[ADwD Spoilers] Ice Dragon's

[LittleDragon]

this idea on the ice dragon is really interesting, but actually i don't see the use of it against the Others... I would say that the wounded Jon was placed in an ice cell this is why he feels cold, and the Wall keeps him alive until his brothers realizes they've made an error, Jon had right with all his strange measures and they heal him and let him continue his way as Lord Commander. But it's too realistic I know :-) So, let's find out what use of an eventual ice dragon can be....

[Ivy Snow]

I suddenly remembered a story on the Wall about a NC falling in-love with a sort-of-Other woman. Could it be Adara? I haven't read the Ice Dragon story though.

Anyway, It could be that the Ice dragon is real and would only be used againt fire dragons. I have a feeling that there Danny would lose control of her dragons ( maybe) and could be the cause of more destruction in Westeros and the Ice dragon will help destroy them.

[ItIsKnown]

Jon will wake up Ice dragon(s) and Bran will warg into one of them ;)

I think there might be something more to this line of thought actually - Brynden/Bloodraven tells Bran that he is going to learn to fly, after all. :) [crackpot]Will he learn to warg into a dragon - especially an Ice Dragon? [/crackpot]

[Ishuäl]

I think there might be something more to this line of thought actually - Brynden/Bloodraven tells Bran that he is going to learn to fly, after all. :) [crackpot]Will he learn to warg into a dragon - especially an Ice Dragon? [/crackpot]

That is not very crackpot, except that the literal appearance of an Ice Dragon seems unlikely and a bit random. But Bran warging into one... very possible.

[Miriamele]

this idea on the ice dragon is really interesting, but actually i don't see the use of it against the Others... I would say that the wounded Jon was placed in an ice cell this is why he feels cold, and the Wall keeps him alive until his brothers realizes they've made an error, Jon had right with all his strange measures and they heal him and let him continue his way as Lord Commander. But it's too realistic I know :-) So, let's find out what use of an eventual ice dragon can be....

Both can happen. Jon gets preserved/healed. The others come riding ice dragons.

In the ice dragon story Adara is a human child with a special connection to the ice dragon.

Different armies use fire dragons in this story and control them well. The ice dragon isn't evil either but it becomes so cold when it's around that people think it makes winter longer and harder and it's bad for them. Also in that story fire dragons are rather susceptible to cold, spend winters in warmer climates. If it is so in ASOIAF Dany will have a hard time in winter. Although maybe it isn't like that. I remember a queen flying to the wall on her dragon.

[Dayne's Sword]

been speaking to a freind of mine stationed in Germany He says he saw advertised somewhere online a pic of Jon riding a white dragon. or did he say ice? sorry guys we last spoke a few weeks ago. The image he saw was from the collectable card game.

the dragn could be viserion or it could be a new "ice" dragon.

[Calibandar]

Well, get your friend to find out more about that card, that could be interesting if the game is based on GRRM's intel.

Also in that story fire dragons are rather susceptible to cold, spend winters in warmer climates. If it is so in ASOIAF Dany will have a hard time in winter. Although maybe it isn't like that. I remember a queen flying to the wall on her dragon.

Yes, there was this queen who flew her dragon Silverwing to the Wall. Of course that may have been in a period when it wasn't so massively cold as it is now, so that still doesn't tell us how the dragons will fare when they come to Westeros Winters, something new to them. I expect that it will be hard for them, but still bearable. If anything you'd think the fire in them would be better medicine against the cold than what others have.

[Dayne's Sword]

Well, get your friend to find out more about that card, that could be interesting if the game is based on GRRM's intel.

i have only just got an email from him that i sent him over a week ago. as if/soon as i get a reply from him i will post up. .

[jon rr stark]

I noticed them mentioned twice as descriptions in Jon chapters:

"The wind was gusting, cold as the breath of the ice dragon in the tales Old Nan had told when Jon was a boy."

"The road beneath the Wall was as dark and cold as the belly of an ice dragon and as twisty as a serpent"

So what is an ice dragon? I believe Jon is AA, so he needs to wake dragons. Perhaps his dragons are ice dragons.

Also King's blood has powers Mel likes to say. Jon has the blood of the kings of the north and the Targs. That seems pretty powerful to me.

