grinny Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 4 hours ago, kimim said: "Gorghan of Old Ghis once wrote that prophecy is like a treacherous woman. She takes your member in her mouth, and you moan with the pleasure of it and think, how sweet, how fine, how good this is... and then her teeth snap shut and your moans turn to screams. That is the nature of prophecy, said Gorghan. Prophecy will bite your prick off every time." I think Rhaegar tossed common sense to the wind in an attempt to fulfill prophecy. Prophecy bit his prick off. EDIT: ...the bloodied prick, of course, doesn't mean he failed to fulfill said prophecy. Whether he did or not remains to be seen. Right now I really want to know the prophecy What does this prince bring to the world? Ever leading peace? Sounds like a nice thing, right? But I don't thing human can actual being this, now a night king of a hive minded group of ice zombies, I say the chances are a lot better, maybe the ptwp isn't actual the savior of mankind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 14 minutes ago, grinny said: Right now I really want to know the prophecy What does this prince bring to the world? Ever leading peace? Sounds like a nice thing, right? But I don't thing human can actual being this, now a night king of a hive minded group of ice zombies, I say the chances are a lot better, maybe the ptwp isn't actual the savior of mankind... The prophecy said the prince will use his sword to defeat the evil and end the king night. Not peace forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grinny Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 2 hours ago, purple-eyes said: The prophecy said the prince will use his sword to defeat the evil and end the king night. Not peace forever. Where did you get that from? From what I remember we only hear the interpretation of the prophecy from different people. Oh by the way I'm not completely sold on the idea that AA and tptwp have to be the same thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 17 minutes ago, grinny said: Where did you get that from? From what I remember we only hear the interpretation of the prophecy from different people. Oh by the way I'm not completely sold on the idea that AA and tptwp have to be the same thing Official APP said so. It also said AA will be reborn as the TPTWP to do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimim Posted February 4, 2016 Share Posted February 4, 2016 3 minutes ago, purple-eyes said: Official APP said so. It also said AA will be reborn as the TPTWP to do this. Azor Ahai and TPTWP are the same person? I don't have the app, btw, so idk. How about the Last Hero? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 5, 2016 Share Posted February 5, 2016 On February 4, 2016 at 5:35 PM, kimim said: Azor Ahai and TPTWP are the same person? I don't have the app, btw, so idk. How about the Last Hero? No entry for last hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimJames Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 Rhaegar was insane. His insanity might not have manifested in burning people, but it was still there. When Aerys was Rhaegar's age, everyone thought he was a swell guy too: look how that turned out. Plus, Aerys raised Rhaegar himself, and you can't call Aerys a good influence on anyone. So we have a lunatic, being raised by a worse lunatic, and being told from birth that he is entitled to everything he could ever want and that he is above the law. Not a recipe for someone who is fit to rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 7, 2016 Share Posted February 7, 2016 On February 4, 2016 at 5:35 PM, kimim said: Azor Ahai and TPTWP are the same person? I don't have the app, btw, so idk. How about the Last Hero? No entry for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 22 hours ago, TimJames said: Rhaegar was insane. His insanity might not have manifested in burning people, but it was still there. When Aerys was Rhaegar's age, everyone thought he was a swell guy too: look how that turned out. Plus, Aerys raised Rhaegar himself, and you can't call Aerys a good influence on anyone. So we have a lunatic, being raised by a worse lunatic, and being told from birth that he is entitled to everything he could ever want and that he is above the law. Not a recipe for someone who is fit to rule. Every single person that mentions or thinks about Rhaegar (except Robert) talks of him as a noble, intelligent person. There is a difference between Aerys being charming when he was young and how people describe Rhaegar. And I doubt very much that Aerys "raised" Rhaegar, no doubt that his mother Rhaella and the stff raised him more than Aerys did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 28 minutes ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said: Every single person that mentions or thinks about Rhaegar (except Robert) talks of him as a noble, intelligent person. There is a difference between Aerys being charming when he was you and how people describe Rhaegar. And I doubt very much that Aerys "raised" Rhaegar, no doubt that his mother Rhaella and the stff raised him more than Aerys did. I agree rhaegar was well respected before his crowning and kidnapping. But you can not use this to justify that. This reminded me my previous boss. Relatively young compared to his title, sort of handsome, very sincere and diligent in work and very successful. Head of a huge institution. But he cheated on his wife, had affair with wife of his coworker, dated his own young employee. People gossiped and bad mouthing about this but they still highly respected him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimJames Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 24 minutes ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said: Every single person that mentions or thinks about Rhaegar (except Robert) talks of him as a noble, intelligent person. Except Bran, and Brandon, and Oberyn ... It's worth mentioning that very few characters have actually met Rhaegar, and the ones who have either really really hate him (Robert Baratheon) or really really love him (Cersei Lannister, Jon Connington). In any case, being popular/having good PR does not necessarily mean someone is a sane person (or for that matter even a good person). In fact, there are a lot of now reviled celebrities in real life who were quite popular before their crimes came to light (compare how people view Bill Cosby and Jared Fogle now with how people viewed them before their crimes were discovered). Since it's impossible to accuratly judge him based on what others think of him, I'm cutting the middle man and judging Rhaegar by his actions. Actions, by the way, which appear so criminally negligent and reckless (if not outright malicious [by the way, I do think Rhaegar was a rapist]) that they couldn't have come from a man in touch with reality. As for his upbringing, I'm assuming that King Aerys raised Rhaegar. This assumption is justified given how close an eye he kept on Viserys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 26 minutes ago, TimJames said: Except Bran, and Brandon, and Oberyn ... It's worth mentioning that very few characters have actually met Rhaegar, and the ones who have either really really hate him (Robert Baratheon) or really