Others vs Wall

[FanTasy]

Not wights, but is there any mention of a female White Walker?

Exactly, there is a difference between wightified people or beasts and the White Walkers, the latter possibly being the Others.

Female white walkers ... the ones we met were described as male.

Comes to mind the story of the Night King, who took a 'pale woman' from beyond the wall for his wife.

[Eyron]

now that might be a terrible misunderstanding but I'll give it a try:

The old woman says:The white cold’s rising out there, crow. I can feel it in my bones. These poor old bones don’t lie.

obviously her bones are aching due to cold because she is old. This is just an expression, no hidden messages here, I think we all agree to that, right?

But what about the seventy-nine deserters' bones? Maybe there is some truth to these bones when the living men of the Night Watch are not true anymore...

with all the respect I think ned's bones have nothing to do with this. But really, where's ned's bones?

Yeah I know the expression, but the words she says are chosen by the author, and that sentence keeps being repeated by so many characters, it is hardly random even when she says it.

@Kissdbyfire, thank you for the quotes! So Old Nan is out of the picture then.

My first thought is that the bones of importance are the ones in the crypts of Winterfell, but also that it refers to bones in general. The CotF keep their bones in their caverns and caves so the weirwoods have "access" to them (the bones remember), but the Starks keep them in the crypts, in tombs. So are the Stark bones kept away from the weirwood network or does keeping them in the crypts beneath Winterfell give the weirwood access to them?

I don't think it could be the 79 sentinels that are important since they were deserters and not true to their vows.

Another interesting thing that Craster said:

"I said as much to that Mance Rayder once, when he come sniffing round. He never listened, no more’n you crows with your swords and your bloody fires. That won’t help you none when the white cold comes. Only the gods will help you then. You best get right with the gods.”

He does not see the White Walkers as gods, since the gods are the ones that can help you when the white cold comes. The Others (or White Walkers) come in the frontier of the white cold, but it is the white cold that is the danger is seems. So what comes behind the Others in the white cold?

And if the neither the Others or the white cold are his gods, are Crasters gods the Old Gods? Are the Others helping the Old Gods against this white cold and that is why he gives his sons to them to be raised as Others? (Black crow, if you are reading this... I know I know, you have been saying this forever :)).

[mor2]

I'll try to interpret KissdbyFire's post. Maybe what's implied is that CoTFs are only female and Others only male because there is another connection between those two?

yes, but caster sacrifice = Wights and as I mentioned they come in all shapes and sizes, doubtless that they are all male, plus we have the Night's king bride or more recently Thistle

Not wights, but is there any mention of a female White Walker?

not that I recall, but then again I dont recall any mention of male Others.

[mor2]

Exactly, there is a difference between wightified people or beasts and the White Walkers, the latter possibly being the Others.

Just to clarify that, so far we know of the Others and Wights, the later being reanimated corpses controlled by the Others.

White Walkers, is just one of the many names the wildlings call them (it's also the name that the TV show use instead of Others, supposedly to avoid confusion with the tv series LOST).

[kissdbyfire]

yes, but caster sacrifice = Wights and as I mentioned they come in all shapes and sizes, doubtless that they are all male, plus we have the Night's king bride or more recently Thistle

not that I recall, but then again I dont recall any mention of male Others.

IIRC, ser Waymar Royce is killed by WW in the prologue of AGoT, and is wightified. And I think Sam kills one, too.

[Serie]

I don't think it could be the 79 sentinels that are important since they were deserters and not true to their vows.

I'm a bit influenced by Lord of the Rings here. The Dead, who were also oathbreakers, helped there in order for the curse to be removed that's why this 79stuff came down to me.

yes, but caster sacrifice = Wights and as I mentioned they come in all shapes and sizes, doubtless that they are all male, plus we have the Night's king bride or more recently Thistle

not that I recall, but then again I dont recall any mention of male Others.

I don't argue on that, it's just an idea I had from Kissdbyfire's post.

[FanTasy]

Just to clarify that, so far we know of the Others and Wights, the later being reanimated corpses controlled by the Others.

White Walkers, is just one of the many names the wildlings call them (it's also the name that the TV show use instead of Others, supposedly to avoid confusion with the tv series LOST).