Also the wall has power, if Jon would just use it according to Mel. LC of NW should have it's own power too I think.

So if Jon bleeds on the wall, does that wake ice dragons? Is the Wall really what is healing him (the smoke from the wounds) and not Mel?

Oh I like this. The magic in the wall is from Bran the builder presumebly, whom the Starks count as an ancestor. Jon possible blood of Ice and Fire. Lots of magic power there. Ice dragons v fire dragons, song of ice and fire. Wow what a battle. The Dragon has three heads I believe is the quote (correct me if Im wrong) not that there are three Dragons. How about Jon Bran and Rickon being the three heads of the Ice dragon. Why are their no Dragons left in Westoros (pre Trag)cos the Ice Dragons kicked their asses and went for a sleep under the wall gaurding it from Others.

No idea how it would play out but sounds graet.

[sean snow]

I think there might be something more to this line of thought actually - Brynden/Bloodraven tells Bran that he is going to learn to fly, after all. :) [crackpot]Will he learn to warg into a dragon - especially an Ice Dragon? [/crackpot]

That is not very crackpot, except that the literal appearance of an Ice Dragon seems unlikely and a bit random. But Bran warging into one... very possible.

If there is an ice dragon I like the idea of bran warging into a it, using the power of the wall (it is full of magic and has lots of ice) and what he learns from the children, waking the dragon. i thought bran might warg into a dragon, why not an ice one, he is of the north.

[Cromm]

This passage had me wondering about the possibility of a dragon, or dragons, in the north.

Hardhome had been halfway toward becoming a

town, the only true town north of the Wall, until the night six

hundred years ago when hell had swallowed it. Its people

had been carried off into slavery or slaughtered for meat,

depending on which version of the tale you believed, their

homes and halls consumed in a conflagration that burned

so hot that watchers on the Wall far to the south had thought

the sun was rising in the north. Afterward ashes rained

down on haunted forest and Shivering Sea alike for almost

half a year. Traders reported finding only nightmarish

devastation where Hardhome had stood, a landscape of

charred trees and burned bones, waters choked with

swollen corpses, blood-chilling shrieks echoing from the

cave mouths that pocked the great cliff that loomed above

the settlement.

Of course, it does sound like volcanic activity but consider otherwise. We know that caves would attract a dragon as a possible lair and a settlement would provide a food source as well. What caused the shrieks from the caves? Volcanic activity would probably not set the entire settlement ablaze at the same time. It would need to be torched at once so that it could be seen from the wall. The scorched landscape just sounds like the work of a dragon.

Earlier in this thread it was mentioned that bloodraven had a red dragon egg and was at the wall for some time. [crackpot]Affected by the cold the red dragon sought refuge in warm caves which were an active volcanic area that, when erupted, forced the dragon out from the warmer depths to eventually prey upon the settlement[/crackpot].

Or it's an ice dragon with the "blue-grey pinions" from Jon's first wolfdream. Or it's an undead, wight dragon (dracolich!). Or maybe Hardhome is just the Tunguska of Westeros. I just wanted to put this passage out there since it certainly was the first time that I considered that there might have been other dragons living in the world before Dany's.

[Arthanis]

I am 90% sure we will see more dragons in SoIaF, even Azor Ahai prophercy is clear evidence.

[Miriamele]

This passage had me wondering about the possibility of a dragon, or dragons, in the north.

Of course, it does sound like volcanic activity but consider otherwise. We know that caves would attract a dragon as a possible lair and a settlement would provide a food source as well. What caused the shrieks from the caves? Volcanic activity would probably not set the entire settlement ablaze at the same time. It would need to be torched at once so that it could be seen from the wall. The scorched landscape just sounds like the work of a dragon.

The city of Pompeii is a partially buried Roman town-city near modern Naples in the Italian region of Campania, in the territory of the comune of Pompei. Along with Herculaneum, Pompeii was destroyed and completely buried during a long catastrophic eruption of the volcano Mount Vesuvius spanning two days in the year AD 79. The eruption buried Pompeii under 4 to 6 meters of ash and pumice, and it was lost for nearly 1700 years before its accidental rediscovery in 1749. Since then, its excavation has provided an extraordinarily detailed insight into the life of a city at the height of the Roman Empire.