really love him (Cersei Lannister, Jon Connington). In any case, being popular/having good PR does not necessarily mean someone is a sane person (or for that matter even a good person). In fact, there are a lot of now reviled celebrities in real life who were quite popular before their crimes came to light (compare how people view Bill Cosby and Jared Fogle now with how people viewed them before their crimes were discovered). Since it's impossible to accuratly judge him based on what others think of him, I'm cutting the middle man and judging Rhaegar by his actions. Actions, by the way, which appear so criminally negligent and reckless (if not outright malicious [by the way, I do think Rhaegar was a rapist]) that they couldn't have come from a man in touch with reality. As for his upbringing, I'm assuming that King Aerys raised Rhaegar. This assumption is justified given how close an eye he kept on Viserys. How can you think Rhaegar raped Lyanna? Why would Ned not be furious with him? Why would he not be furious with the King's Guard that kept Lyanna prisoner while she died after giving birth to Rhaegar's baby by rape? Why would Ned return Dawn if Arthur was just a henchmen for the rapist Rhaegar? Why would Lyanna ask Ned to protect her child if he was the result of Rhaegar brutally raping her and hold her prisoner? Why would Ned keep that promise instead of turning over the Dragon seed to Robert? None of what happened AFTER the Tower of Joy makes sense of Rhaegar raped Lyanna and held her prisoner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 35 minutes ago, purple-eyes said: I agree rhaegar was well respected before his crowning and kidnapping. But you can not use this to justify that. This reminded me my previous boss. Relatively young compared to his title, sort of handsome, very sincere and diligent in work and very successful. Head of a huge institution. But he cheated on his wife, had affair with wife of his coworker, dated his own young employee. People gossiped and bad mouthing about this but they still highly respected him. So a heartless dickhead is the same as Insanity? He said that Rhaegar was insane just like Aerys, even if Rhaegar cheated, lied and what ever else people accuse him of, there is NOTHING that even remotely suggests that he was insane like Aerys was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 4 minutes ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said: So a heartless dickhead is the same as Insanity? He said that Rhaegar was insane just like Aerys, even if Rhaegar cheated, lied and what ever else people accuse him of, there is NOTHING that even remotely suggests that he was insane like Aerys was. If he did all of these for his "dragon must have three heads", then he is sort of insane, at least over these events. Egg is a good man. But in his late years, he was so obsessed with dragon hatching and ignored the objections of his people and eventually made the summerhall tragedy. Rhaegar is similar to Egg on this. He is good and normal on rest of the things. But Prophecy is his weak point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, purple-eyes said: If he did all of these for his "dragon must have three heads", then he is sort of insane, at least over these events. Egg is a good man. But in his late years, he was so obsessed with dragon hatching and ignored the objections of his people and eventually made the summerhall tragedy. Rhaegar is similar to Egg on this. He is good and normal on rest of the things. But Prophecy is his weak point. He would be insane in our world, but in Westeros things like magic, prophecy and dragons are real. Studying the prophecy of TPwwP would not be insane at all because it is real. It is no more insane then the Maesters learning their teachings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said: He would be insane in our world, but in Westeros things like magic, prophecy and dragons are real. Studying the prophecy of TPwwP would not be insane at all because it is real. It is no more insane then the Maesters learning their teachings. Everytime somebody brought this, I just want to ask this question: sure, prophecy is real. But Is this the only and best way he can get a child from lyanna's belly? By the way, why must be lyanna? Is she the only fertile woman in the world? All other women just died or were barren? To be honest, lyanna is the worst option in the whole realm for him to get a third child (except rhaella of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Just now, purple-eyes said: Everytime somebody brought this, I just want to ask this question: sure, prophecy is real. But Is this the only and best way he can get a child from lyanna's belly? By the way, why must be lyanna? Is she the only fertile woman in the world? All other women just died or were barren? To be honest, lyanna is the worst option in the whole realm for him to get a third child (except rhaella of course). except that he seems to be right. Why did the witch say it had to be from the line of Aerys and Rhaella? Who knows WHY? But it seems to be that it HAD to be Lyanna. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said: except that he seems to be right. Why did the witch say it had to be from the line of Aerys and Rhaella? Who knows WHY? But it seems to be that it HAD to be Lyanna. It never mentioned that it had to be lyanna. You can imagine that wood witch told him the savior has to be from line of rhaegar and lyanna, but this is pure made-up imagination, not supported by anything. Even it is true, I bet there is a better and more diplomatic way to get a child from lyanna without causing a bloody war and downfall of his own house. Thousands of people died because he can not think a better plan to knock up a woman. And yes, this sounds insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Viserys Targaryen IV Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 9 minutes ago, purple-eyes said: It never mentioned that it had to be lyanna. You can imagine that wood witch told him the savior has to be from line of rhaegar and lyanna, but this is pure made-up imagination, not supported by anything. Even it is true, I bet there is a better and more diplomatic way to get a child from lyanna without causing a bloody war and downfall of his own house. Thousands of people died because he can not think a better plan to knock up a woman. And yes, this sounds insane. I am not saying that the series told us that it had to be Lyanna. But we have no idea what all Rhaegar was reading, studying. And I am not arguing about how he did it, I am saying that believing prophecy does not make him insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple-eyes Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 4 minutes ago, King Viserys Targaryen IV said: I am not saying that the series told us that it had to be Lyanna. But we have no idea what all Rhaegar was reading, studying. And I am not arguing about how he did it, I am saying that believing prophecy does not make him insane. It depends on the outcome. He believed prophecy and he started to do fighting training. This is not insane. But he believed prophecy and he screwed up a whole kingdom, then this is insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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