Is Benjen Stark Alive?

[Scipio Africanus]

Alright so all of this "Bran would recognize his uncle" so Coldhands can't be Benjen is really starting to annoy me. The text CLEARLY states that they can't see ColdHands' face because it's COVERED. Now you might ask, wouldn't Bran still recognize his voice? Well, Bran is what, 10 years old? And how often has he actually been around his uncle, you know, SINCE HE LIVES AT THE WALL AND NOT AT WINTERFELL? So yeah, given those 2 FACTS, it's perfectly reasonable that if Coldhands is Benjen, that Bran would not recognize him.

So please stop with all the "Bran would recognize him so it can't be Benjen" as the main reason that Benjen can't be Coldhands..

/rant

Coldhands most like isn't uncle Ben because he knew the old tongue which no Rangers at that time other then ex-Wildlings knew and because Leaf said he died a long time ago, which implies that Coldhands died more then just a year ago but that he's very old (for a corpse/golem/whatever).

Coldhands isn't uncle Ben because otherwise Martin would've made it more of a point that Ben died beyond the Wall. At least the latter is my theory. In interviews Martin always says (or least I've read it once) that uncle Ben is more important then we think (why did he join the NW in the first place? Where did he go after he went AWOL?).

If Coldhands is Uncle Ben then that would be anti-climatic to say the least.

[Derrick Stark]

Coldhands most like isn't uncle Ben because he knew the old tongue which no Rangers at that time other then ex-Wildlings knew and because Leaf said he died a long time ago, which implies that Coldhands died more then just a year ago but that he's very old (for a corpse/golem/whatever).

Coldhands isn't uncle Ben because otherwise Martin would've made it more of a point that Ben died beyond the Wall. At least the latter is my theory. In interviews Martin always says (or least I've read it once) that uncle Ben is more important then we think (why did he join the NW in the first place? Where did he go after he went AWOL?).

If Coldhands is Uncle Ben then that would be anti-climatic to say the least.

I'm not saying he is Coldhands, but I would definitely love for him to be Coldhands. It wouldn't be anticlimactic to me in any sense of the word (See what I did there? I said "to me" since it was my opinion. Don't speak your opinion as if it is a fact).

And as someone else has already said previously in this thread, and probably many other threads, "long ago" is extremely subjective. How do you know that the CotF was saying "long ago" with respect to themselves? How do you know Leaf wasn't saying "long ago" with respect to Bran and regular human time? How do you know that Leaf has a complete grasp on the Common Tongue compared to what the CotF actually speak?

Edit: It also isn't youre place to say what GRRM would / wouldn't do / intends

[Scipio Africanus]

And as someone else has already said previously in this thread, and probably many other threads, "long ago" is extremely subjective. How do you know that the CotF was saying "long ago" with respect to themselves? How do you know Leaf wasn't saying "long ago" with respect to Bran and regular human time? How do you know that Leaf has a complete grasp on the Common Tongue compared to what the CotF actually speak?

Well the concept of time is complicated and has human theoretical physicists (especially string theorists) in knots trying to calculate the phenomenon and our concept of time, space and dimensions.

What the CotF concept of time is, is anyone's guess.

Tolkien always made it a point that his Elves had a different concept of time. Wouldn't rule out Martin has the same in store for his CotF.

However there is enough circumstancial "evidence" to support that Coldhands does not equal uncle Ben. At least to ME, the only one who knows for certain is indeed Martin.

[Derrick Stark]

Well the concept of time is complicated and has human theoretical physicists (especially string theorists) in knots trying to calculate the phenomenon and our concept of time, space and dimensions.

What the CotF concept of time is, is anyone's guess.

Tolkien always made it a point that his Elves had a different concept of time. Wouldn't rule out Martin has the same in store for his CotF.

However there is enough circumstancial "evidence" to support that Coldhands does not equal uncle Ben. At least to ME, the only one who knows for certain is indeed Martin.

