Casting the Movie Continued Continued Continued

[Dracosmith]

Sackhoff is broad, she just needs to look taller. Look at her in relation to Grace Park and Jamie Bamber - her frame is far closer to that of Bamber than Park.

I've already said in an earlier post that the tub scene will be one of the easiest to do because their bodies will mostly be submerged in water. It's simply a matter of placing them each at certain levels so that she looks taller or the same height. Fight scenes will probably require the use of stunt doubles anyway, so it's just a matter of using a double in wide scenes shot from behind and close-ups of Sackhoff. When tied to Jaime on a horse, again the actors can just be arranged in such a way that she looks taller or the same height, and then make sure that they are only shot from the waist up.

You're right, there probably is but until we find that woman I think the scales are stacked in favour of Sackhoff - all Jackson has is the height whereas all Sackhoff is missing is the height, and that can be faked very easily, no expensive CGI required. Acting skills can't be.

I guess the other side of the issue that I'm not saying is that I simply do not think that the Brienne role requires a lot of acting talent to play and therefore is not worth hiring someone like Sackhoff, not to mention the camera tricks with body doubles and such.

[Tysha]

I guess the other side of the issue that I'm not saying is that I simply do not think that the Brienne role requires a lot of acting talent to play and therefore is not worth hiring someone like Sackhoff, not to mention the camera tricks with body doubles and such.

I could not disagree with you more! I think pretty much every character in this series is extremely complex and requires - and deserves - a talented actor to play them. Brienne needs someone who can go beyond the action chick to find the human underneath.

Brienne is insecure, awkward unless she has a sword in her hand, lacking confidence, emotionally guarded yet completely in love with Renly, conflicted about her feelings for Jaime, desperate to be honorable ... she needs an actress who can convey all this and more, not just someone who can wield a sword.

[Dracosmith]

I could not disagree with you more! I think pretty much every character in this series is extremely complex and requires - and deserves - a talented actor to play them. Brienne needs someone who can go beyond the action chick to find the human underneath.

Brienne is insecure, awkward unless she has a sword in her hand, lacking confidence, emotionally guarded yet completely in love with Renly, conflicted about her feelings for Jaime, desperate to be honorable ... she needs an actress who can convey all this and more, not just someone who can wield a sword.

But all of these things are conveyed primarily through other actors playing off of the Brienne character. Her character is not complex at all, she's one of the most simple characters in the books. She's a great character, I'm not in any way suggesting she's not... but it's because of the various reactions she inspires from those around her.

Her simplistic nature is an excellent counterpoint to complex and conflicted characters like Jaime and Catelyn. But I'm telling you, the things an actress would have to do to play her convincingly based on what's in the books are not the least bit challenging. It is a far more physically demanding role than it is dramatically.

Even her "conflicted" feelings for Jaime are conveyed through dialogue, she stops calling him kingslayer and starts being halfway polite to him. That is not dramatically difficult or taxing. A first year acting student who is capable of following direction could handle that.

[Tysha]

I was wrong before – it is possible for me to disagree with you more.

Brienne is not just a foil for the other characters, she is an extremely complex character in her own right.

She appears to be a simple woman but she’s not. She can be a bit dense sometimes but she has a deep emotional core and many, many complex and conflicted feelings and thoughts inside her, about herself, and about the people around her. She needs an actress who can convey that, who can bring out those layers, and not just make her a dull, one-dimensional, action chick cipher.

In a way Brienne is very like Sansa – they are each in love with the idea of chivalrous knights, but where Sansa wants to marry one, Brienne wants to be one. And slowly, over time, their illusions are shattered as they first see someone they love die in front of them and then they have all their notions and preconceptions of honour and chivalry challenged or shattered. These are not simple emotions to play, particularly not with the kind of subtlety that would be required.

No, her changing attitude to Jaime cannot simply be conveyed through dialogue. The words will be meaningless if the actress saying them does not give them any kind of emotional conviction. It’s not a simple transformation, it’s a source of great and continuing conflict for both Brienne and Jaime.

