The Marquis de Leech Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 The Winter War "disaster"???!!!!!!! The Winter War was a disaster for the Soviets, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElizabethB. Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 The Winter War was a disaster for the Soviets, yes. No it wasn't. Soviet failed to expand as much as it wanted. No way that is a disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bennis of the Brown Shield Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 "Invading Finland" in this context means launching air-raids on Helsinki in February 1944, and a land attack on Karelia in June 1944 - in response to Finland joining the German invasion of Russia (the Winter War may have been morally clear-cut; the Continuation War was a good deal less so). Wrong. Following the end of the Winter War in 1940 (where the Soviet Union suceeded in occuping Karelia and some other territories) they had been putting constant pressure on Finland. Molotov visited Berlin in November 1940 and wanted permission for the Soviet Union to "solve the Finnish question once and for all" but Hitler declined. The Soviet Union nevertheless created an attack plan for Finland, involving almost 2 million soldiers. What happened next was that Hitler decided to attack the Soviet Union, beginning Operation Barbarossa. This prompted the Soviet Union to declare war on Finland a few days later, and begin air raids as well as a ground invasion in the east. However as the German army was destroying vast Soviet forces further south, and advancing at a quick pace, the Soviets had to start pulling resources away from Finland, and the offensive stopped. At this point the Finns, having been the subject of yet another attempted Soviet invasion, decided to advance into the Soviet occupied parts of Karelia and take the fight to them. They were never actually part of Operation Barbarossa, and the Continuation War was pretty clear-cut as well. Either way, as Germany eventually started to collapse the Soviet Union launched yet another large invasion of Finland in 1944, the goal of which was in all likelihood to occupy the entire country (because Finland had been offering to negotiate a peace since 1943 but the Soviet Union demanded an unconditional surrender) however after this invasion was stopped at Tali-Ihantala, as well as the loss of a number of divisions further north in country, Stalin decided he had had enough and was willing to offer better terms than an unconditional surrender.* Considering that these negotiations resulted in Finland retaining all pre-Continuation War territory except for two small and unpopulated slivers of land, "holding off" the Red Army is an accurate summary of the conflict. Especially since the Soviet Union had a 60 times larger population, meaning that we aren't exactly talking about two evenly matched countries here. "Stalled" means "Finland gets plenty of German help in terms of both food and military assistance, and President Ryti promises the Germans that Finland won't leave the war while he's President, except that he promptly resigns and allows Mannerheim to negotiate peace." Finland got out while the going was good, knowing full well what would have happened if they didn't (and even then, the war reparations were considerable). The Soviet Union was reliant on getting lend-lease aid from the allies to survive WW2 as well. Not an alliance. The Pact was only ever to buy time and buffer zone. K. *Which is a bit of an interesting addition to the discussion of a Soviet invasion of Japan as well. Considering that as indicated by this, Stalin was getting tired of losing men in conflicts he didn't consider really necessary as early as 1944. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerraPrime Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 [mod hat] Let's focus the discussion on the issues surrounding the two atom bombs. The discussions about general WW2 events should probably find a different home. [/mod hat] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DireWolfSpirit Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 The Full length Kuroi Ame (Black Rain) documentary is viewable through Youtube. Kuroi Ame (1989) - Full (English Subtitles) - YouTube Video for black rain atomic bomb movie▶ 1:57:29 http://youtu.be/XWzbTQTkVnc Jan 24, 2013 - Uploaded by Hermes Trismegisto The story of the aftermath of the Hiroshima bombing, based on ... of days, phrases from this ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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