So, I hate Daenerys

[Thor85]

If I can't stand Daenerys, does that automatically make me a bad person (I also dislike Catelyn with a passion but that would be a topic for a different thread)? Did GRRM even intend for a her to become a likable character?

I'm not going to recount all the reasons why I don't like Daenerys as a character. I always felt like she was the least relatable/likable of GRRM's great cast of characters. Yet the minute I mentioned my opinion in a comment on another website i was assaulted from all sides and singled out as someone who doesn't know women very well or even has no close relationships with the opposite sex. So I would like to know, from female readers especially, if you enjoy reading Dany's POV chapters and some of the reasons why.

Also do you think that GRRM writes his female characters well? I'm not going to presume to give opinion on that particular topic ever again as my ego still hurts from that last flaming tongue lashing I got :( . But I would just like to know.

[Greyjoy Rebellion]

Many on this board hate Daenerys. You are certainly not alone.

I personally really like her, and the some things that people dislike her for (the sense of entitlement, narrowly escaping death and disaster unrealistically too many times) they're willing to excuse in other characters like Arya.

[WinterRyan]

Many on this board hate Daenerys. You are certainly not alone.

I personally really like her, and the some things that people dislike her for (the sense of entitlement, narrowly escaping death and disaster unrealistically too many times) they're willing to excuse in other characters like Arya.

Oddly i always felt Arrya and Dany were so similar

Both renegades trying to avenge wrongs and fighting against gender stereotypes. I am not a huge fan of Dany but I do admire the problems of writing such a rapidly maturing character. She is learning and growing, perhaps many hate her since she is the hanging sword over the story line and we just want her to get across the sea and start killing lannisters!

[Thor85]

I should probably add that I'm a guy (if I was too vague or you're too lazy to check my profile :) ). In a previous discussion someone said that I only liked female characters who acted or thought like man (after I mention that I liked Arya and Brienne most of all the characters in the book, although Sansa is up there too). So I don't like Dany, Cat (alive), and Cercei (that one is a no brainer though ).

I like to hope it is not some unconscious psychological thing on my part (do I have an unconscious dislike of overly power-hungry women? i certainly hope I don't) but as another question, do other men get turned off by Daenerys's actions? (she also acts/thinks like a man in my opinion).

[Nichole]

I used to not like Dany, but have begun to like her character more and more. Especially on re-reads. My mom is in the middle of aCoK and cannot stand her.

So, no I would not say you are sexist, or a bad person just because you don't like Dany. If you had said you don't like her because women are not capable of ruling because they have periods, well, we would have problems.

[Errant Bard]

The girl is relatable and likeable, it's just that her arc is the most ludicrous bunk in the books just above Jon's ascension to power, so as a character/part of the story she is mediocre. Only my opinion.

But anyway, do you really only like the tomboys in the books? What about Sansa, Myrcella, Arianne, Gilly, Miranda, Shae, Margaery, Shireen, Ellaria, Tyene, Lynesse, among others?

[Marquis]

I started to like Dany once she began to stand up to Viserys, and have liked her ever since. I have always felt sorry for her though. I find it amazing that after all the crap that she has gone through, she is still a fairly well adjusted young lady. Thinking about how Dany grew up makes me realize how many kids are simply used as pawns in the"Game" by the power brokers in the realm.

[Greyjoy Rebellion]

The girl is relatable and likeable, it's just that her arc is the most ludicrous bunk in the books just above Jon's ascension to power, so as a character/part of the story she is mediocre. Only my opinion.

Arya surviving the riverlands, and then harrenhal, and then everything else afterwards is as ludicrous if not more ludicrous, in my opinion.

[WinterRyan]

Arya surviving the riverlands, and then harrenhal, and then everything else afterwards is as ludicrous if not more ludicrous, in my opinion.

maybe we should start a thread: When did Arrya storyline jump the shark?"

I vote for Arrya super ninja assassin -

[Blackthrone]

In my opinion, Daenerys' story should have been told by somebody else. Obviously, with the story the way it is, there is no one character who could provide the whole thing, but that's not really the point. Such a character could conceivably have been invented at the start of the series. But hearing Daenerys' story from Daenerys' point of view is a bit like reading Caesar's Commentaries - sure, it's interesting to hear about all these things, but you can't shake the feeling that the main character is just a leetle bit over-represented. In fact, to me Dany's chapters have always felt a lot like the Commentaries - the post-coup apologia of a ruthless general.