This is not entirely true. Nan called them white walkers in her story to Bran in AGOT. Interestingly Bran asks "The Others?". Nan confirms this.

[Wightman]

IIRC, ser Waymar Royce is killed by WW in the prologue of AGoT, and is wightified. And I think Sam kills one, too.

Both are Wights as opposed to Others/iWalkers

[FanTasy]

Both are Wights as opposed to Others/iWalkers

In AGOT (Prologue) the one who slays Waymar Royce is explicitly named as 'The Other'.

[kissdbyfire]

Just to clarify that, so far we know of the Others and Wights, the later being reanimated corpses controlled by the Others.

White Walkers, is just one of the many names the wildlings call them (it's also the name that the TV show use instead of Others, supposedly to avoid confusion with the tv series LOST).

I can't edit my previous post for some reason. I was trying to add that I believe Craster's sons become WW, not wights.

[Eyron]

Edit: wrong quote

[Eyron]

This is not entirely true. Nan called them white walkers in her story to Bran in AGOT. Interestingly Bran asks "The Others?". Nan confirms this.

Aha!

So maybe Old Nan is a wildling after all

Edit: wrong quote :)

[FanTasy]

I can't edit my previous post for some reason. I was trying to add that I believe Craster's sons become WW, not wights.

I agree. So we have wights (human, giant, beast and they could be of all ages and probably male as well as female). And we have the white walkers, the Others. I recall meeting two of them (brrr ....) one in the prologue and the one Sam slew. Both seemed to me as being described as male.

[Silmarien]

yes, but caster sacrifice = Wights and as I mentioned they come in all shapes and sizes, doubtless that they are all male, plus we have the Night's king bride or more recently Thistle

not that I recall, but then again I dont recall any mention of male Others.

Old Nan says in one of her stories that during the long night, The Others used to lie with human women to sire terrible half-human half-Other children. I believe this is in AGoT after Bran wakes from his coma (could be wrong though). I suppose this would lend credence to the theory that the Others are all male, and need to find females from another species (CotF, Humans) to reproduce?

[FanTasy]

And strolling back to my question in the earlier post: what if any is the significance that we have Crasters sons, possibly recruited for or turned into white walkers and the seemingly all female population of the Children of the Forest?

[Wightman]

In AGOT (Prologue) the one who slays Waymar Royce is explicitly named as 'The Other'.

Yeah, I meant Royce himself and the one Jon kills at Castle Black. They are both Wights, but no mention is made of the gender of their original slayers, the ones who 'wightified' them.

I like that word, can we get it put in the dictionary?

[kissdbyfire]

Both are Wights as opposed to Others/iWalkers

No, actually. From AGoT prologue:

"The Others made no sound."

"The Other slid forward on silent feet. In its hand was a longsword like none that Will had ever seen. No human metal had gone into the forging of that blade. It was alive with moonlight, translucent, a shard of crystal so thin that it seemed almost to vanish when seen edge-on. There was a faint blue shimmer to the thing, a ghost-light that played around its edges, and somehow Will knew it was sharper than any razor.

Ser Waymar met him bravely. “Dance with me then.”

"The Other halted. Will saw its eyes; blue, deeper and bluer than any human eyes, a blue that burned like ice. They fixed on the longsword trembling on high, watched the moonlight running cold along the metal. For a heartbeat he dared to hope."

[FanTasy]

Thnx for the exact quote Kissdbyfire. Hm ... "its hand", not "his hand" :bang:

[kissdbyfire]

Yeah, I meant Royce himself and the one Jon kills at Castle Black. They are both Wights, but no mention is made of the gender of their original slayers, the ones who 'wightified' them.

I like that word, can we get it put in the dictionary?

Gotcha. Sorry, posted before I saw your reply. And, yes, it isn't gender isn't mentioned, I just assumed they were male; or I thought of them as being male because there is no description that indicates otherwise. Also, if the WW are all male, it would explain why they have to strengthen their ranks through offerings since they can't reproduce...

[FanTasy]

But further on in the Prologue the voice of The Other is described as "his voice". :eek: