lyvyathan Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 Did the Red Wedding happen purely because of Robb Stark's decision to abandon his marriage to the Frey - or would it have happened eventually because Walder Frey was a treacherous bugger?The Frey always made sure he was on the winning side. So with House Tyrell on the side of the Lannisters - and the Boltons sliding over too + losing Winterfell to the Ironborn, etc.. it won't have taken Robb's faux pas to have turned Frey over to the dark side.He was also very greedy. If Walder was certain that he could gain much more by switching sides - I wouldn't be surprised if he still went ahead and betrayed the Starks et al at some stage.(This is in no way an attempt to excuse Robb's stupidity in marrying his one night stand) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horza Posted October 23, 2011 Share Posted October 23, 2011 That's about the size of it.You can see the cogs turning for them (and Roose Bolton) in the last Arya chapter of ACoK. They wouldn't have done the Red Wedding, which comes directly from Robb's stupidity and Walder's wounded pride but Robb's cause is all but lost after Winterfell and the Blackwater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattyp Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 There are a lot of things that could have stopped the RW. One was Robb's truth in Theon being completely misplaced, if he had sent someone else to the Iron islands he would not have lost Winterfell, and Bran and Rickon wouldn't have 'died', causing him to sleep with Jeyne. But I imagine Walder would have tried to avoid betraying him had he not slept with Jeyne. Robb had charmed a lot of the Fray's, and they would likely not have betrayed him as easily as Walder did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaggydog Stark Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Did the Red Wedding happen purely because of Robb Stark's decision to abandon his marriage to the Frey - or would it have happened eventually because Walder Frey was a treacherous bugger?The Frey always made sure he was on the winning side. So with House Tyrell on the side of the Lannisters - and the Boltons sliding over too + losing Winterfell to the Ironborn, etc.. it won't have taken Robb's faux pas to have turned Frey over to the dark side.He was also very greedy. If Walder was certain that he could gain much more by switching sides - I wouldn't be surprised if he still went ahead and betrayed the Starks et al at some stage.(This is in no way an attempt to excuse Robb's stupidity in marrying his one night stand)I think it was a combination of both. I think losing the north was the beginning of Robb's demise. However, perhaps if he had not married Jeyne, the betrayal would not have been so gruesome and horrific. Perhaps they might not have murdered him or done it differently. I found the RW to be really barbaric and the way Walder Frey was enjoying it and watching with his greedy eyes just made it more horrific to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillWork4NinjaPowers Posted October 26, 2011 Share Posted October 26, 2011 Also, Bolton was not the happiest after his van was demolished in ACoK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soob Posted October 26, 2011 Share Posted October 26, 2011 Frey backed Robb from the beginning, when it looked like he had no real hope of winning. It's hard to reconcile that with the view of Frey as just being an opportunistic villain. I mean, obviously he is, but there had to be more there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aki Posted October 26, 2011 Share Posted October 26, 2011 My guess is that Tywin Lannister was behind RW. He just knew how to use Walder Freys greed. He probably promised them something (Riverrun, Seagard), to betray Robb Stark. So the idea probably came from Tywin Lannister, but the execution itself was something that only old bugger Walder would have organized."some wars are won with swords others with quills and ravens" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antonius Pius Posted October 27, 2011 Share Posted October 27, 2011 Aki has it down. Tywin OK-ed the Red Wedding, or rather promised Walder Frey he'd be accepted back into the King's Peace, and probably that they'd get Riverrun too. For this to happen, Frey was to kill Robb Stark. The how and when was a matter for Walder Frey, Black Walder and Roose Bolton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaggydog Stark Posted November 3, 2011 Share Posted November 3, 2011 On a side note, my personal view has been that had the Freys felt that Robb was losing the war, they might have broken the marriage pact themselves. That's just the type of family they seem to be like. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheesemonger Posted November 20, 2011 Share Posted November 20, 2011 I though it was fairly obvious that Tywin was partly, if not mostly behind the Red Wedding. At first he talks about some wars being won with pen and paper or something to that nature. Tyrion guesses it in one of his conversations with Tywin right after the news of the RW reaches Kings Landing. I'm sure it wasn't Tywin's idea, he just supported getting rid of Robb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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