other hand, is the "young crone" of the story, as I outlined above. Thematically, it could work.

The link between Jon and Bloodraven also appears clear in the narrative (Mormont's raven, now Snow's raven, now the King of Winter's raven!), but I'm less certain about their thematic link as the old and young (dragon), respectively.

In terms of the dragons all being Targaryens, however, I have to disagree. If we both agree that Aegon "Young Griff," Varys, and Illyrio Mopatis all constitute the dragons of the vision, then it seems clear that a blood link to the Targaryens might be important to the naming of a "dragon," but the name of Targaryen need not be attached to them either. Jon Snow, for instance, despite being one of the dragons, may never be in the position to claim his Targaryen name--despite being a Targaryen (assuming, then, that he's not a "Waters" and his parents were married! Personally, I think they were, because it is the promised prince that Rhaegar was trying to beget in the first place, and it appears clear from the prophecy itself that being of legitimate royal blood was integral to its completion! While polygamy may have fallen out of practice in his family, as well, it may never have been written out of law, so... the legality of this claim to "princehood" may be tested (so will Aegon "Young Griff's!"), but there may be no way to discount it in Westerosi society, either. We'll see!). House Blackfyre was founded upon legitimized bastards, as well, and they still count, so I see no reason why the legitimized "Rivers" cannot count too, even before Maester Aemon (a Targaryen by birth, who disavowed himself of his name).

To be clear, I do not see a link between Bloodraven and Tyrion as yet, either (except an indirect one!). There may be still time for one to develop, who knows? I do think the word "snarling" is the most significant part of that section of the vision/prophecy, however. I think it isn't just a link between the parties, but an antagonistic one that matters most (and I think it more likely that Bloodraven could fit that bill than Aemon, even indirectly). It's a difficult thing to interpret, because I do believe both interpretations (seven-personage vision; four-personage vision) hold equal weight.

Ah, well, Martin never promised it would be easy!

On 03/27/2016 at 8:17 PM, dornishdame said:

Each time I do a re-read, I pick up on more and more Bloodraven symbolism. I am not entirely sure he is to be trusted, but he certainly has links into multiple character arcs - particularly Bran and Jon.  

I have - at various points - considered multiple versions of the Blackfyre theory for Aegon, but am now decided (for the moment anyway!) on this Bright Blacksteel theory, as I call it! It unifies a number of theories, although I am not entirely convinced on Varys being the brother of Serra - I find it a bit too tidy. That said, I do think they are related; though this does not necessarily need to mean brother and sister. 

For me, the idea of a contract writ in blood..........the aim of the Blackfyres and the Golden Company was to return to Westeros and place a king of Blackfyre blood on the throne.  As much as Illyrio speaks of dragons being dragons regardless of color, a contract writ in blood suggests a link to the Blackfyres and the reason for the original members of the Golden Company being in exile.  Calla is the only Blackfyre daughter we actually know the name of, and she was the wife of Aegor "Bittersteel" Rivers - I think the fact her name is the only one we know has to mean something.  That said, I am not sure that we will ever know for sure who Aegon is. After all, over 500 years on, we still debate exactly who 'Perkin Warbeck' was. Perhaps the same open question will be left on Aegon's identity.  

And you didn't confuse me with the Aegon/Young Griff stuff!  Identity is such a huge theme in the series, and Aegon's arc has a healthy dose of it.  

I'm not entirely certain Bloodraven can be trusted, either! After the Varamyr prologue to Dance, rethinking the Bran arc makes me queasy. It's the education of an abomination! Worse still, they're (Bloodraven, Coldhands) deliberately lying about what they're encouraging Bran to do. Worst of all, it appears Jojen was a sacrifice to marry Bran to the weirwood, and Meera was the deciding factor in when Bran was considered "ready" as it appears Bran skinchanged into her momentarily, just as when he "reached" for Hodor. Just as well, I do believe either Bran or Bloodraven deliberately traumatized Hodor as a child (when he went into the crypts) specifically for the purpose that Bran could use him as a skinchanging slave! It just gets creepier and creepier, really, but Bran is living his own horror story, so we should only expect it to get worse.

I love your Bright Blacksteel interpretation of Aegon's family history! I agree about the contract writ in blood (I was only joking before), and I hope Aegon is the one to finally put this nonsense to rest at long last (perhaps with his "brother," Jon Snow, to help him out! They are both "bastard" by birth, so hopefully they should understand each other. Should they ever meet, of course. I'm not convinced they will--I fear Dany will get to Aegon first, unfortunately!--so when I say they "align" and "seek brotherhood together" above, what I really mean is that they "align" thematically and politically--and, gods forbid, in memoriam?--with Jon Snow "choosing" Aegon's side over Dany's. So far that's how it looks to me, with the "sweetness" of the blue flower "masking a poison" for Dany (being "rejected" by her last living family, her brother, Rhaegar's, son!) and Jon Snow (the Promise!) both.).

I agree we may never learn "the truth" about Aegon. That would certainly be a "bittersweet" way of putting down for good the Blackfyre rebellions... Maybe the lines will mingle and marry somehow (if Aegon leaves a child behind)? The horrifying thing about it, though, is that Aegon VI ends up forgotten by history, essentially, and so does Aegon "Bright Blacksteel," who himself never learns who he is and what inhuman things were done to him before he dies!

Glad I didn't confuse you with all the "Young Griff" references. Aegon is his likely name (a coincidence? A plot--if, perhaps, he's some months shy of Aegon VI? Who can say?), but I just dislike the thought of calling him only Aegon or Aegon VI (as some people do) because it muddles up his identity, and he's suffered enough of that. I have the same (irrational?) reaction when someone calls Jon only "Snow," since it feels more like calling him "Bastard," as that's primarily how "the bastard name" is used in that society (a brand, not a name); yes, "Snow" is his surname, but by societal rules it's also somehow... not (like flinching when someone says "John Doe," I suppose).