[ADWD Spoilers] Post here if you're an idiot like me

[Layne]

Its spelled out on pg. 499, IMO

"Get her ready for me"

"I....do you mean m'lord.....I have no, .I.."

"With your mouth"

I had no idea you spelled "Ramsay Bolton cut off my cock and/or balls." with those letters. Crazy. I really should have paid better attention in college.

To be clear, I'm not saying it isn't true. I'm just saying that Martin has, not to my recollection, used any kind of misdirection or ambiguity when it came to the POV characters relating their own thoughts and experiences. I can see how he might not have said anything in the first chapter or two, but it would have come out, and he wouldn't have made a concrete refutation of the idea like he did.

Like I said the first time, it's either a dramatic change in style, or a glaring error in editing and definitely terrible storytelling.

[Galen M]

I'm just saying that Martin has, not to my recollection, used any kind of misdirection or ambiguity when it came to the POV characters relating their own thoughts and experiences.

Are you sure we're reading the same series?

[slayer420]

Why is theo so ready to die? If he just lost a few fingers and toes I dont see him so ready to die. The only thing that makes cents is that he lost his johnson. I think that it is so bad to him that he cant even think of it. He is blacking it out. When Ramsey tells him to get her ready he cant even say it. Also He thinks of it as the other thing he took.

[Morrigan]

Are you sure we're reading the same series?

No kidding. If what he said were true, we'd have known about Jon's mother from the first Ned chapter or so.

[Ninotchka]

One option is "his true name."

Sure. And other is "my teeth" :unsure: or "my youth" or "my health" or "my wealth" or even "my honor". But he can actually think about all this. He cannot think about "that other thing" :thumbsup:

To be castrated is to have removed your testicles. Ramsay didn't want to have him unable to father kids, but to punish and harm him. I bet he flayed his penis and later cut it, when Theon asked him to do so, as he did with his fingers and toes. And "that other thing" :frown5: . And so, Theon had to "get ready" Jeyne with his mouth :frown5:

[Galen M]

Sure. And other is "my teeth" :unsure: or "my youth" or "my health" or "my wealth" or even "my honor". But he can actually think about all this. He cannot think about "that other thing" :thumbsup:

To be castrated is to have removed your testicles. Ramsay didn't want to have him unable to father kids, but to punish and harm him. I bet he flayed his penis and later cut it, when Theon asked him to do so, as he did with his fingers and toes. And "that other thing" :frown5: . And so, Theon had to "get ready" Jeyne with his mouth :frown5:

so, he can still produce sperm; great, just wait a few thousand years for IVF to be invented, and then Theon can have children. Woot.

[Aye]

Oh, this has mutated into a thread about castration. :unsure:

I wanted to talk about how I am beating myself up for believing that Mance would die like a cowardly dog. Not that I had any way of knowing that Mellisandre had the power to make people look like other people, but still.

[Sean T. Collins]

Missed:

* The possible fulfillment of Mirri Maz Dur's "when the sun rises in the west" etc. prophecy -- though I had a sense from Dany's vaginal bleeding and running into a khalasar that SOMETHING was going on there

* The possible fulfillment of the Azor Ahai "under a bleeding star" etc. prophecy

* The Frey pie

* Theon's loss of his "Li'l Greyjoy"

* Abel = anagram of Bael

* Rickon on Skagos (I thought it was the Neck the whole time -- even the cannibal reference was, I assumed, just another rumor about those infernal "bog devils")

* Bloodraven = the Three-Eyed Crow (I'd just read the D&E stories for the first time but completely whiffed on the similar descriptions)

* JonCon's crush on Rhaegar

* I don't think I gave much thought to Young Griff being a fake Aegon, the "mummer's dragon"; I KNOW I didn't give ANY thought to him actually being Illyrio's kid

* The Mance/Rattleshirt switcheroo

* Tormund's nickname "Giantsbane" and his tall kid being related to the Umber daughter who wildlings kidnapped years ago

* Wun Wun = Phil Simms :)

Caught:

* Abel and his back-up singers = Mance and the spearwives

* The ship's name = The Perfumed Seneschal

* Arya's poisoned coin

* Arya skinchanging into the cat

* I may have missed the bleeding-star AA prophecy stuff, but I certainly caught that Melisandre's visions implied that Jon is AA

* That there's more to Septa Lemore than meets the eye (though I guessed she was that one Sand Snake's septa mother, not Ashara Dayne, which I don't buy -- surely Tyrion would notice her Liz Taylor eyes if she were)

* The Dunk, Lyanna, Benjen etc. cameos in Bran's vision through the Winterfell weirwood

* Aeron's hots for Joanna Lannister and the ramifications for the Lannister Siblings' parentage

* Asha angling to use Theon as a means to overturn the Kingsmoot

* Jaqen's Citadel key as a way to get the forbidden book of dragonlore that Tyrion says is locked up in a vault there

* Tyrion killing Nurse with his tragic mushrooms

[Ser Bronn o the Blackwater]

I missed the Arya coin in my first read through, didn't know how she killed him with a coin, till I was reminded of the Jaqen on Pate trick.

