Lady Arianne Martell Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 We know she was sent with Rosamund, who looked quite like her.What if she died of her ear wound, and they're sending Rosamund to Cersei?But then, why would they do that if Cersei would obviously recognize her child....Unless Doran actually had it be Rosamund who Darkstar hurt?I'm confused, anyone have any theories? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Balon Swann would recognize Myrcella would he not? He was with the party during the time of the riot so I'm sure he would. He would do something if anything was amiss. Or I may be wrong. Either way, I think Myrcella is still alive. Now Tommen on the other hand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 She could be dead, I guess. Far weirder things have happened. Do I think she's dead? No. The theory relies on Balon Swann, who lived at court for several months and was around Myrcella, to be a total idiot. It also relies on Doran Martell being willing to mutilate an innocent young child (Myrcella's double), and I don't think he'd do that either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Yes, I think it's likely (though not assured) that Myrcella actually died. There are some indicators for this. Among others, reread Doran's tale of the Water Gardens in ADWD. I think his tale hints at Rosamund, not Myrcella, being in the Water Gardens.Remember Doran telling the Sand Snakes that there would be an attack on the party bringing Myrcella back home? I'm pretty sure it's not really a KL ploy, but rather Doran planning to have 'Myrcella' (i.e. Rosamund) killed once she's out of his jurisdiction so her death can't be blamed on him.I really think we'll only know once Myrcella tries to play cyvasse and fails to do so with any success; remember that Myrcella was a great cyvasse player for her age, while Rosamund was totally uninterested in the game? I think this is going to come up again.Also, it's convenient for Doran that Balon didn't become a King's Guard until after Myrcella had been shipped off to Dorne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noelle Snow Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 I think it's quite likely she's dead already. Or at least dying. Perhaps Doran figures that sending Balon off to find Darkstar will get him killed. And even if that doesn't work, sending Rosamund back to Cersei may not make a difference because by the time that decision happens, Cersei has fallen and been arrested. Plus all that delay would give Quentyn more time to return.Something is definitely going on with all that. It is not as it appears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Arianne Martell Posted July 29, 2012 Author Share Posted July 29, 2012 Balon Swann would recognize Myrcella would he not? He was with the party during the time of the riot so I'm sure he would. He would do something if anything was amiss. Or I may be wrong. Either way, I think Myrcella is still alive. Now Tommen on the other hand...Wasn't she covered up with bandages and the like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Wasn't she covered up with bandages and the like?She was. Balon also wasn't a King's Guard at the time, so it's unclear how often he had seen her before that - it's hard to remember a face you have seen only once or twice, and even harder if it's a child's face that has grown one year older and disfigured by a huge scar and bandaged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Arianne Martell Posted July 29, 2012 Author Share Posted July 29, 2012 She could be dead, I guess. Far weirder things have happened. Do I think she's dead? No. The theory relies on Balon Swann, who lived at court for several months and was around Myrcella, to be a total idiot. It also relies on Doran Martell being willing to mutilate an innocent young child (Myrcella's double), and I don't think he'd do that either.Yeah....that's the part I struggle with. Doran won't hurt a child...but what's the suspicious way that Myrcella was super subservient to Arianne? Seems off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Yeah....that's the part I struggle with. Doran won't hurt a child...but what's the suspicious way that Myrcella was super subservient to Arianne? Seems off.I don't think it's that big of a deal. She's a young girl away from home and Arianne is kind of a mother/big sister figure to her. If she gets a sense of security from Arianne, she'll do what she asks her to.ETA: Like I said, it's definitely possible. But it relies on a few logical/moral gaps that, as of yet, I haven't seen satisfactory explanations for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Yeah....that's the part I struggle with. Doran won't hurt a child...but what's the suspicious way that Myrcella was super subservient to Arianne? Seems off.Are you sure Doran wouldn't hurt a child? This isn't anyone's child, it's Tywin Lannister's granddaughter - and I think Doran wants the lives of at least three Lannisters (ideally Cersei, Tommen and Myrcella) as recompense for Elia and her children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Arianne Martell Posted July 29, 2012 Author Share Posted July 29, 2012 I don't think it's that big of a deal. She's a young girl away from home and Arianne is kind of a mother/big sister figure to her. If she gets a sense of security from Arianne, she'll do what she asks her to.I suppose, I just feel the way that scene was written seemed rather strange...and I feel like Rosamund is there for a purpose...I don't actually know, but I just feel like something is off with the whole Darkstar-Doran-Myrcella thing. Methinks it would be wonderful to have a Balon or Obara prologue in order to figure out who the hell Darkstar really is and what his intentions are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 Are you sure Doran wouldn't hurt a child? This isn't anyone's child, it's Tywin Lannister's granddaughter - and I think Doran wants the lives of at least three Lannisters (ideally Cersei, Tommen and Myrcella) as recompense for Elia and her children.But it's not Myrcella whom Doran would be hurting if they switched the girls. It'd be Rosamund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Arianne Martell Posted July 29, 2012 Author Share Posted July 29, 2012 Are you sure Doran wouldn't hurt a child? This isn't anyone's child, it's Tywin Lannister's granddaughter - and I think Doran wants the lives of at least three Lannisters (ideally Cersei, Tommen and Myrcella) as recompense for Elia and her children.But Doran agreed with Ellaria, when she made her wonderful speech on how it is just a continuous vicious circle.I think Doran has indicated he wants no part of child killing, as it would be stooping to the level of his enemies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor227 Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 If that's the case though, why did Doran need Arianne to speak with Myrcella? That was, at least according to their conversation, the main reason why he brought her down from her tower-cell. Anyone else could have put the double under their thumb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 But it's not Myrcella whom Doran would be hurting if they switched the girls. It'd be Rosamund.But he would already have killed Myrcella, and admitting that would stop his other plans.It might also be that he'd kidnap 'Myrcella' rather than kill her; he could still blame Tyrion after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 But he would already have killed Myrcella, and admitting that would stop his other plans.It might also be that he'd kidnap 'Myrcella' rather than kill her; he could still blame Tyrion after all.So you think that Doran planned for Darkstar to do what he did to Myrcella? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The guy from the Vale Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 So you think that Doran planned for Darkstar to do what he did to Myrcella?I'm not sure, actually.But either way, whether it was planned or not, he can't have Cersei know that Myrcella is dead (if she is; again, I'm not sure about this, but I can see how she would be) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 So you think that Doran planned for Darkstar to do what he did to Myrcella?Well the theory has been tossed around that Darkstar is just an agent that was hired by Doran, but I'm not sure to what extent I believe that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Arianne Martell Posted July 29, 2012 Author Share Posted July 29, 2012 I truly doubt Doran would kill a child. His whole point, his whole existence, his whole moral beliefs are against that. He specifically wants revenge, but not against the children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopeForSpring Posted July 29, 2012 Share Posted July 29, 2012 From ADWD Chapter 38“He will if he hears it from Myrcella,” Arianne insisted.Obara snorted in disbelief. “She may lie today and lie tomorrow, but soon or late she’ll tell the truth. If Ser Balon is allowed to carry tales back to King’s Landing, drums will sound and blood will flow. He should not be allowed to leave.”This makes me think that she is alive, or at least Obara thinks she is alive at this point.I'm still having a hard time believing the Balon Swann would go along with something quite so awful as Doran thinks is being plotted (who told him? Varys?), but he did stay in King's Landing even though his brother was a Renly then a Stannis man.Wouldn't be surprised if something happens to Myrcella on the way home, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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