Was Aerys trying to reunite his house to the Blackfyres?

[joluoto]

Hmm, we don't know how pure the Blackfyre line is. I guess they practiced sibling marriages when it was possible, but what did they do when it wasn't? The Targaryens just married women of other noble houses, but did the Blackfyres had the same opportunities? Would the Essosi patricians and nobles be willing to marry their daughters/ sisters to the leaders of the Golden Company? My guess is no.

[caravaggio]

Hmm, we don't know how pure the Blackfyre line is. I guess they practiced sibling marriages when it was possible, but what did they do when it wasn't? The Targaryens just married women of other noble houses, but did the Blackfyres had the same opportunities? Would the Essosi patricians and nobles be willing to marry their daughters/ sisters to the leaders of the Golden Company? My guess is no.

Blackfyres are still the only option other than Aerion's descendents that would make sense given what Aerys wants and Steffon's failures to find it.

You have Daemon's descendents there and Aegor's (If he had any). If they had to marry outside of the bloodline, I'm sure any number of the noble lines that went off into exile with them would have been happy to tie their houses to the Blackfyres.

Even the wiki says, "According to Illyrio Mopatis the Blackfyres were extinguished in the male line when Maelys Blackfyre was slain by Ser Barristan Selmy. ^[4] What happened to the female line is not known, it should be safe to say that there are Blackfyre descendants in Essos who trace their ancestry through the female line."

[sertravisredbeard]

Maybe Steffon failed on purpose so if the Targaryens fail to produce heirs the throne will pass to the Baratheons. It is weird that he went on a big trip east to find ANY bride with Valyrian blood and came up empty.

[caravaggio]

Maybe Steffon failed on purpose so if the Targaryens fail to produce heirs the throne will pass to the Baratheons. It is weird that he went on a big trip east to find ANY bride with Valyrian blood and came up empty.

Maybe, but then Steffon's plan would also have needed to have included a plan to kill Rhaegar (who was already heir) and any other children Aerys had.

Aerys is already batty and paranoid at this point, so I suspect most people would have been afraid to fail him.

[daario's man]

Maybe Steffon failed on purpose so if the Targaryens fail to produce heirs the throne will pass to the Baratheons. It is weird that he went on a big trip east to find ANY bride with Valyrian blood and came up empty.

Then it can't have been any Valyrian the, can it. It must be someone specific. As to your other point about Steffon wanting the IT to pass to the Baratheons it seems unlikely as unless he planned to kill Rhaegar the crown would not come to him in his life time.

Until the rebellion the Baratheons were the closest house to the Targaryens.

[PrimeRhaegar]

well i did find it weird that he would send the lord paramount of the stormlands to search for rhaegar's wife but hey it was his cousin so why not. No idea though i mean the free cities do have nobility themselves maybe he really couldn't find one suitable enough it happens man.

[caravaggio]

well i did find it weird that he would send the lord paramount of the stormlands to search for rhaegar's wife but hey it was his cousin so why not. No idea though i mean the free cities do have nobility themselves maybe he really couldn't find one suitable enough it happens man.

Aerys: Steffon, go find me any girl of Valryian descent in the Free Cities.

Steffon: Sure thing.

Steffon returns months later...

Steffon: Sorry buddy, no worthy Valryians.

Aerys: You didn't even bother to bring back a few you thought I might have considered? You had a whole ship to fit them in after all.

Steffon: Nah.

Aerys to Rossart: Get Steffon his Armor and warm up the wildfire.

[Maester Tormund]

Nice thought, but I think he was really just looking for valyrian descent. He didn't give a damn about other houses, apparently.

House Velaryon? Ya know they are an old house... and a true house... and a brave house.

(For those of you who are unaware that is their motto :leaving: )

That's a house with Valyrian blood and they are sworn bannermen to Dragonstone, AKA the Targaryens. There is some precedent for a high lord to marry a lesser lord's daughter. Viserys I married a Hightower (lesser house but old and noble), Steffon Baratheon married an Estermont, and Aegon III married someone from dun...dun...dun... House Velaryon! So if they wanted someone with Valryian blood then they could have went to House Velaryon.