Brienne goes through an incredible amount - she narrowly avoids being raped, the last time we saw her she was in the midst of being hanged … and you don’t think she needs a good actress to play her?!

Sackhoff could do all this and more, and she could do the physical, action stuff. The only thing she lacks is height and as I have already said, that would be very easy and inexpensive to get round.

[Dracosmith]

She appears to be a simple woman but she’s not. She can be a bit dense sometimes but she has a deep emotional core and many, many complex and conflicted feelings and thoughts inside her, about herself, and about the people around her.

I don't know where you are getting this from but it's not in the books, not even in her POV. She's not conflicted about anything. She had learned that knights were not all chivalry before she meets Jaime. There is no indication that she's conflicted about anything. She starts off thinking that Jaime is a scumbag, but comes to have respect for him in the end. That's not conflicted, that's just a change of opinion.

In a way Brienne is very like Sansa – they are each in love with the idea of chivalrous knights, but where Sansa wants to marry one, Brienne wants to be one. And slowly, over time, their illusions are shattered as they first see someone they love die in front of them and then they have all their notions and preconceptions of honour and chivalry challenged or shattered. These are not simple emotions to play, particularly not with the kind of subtlety that would be required.

As I said, she comes into this tale knowing that knights are not all chivalry. It's made completely plain in her POV that her maester prepared her for this fact as a young girl. Your comparison to Sansa is not valid.

No, her changing attitude to Jaime cannot simply be conveyed through dialogue. The words will be meaningless if the actress saying them does not give them any kind of emotional conviction. It’s not a simple transformation, it’s a source of great and continuing conflict for both Brienne and Jaime.

The change of her attitude towards Jaime requires that she stop scowling at him and stop calling him Kingslayer, and start talking to him like a person. That really is not as complex as one might think, having done years of stage acting myself I can assure you of that.

Brienne goes through an incredible amount - she narrowly avoids being raped, the last time we saw her she was in the midst of being hanged … and you don’t think she needs a good actress to play her?!

You are extrapolating aspects to her character that are simply not supported by the narrative. There is no indication that Brienne was noticeably traumatized by her encounter with the Brave Companions, it just reinforces the suspicious aspect of her character. I assure you, suspicion and mistrust are not difficult qualities to demonstrate through acting and dialogue.

Sackhoff could do all this and more, and she could do the physical, action stuff. The only thing she lacks is height and as I have already said, that would be very easy and inexpensive to get round.

And so could many, many other lesser known and less costly actresses. I stand by my arguments that it is a far more physically challenging role than dramatically. Dramatically speaking, it is a character that others play off of - not a catalystic role like Jaime, Catelyn or others.

Yes she's been through a lot, that's made clear in the plotline through the events that happen. The audience will know that because they will see it happen. They will see her witness her king die, be abducted and threatened with rape etc. But in the end the Brienne character does not change, except to become more suspicious. To argue otherwise is contrary to what has been written.

[Starkess]

I don't know where you are getting this from but it's not in the books, not even in her POV. She's not conflicted about anything. She had learned that knights were not all chivalry before she meets Jaime. There is no indication that she's conflicted about anything. She starts off thinking that Jaime is a scumbag, but comes to have respect for him in the end. That's not conflicted, that's just a change of opinion.

As I said, she comes into this tale knowing that knights are not all chivalry. It's made completely plain in her POV that her maester prepared her for this fact as a young girl. Your comparison to Sansa is not valid.

The change of her attitude towards Jaime requires that she stop scowling at him and stop calling him Kingslayer, and start talking to him like a person. That really is not as complex as one might think, having done years of stage acting myself I can assure you of that.

You are extrapolating aspects to her character that are simply not supported by the narrative. There is no indication that Brienne was noticeably traumatized by her encounter with the Brave Companions, it just reinforces the suspicious aspect of her character. I assure you, suspicion and mistrust are not difficult qualities to demonstrate through acting and dialogue.