Thank you =)

[rmholt]

Coldhands most like isn't uncle Ben because he knew the old tongue which no Rangers at that time other then ex-Wildlings knew and because Leaf said he died a long time ago, which implies that Coldhands died more then just a year ago but that he's very old (for a corpse/golem/whatever).

Coldhands isn't uncle Ben because otherwise Martin would've made it more of a point that Ben died beyond the Wall. At least the latter is my theory. In interviews Martin always says (or least I've read it once) that uncle Ben is more important then we think (why did he join the NW in the first place? Where did he go after he went AWOL?).

If Coldhands is Uncle Ben then that would be anti-climatic to say the least.

It's kind of hilarious (assuming you recall correctly) that GRRM says Benjen is more important than we think. Not sure that is even possible!! But now I am 100% sure he is at Winterfell. Unless he isnt.

Coldhands was a tool. He will not be seen again.

[Alta1r]

It's kind of hilarious (assuming you recall correctly) that GRRM says Benjen is more important than we think. Not sure that is even possible!! But now I am 100% sure he is at Winterfell. Unless he isnt.

Coldhands was a tool. He will not be seen again.

Who is this person at Winterfell you're talking about? Some hooded man? My memory's a little hazy, when in the series does this guy appear and what does he do in Winterfell?

[rmholt]

Who is this person at Winterfell you're talking about? Some hooded man? My memory's a little hazy, when in the series does this guy appear and what does he do in Winterfell?

Well I refer to two men, so "he" could be GRRM or Benjen.

If you are trolling me, trolls usually go completely over my head or I take them completely seriously.

If you arent, i congratulate you on knowing so much about Winterfell, Benjen, and the Hooded Man discussions after only a couple days on the forum.

[Alta1r]

Well I refer to two men, so "he" could be GRRM or Benjen.

If you are trolling me, trolls usually go completely over my head or I take them completely seriously.

If you arent, i congratulate you on knowing so much about Winterfell, Benjen, and the Hooded Man discussions after only a couple days on the forum.

Lol. Not trolling, I just read through this thread from the beginning and saw in another post (maybe yours) a few pages back that linked tunnels and Winterfell and some hooded man, so I was curious what this was a reference to.

[rmholt]

Lol. Not trolling, I just read through this thread from the beginning and saw in another post (maybe yours) a few pages back that linked tunnels and Winterfell and some hooded man, so I was curious what this was a reference to.

Hmm yeah that sounds like me!

[Alta1r]

Are you talking about this guy?

]Farther on, he came upon a man striding in the opposite direction, a hooded cloak flapping behind him. When they found themselves face-to-face their eyes met briefly. The man put a hand on his dagger. “Theon Turncloak. Theon Kinslayer.”

“I’m not. I never … I was ironborn.”

“False is all you were. How is it you still breathe?”

“The gods are not done with me,” Theon answered, wondering if this could be the killer, the night walker who had stuffed Yellow Dick’s cock into his mouth and pushed Roger Ryswell’s groom off the battlements. Oddly, he was not afraid. He pulled the glove from his left hand. “Lord Ramsay is not done with me.”

The man looked, and laughed. “I leave you to him, then.”

[rmholt]

Are you talking about this guy?

That is the mysterious hooded man.

[King Doug]

We can all agree that GoT has the most foreshadowing. In that book there is constant mention of his disappearance and people wanting to find out what happened. That could simply be because it had recently happened, but I think it is because Benjen's role is not over in the story. Then in Jon's POV's in DwD, he starts to think about Benjen again, quite a bit. I too think this is more foreshadowing of the re-emergence of Benjen.

To put it simply, I think he is still alive. My personal crackpot theory is that he is in Winterfell as the hooded man, but I don't necessarily believe my own theory.

[Alta1r]

That is the mysterious hooded man.

Could be, I guess. It seems kind of a stretch to me. You'd think Theon would recognize Benjen, as the part in the chapter mentions them meeting face-to-face and making eye contact briefly. But stranger things have happened I guess.

[rmholt]

Could be, I guess. It seems kind of a stretch to me. You'd think Theon would recognize Benjen, as the part in the chapter mentions them meeting face-to-face and making eye contact briefly. But stranger things have happened I guess.

