"The Winged Wolf" A Bran Stark Re-read Project - Part 1: AGOT

[imp-ty]

Yea!

[imp-ty]

There is some truth to the adage "you're never given more than you can handle". I was literally hit by a truck and have had my world ripped apart.

[imp-ty]

After a significant trauma, you have to do a triage of sorts. Figure out the immediate and high priority stuff and postpone everything else because there is kbly so much energy/time/resources at a time. The crow even points this out during the dream. We think remembering is important because we have the other POVS and can see the future (reread). Bran needs to wake up, that's his priority. If he is crippled mentally/emotionally by being overwhelmed and bombarded with everything, he will accomplish nothing. He has to do it in manageable chunks. However, it is all still in there and the trigger events making him upset reminds him that there is still more work to be done. The memory of pain is protective because we learn to modify our behavior. We can't become crippled by it and still survive.

[DarkSister1001]

Excellent point. Manderly even jests that Bran isn't late, it's just that lords are early, despite the fact that Bran HAS kept everyone waiting.

Speaking of currying favor, there is something that doesn't come up that in retrospect is odd. Even though it would be a sensitive subject for the Starks at present, should they win the war, Sansa will be coming home and she' no longer the eldest daughter of the high lord of the North--but Princess Sansa Stark. Everyone is focusing on Lady Hornwood's lands and marriage hand, but no one mentions Sansa (or even Arya). Either they think it's indelicate (but come on...these northmen joke about "curing" what ails Lady Hornwood with "what is beneath my furs") or they are respectful enough to not broach the subject as a sensitive time.

Oh good catch.

Welcome to the re-read! I'm sure none of us would mind you speaking about something if you were comfortable enough to do so. It's an important part of Bran's arc and something that bears greater discussion.

Excellent point about Sansa. And lol, yeah it wasn't about being couth, that's for sure. (I think) I mentioned it early on that it was odd that up until King Robert et al came to WF and agrees to a Sansa and Joff betrothal there isn't any mention of what Ned & Cat had in mind for their children. It could be that they were both soured on betrothals considering how their marriage came to be (not that it was bad, it just ended up being very different than they expected...which happens to be the case of ALL the Stark betrothals in the series) or maybe they wanted their children to remain at home with them as long as possible. With so much emphasis in the story about attaching houses via marriage it seems very strange to not even have a thought on the subject until Sansa/Joff and then the Freys.

I just discovered this thread yesterday and have inhaled it. Very impressive people. As someone who actually has PTSD, Bran's behavior and responses make perfect sense. I'm happy to elaborate, but don't want to start a tangent without permission.

I agree with what BQ said. We're open, as long as you're comfortable. Welcome! :cheers:

[imp-ty]

Bran has also lost his mobility,as well as his fledgling identity and independence. These are all part of progression through childhood to adult (someone else already discussed his regression nicely). It is frustrating as hell and anything you can do to get it back, even if it is painful or uncomfortable is better than feeling helpless and angry and trapped. Most of us avoid pain at all costs. Bran is forced to make calculated choices between rotten options. The men at dinner called him craven for not taking his own life. They could only do this because he was willing to get out of his comfortable bed (physical) to be mocked (emotional). Our society has a complicated relationship with suicide vs assisted suicide vs heroic end of life care. GRRM plants a lot of this in the stories without being blunt.

[imp-ty]

Because this is a magical world, we attribute his desire to leave the gates of Winterfell to BR or Summer, or his impending destiny. In our world, he is cooped up and agry, and wants out of the house. Cabin fever anyone. :)

[imp-ty]

DS, I think the lack of attention to Stark marriages is twofold. First, the children are really young and still seen as children (Cat's POVs show this often)... Secondly, marriages are made for political alliance. The kingdom has been peaceful and Ned was perfectly happy being left alone as Warden of the North. Unlike many of the Stark kings, he's not ambitious and is content to manage his role as Lord of Winterfell since he didn't even want that. It was supposed to be Brandon's. This aspect is pointed out in many second sons of major families. Until recently, his family did not need to use his kids as currency. His marriage to Cat was necessary at the time. Nothing had made a Stark marriage into a priority until he was entangled to southern politics.