And so could many, many other lesser known and less costly actresses. I stand by my arguments that it is a far more physically challenging role than dramatically. Dramatically speaking, it is a character that others play off of - not a catalystic role like Jaime, Catelyn or others.

Yes she's been through a lot, that's made clear in the plotline through the events that happen. The audience will know that because they will see it happen. They will see her witness her king die, be abducted and threatened with rape etc. But in the end the Brienne character does not change, except to become more suspicious. To argue otherwise is contrary to what has been written.

Besides which, I think a lot of the support for Sackhoff is based off the idea that Jackson is a bad actress, which I don't think is necessarily the case. Brienne grows into having more of a role as the series progresses, so Jackson would have time to get used to the character. Maybe it would be possible to use all the tricks to make Sackhoff work for Brienne--but what's the point when we have an actress who actually fits the build? And think about how much easier and less costly it would be to pull in Jackson rather than Sackhoff.

[redxavier]

So was there a problem with Damian Lewis as Edmure? Was he too old? I'm assuming that Edmure was about mid to late 30s?

I don't think Tuyk has a serious enough face for the role myself. How about Tony Curran? http://us.movies1.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.co.../evolution1.jpg

[akpov]

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0227759/

I like Peter Dinklage for Tyrion. If you seen him in the tv show Threshold he is perfect. He is able to play a troubled character perfectly and he looks perfect to me. Well, with a little make up.

[Starkess]

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0227759/

I like Peter Dinklage for Tyrion. If you seen him in the tv show Threshold he is perfect. He is able to play a troubled character perfectly and he looks perfect to me. Well, with a little make up.

That's who we have listed.

[Starkess]

So was there a problem with Damian Lewis as Edmure? Was he too old? I'm assuming that Edmure was about mid to late 30s?

I don't think Tuyk has a serious enough face for the role myself. How about Tony Curran? http://us.movies1.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.co.../evolution1.jpg

I think Damian Lewis fits the age range. The only problem I have with him is that he has orangey-red hair instead of auburn, which is what the Tullys seem to have (at least Catelyn and Robb, who looks like Catelyn). That can be fixed pretty easily, I'd imagine.

If we're looking for alternatives, though, what about Ewan McGregor? He's in the right age range and I believe he is a natural auburn, although he might need some dye-enhancement too. He also has the handsome look I've always associated with Edmure.

[Darcia]

Damian Lewis is too old. Ned is only 35, Cat is younger than him, and Edmure is her little brother.We think that Edmure is about 25ish.

Anyway I was thinking Robin Laing, who was in Band of Brothers and The Lakes. He is only 1 year younger than Kate Winslet but he looks much younger. And he has the hair.

pic

colour pic

[Starkess]

Damian Lewis is too old. Ned is only 35, Cat is younger than him, and Edmure is her little brother.We think that Edmure is about 25ish.

Anyway I was thinking Robin Laing, who was in Band of Brothers and The Lakes. He is only 1 year younger than Kate Winslet but he looks much younger. And he has the hair.

pic

colour pic

I guess I didn't realize how young Edmure is. Robin Laing looks very Edmure-ish in that first picture, his hairstyle looks weird in the second one! I could see him as Edmure.

The only issue I have is that Edmure is described as "stocky" and I don't think Laing looks all that stocky.

[Ser Bruce the Hound KG]

looking over the site I think we need a new Meera Reed as she is stated as being 15 and young looking and we have cast a 25 year old to play her too Alexis Bledel as the right look also we need Howland Reed for the flashbacks or is he better unseen until he comes to talk to Jon. Finally what do people think of have young verison of some of the main for teh flashback to the War of teh Urspoer after all there 14 year young and bearly men at that time

[Starkess]

looking over the site I think we need a new Meera Reed as she is stated as being 15 and young looking and we have cast a 25 year old to play her too Alexis Bledel as the right look also we need Howland Reed for the flashbacks or is he better unseen until he comes to talk to Jon. Finally what do people think of have young verison of some of the main for teh flashback to the War of teh Urspoer after all there 14 year young and bearly men at that time

I'm not 100% positive what you're even trying to say. I agree, we could use a different, younger Meera. So far Howland Reed has had no more than a sentence mention, so I would have no idea what/who to cast for him until we are given more information. (It could be I'm just forgetting, of course!)