I know it doesn't exactly line up but instead of maybe trying to reunite Blackfyre to Targaryen maybe he was looking for some allies overseas? His paranoia really set in after the Defiance of Duskendale in 276 AL. Steffon Baratheon died in 278 AL (my dates are from the Wiki, the App doesn't appear to have entries or dates for either of those two) meaning he was most likely sent to the Free Cities shortly after The Defiance. That same year Steffon died Arianne was born, indicating that Doran Martell and Mellario were married not long before. Rhaegar was married to Elia in 278. I'll show how everything lines up in a timeline.

276- Aerys is kidnapped, afterwards extreme paranoia sets in.

277- Steffon Baratheon sent to Free Cities to find a wife for Rhaegar. (I took 277 as an estimate, he went somewhere between 276-278. I assume it would take at an absolute minimum one full year to search all of the Free Cities and return with no bride and only a fool.)

277- Doran Martell marries Mellario of Norvos.

278- Rhaegar Targaryen marries Elia Martell of Dorne, bringing House Targaryen and House Martell together again.)

Aerys fails to win any direct foreign allies so he goes for the next best thing. He weds his House to the most distinct and different area in Westeros. That area also has ties to a Free City, Norvos. So it's almost like he wins two foreign allies. In his mind he know has the Crownlands in his pocket, Dorne, and the Free Cities. Tywin has been his most loyal lord so he has the Westerlands. Steffon Baratheon was a loyal lord and had Targaryen blood, just as his sons do, so why won't this young Robert stay loyal? There's the Stormlands. Mace Tyrell is too stupid to plot rebellion. So in Aerys' mind he has 5 of the regions in Westeros (Stormlands, Dorne, Westerlands, The Reach, and The Crownlands. Losing only the North, The Vale, The Riverlands, and The Iron Islands) plus he has foreign aid. No lord could possibly raise up against him, right?

[caravaggio]

I'd also like to point out that if Aerys is only looking for someone of Valryian descent and not Targaryen descent he could have picked a Dayne. They are descended from Valyria, but not Targaryens, correct?

I agree with the above that after the Defiance at Duskendale (I made a similar timeline on the first page) Aerys might be looking for allies in the East. I think the reason he sends Steffon to find a Blackfyre wife is that 1. It meets his conditions for finding a wife for Rhaegar with Targaryen blood (Otherwise why not Cersei who was offered to him numerous times) 2. He gains the allegiance of The Golden Company, the exiled Nobles, any any Blackfyre supporters still in Westeros.

When the plan falls through due to Steffon's failure to find them, Aerys again passes up Cersei (at political cost), and arranges the marriage with Elia where he gets 1. A wife with Targaryen blood. 2. Some allies.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

I'd also like to point out that if Aerys is only looking for someone of Valryian descent and not Targaryen descent he could have picked a Dayne. They are descended from Valyria, but not Targaryens, correct?

Nope. The Daynes are a purely Westerosi family of First Men heritage, predating even the Long Night. Violet eyes don't make somebody Valyrian.

[caravaggio]

Nope. The Daynes are a purely Westerosi family of First Men heritage, predating even the Long Night. Violet eyes don't make somebody Valyrian.

Sorry, you are correct. I think I was remembering a theory on the Daynes someone else had.

Still, I think my other points stand.

[Lord Damian]

Aerys seems to have been trying to wipe out all potential rival claims to the throne. Blackfyres were not in Westeros like the Baratheons and Starks so, he did not get to them.. yet.

[caravaggio]

Aerys seems to have been trying to wipe out all potential rival claims to the throne. Blackfyres were not in Westeros like the Baratheons and Starks so, he did not get to them.. yet.

At the time he sends Steffon? I don't think so.

Why would he send someone he wants dead to find someone he wants dead? If Aerys is trying to eliminate others claims to the throne at the time he would want to kill the Baratheons (he trusts Steffon at the time), The Martells, and The Blackfyres. If he is trying to eliminate people with claims at the time he would have just married Rhaegar off to Cersei or some other noble.

[mcb]

Mostly speculation, but...

Aerys knows that someone from his line is supposed to be TPTWP. At the time he only has one heir, Rhaegar. He sends Steffon Baratheon to the Free Cities to find a wife for Rhaegar.