[DarkSister1001]

After a significant trauma, you have to do a triage of sorts. Figure out the immediate and high priority stuff and postpone everything else because there is kbly so much energy/time/resources at a time. The crow even points this out during the dream. We think remembering is important because we have the other POVS and can see the future (reread). Bran needs to wake up, that's his priority. If he is crippled mentally/emotionally by being overwhelmed and bombarded with everything, he will accomplish nothing. He has to do it in manageable chunks. However, it is all still in there and the trigger events making him upset reminds him that there is still more work to be done. The memory of pain is protective because we learn to modify our behavior. We can't become crippled by it and still survive.

Bran has also lost his mobility,as well as his fledgling identity and independence. These are all part of progression through childhood to adult (someone else already discussed his regression nicely). It is frustrating as hell and anything you can do to get it back, even if it is painful or uncomfortable is better than feeling helpless and angry and trapped. Most of us avoid pain at all costs. Bran is forced to make calculated choices between rotten options. The men at dinner called him craven for not taking his own life. They could only do this because he was willing to get out of his comfortable bed (physical) to be mocked (emotional). Our society has a complicated relationship with suicide vs assisted suicide vs heroic end of life care. GRRM plants a lot of this in the stories without being blunt.

Because this is a magical world, we attribute his desire to leave the gates of Winterfell to BR or Summer, or his impending destiny. In our world, he is cooped up and agry, and wants out of the house. Cabin fever anyone. :)

Excellent points. His lack of mobility is particularly difficult on Bran considering how very active he was prior to his injury. Not just running, playing, sword fighting but he was an insane climber. One could almost equate him with an extreme sports participant/adrenaline junkie and now he's confined and like you said, getting cabin fever. There isn't much he can do in WF that gives him that feeling of exhilaration. He almost had it riding Dancer, but the wildling attack put an abrupt end to that.

[imp-ty]

Exactly! He even mentioned how uncomfortable the saddle was, but he didn't say anything because he didn't want to look weak and because the benefits of the activity trumped the side effects.

Willingness to use tools, tactics, workarounds, and endure pain to regain the most important pieces/feelings of his prior identity balanced with acceptance of reality is a major theme both in their world and ours.

[DarkSister1001]

DS, I think the lack of attention to Stark marriages is twofold. First, the children are really young and still seen as children (Cat's POVs show this often)... Secondly, marriages are made for political alliance. The kingdom has been peaceful and Ned was perfectly happy being left alone as Warden of the North. Unlike other Stark kings, he's not ambitious and is content to manage his role. This aspect is pointed out in many second sons of major families. Until recently, his family did not need to use his kids as currency. His marriage to Cat was necessary at the time. Nothing had made a Stark marriage into a priority until he was entangled to southern politics.

When Cat & Ned discuss Sansa/Joff, Cat says she's too young but then seems ok with just letting them be betrothed for a few years. Robb is 14-15 and it seems like most of the boys his age already have their futures lined out. Cat promises Arya to the Frey's without voicing (for us to know) doubt about her age so I don't think it's that they're too young. Perhaps it's like I mentioned and you reiterated, maybe since all is well they wanted to keep their kids as kids and at home. OR maybe it was just too much for GRRM have to untangle that web before they could be used as bargaining chips with the Frey's. OR maybe when your BFF is the king you wait for him to make the first move, keeping you options open to His Grace?

[DarkSister1001]

Exactly! He even mentioned how uncomfortable the saddle was, but he didn't say anything because he didn't want to look weak and because the benefits of the activity trumped the side effects.

Willingness to use tools, tactics, workarounds, and endure pain to regain the most important pieces/feelings of his prior identity balanced with acceptance of reality is a major theme both in their world and ours.

Quick parallel between Dany & Bran. He rides Dancer and feels like he's flying, as does Dany when Khal gives Dany her silver. Both characters lack freedom until they are given the wind via their horses.

[imp-ty]

I think all of those are perfectly reasonable. :)

[imp-ty]

Remember the feeling of getting your license and taking the car out alone for the first time? I imagine it's pretty similar... Great parallel btw!

[imp-ty]

There have been a number of times when how we unpack the details and significance of events has been dominated by the fact that this is a magical world. While GRRM is so very deliberate in his imagery and word choice, I wonder how often we might get led astray by things meant to be literal or less significant. For example, the discussion of how a Stark could tell the wolves apart while they were howling, but Cat could not. The ability was attributed to having wolf's blood (the mystical connection). However a non magical world explanation is that canine voices differ if you know how to listen. I can tell my dogs apart by voice because I'm home with them all day. My husband can't. The Stark children spend significantly more time with the wolves than Cat and would notice details more readily.

