Comics, Graphic Novels and Manga

[red snow]

I picked up 5 volumes of Essential X-Men the other day. Haven't cracked them open yet but it looks like I've got A LOT of reading ahead of me :P

If you picked it up from volume 1 then you're in for a treat. Reading those volumes, it's easy to see how the x-men became the biggest comics franchise in the US (still big now but not as big as avengers). The art by Cockrum and Byrne is great too - although reading them all I feel as if Cockrum didn't get as much credit as he deserved in comparison to Byrne. I should pick some more up but i stopped after they started to introduce all the neverconcluding stories and extra characters. Great value though.

[haLobEnder]

If you picked it up from volume 1 then you're in for a treat. Reading those volumes, it's easy to see how the x-men became the biggest comics franchise in the US (still big now but not as big as avengers). The art by Cockrum and Byrne is great too - although reading them all I feel as if Cockrum didn't get as much credit as he deserved in comparison to Byrne. I should pick some more up but i stopped after they started to introduce all the neverconcluding stories and extra characters. Great value though.

It's volumes 4-8 which is smack dab in the middle of the Claremont run. I would have preferred starting from volume 1 but it seems the earlier volumes are now considered 'collector's items' as Marvel hasn't seen fit to reprint them.

I really wish they'd do an Essential run on New Mutants. I mean they did one for Dazzler, New Mutants has to have more mass appeal than her.

I was more in the era of Generation X so they're nearer and dearer to my heart, but I've heard enough people wax nostalgic for that series that it's peaked my interest.

An Essential Alpha Flight might also be nice.

[manmiles]

It's volumes 4-8 which is smack dab in the middle of the Claremont run. I would have preferred starting from volume 1 but it seems the earlier volumes are now considered 'collector's items' as Marvel hasn't seen fit to reprint them.

Well, that explains why I can't find those volumes!

Marvel! *Shakes fist* Grrr

[red snow]

That's stupid turning black and white reprints into collector's items. the fact the line is still going means it can't be a sales issue either.

I wonder how far up the line they can go? I'm not dissing the art of the earlier work (actually more of a snub on the newer) but I think at some stage nearing the nineties the art wont work very well in B&W. This is partly because colouring became much more of the art process (especially now that some colorists are essentially inkers too) but also because it will highlight how sparse some of the newer artists are. I can imagine Chris Bachalo working in B&W still and Jim Lee may get away with all those scratchy lines.

I've actually been considering giving the X-men another go. I gave up after 4-5 years of frustration right around Messiah complex (which was good but i took it as a jumping off point). The problem is that uncanny and legacy sound a bit dull, while X-factor and X-force sound good. I might just try and grab the trades for the recent "x-events" and then see what the "year of the x" will entail. The "age of x" may be a fun primer as it looks like an age of apocalypse thing.

[haLobEnder]

That's stupid turning black and white reprints into collector's items. the fact the line is still going means it can't be a sales issue either.

Even though Volume 1 seems to be pretty rare, I did purchase the five volumes I bought at a discount book store, so I'm not so sure it's doing well saleswise. Not to mention they seem to come out at a snail's pace; The first Essential X-Men volume came out in the late 90's and there seems to be a good two year gap between releases.

I wonder how far up the line they can go? I'm not dissing the art of the earlier work (actually more of a snub on the newer) but I think at some stage nearing the nineties the art wont work very well in B&W. This is partly because colouring became much more of the art process (especially now that some colorists are essentially inkers too) but also because it will highlight how sparse some of the newer artists are. I can imagine Chris Bachalo working in B&W still and Jim Lee may get away with all those scratchy lines.

Currently they're up to Volume 9 which covers up to '89. I don't think any Essential title yet has ventured into the 90's, but they'd have my dollar if they chose to continue it. I started reading X-Men comics in '93 or so --whenever the animated series began airing-- and I'd love it if they'd do reprints of the era I'm familiar with.

