Stark right doings and other heroistic victorys.

[Thomask]

I have previously made a list about Stark wrong doings. This is for the complete opposite. A Stark list of good things. Here is the list:

1) The Stark army attacking Jaime Lannisters army and preventing the siege of Riverrun. Therefore saving a lot of innocent peoples. That being the Tullys, their bannermen and their people because they are attacked for something they didn't do.

2) The release of Theon Greyjoy, because he has been a hostage for many years under the Starks.

3) Arya saving the people at Harrenhal by making Jaqen H'gar kil people that is hurting others. Noteably she helps Hot Pie and Gendry survive the Riverlands and escape Harrenhal.

4) Eddard Stark choosing to lie about Joffrey and claim himself as a traitor for supporting Roberts brother Stannis for the throne. He is trying to save a lot of lives and he dies for it. Making him somewhat of a martyr.

5) Catelyn Stark puts herself in a bad position and saves Brienne of Tarth from Renly's suporters.

6) Starks soldiers are battling Lannister men in the Riverlands under the command of Roose Bolton ordered by Robb Stark to battle Tywin Lannister. The reult of this is that they have reduced the Lannister bannermen's ravaging of the Riverlands.

7) Robb Starks decision to go back north and battle against the Greyjoys to save his people instead of continue his war against the Lannisters i the Riverlands.

I hopt you will add sugestions to add on this list, because I didn't bother to list a lot of them right now. Jon Snow actions will not be listed, because I think he stands with the Night's Watch and therefore his actions should be counted as a plus or minus to the Night's Watch and not the Starks.

The other list about Stark wrong doings and crimes got insired by a list of Lannister crimes and wrong doings.

[Ramsay the Bastard]

it's a well respected fact that the starks were complete morons

[Toxspecific]

it's a well respected fact that the starks were complete morons

For politics and stuff yeah, but they were streetsmart for Northern stuff.

[Theli]

1) The Stark army attacking Jaime Lannisters army and preventing the siege of Riverrun. Therefore saving a lot of innocent peoples. That being the Tullys, their bannermen and their people because they are attacked for something they didn't do.

Several Tully bannerman were involved in Tyrions kidnapping, so, they got it coming. .

2) The release of Theon Greyjoy, because he has been a hostage for many years under the Starks.

He was not released for any altruistic or heroic reasons.

3) Arya saving the people at Harrenhal by making Jaqen H'gar kil people that is hurting others. Noteably she helps Hot Pie and Gendry survive the Riverlands and escape Harrenhal.

He made Jaqen kill people because she was pissed at them, not because any heroic motive -common folk continued to be abused, Gendry and Hot Pie had already adapted to live in Harrenhal and it was probably as bad as being in the wall anyways (or better since it is less cold) but selfish Arya lied to them and put them at risk by going into the road again.

4) Eddard Stark choosing to lie about Joffrey and claim himself as a traitor for supporting Roberts brother Stannis for the throne. He is trying to save a lot of lives and he dies for it. Making him somewhat of a martyr.

He's either a traitor to Jeoff or a traitor to Stannis, so, that's a pretty dumb move and deserved execution.

5) Catelyn Stark puts herself in a bad position and saves Brienne of Tarth from Renly's suporters.

Of course not. Brienne wanted to stay and clear her name and Catelyn convinced to escape and made everyone to thought of her as a traitor and assasin!!!

6) Starks soldiers are battling Lannister men in the Riverlands under the command of Roose Bolton ordered by Robb Stark to battle Tywin Lannister. The reult of this is that they have reduced the Lannister bannermen's ravaging of the Riverlands.

With personal gain in mind, no heroicism involved at all!! (not to mention that Stark bannermen also ravaged the Riverlands)

7) Robb Starks decision to go back north and battle against the Greyjoys to save his people instead of continue his war against the Lannisters i the Riverlands.

This never happened, so it doesn't count it would be like saying that Drogo conquered Westeros because he decided to invade, too bad he died before doing that!!

:cheers:

[Usrnmhsnomning]

So, Theli is baiting, who wants to bite?

[nirolo]

For politics and stuff yeah, but they were streetsmart for Northern stuff.

So street smart that they left one of the Realm's most important institutions, the Watch, in complete ruin?

[Barty]

So street smart that they left one of the Realm's most important institutions, the Watch, in complete ruin?

The watch is not the Starks responsibility - it's maintenance belongs to the entire realm.