I think the mystical explanation is likely what GRRM was going for, but it's just something to keep in mind. Sometimes it is ok to keep it simple.

It is possible GRRM was hinting at this during the convo between Arya and Syrio about how he became first sword. Paraphrasing:People saw a fantastic beast because that is what they expected to see, but sometimes a cat is just a cat...

Ok, point made... will stick to Bran stuff now. :)

[BearQueen87]

Excellent points. His lack of mobility is particularly difficult on Bran considering how very active he was prior to his injury. Not just running, playing, sword fighting but he was an insane climber. One could almost equate him with an extreme sports participant/adrenaline junkie and now he's confined and like you said, getting cabin fever. There isn't much he can do in WF that gives him that feeling of exhilaration. He almost had it riding Dancer, but the wildling attack put an abrupt end to that.

Exactly! He even mentioned how uncomfortable the saddle was, but he didn't say anything because he didn't want to look weak and because the benefits of the activity trumped the side effects.

Willingness to use tools, tactics, workarounds, and endure pain to regain the most important pieces/feelings of his prior identity balanced with acceptance of reality is a major theme both in their world and ours.

Excellent points, both of you. In this current chapter and in ones past, when Bran laments the loss of his legs it always comes down to how active he could be if he had them back. When he thinks about how much he wanted to be a knight, he thinks about tourneys and jousting and sword fighting and riding. It's just being a knight, it's doing knightly things. Bran was a "doer." People tell him to stay on the ground and he climbs. Now he can't do anything--in our current chapter there is even a bit of narrative in which Bran has to have Hodor dress him, even though Bran wants to be able to do it all on his own.

[Hrafntýr]

There have been a number of times when how we unpack the details and significance of events has been dominated by the fact that this is a magical world. While GRRM is so very deliberate in his imagery and word choice, I wonder how often we might get led astray by things meant to be literal or less significant. For example, the discussion of how a Stark could tell the wolves apart while they were howling, but Cat could not. The ability was attributed to having wolf's blood (the mystical connection). However a non magical world explanation is that canine voices differ if you know how to listen. I can tell my dogs apart by voice because I'm home with them all day. My husband can't. The Stark children spend significantly more time with the wolves than Cat and would notice details more readily.

I think the mystical explanation is likely what GRRM was going for, but it's just something to keep in mind. Sometimes it is ok to keep it simple.

It is possible GRRM was hinting at this during the convo between Arya and Syrio about how he became first sword. Paraphrasing:People saw a fantastic beast because that is what they expected to see, but sometimes a cat is just a cat...

Ok, point made... will stick to Bran stuff now. :)

It's funny that you should mention this little parable, because I was just thinking about it with respect to the rather gruesome imagery of the 3EC pecking out Bran's eyes and then boring into bone and brain in order to open his third eye, which then enables him to see. I definitely agree that learning to see clearly what's really there right in front of you can enable you to see things that no one else can see, and even that GRRM might be signalling that sometimes the "mystery" is hidden in plain sight, that we might miss it for trying to see something else (e.g. what we want to see, or what we think someone wants us to see). But I think that Bran's dreams (let alone his subsequent story) make it pretty clear that there are some kinds of seeing that can't be done with your eyes alone. Not sure that we're given any key for distinguishing between the two cases, though--when is a cat just a cat, and when is a cat being skinchanged?!

ETA: Oh, and I meant to say how much I liked BearQueen's comparison of Freys and Manderlys. I wanted to add that there's the interesting bit with Wylla's garish green hair, which calls to mind the connection of her house with Garth Greenhand/Greenhair, who calls to mind the Green Men.

[Illuminated by Fire]

Great analysis, MoIaF!

ANALYSIS

A Crippled Body but A Nimble Mind

There is irony and then there is irony:

“Why must he waste his days listening to old men speak of things he only half understood? Because you’re broken, a voice inside reminded him. A lord on his cushioned chair might be crippled— the Walders said their grandfather was so feeble he had to be carried everywhere in a litter— but not a knight on his destrier.”

“Lord Wyman Manderly had arrived from White Harbor two days past, traveling by barge and litter, as he was too fat to sit a horse.”