For a younger version of Robert we ought to use the Renly actor (can't remember who that is), because Renly is described as the exact image of Robert during the rebellion. We should probably get a young-Ned, but other than that I can't think of who we'd need a younger version of.

[Ser Bruce the Hound KG]

the Lannister Twins

[Dracosmith]

I'm not 100% positive what you're even trying to say. I agree, we could use a different, younger Meera. So far Howland Reed has had no more than a sentence mention, so I would have no idea what/who to cast for him until we are given more information. (It could be I'm just forgetting, of course!)

For a younger version of Robert we ought to use the Renly actor (can't remember who that is), because Renly is described as the exact image of Robert during the rebellion. We should probably get a young-Ned, but other than that I can't think of who we'd need a younger version of.

There are actually quite a few characters we might need younger versions of. A young Cersei (for when she's remembering Maggy the Frog and stuff with her and Jaime) and a young Jamie too. But we DEFINITELY need a young Catelyn, Liza and Littlefinger. The memories of their youth are really important, I think.

Some other possible candidates for young versions for flashbacks:

Theon (more important than at first thought, if the viewer doesn't understand some of the coldness he grew up with the during his stay with the Starks he is just a pure villain)

Lord Hoster Tully

John Arryn (young and old)

Ser Jorah (maybe, maybe not)

Renly as a boy (look at me look at me!)

Brienne (remembering her maester's teachings would be important)

Joffrey (his fun with the kittens)

Varys (when he gets cut)

Those are all I can think of.

[Starkess]

There are actually quite a few characters we might need younger versions of. A young Cersei (for when she's remembering Maggy the Frog and stuff with her and Jaime) and a young Jamie too. But we DEFINITELY need a young Catelyn, Liza and Littlefinger. The memories of their youth are really important, I think.

Some other possible candidates for young versions for flashbacks:

Theon (more important than at first thought, if the viewer doesn't understand some of the coldness he grew up with the during his stay with the Starks he is just a pure villain)

Lord Hoster Tully

John Arryn (young and old)

Ser Jorah (maybe, maybe not)

Renly as a boy (look at me look at me!)

Brienne (remembering her maester's teachings would be important)

Joffrey (his fun with the kittens)

Varys (when he gets cut)

Those are all I can think of.

I forgot about the LF-Catelyn-Lysa flashbacks. To be honest I don't see a lot of those scenes making it into a screenplay when it would be easier to inser the information other ways. JMO, though.

[Lightsnake]

looking over the site I think we need a new Meera Reed as she is stated as being 15 and young looking and we have cast a 25 year old to play her too Alexis Bledel as the right look also we need Howland Reed for the flashbacks or is he better unseen until he comes to talk to Jon. Finally what do people think of have young verison of some of the main for teh flashback to the War of teh Urspoer after all there 14 year young and bearly men at that time

There's a problem: We have no idea what Reed looks like

[Dracosmith]

I forgot about the LF-Catelyn-Lysa flashbacks. To be honest I don't see a lot of those scenes making it into a screenplay when it would be easier to inser the information other ways. JMO, though.

They are certainly going to have to do that for some of the memories I would think. It will be interesting to see how they will handle not just some of the character's memories, but their thoughts as well. Three options:

1) Have someone actually remember or imagine it and play it out with cast.

2) Have the character confide the thought or memory to someone else.

3) Have the character's voice narrate the memory while we see the character.

I imagine that they will use a mix of these methods.

[Maester Yobjascz]

Dracosmith -

This has been the topic of *much* discussion over on the adaptation thread. Needless to say, there's no consensus yet. But I think you're on the right track.