I hope there are more dragons though. It would be more interesting storywise if te town was buried by dragonfire and not by volcanic activity.

[Aye]

I think Jon is going to be the Ice dragon, figuratively, or ride an ice dragon. :unsure:

[Jon Snow's Nuncle]

The name "The Winds of Winter" itself is a clue of sorts. A dragon's breath can be powerful and wind-like. And if it is an ice dragon, then the breath would be cold as winter. (Just speculating)

I too would like to believe there is a dragon in the north. It should be evident from all the references, but could just be GRRM taking the mickey.

[jon rr stark]

This "children's book," as it is called

(contains rape, murder, many deaths, a crucifixion of sorts) has an Ice Dragon that seems to be made litereally of ice. It shows up only when it is cold enough for it to do so, without excessive 'weeping.' It could be that an Ice Dragon in this series would be more or less confined to the Lands of Always Winter until Winter has come south of the Wall, as it seems to be doing now. As mentioned before, the Ice Dragon in the children's book does kill a couple of the fire dragons before it has a wing melted off by a fire dragon's breath before it crashes to the ground. The Ice Dragon in teh case was too far south for the weather, and it melts into a large pond or lake. There is a small girl that rides the Ice Dragon, only being able to do so because her body is seemingly without warmth. This allows her to ride the Dragon without her warmth melting it where she touches it. Much of this of course, could be Old Nan speak, and not to be taken so literally. But it still stands to reason that the Ice Dragons, if present in actual Westeros, would only come south when it is cold enough to do so. Now that the fantasy faucet has been opened up in this series, I think an Ice Dragon has a good chance of making an appearance.

All Jon can feel is cold right now all the warmth is gone. Didn't he or Bran have a dream of him never feeling warmth again so maybe if there is an ice dradon he can ride it?

[Ivy Snow]

All Jon can feel is cold right now all the warmth is gone. Didn't he or Bran have a dream of him never feeling warmth again so maybe if there is an ice dradon he can ride it?

It was Bran who had a dream about Jon feeling cold.

[sean snow]

I like the idea that Jon is the metaphorical ice dragon, just another hint towards the R+L=J, fire and ice. But real ice dragons would be bad ass and from the "children's story" we know that they can do a lot of damage. We know the cold doesn't bother the others but i'm sure being trapped in solid ice would slow them down.

Going back to the smoking wounds, im re-reading ASoS right now and there is another reference to smoking wounds.

pg 252 my softcover copy of the book when Sam, Paul, and Grenn meet the other,

"It came out his back with a hissssssssss and Sam heard Paul say, "Oh," as he lost the axe. Impaled, his blood smoking around the sword, the big man tried to reach his killer...."

I think this could mean that GRRM is using smoking and steaming interchangeable, or there is something about Paul's wound, either because its from the other, or from the others sword that makes it smoke, opposed to steam.

[HannibalStark]

I like the idea that Jon is the metaphorical ice dragon, just another hint towards the R+L=J, fire and ice. But real ice dragons would be bad ass and from the "children's story" we know that they can do a lot of damage. We know the cold doesn't bother the others but i'm sure being trapped in solid ice would slow them down.

Going back to the smoking wounds, im re-reading ASoS right now and there is another reference to smoking wounds.

pg 252 my softcover copy of the book when Sam, Paul, and Grenn meet the other,

"It came out his back with a hissssssssss and Sam heard Paul say, "Oh," as he lost the axe. Impaled, his blood smoking around the sword, the big man tried to reach his killer...."

I think this could mean that GRRM is using smoking and steaming interchangeable, or there is something about Paul's wound, either because its from the other, or from the others sword that makes it smoke, opposed to steam.

just like with Jon, smoking = steaming when an ice sword plunges into a meat bag full of 98 degree blood it is going to result in steam/smoke. I never read it as anything else. I thought the description of Jon "smoking" seemed unusual, until I reread the passage about Sam's whitewalker buddy.

It seems like steam=smoke and is yet another way to seemingly match the AAR prophecy, or the description of it...to go along with the other 4 or 5 already in the book.

[HannibalStark]

double post...*sorry.