In the first quote Bran laments that he has to perform the lordly duties now befitting of his position as a Prince. He wants to be a knight, he want to be a man of actions, what can he possibly do as a crippled? Of course the irony lies in that the man (Lord Frey) he mentions along with himself in that thought, might be also someone unable to move but he has quite the cunning mind and he did not need to move in order to help orchestrate the downfall of the Northern forces. The other irony is that the man that Bran is about to speak to is another immobile Lord who is quite cunning in his own right as well, he also does not need to move around to be able to orchestrate his plans.

With Bran we have the physical vs. the mental. As a child the physical is so important to him, he of course was an exceptionally physically active child so it’s that much harder for him to accept his physical limitations. However, as his story progresses we see that being physical unable to move does not take away your ability to think, to learn, to use your other gifts. It’s equivalent to developing your other senses when you’ve lost one. At the end of the chapter, the three-eyed crow shows Bran that he does not need his physical abilities, what he needs is his mental abilities:

“Fly or die!” cried the three-eyed crow as it pecked at him. He wept and pleaded but the crow had no pity. It put out his left eye and then his right, and when he was blind in the dark it pecked at his brow, driving its terrible sharp beak deep into his skull. He screamed until he was certain his lungs must burst. The pain was an axe splitting his head apart, but when the crow wrenched out its beak all slimy with bits of bone and brain, Bran could see again.”

Here we see how the three-eyed crow physically destroys Bran eyes, in order to help open his third eye, and when Bran finally is able to open that third eye, he is able to see again. And what he sees is the clearest image he has seen yet of what happen the day he fell from the tower. It’s the lesson of observation, to see beyond what is in front of you, and that’s been a recurring themes in Bran’s chapter, to see beyond seeing, to question and see things from different angles.

Very good observation. He wants to be Bran the knight, not Bran the lord. It is true that you can wield great influence even with a physical disablity, but that is not the kind of action Bran looks for. He is not interested in power, but in heroic deeds, as already pointed out. There is a reason why warriors have many more songs than politicians do, even the Rains of Castamere deals with Tywin eradicating house Reyne, not with the politics involved with that. That is always a muddy business. But as we see with Barristan, that is also true for battles. It stands to reason that Bran would be very disappointed with the actual realities of being a knight. And there comes the three-eyed crow into play, wanting to lead Bran to realize his magical abilties. But I must say he does a remarkably poor job with this. Does he have no idea what kind of reaction such a dream causes? Even if the physical pain and mutilation cannot be avoided, he could at least properly talk to him. He begins to remember, but he is also scared. And in the meanwhile we have this line:

"As you will, my prince," said Ser Rodrik. "You did well." Bran flushed with pleasure. Being a lord was not as tedious as he had feared, [...]

Bran at least partially begins to accept the notion of being a lord, even if he still does not particularly like it. Even though the crow and the weirwood appear in his dreams over and over again, he turns more into the direction of the lord than that of the greenseer. He is also accepting his responsibilites as already pointed out. He knows what Robb and Eddard would tell him, and he does not disagree.

Want to note here that Jaime is cast as a golden man--going back to the Icarus story from Bran II in AGOT.

It is really more of a reverse Icarus story. He falls and needs wings. He dies if he hits the ground. Icarus flew to high and paid the price. Bran stumbled upon something and paid the price, but that is nothing he could have forseen. Now he needs to grow new wings before he hits the ground. It is a race against time.

Bran has also lost his mobility,as well as his fledgling identity and independence. These are all part of progression through childhood to adult (someone else already discussed his regression nicely). It is frustrating as hell and anything you can do to get it back, even if it is painful or uncomfortable is better than feeling helpless and angry and trapped. Most of us avoid pain at all costs. Bran is forced to make calculated choices between rotten options. The men at dinner called him craven for not taking his own life. They could only do this because he was willing to get out of his comfortable bed (physical) to be mocked (emotional). Our society has a complicated relationship with suicide vs assisted suicide vs heroic end of life care. GRRM plants a lot of this in the stories without being blunt.

I agree with the first notion if it means the societal notions that people see as adulthood. I disagree if it relates to him actually stopping to become an adult. Adulthood is how you deal with the issues you have and how you use the means available to you, something that is all to often forgotten when people actually deal with disabled people in real life. He still matures, he just needs to take a different path, which you nicely pointed out with the 'choice between rotten options'. Dealing with these choices is what actually makes him mature. This is unrelated to the presence of the societal pressure and shame he faces due to being disabled, which admittedly is very harsh. But it also shows the Bran's thought process. He has phases of wishful thinking and denial, and then he has phases of acceptance and action. Which is very close to reality and not something limited to children I might add. People speak of adulthood if it were something you just reach. But maturity fits it more than adulthood, and that is something to be earned and preserved and not quite variable depending on the situation.