I'm actually quite satisfied with how the artwork has transferred over; Colouring in the 80's ruined the artwork more than it helped, and I've discovered a new appreciation for some of these artists now that I can actually see a clean version of their work.

I've actually been considering giving the X-men another go. I gave up after 4-5 years of frustration right around Messiah complex (which was good but i took it as a jumping off point). The problem is that uncanny and legacy sound a bit dull, while X-factor and X-force sound good. I might just try and grab the trades for the recent "x-events" and then see what the "year of the x" will entail. The "age of x" may be a fun primer as it looks like an age of apocalypse thing.

I keep reading the odd issue every once and awhile, and it hasn't gotten any better since Messiah Complex to tell you the truth.

I know it's been a common complaint since the 90's, but I don't think the X-Men have ever been this big of an incomprehensible mess; There are just so many X-titles that it's hard to tell what's actually relevant to the overall story these days.

The worst part of it is that despite having so many titles, it seems to be a Marvel mandate that EVERY X-title star Cyclops, Emma Frost and Wolverine. They have such a huge cast to draw from, so why is it that these three characters need to appear in every monthly title?

...Oh and don't get me started on the new adjectiveless 'X-Men' title they introduced last year. Poor, poor Jubilee :(

[red snow]

I keep reading the odd issue every once and awhile, and it hasn't gotten any better since Messiah Complex to tell you the truth.

I know it's been a common complaint since the 90's, but I don't think the X-Men have ever been this big of an incomprehensible mess; There are just so many X-titles that it's hard to tell what's actually relevant to the overall story these days.

The worst part of it is that despite having so many titles, it seems to be a Marvel mandate that EVERY X-title star Cyclops, Emma Frost and Wolverine. They have such a huge cast to draw from, so why is it that these three characters need to appear in every monthly title?

...Oh and don't get me started on the new adjectiveless 'X-Men' title they introduced last year. Poor, poor Jubilee :(

I'm getting old. I didn't realise it had been that long since i picked up the first essential x-men.

Things like the vampire x-men title are what always makes me reconsider getting back into the x-men. Maybe better just playing around in the Age of X alterverse while that's running. It's such a shame that Marvel seems unable to get the title back on top, creatively. They could really do with getting a strong creative voice on the franchise as it's worked wonders for Avengers and Green Lantern (Batman almost falls into this too). I couldn't say who would make a good fit but there must be a comic writer around willing to stick with X-men for a while.

[Gormenghast]

I skimmed the thread and it seems no one mentioned "EDEN" by Hiroki Endo and "Homunculus" by Hideo Yamamoto.

The first is a completed series of 18 volumes and one of the best sci-fi stories in manga next to AKIRA.

The second is a masterpiece that moves slowly but it's the biggest pageturner I've ever read.

[Nephrite]

Currently they're up to Volume 9 which covers up to '89. I don't think any Essential title yet has ventured into the 90's

Probably cause nothing Marvel published in the 90's is essential. :P

[haLobEnder]

Probably cause nothing Marvel published in the 90's is essential. :P

That's not what the sales figures would indicate. Marvel would kill for its 90's audience back.

Also, Age of Apocalypse.

[Curethan]

The new(ish) X-factor is a good read. No cyclops, wolvie or Miss Underpants (frost) :) And Longshot, yay. I was buying the floppies, but I'm back at uni now so the purse string have been cut. PAD has been writing it for mebe 5 years now in its current incarnation.

[red snow]

That's not what the sales figures would indicate. Marvel would kill for its 90's audience back.

Also, Age of Apocalypse.

Especially with regards to X-men, which was probably what kept Marvel (barely) afloat after the speculator bubble burst. 90s x-men was my x-men and while I understand how it went wrong in hindsight it was perfect fodder for a teenage kid at the time (I can even recall thinking Liefeild was good).

