Booknerd2 Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Crackpottery perhaps. But if Benjen is alive, there are wolves/direwolves on the other side of the wall, farther North. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
donalnig Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 Unless, of course, he is. I guess we'll find out sooner or later. according to leaf who's older than 200 years they killed coldhands LONG ago!! how could a man whos been missing for 3 years have been killed LONG ago to a creature older than 200 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Sparrow Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 If Benjen is alive, he's probably somewhere in the Lands of Always Winter (I think that's what they're called) because GRRM has said that we will see more of the Lands of Always Winter and that TWOW will take us further North than ever before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daemon Dagoghlor Posted September 6, 2012 Share Posted September 6, 2012 He was not in Theon's dream of the Stark dead/soon to be dead. I think he is alive. This. He's probably being kept prisoner by some supernatural force somewhere. I thought he was Coldhands at first too, but the CotF say that "they killed him long ago." Benjen's only been missing for a couple of years at this point, which isn't a long time at all for the Children. Also, Coldhands seems to have no problem killing Black Brothers, something that doesn't seem like Benjen at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God_made_me_do_it Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 according to leaf who's older than 200 years they killed coldhands LONG ago!! how could a man whos been missing for 3 years have been killed LONG ago to a creature older than 200 years Meh I've already been over this far too much. Go look up "subjective" in the dictionary will ya and save me some time.. in short though it's far too ambiguous a term to make assumptions based upon. He could even be intentionally misleading Bran for that matter, if Benjen didn't want to be discovered yet. Also, Coldhands seems to have no problem killing Black Brothers, something that doesn't seem like Benjen at all. I think the black brothers in question were oathbreakers, likely left over from the business at Craster's - there's a fair few ways in which Coldhands could know they were oathbreakers in which case killing them would be EXACTLY what a true ranger would do. He was in the area at the time, as he rescued Sam not long after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grindylow Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 If Benjen is alive, he's probably somewhere in the Lands of Always Winter (I think that's what they're called) because GRRM has said that we will see more of the Lands of Always Winter and that TWOW will take us further North than ever before. I think so, too, and a big crackpottery step further: I am suddenly getting Night's King 2.0 vibes about him. None of this is based on anything further than his prolonged unexplained absence and his little speech to Jon about how he might feel differently about a life of celibacy if he knew what he was giving up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkstar is the Key Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 There is no way Benjen Stark is dead, I guarangoddamntee it. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to take their goggles off. This whole story has been set up to have the Starks look the smallest and the bleakest once Winter comes because they are not "Summer Knights" or "Summer Lords" But now that Winter is here you WILL see a Stark resurgence and by the end of the series the SXtarks will be THE most powerful family in Westeros, maybe outside of the Targaryens. And a major crux of that is Benjen Stark's survival. If you can't see this I'm sorry but it is what it is. This ALSO means, that he isn't Coldhands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Sparrow Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 This ALSO means, that he isn't Coldhands. Well, of course he isn't Coldhands. Even if Benjen were dead, he hasn't been dead for nearly long enough to be Coldhands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I'm not even convinced Coldhands was real. Varamyr saw the elk carrying Jojen and Meera when it snorted. No mention of Coldhands. Also no mention of Bran and Hodor...so. Of course Coldhands might have been taking care of the Night Stalkers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Sparrow Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I'm not even convinced Coldhands was real. Varamyr saw the elk carrying Jojen and Meera when it snorted. No mention of Coldhands. Also no mention of Bran and Hodor...so. Of course Coldhands might have been taking care of the Night Stalkers. That would be quite a twist... after getting everyone arguing about who Coldhands is, it turns out that he was just a figment of Sam's imagination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 That would be quite a twist... after getting everyone arguing about who Coldhands is, it turns out that he was just a figment of Sam's imagination. Not so much a figment of the imagination but a sort of interactive hologram or homunculus made by Brynden via the ravens. Granted there are a lot of holes in this theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Africanus Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I'm not even convinced Coldhands was real. Coldhands is real, didn't Leaf know about him / see him? Didn't Sam/Gilly see/talk to him? He's just not Uncle Ben that's true. Coldhands knew the old tongue, something which most Rangers except ex-Wildlings don't know how to speak, and I doubt Ben was the type to learn it. Who he is then, is anyone's guess. My fav would be the former Nightking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Coldhands is real, didn't Leaf know about him / see him? He's just not Uncle Ben that's true. Coldhands knew the old tongue, something which most Rangers except ex-Wildlings don't know how to speak, and I doubt Ben was the type to learn it. Who he is then, is anyone's guess. My fav would be the former Nightking. Sam, the Reeds, and Bran saw him too. If he is a construct, he is real, just not a real PERSON. He can hack apart wights and Nights Watch and butcher an elk. but when Brynden stop broadcasting through the ravens he vanishes. Why the wolf didnt see him (Varamyr) - well, he's a wolf. Maybe that's why. Not saying the theory doesnt have holes, but that isnt the biggest one MHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Africanus Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Sam, the Reeds, and Bran saw him too. If he is a construct, he is real, just not a real PERSON. He can hack apart wights and Nights Watch and butcher an elk. but when Brynden stop broadcasting through the ravens he vanishes. Why the wolf didnt see him (Varamyr) - well, he's a wolf. Maybe that's why. Not saying the theory doesnt have holes, but that isnt the biggest one MHO. A golem eh? Well that would explain why Coldhands doesn't behave like the other undead. Still, traditional Golems aren't supposed to have such a degree of reasoning or problemsolving, they're supposed to be single-minded vessels to their masters. I'll need way more proof before I truely commit to any theories personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gradimir Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 A golem eh? Well that would explain why Coldhands doesn't behave like the other undead. Still, traditional Golems aren't supposed to have such a degree of reasoning or problemsolving, they're supposed to be single-minded vessels to their masters. I'll need way more proof before I truely commit to any theories personally. Brynden was controlling him all the time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Africanus Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Brynden was controlling him all the time? Never heard of a golem like that but hey it could be in a fantasy setting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverx2 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 No. If benjen were alive he would have returned to the wall by now. It's been years since he went missing. If the wildlings were to have found them Mance would have told john, The others dont keep prisoners, and Craster said he hadn't seen him. So either Benjen has survived in the north alone by himself for 3 years, or he was taken prisoner by the others, which makes Zero sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Brynden was controlling him all the time? Never heard of a golem like that but hey it could be in a fantasy setting. Borderline crackpottery but I like it. Explains the ravens. Also Brynden isnt limited to watching - he has been trying to get Bran up there for 10 years but he did it and Coldhands is inside the Wall. I like the golem concept - I didnt know it til now - thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmholt Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 PS Benjen is at Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrick Stark Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Alright so all of this "Bran would recognize his uncle" so Coldhands can't be Benjen is really starting to annoy me. The text CLEARLY states that they can't see ColdHands' face because it's COVERED. Now you might ask, wouldn't Bran still recognize his voice? Well, Bran is what, 10 years old? And how often has he actually been around his uncle, you know, SINCE HE LIVES AT THE WALL AND NOT AT WINTERFELL? So yeah, given those 2 FACTS, it's perfectly reasonable that if Coldhands is Benjen, that Bran would not recognize him. So please stop with all the "Bran would recognize him so it can't be Benjen" as the main reason that Benjen can't be Coldhands.. /rant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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