Excellent points. His lack of mobility is particularly difficult on Bran considering how very active he was prior to his injury. Not just running, playing, sword fighting but he was an insane climber. One could almost equate him with an extreme sports participant/adrenaline junkie and now he's confined and like you said, getting cabin fever. There isn't much he can do in WF that gives him that feeling of exhilaration. He almost had it riding Dancer, but the wildling attack put an abrupt end to that.

This is a very good point, since climbing was not just something he liked, but something which defined him to an extent. And dealing with that is one of the big challenges he faces.

As a last point I found the line I was alluding to some time before, as I said that Luwin is very understanding, but makes a clear hierarchical distinction that Bran is still a child, not an adult and has certain limits that come with it:

"Will we talk of the war?"

"You will talk of naught." The sharpness was back in Luwin's voice. "You are still a child of eight...
"Almost nine!"

"Eight," the maester repeated firmly. "Speak nothing but courtesies unless Ser Rodrik or Lord Wyman puts you a question."

Just a thing to remember, especially when the Reeds come into play in the next chapters. It contrasts very well with a line two chapters later, which is actually really important, so be assured that I will point it out should the analysis miss it.

[imp-ty]

I should have been more clear. I think Bran is incredibly mature and his disability has caused a perceived regression. The independence to go where we want is based more on maturity than the physical ability to walk (the increased coordination that comes with growing children). Most milestones and associated responsibilities/privileges are granted based on maturity and the assumption that you have gained a certain amount of maturity by the time you hit legal age/adulthood. It is usually a progressive series of steps that children are able to engage in more and more activities as they gain the physical coordination and emotional maturity to handle them. He was suddenly robbed of many (fun) privileges of his maturity by physical limitations. Knowing what he wants to do and used to be able to do is all the more frustrating now that he can't. His physical limitations require being carried, dressed, washed like a baby. He did the work of growing up to move past those stages, but now gets no "credit". Needing help to do simple things and lashing out at the people who have to help you is really awful. It is humiliating (the prejudice that if you can't do age appropriate things, you must also have mental deficits) and frustrating beyond belief. Trust me.

[BearQueen87]

It's funny that you should mention this little parable, because I was just thinking about it with respect to the rather gruesome imagery of the 3EC pecking out Bran's eyes and then boring into bone and brain in order to open his third eye, which then enables him to see.

I've been staring at this comment all day wondering why it was bringing to mind something that I couldn't quite put together. It finally snapped into place: it's the idea that in order to "see" you have to stop seeing. In the dream, Bran loses his eyes--those things which allow us to literally see. And, perhaps more importantly, this brought to mind a certain Greek prophet renown for being blind but being able to see more clearly than any other man alive: Tiresias.

If you've ever read Oedipus Rex, then you've met Tiresias. It's not uncommon in any sort of literature that the person who has lost a sense is actually more able in some regard. So the old blind prophet can "see" what is going on in Thebes more clearly than Oedipus who has basically..,uh...screwed everyone. Bran is able to "see" via a third eye that doesn't literally exist but the 3EC has to first peck out his two real eyes.

There is one very interesting myth about Tiresias that sprung to mind once I made this first connection. Tiresias spent 7 years as a woman. That's not the interesting part...the part that I find noteworthy is that it happened when Tiresias came upon two snakes coupling and hit them with a stick thus angering the snakes and the goddess Hera who transformed him. (Perhaps worth noting that Hera was married to Zeus, a mighty war god who wasn't exactly faithful (Robert) and Hera (Cersei) had quite the jealous rage toward Zeus's lovers and illegitimate offspring). In my Bran II analysis I talked a lot about the gargoyles and how one of their primary reasons for existing was to remind people of the original sin that involved snakes, nakedness, sex, ect. So it might be that GRRM is taking some of those elements and combining them into our little Bran.

Bran, the soon to be prophet, comes upon two snakes (Jaime and Cersei) having sex and breaks up their coitus, thus angering a Queen (Hera being the Queen of Olympus) and causing a rather unfortunate accident to befall Bran.

It's like GRRM took several Greek myths and threw them into a blender. Or perhaps, he starts off as Icarus and becomes Tiresias.