I am not as sure that he is the Hooded Man (or that he killed LW) as I am that he has been at Winterfell for quite some time. Otherwise, why do we care that there are deeper levels to the crypts?

[Scipio Africanus]

I am not as sure that he is the Hooded Man (or that he killed LW) as I am that he has been at Winterfell for quite some time. Otherwise, why do we care that there are deeper levels to the crypts?

The big problem with uncle Ben being at Winterfell all this time is simply "why"?

Martin mentions the crypts quite a bit but to what end it will lead is anyone's guess. But back to uncle Ben, why would he hide in the crypts for so long? Why didn't he pop out when Theon besieged Winterfell in the first place? Or when Ser Roderick Cassel and his men appeared? Or when Bran + Rickon were hiding (for quite some time) in the crypts? Or when Reek/Lady Dustin visited the crypts. Or even as the hooded man, killing off Bolton/Frey lackeys?

For I don't think he's the hooded man for the same reason as I don't think he's Coldhands. Bran doesn't recognize CH and Theon doesn't recognize the HM even though both knew what uncle Ben looked liked and have heard his voice.

So what's uncle Ben been doing down there all this time?

My personal guess is that if uncle Ben is still alive he's far North, beyond the Wall.

[Tall Tyrion Lannister!]

I think if Benjen is alive he's probably up in the land of always winter or somewhere where no one would look for him. don't think he's the hooded man.

[rmholt]

The big problem with uncle Ben being at Winterfell all this time is simply "why"?

So what's uncle Ben been doing down there all this time?

My personal guess is that if uncle Ben is still alive he's far North, beyond the Wall.

There must always be a Stark at Winterfell, Dead Little Walder at the crypt entrance

The Far North is going to be prominent IIUC so not out of the realm of possibility, even likelihood

[Alta1r]

The big problem with uncle Ben being at Winterfell all this time is simply "why"?

Martin mentions the crypts quite a bit but to what end it will lead is anyone's guess. But back to uncle Ben, why would he hide in the crypts for so long? Why didn't he pop out when Theon besieged Winterfell in the first place? Or when Ser Roderick Cassel and his men appeared? Or when Bran + Rickon were hiding (for quite some time) in the crypts? Or when Reek/Lady Dustin visited the crypts. Or even as the hooded man, killing off Bolton/Frey lackeys?

For I don't think he's the hooded man for the same reason as I don't think he's Coldhands. Bran doesn't recognize CH and Theon doesn't recognize the HM even though both knew what uncle Ben looked liked and have heard his voice.

So what's uncle Ben been doing down there all this time?

My personal guess is that if uncle Ben is still alive he's far North, beyond the Wall.

Yeah, the why doesn't make sense to me either. Unless it took him from the time he went North of the Wall all the way until the end of DwD to travel from the North to the Winterfell crypts. I guess it's possible he went way up North for a couple books and then traveled back through the tunnels, taking another couple books worth of time. But, it's a stretch. I think he's somewhere way up north hanging out with the Others.

[Dark Rider]

Yeah, he's out there. Remember some Rangers have been known to be caught north of the wall for a great period of time. I think he was cut off during an attack by the Others from traveling south and had to go north. Something tells me he'll show-up with a wealth of intel about the movements of the Others.

[Warlock Vetolgar]

We can all agree that GoT has the most foreshadowing. In that book there is constant mention of his disappearance and people wanting to find out what happened. That could simply be because it had recently happened, but I think it is because Benjen's role is not over in the story. Then in Jon's POV's in DwD, he starts to think about Benjen again, quite a bit. I too think this is more foreshadowing of the re-emergence of Benjen.

To put it simply, I think he is still alive. My personal crackpot theory is that he is in Winterfell as the hooded man, but I don't necessarily believe my own theory.

But it could also be that the main reason for Ben's disappearance was to force Mormont to go beyond the Wall so that we, the readers, could have a POV character as a window into that part of the world. In writing, unless a character is certified dead (not just MIA), he can still pop up in any way, shape, or form when we least expect it.