Would Darkstar be more compelling with a less-ridiculous name?

[Independent George]

Like many, I can't take Dim Bulb seriously on account of his pretentious nickname and stock catchphrase. Both the name and the "I am of the night" just screams 'Rob Liefeld' to me. Give him some pouches, and it is complete.

If he were simply Ser Gerold, though, could his character work as some brash kid trying to escape the shadow of Arthur Dayne? How much of our reaction is colored by his name?

[Toccs]

I think his stupid self appointed nickname helps to sell the brash kid trying to escape the shadow of Arthur "Star of the Morning" Dayne angle better then anything else.

[Blisscraft]

Perhaps he should begin ro refer to himself as "The Phonz."

[lojzelote]

I think that Ser Gerold, referring to himself by a nickname he gave himself himself, just shows the clear essence of his utter moronity and boastfulness.

This way it makes for a better laugh. :D

[Free Northman]

Look, something has puzzled me for a long time.

I don't get this immense dislike so many readers seem to have for the Darkstar.

What about the guy is so despicable?

To me he is a mysterious, cool, dangerous looking semi-villain with a hard edge. We don't know what motivates him, and I don't get how people can like Jaime or Bronn or the Hound, but are immediately put off by the Darkstar.

Besides, he has like one chapter worth of screentime, so why this immense antipathy towards him?

I just don't get it.

Personally, I think he is a very interesting character - kind of like a second Oberyn, and him wanting to unleash a war against the Lannisters by trying to kill Myrcella actually makes him an ALLY to the Starks in my view, so I basically like the guy.

So whats up with the anti-Darkstar sentiment people? Can someone explain it to me from the ground up, please.

[Raksha the Demon]

Why is Darkstar so despicable? I dunno, something about trying to murder a little girl who he was supposed to guard and leaving her maimed and bleeding?

That takes major courage and charisma, alright. Darkstar has a lot in common with a certain other fellow who was also supposedly brave and appealing - Jaime Lannister, who tried to murder a child while he was a guest in the kids' parents' home. Both very intriguing gentlemen, perhaps, but forgive me if I am underwhelmed by their attacks on children. (I'm not a big Theon fan either, who also murdered innocent adults)

[Independent George]

To me he is a mysterious, cool, dangerous looking semi-villain with a hard edge. We don't know what motivates him, and I don't get how people can like Jaime or Bronn or the Hound, but are immediately put off by the Darkstar.

It's because he is deliberately staged as a mysterious, cool, dangerous looking semi-villain with a hard edge. Click through to the Rob Leifeld link I posted earlier - scan down the list and see how many things you can check off with regard to Darkstar.

Instead of building up those characteristics organically, as was the case with the Hound, we were expected to just swallow all of that up whole. He's a clumsy archetype, and beneath what we've come to expect from the series.

[ThePrinceOfSunspear]

Until I read this thread I had no idea that the vast majority of readers hated the guy.

I actually was intrigued by him. And I totally dig the nickname he gave himself. So badass in my opinion. And it totally fits his need to differentiate himself from the other famous Dayne.....

Who cares about Myrcella anyways? Shes just a means to an end....I feel bad for her but at the same time she's never been a major player and her only role is make Cersei suffer for her crimes.

[QuaitheTheShadow]

He would be less compelling if he called himself Gerold.

[Milcov]

Look, something has puzzled me for a long time. I don't get this immense dislike so many readers seem to have for the Darkstar. What about the guy is so despicable? To me he is a mysterious, cool, dangerous looking semi-villain with a hard edge. We don't know what motivates him, and I don't get how people can like Jaime or Bronn or the Hound, but are immediately put off by the Darkstar. Besides, he has like one chapter worth of screentime, so why this immense antipathy towards him? I just don't get it. Personally, I think he is a very interesting character - kind of like a second Oberyn, and him wanting to unleash a war against the Lannisters by trying to kill Myrcella actually makes him an ALLY to the Starks in my view, so I basically like the guy. So whats up with the anti-Darkstar sentiment people? Can someone explain it to me from the ground up, please.

It's because he should be a second Oberyn based on his nickname and being "the most dangerous man in Dorne", but really he's a total loser. He's a crap Oberyn basically and that's the problem.

[Great Dayne]

I think his stupid self appointed nickname helps to sell the brash kid trying to escape the shadow of Arthur "Star of the Morning" Dayne angle better then anything else.

[/quote

Where in this series does it say that he gave himself that nickname???!!! Granted he does say "because I am of the night" but it never states that he made uop the name himself. Maybe he was given that name as a joke because he was angry and resentful of his cousin, the Sword of the Morning Ser Arthur Dayne and he chose to own this name instead of despise it. It may be a little cheesy, but what nickname in this series wouldn't be considered cheesy? The Mountain that Rides, the Hound, Barristan the Bold, Sand Snakes etc....

It is a fantasy world with dragons based on a different time period, get over it.

I like Darkstar, even Oberyn Martell's own brother calls him the most dangerous man in Dorne. (I believe they are working together but that is for another thread).

I hope to see more of him.

[Raksha the Demon]

Until I read this thread I had no idea that the vast majority of readers hated the guy. I actually was intrigued by him. And I totally dig the nickname he gave himself. So badass in my opinion. And it totally fits his need to differentiate himself from the other famous Dayne..... Who cares about Myrcella anyways? Shes just a means to an end....I feel bad for her but at the same time she's never been a major player and her only role is make Cersei suffer for her crimes.