One more thing. Tiresias was also known for giving useful information to those who visited the underworld. For example, during Odysseus's katabasis (In ancient Greek it means "to go down" and is used to describe a descent into the underworld to obtain information, knowledge, ect) Tiresias meets with Odysseus and gives him some helpful clues about cattle of the sun god. Anyone we know who is a sort of "big damn hero" and who may have just died/warged/be critically injured all while Bran (our Tiresias stand in) is sitting in what is basically the underworld?

[MoIaF]

Great analysis, MoIaF!

Very good observation. He wants to be Bran the knight, not Bran the lord. It is true that you can wield great influence even with a physical disablity, but that is not the kind of action Bran looks for. He is not interested in power, but in heroic deeds, as already pointed out. There is a reason why warriors have many more songs than politicians do, even the Rains of Castamere deals with Tywin eradicating house Reyne, not with the politics involved with that. That is always a muddy business. But as we see with Barristan, that is also true for battles. It stands to reason that Bran would be very disappointed with the actual realities of being a knight. And there comes the three-eyed crow into play, wanting to lead Bran to realize his magical abilties. But I must say he does a remarkably poor job with this. Does he have no idea what kind of reaction such a dream causes? Even if the physical pain and mutilation cannot be avoided, he could at least properly talk to him. He begins to remember, but he is also scared. And in the meanwhile we have this line:

"As you will, my prince," said Ser Rodrik. "You did well." Bran flushed with pleasure. Being a lord was not as tedious as he had feared, [...]

Bran at least partially begins to accept the notion of being a lord, even if he still does not particularly like it. Even though the crow and the weirwood appear in his dreams over and over again, he turns more into the direction of the lord than that of the greenseer. He is also accepting his responsibilites as already pointed out. He knows what Robb and Eddard would tell him, and he does not disagree.

Thank you!

I think the 3EC's behavior is probably based in some desperation, they are running out of time so he doesn't want to or can't finesse this transition for Bran. Winter is coming and they need to get read before winter finally arrives.

I've been staring at this comment all day wondering why it was bringing to mind something that I couldn't quite put together. It finally snapped into place: it's the idea that in order to "see" you have to stop seeing. In the dream, Bran loses his eyes--those things which allow us to literally see. And, perhaps more importantly, this brought to mind a certain Greek prophet renown for being blind but being able to see more clearly than any other man alive: Tiresias.

If you've ever read Oedipus Rex, then you've met Tiresias. It's not uncommon in any sort of literature that the person who has lost a sense is actually more able in some regard. So the old blind prophet can "see" what is going on in Thebes more clearly than Oedipus who has basically..,uh...screwed everyone. Bran is able to "see" via a third eye that doesn't literally exist but the 3EC has to first peck out his two real eyes.

There is one very interesting myth about Tiresias that sprung to mind once I made this first connection. Tiresias spent 7 years as a woman. That's not the interesting part...the part that I find noteworthy is that it happened when Tiresias came upon two snakes coupling and hit them with a stick thus angering the snakes and the goddess Hera who transformed him. (Perhaps worth noting that Hera was married to Zeus, a mighty war god who wasn't exactly faithful (Robert) and Hera (Cersei) had quite the jealous rage toward Zeus's lovers and illegitimate offspring). In my Bran II analysis I talked a lot about the gargoyles and how one of their primary reasons for existing was to remind people of the original sin that involved snakes, nakedness, sex, ect. So it might be that GRRM is taking some of those elements and combining them into our little Bran.

Bran, the soon to be prophet, comes upon two snakes (Jaime and Cersei) having sex and breaks up their coitus, thus angering a Queen (Hera being the Queen of Olympus) and causing a rather unfortunate accident to befall Bran.

It's like GRRM took several Greek myths and threw them into a blender. Or perhaps, he starts off as Icarus and becomes Tiresias.

One more thing. Tiresias was also known for giving useful information to those who visited the underworld. For example, during Odysseus's katabasis (In ancient Greek it means "to go down" and is used to describe a descent into the underworld to obtain information, knowledge, ect) Tiresias meets with Odysseus and gives him some helpful clues about cattle of the sun god. Anyone we know who is a sort of "big damn hero" and who may have just died/warged/be critically injured all while Bran (our Tiresias stand in) is sitting in what is basically the underworld?

That is really interesting, thanks for sharing.

I'm not sure if GRRM purposely used these mythologies, a lot of these stories have permeated literature through different variations and authors will then use similar themes.