That was my polite answer though, I really wanted to reply "There are no idiots like you there is only you." but don't know if you would have taken Jaime-snark kindly. :P

Wait, Jaqen is the Alchemist? Wow. I guess I'll add that to the list...

[Ser Bronn o the Blackwater]

Also, sun setting in the east? Can someone point out the significance of that?

I just figured if the sigil of House Martell is a Sun and Spear... A Lannister's a Lion, a Stark's a Wolf...

[80r]

I had interpreted that Theon *did* have his penis cut off, because when he talked about his fingers being cut off, he thought something along the lines of "and another thing". That's at least what I remember.

I had actually thought that Abel was Lemoncloak. I thought the BwB had infiltrated Winterfell and were making the killings. Of course, later they spell out that it's Mance.

I didn't realize the Manderly Pie.

Rickon on Skagos, I figured, though I don't really know why. I just combined the though Davos had with some vague recollection that Skagos wasn't a pretty place and put the two together.

"Sun setting on the East"? No idea what that's about.

Never considered that Aegon might be a fake.

[Owen Pope]

Its spelled out on pg. 499, IMO

"Get her ready for me"

"I....do you mean m'lord.....I have no, .I.."

"With your mouth"

I read this bit as

"I... do you mean m'lord... I have no [right to penetrate my lord's bride], I..."

I hadn't even considered the castration angle until I found these forums. Also, having read this, it seems more Bolton-ish to flay his penis than to chop his bits off.

[Owen Pope]

Got:

Abel = Mance (eventually)

Arya poisoning the coin (eventually)

Bloodraven = 3 eyed crow

Missed:

Frey pie

All the AA/Jon stuff

ANY gay characters (including Renly & Loras. Where?)

perfumed seneschal

Skagos (Where is this reference?? I don't even know where to look!)

Theon castration (again, where? I've skimmed back over the chapters, but I don't see it)

fake Aegon (?)

Bleeding star

mance/rattleshirt swap (how could we know what a glamor is, or that Melisandre could use them?)

Jaquen = the Alchemist

Is there anywhere that has a quick summary of most of these theories?

Hopefully with references, because it takes damn near forever to dig through 5 LONG books to find details on all these things.

[LordBloodravenI]

I'm not a total idiot, though. I did manage to notice Bloodraven, the ship's name being Fragrant Seneschal, young Lyanna & Benjen in Bran's vision, that Septa Lemore might be someone of consequence, gay Jon Connington, and other things.

Jon Connigton is gay?! Wow... I totally did not notice that. I didn't notice the Frey pie or Theon's penis-flaying either. The only thing I did get was Mance=Abel and Lyanna and Benjen. Hell, I didn't even get that Leaf=Bloodraven despite Bloodraven being one of my favorite characters. Now I feel stupid.

[Tall Tyrion Lannister!]

Missed

Mance

Theon being gelded, I got it after I was told though.

Jon being gay.

Got

Arya's coin. Got that right away.

Another thing I got right away Jorah's slavery being karma.

[Aye]

I missed one that makes me feel really stupid - the identity of the knight who captured Tyrion. I was just so stressed out about the capture, and I only got it in the next chapter. Then I read back and had a good laugh about the silver-blonde whore sitting in his lap :laugh:

I know what confused me though, it was the difference between TV Jorah and book Jorah. I'd gotten used to thinking of him as a fair-haired hottie.

[Ishuäl]

I totally missed the Frey Pie, as well as the significance of Dany's last chapter... man that thing with Quentin as the prophecy's sun is ingenious...

[The Demon of Darry]

can someone please tell me where it was said/implied that Theon was gelded?

[HashRouge]

I got the Manderly Pie bit, and I really hope it isn't just supposition from us and that Manderly the massive really did serve up a few Freys at Ramsay's wedding :laugh:

I missed the Perfumed Seneschal bit though, didn't notice it until I was on here! I did that think Jon Connington seemed a bit in love with Rhaegar though and was pretty certain Lemore wasn't all she seemed. Thanks for explaining how Arya killed that man with a coin though, because I really didn't get that!

[Aye]

can someone please tell me where it was said/implied that Theon was gelded?

Sorry I don't remember the exact pages and quotes, but once he thinks about how Ramsay only took "a few fingers and toes and that other thing". Then when he goes off with Roose and Roose offers to have him bathed, he freaks out at the suggestion that others would see him naked, and says "my lord, I have ... wounds". And then when Ramsay tells him to get his bride ready, he says "but I have no..." and Ramsay says "with your mouth!". Aside from that there are a few times where both he and Ramsay refer to him not even being a man anymore.