So it's okay to try to murder little girls, as long as they're minor players in a scheme or family. Does that mean it was uncool for Gregor Clegane to slam a baby's head against a wall, since the child was the son of the King's heir (and thus a future major player), but cool for Amory Lorch to stab that baby's toddler sister 50 times or whatever? And I suppose deliberately torturing/murdering smallfolk, men, women, children, whoever, is also acceptable, because they're not major players. Let's give the Tickler a bonus, he's badass too!

Oberyn Martell, the ultimate Dornish badass, was so incensed at the murder of those two children and their mother, his beloved sister (who was not a major player either), that he gave up his life to avenge them. Even people who are not major players do not deserve to be slaughtered just because they are in someone's way.

The end does not always, should not always, justify, the means. Dorne had not declared itself at war with the Lannisters, they were not bombing King's Landing; an action of war where some innocent civilians would almost inevitably die. This was a sudden, sneak attack by a warrior on a child whose ally, escort, guard and protector he was supposed to be. Dayne's act was the deed of a coward and traitor; he had sworn an alliance with Arianne, who was trying to keep Myrcella alive and crown her queen (which was an act of rebellion against her father, but she at least was not trying to murder Myrcella - what Arianne thought would happen to the equally innocent Tommen, if she had succeeded, is another discussion).

I'd like Gerold Dayne much better if he went around calling himself Child-Maimer. Then at least he'd be honest.

[ThePrinceOfSunspear]

You're taking it way too far but feel free to go where ever you want to go.

I didn't say he was badass because of what he did to Myrcella. I'm simply saying that to me while it was tragic it doesn't make him the most God awful person on the planet.

More to the point I liked him because of the few lines of dialogue that Martin gave him and Arianne's fascination with him.

Everyone knows that The Mountain is/was a monster and what he did to Elia and her kids was an abomination. To equate that with what Darkstar did is just ridiculous.

I'm just wondering if the majority of readers actually don't like him or if its just a vocal minority.

[eyeheartsansa]

He seems a bit comic bookish at this point, honestly.. we all know GRRM loves his comics so it makes sense. A bit of an oddity perhaps.. and a plot device to make some shit go down in Dorne..

I like to imagine his name is a nod to the Grateful Dead, but that could just be me.

[Ser Adam Dayne]

Free Northman, I totally "dig" the Liefeld vibe. Maybe it's really Shatterstar? Anyway, I like him right off the bat because he's a Dayne, even if he's from High Hermitage. Also, Doran names him the most dangerous man in Dorne, and all that guy ever does is think, so that says something. I just think that the "I am of the night" is who this guy is. He buys into himself, his whole persona. He's trying to make a mark. Unfortunately, he tried (and failed) to kill a little girl so that takes him down a notch, but clearly he is NOT Ser Arthur. We don't really know much about him, and you would think that GRRM would have plans to bring him back. At first I wasn't really clear about his age and my first theory about him was that he was the son of Ashara and Ned. It would be ironic to say the least if Ned, Mr Honor himself, sired a true bastard in every sense of the word.

[Red Wedding Singer]

Wow, I never realized Darkstar was so disliked. With the amount of hateable characters in the book, and the limited exposure he has had thus far; it is pretty surprising anyone would have such strong feelings about him one way or the other. Personally I would like to see a little more of him, as he is somewhat of an enigma at the moment.

[Thendel]

OT: Yes, I believe I'd dislike him less if he didn't go around calling himself Darkstar. I begrudge him that nickname because he hasn't done anything to earn it. When people wear titles without having done anything to earn them, that's either a sign of arrogance, presumptiveness or lack of self esteem, or all three, and there's nothing admirable about that. And when you come from a family with a reputation for stellar fighters, more's the need for you to prove your worth. To date, all Gerod is known for is trying to lop off the head of an innocent child, and failing at even that. He's like the Daario of Westeros, only more useless.

[Queen of Spades]

I heatedly disagree with anyone comparing Darkstar to Daario !

Daario is a poser, but does not try to present himself as some dark haunted character. When he comes to Dany, he basically says : I killed a hundreds of women and fucked thousands of men (or is it the other way round ?). Well so far he does exactly that : kill and fuck. In short, he is true to his word.

Darkstar on the other hand :

• badass hair :cool4:
  
• badass name :cool4:
  
• badass catchphrase (doesn't mean anything really, but it kind of goes well with the badass name...)
  
• badass reputation ("most dangerous man in Dorne", seriously ? Not that we know how he got that reputation, though... )
  
• badass action : tries to kill a nice little girl to start a war... and fails even that. :dunno:
  

Seems like a lot of posing as badass, and not a lot of true badassery !

[Ser Tom Tarly]

When Darkstar first appeared I must admit I got abit excited, he is the cousin of Ser Arthur Dayne so I thought they may share some family traits. That just wasnt to be, Doran does describe him as the most dangerous man in Dorne but that doesnt mean the most dangerous in battle. I think he meant that Darkstar was unpredictably dangerous, what he done to Mycrella was completely unexpected and could have started a shit load of trouble.

Before he done that I took a shine to him but now Im not so sure, lets see what he does when he turns up.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I wouldn't call him despicable (apart from, you know, attempting to murder a little girl and failing), but he just seems cartoonish, up his own ass, a legend in his own mind, etc. I can't take him seriously.