As for age of apocalypse, this weeks teaser promos for the X-men titles seems to have a very strong AoA vibe to it. Could they be bringing that world back somehow? If they are, I won't be able to resist.

Curethan: I was reading the new X-factor from the madrox mini up until around issue 30ish. It was when I went cold turkey on "weekly pick ups" and I stopped mainly because I was still annoyed at the whole "decimation" thing and how cast members from X-factor kept being stolen for other X-comics. It was still my favourite X-title at the time. Has it remained self contained, as i could try and catch up on it?

[Gormenghast]

The crossover is titled "Age of X", but is unrelated to Age of Apocalypse.

It's just done in the same style showing known characters in their alternate universe (in this case mutants under siege and lead by Magneto).

I read the first and it's not bad, nor it's really good. Seems another bloated "what if" that fails to impress.

[Nephrite]

That's not what the sales figures would indicate. Marvel would kill for its 90's audience back.

Everybody would kill for it's 90's audience back. And sales figures don't mean much as far as quality is concerned. I'm sure freakin' Clone Saga sold like cupcakes. And Mark Millar sure as hell ain't the best writer comics have today.

And these days Marvel seems to be trying to get back that audience cause I saw a cover with fuckin' Legion on it. And he looks even dumber when not drawn by a Jim Lee clone.

[haLobEnder]

I feel like older fans of comics --as in anyone who began reading prior to the 90's-- seem to have this almost Comic-Book Guy-like contempt of any property that was successful during the 90's or anyone who may have been a fan. It seems to have caught on at Marvel too that they should glorify the 80's and feel ashamed of the 90's, as exemplified by things like New Mutants getting a brand new title with all its cast intact, while pretty much every Generation X character is dead, forgotten or depowered.

I don't get it, seems to me that comic books is a niche enough industry as it is that it can't really afford to be alienating existing fans by telling them the stuff they liked was shit.

Even reading comics in the 90's as a kid, I knew not every story was top notch, but how is Spiderman having a clone any more or less hokey than Thor being turned into a frog? The whole concept of 'superheros' and 'mutants' and 'monsters' is more akin to action movie popcorn flick than it is Criterion Collection masterpiece.

That's not to say that powerful and important stories can't be told within the medium of comics, but to the public at large, all our shit stinks, 80's and 90's fan alike.

[red snow]

I feel like older fans of comics --as in anyone who began reading prior to the 90's-- seem to have this almost Comic-Book Guy-like contempt of any property that was successful during the 90's or anyone who may have been a fan. It seems to have caught on at Marvel too that they should glorify the 80's and feel ashamed of the 90's, as exemplified by things like New Mutants getting a brand new title with all its cast intact, while pretty much every Generation X character is dead, forgotten or depowered.

I don't get it, seems to me that comic books is a niche enough industry as it is that it can't really afford to be alienating existing fans by telling them the stuff they liked was shit.

Even reading comics in the 90's as a kid, I knew not every story was top notch, but how is Spiderman having a clone any more or less hokey than Thor being turned into a frog? The whole concept of 'superheros' and 'mutants' and 'monsters' is more akin to action movie popcorn flick than it is Criterion Collection masterpiece.

That's not to say that powerful and important stories can't be told within the medium of comics, but to the public at large, all our shit stinks, 80's and 90's fan alike.

The Scott Lobdell issues of Gen X were excellent, particularly the first 6. The guy had a lot of haters but Gen X was one of the higlights of the 90s IMO. Then again i quite liked his X-men stories at the time too.

I really don't think Marvel is pretending the 90s never happened though. X-force to me looks very 90s and Gen hope is a bit of a revamped Gen X. The x-men seem to be heading into an age of apocalypse story later in the year too. I suspect it's a case of comic book writers are now coming into play that grew up on 90s comics as opposed to 80s comics (the same thing happens in the music and film industry eg 80s is back in play and 70s were popular at the turn of the century).

I remember reading the clone-saga in the uk reprints during the 90s and it started well but ended up in a mess and it took until JMS took over the title for them to fully recover from the damage that storyline caused. Then again it still didn't drive me away from the title half as much as the "one more day" storyline did.

One thing i think MArvel is good at is in it's "forever" titles which is a nice way of keeping old school fans happy without sacrificing the "real" line to them.

[haLobEnder]

I remember reading the clone-saga in the uk reprints during the 90s and it started well but ended up in a mess and it took until JMS took over the title for them to fully recover from the damage that storyline caused. Then again it still didn't drive me away from the title half as much as the "one more day" storyline did.

I was just using the 'Clone Saga' as an example, I wasn't really following the Spiderman line myself in the 90's, so I can't really judge it's overall quality.

In fact, I've never really been one for the concept of 'superheros'. I think one of the things that initially appealed to me about the X-titles was that they acted like a self-interested family rather than blind defenders of justice like so many other superheroes.

And yeah, if you can't tell Gen X was my favourite comic title right up until Larry Hama took over and ruined all the plot lines Lobdell set up. I heard it got good again once Jay Faeber took over --and after him, Brian Wood-- but that was right around the point I stopped reading comics entirely.

[red snow]

And yeah, if you can't tell Gen X was my favourite comic title right up until Larry Hama took over and ruined all the plot lines Lobdell set up. I heard it got good again once Jay Faeber took over --and after him, Brian Wood-- but that was right around the point I stopped reading comics entirely.

they really messed that title up and even when the latter writers turned up it seemed too late as by then most of the characters had been killed off. Then again death would have been a blessing compared to how badly they fucked up the character of Chamber. That character was a perfect metaphor for mutants and had such a cool appearance and now he's some weird-ass apocalypse vessel with sonic powers WTF?

[haLobEnder]

they really messed that title up and even when the latter writers turned up it seemed too late as by then most of the characters had been killed off. Then again death would have been a blessing compared to how badly they fucked up the character of Chamber. That character was a perfect metaphor for mutants and had such a cool appearance and now he's some weird-ass apocalypse vessel with sonic powers WTF?

I really miss Synch. He was one of the few black characters Marvel had that wasn't a walking stereotype. Not to mention his power set was pretty cool; Like a non-Mary Sue version of Hope Summers.

I'd actually say Jubilee is the character who has the worst of it at the moment. They've tried so many things to make her relevant to comics again except the one thing that would actually work: Giving back her mutant powers. At least Chamber and the others are left alone in relative obscurity. Chamber can come back some day with his original powers and everyone will assume something cool happened to him off-panel.

Anyone reading anything new?

I picked up the first issue of Carbon Grey this week. It's a new steampunk series from Image, that has a very Southeast Asian look to the art --manga inspired art, heavy focus on digital colouring.

I didn't particularly care for the writing, but the set-up has some promise.

[red snow]

I really miss Synch. He was one of the few black characters Marvel had that wasn't a walking stereotype. Not to mention his power set was pretty cool; Like a non-Mary Sue version of Hope Summers.

I'd actually say Jubilee is the character who has the worst of it at the moment. They've tried so many things to make her relevant to comics again except the one thing that would actually work: Giving back her mutant powers. At least Chamber and the others are left alone in relative obscurity. Chamber can come back some day with his original powers and everyone will assume something cool happened to him off-panel.

Anyone reading anything new?

I picked up the first issue of Carbon Grey this week. It's a new steampunk series from Image, that has a very Southeast Asian look to the art --manga inspired art, heavy focus on digital colouring.

I didn't particularly care for the writing, but the set-up has some promise.

Synch's power was pretty cool too. It seemed odd how they replaced him with Prodigy who has a similarish power-set.

Luckily I haven't read the ongoing defamation of Jubilee.

In terms of new comics, I've been pretty poor of late - although I find that Image and Boom! has some of the more interesting "new" titles.

[haLobEnder]

Can't resist linking this.