[Ramsay the Bastard]

The watch is not the Starks responsibility - it's maintenance belongs to the entire realm.

I'm pretty sure that's one the main responsibilities of being Warden of the North

[Barty]

I'll add a few:

Ned's decision to keep Jon, Brandon's "come out and die" were pretty awesome.

Robb's decision to lead the northern armies himself, to lead in the more dangerous battle, to declare independence, to behead Rickard Karstark are all heroic and honorable.

Jon's defense of the wall and his peace with the wildlings also deserve mentions.

[Barty]

I'm pretty sure that's one the main responsibilities of being Warden of the North

Nope - the entire realm is supposed to send men to the wall. The watch is there to protect the realms of men not to protect the north.

[nirolo]

The watch is not the Starks responsibility - it's maintenance belongs to the entire realm.

But the Starks are the closest to the Watch, and their men are the most adopted/suited for the environment.

[nirolo]

Nope - the entire realm is supposed to send men to the wall. The watch is there to protect the realms of men not to protect the north.

The Watch is in the North, is it not? And the Starks hold the title, Warden of the North, do they not?

[Joyful Union]

it's a well respected fact that the starks were complete morons

This pretty much. I find it hard to believe that they weren't put in their place by the Bolton's centuries ago (as in, cleaning out the stables at the Dreadfort). Maybe previous Stark generations weren't as stupid.

[Barty]

But the Starks are the closest to the Watch, and their men are the most adopted/suited for the environment.

So?? When the watch's strength goes low the Lord Commander sends the request for men to the King on the IT. See ser Allister and Yoren going all the way to KL to request more men or Jon writing to Cersei.

[Barty]

The Watch is in the North, is it not? And the Starks hold the title, Warden of the North, do they not?

The watch is on the gift - land that does not come under the North's jurisdiction. They take no taxes from that land since it belongs to the NW and they have no lords or people living there.

[nirolo]

So?? When the watch's strength goes low the Lord Commander sends the request for men to the King on the IT. See ser Allister and Yoren going all the way to KL to request more men or Jon writing to Cersei.

So?? Just because the NW is not precluded from requesting for help from the rest of the Realm does not mean the Watch is not under the jurisdiction of the Starks.

See Ned dispensing justice over a deserter of the NW in AGoT.

[Kernest]

The Watch is in the North, is it not? And the Starks hold the title, Warden of the North, do they not?

Actually the Wall, the Gift and the New Gift belong to the Night's Watch, making them an independent organization. Now if the Night's Watch received some monetary assistance from the North, or took orders from the Warden of the North, things would be different...

And as things stand, most of the Night's Watchmen are already northeners, so if anything it's the other kingdoms that failed the NW and forced the burden on the North.

[Kernest]

So?? Just because the NW is not precluded from requesting for help from the rest of the Realm does not mean the Watch is not under the jurisdiction of the Starks.

See Ned dispensing justice over a deserter of the NW in AGoT.

He "dispensed" justice in the name of Robert Baratheon, the king... That just means that both the North and the Night's Watch are under the Iron Throne's rule, but doesn't mean that the North is above the NW or somehow in charge of the NW.

Had the deserter made it out of the North, any other Warden would have been compelled to execute him if captured.

[Usrnmhsnomning]

See Ned dispensing justice over a deserter of the NW in AGoT.

That's cause he caught the guy in his lands and as the punishment is death, delivered the punishment himself. The NW is not under the jurisdiction of the North at all. This is like saying a Western lord isn't allowed to punish a man who murdered someone in the Vale. Of course he is.

[nirolo]

Actually the Wall, the Gift and the New Gift belong to the Night's Watch, making them an independent organization. Now if the Night's Watch received some monetary assistance from the North, or took orders from the Warden of the North, things would be different...

And as things stand, most of the Night's Watchmen are already northeners, so if anything it's the other kingdoms that failed the NW and forced the burden on the North.

Sure. But where and from whom did the NW get the Gift from?

He "dispensed" justice in the name of Robert Baratheon, the king... That just means that both the North and the Night's Watch are under the Iron Throne's rule, but doesn't mean that the North is above the NW or somehow in charge of the NW.

Had the deserter made it out of the North, any other Warden would have been compelled to execute him if captured.

Of course. The NW is an independent institution. Nonetheless, the Starks are the closest to the Wall, they are the most familiar with its institution, with the landscape, and assistance would flow most easily and naturally from the Starks.