Who is Steffon looking for? Some random minx of Valyrian descent? That doesn't make much sense when there are better alternatives for your only child and heir to the throne.

Precisely. That's why he was supposed to find a minx with impressive enough Valyrian pedigree. Apparently whatever was presented on the market, was already of lowest quality than what could be find on domestic market, like Elia of Dorne, with blood of Aegon the Conqueror and Queen Nymeria in her veins.

I could buy that, but why then send Steffon (an important person in his own right) out searching? Just send out word to the Free Cities that you are looking for a wife of Valyrian descent for Rhaegar.

Because arranging a royal marriage is Serious Business, and you don't entrust that mission to some random schmuck. When Robb needs to broker a deal, he sends Lady Catelyn to speak with his voice. When forging a Lannister-Tyrell alliance, Queen Regent and Hand (interim, but still) were two obvious candidates for envoys, and only because they hated and mistrusted one another they agreed to send a lowly Master of Coin instead. Hell, Robert went himself with his whole court to Winterfell to ask Ned to be his Hand.

I imagine that to broker a marriage for the Crown Prince, a Lord Paramount was lowliest possible envoy. King's Hand or a Targaryen prince (although there were that many of those around) would be other acceptable choices, if the king didn't want to or couldn't go himself.

[caravaggio]

Precisely. That's why he was supposed to find a minx with impressive enough Valyrian pedigree. Apparently whatever was presented on the market, was already of lowest quality than what could be find on domestic market, like Elia of Dorne, with blood of Aegon the Conqueror and Queen Nymeria in her veins.

Because arranging a royal marriage is Serious Business, and you don't entrust that mission to some random schmuck. When Robb needs to broker a deal, he sends Lady Catelyn to speak with his voice. When forging a Lannister-Tyrell alliance, Queen Regent and Hand (interim, but still) were two obvious candidates for envoys, and only because they hated and mistrusted one another they agreed to send a lowly Master of Coin instead. Hell, Robert went himself with his whole court to Winterfell to ask Ned to be his Hand.

I imagine that to broker a marriage for the Crown Prince, a Lord Paramount was lowliest possible envoy. King's Hand or a Targaryen prince (although there were that many of those around) would be other acceptable choices, if the king didn't want to or couldn't go himself.

But a random Valyrian wouldn't equate to Aerys desire to have Rhaegar wed to someone with Targaryen blood.

[mcb]

But a random Valyrian wouldn't equate to Aerys desire to have Rhaegar wed to someone with Targaryen blood.

Yes, a random Valyrian wouldn't do at all, that was pretty much my point.

[PrimeRhaegar]

Aerys: Steffon, go find me any girl of Valryian descent in the Free Cities.

Steffon: Sure thing.

Steffon returns months later...

Steffon: Sorry buddy, no worthy Valryians.

Aerys: You didn't even bother to bring back a few you thought I might have considered? You had a whole ship to fit them in after all.

Steffon: Nah.

Aerys to Rossart: Get Steffon his Armor and warm up the wildfire.

and poor rhaella would be visited on that day so i guess dany would have been born earlier so rhaegar could just wait a few more years

[caravaggio]

Yes, a random Valyrian wouldn't do at all, that was pretty much my point.

Maybe it is your point, but it was my point first. :)

A random Valryian wouldn't do for Aerys, that's why Steffon is looking for a Blackfyre.

[caravaggio]

and poor rhaella would be visited on that day so i guess dany would have been born earlier so rhaegar could just wait a few more years

I don't want to derail my own thread, but... that would be a funny twist.

Aerys burns Steffon and Robert dies watching.

Stannis is engaged to Lyanna.

S+L=J

[Lost Melnibonean]

The Defiance of Duskendale happened in 276. Tywin Lannister proposed to wed Cersei to Rhaegar earlier that year. And Aerys II brought Varys to court after Duskendale. Aerys II sent Steffon Baratheon to the Free Cities shortly after Duskendale too. Steffon sank in 278.

So, was Varys already in service to Aerys before he sent Steffon to Essos & if so was it Varys' s idea?