I think that by setting up an alternative viewpoint to see Dany by, we will gain a better image of her, either as a real person or a larger-than-life Rhaegaresque hero.

SPOILER: ADwD

This is the main reason I am excited for ADwD, actually. It will be interesting to see how Quentyn, Tyrion, Victarion and whoever else form opinions about Daenerys.

[lady narcissa]

So I would like to know, from female readers especially, if you enjoy reading Dany's POV chapters and some of the reasons why.

I'm female and I have really enjoyed Dany's chapters. For me, she was the first character in the first book to really jump off the pages and distinguish herself from all the others. When I got to the end of her first chapter, I wasn't willing to just wait for another 100 pages until she showed up again. I read all her chapters straight through and then went back and read the rest of the book. I subsequently read the second and third books the same way - Dany's chapters first then read the entire book straight through.

I can't say I relate to her at all. And she is a total Mary Sue. But I feel a great deal of empathy for her and the life she has led and the decisions she's had to make at a very early age. I sometimes have to remind myself when reading about her that she is only a 14 year old girl.

I don't think it makes you a bad person not to like her. I mean there are many characters in the series that I absolutely hate.

[HyperVolk]

I also don't like Danerys.

Then again I don't like any of his characters except Jon. Who also gets on my nerves some times too.

What I see about all the female characters is that each one has a specific flaw that may be common and many women have, but it's magnified by a million times so that the character just seems like an archetype, not real, almost like Martin was trying to accentuate their flaws or personalities too much.

Either you have a character that is a super huge wimp, or super vain, or super protective, or super curious, so on so forth.

Which does not mean I don't love that each character is not perfect, far from it even, and that they are accentuated in their traits to a crazy level. Makes it fun.

[Thor85]

The girl is relatable and likeable, it's just that her arc is the most ludicrous bunk in the books just above Jon's ascension to power, so as a character/part of the story she is mediocre. Only my opinion.

But anyway, do you really only like the tomboys in the books? What about Sansa, Myrcella, Arianne, Gilly, Miranda, Shae, Margaery, Shireen, Ellaria, Tyene, Lynesse, among others?

Well Sansa's character development has been great so far. So she is definitely among my favourites. She is turning out into quite a complex character and that is what I like. Many of the others you mentioned are likable (except for Shae for betraying Tyrion) but they are not developed that well. I hope we will hear from Arianne more. And Margaery and Myrcella would be very interesting as POV characters (although it does seem that Martin has something bad planned for both of them in the future :( ).

[wakiki]

Daenerys is a guilty pleasure of mine. She doesn't have the depth of Cat, Arya, or Sansa, but I still like her alot. GRRM somehow makes the Mary Sue's much more real than other authors. I suppose she's my least favorite female POV in the pre-AFFC series.

[Ser_not_appearing_yet]

I also don't like Danerys.

Then again I don't like any of his characters except Jon. Who also gets on my nerves some times too.

What I see about all the female characters is that each one has a specific flaw that may be common and many women have, but it's magnified by a million times so that the character just seems like an archetype, not real, almost like Martin was trying to accentuate their flaws or personalities too much.

Either you have a character that is a super huge wimp, or super vain, or super protective, or super curious, so on so forth.

Which does not mean I don't love that each character is not perfect, far from it even, and that they are accentuated in their traits to a crazy level. Makes it fun.

Good Lord, why on earth are you reading the books?

Ps: I also dislike Dany, though not on an epic scale or anything. I hate the idea of her sitting on the iron throne.

[Kimera757]

The girl is relatable and likeable, it's just that her arc is the most ludicrous bunk in the books just above Jon's ascension to power, so as a character/part of the story she is mediocre. Only my opinion.

But anyway, do you really only like the tomboys in the books? What about Sansa, Myrcella, Arianne, Gilly, Miranda, Shae, Margaery, Shireen, Ellaria, Tyene, Lynesse, among others?

I think Arianne is a tomboy. Just because she's hot doesn't mean she's not a tomboy. I don't recognize a lot of those names (Miranda, Ellaria, Tyene, Lynesse).

Arya is awesome. The book needs more kids like her. (Yes, she's a kid, but it's easy to forget that.) Same with Brienne (who is grown up) and the Queen of Thorns. What do the three have in common? Arya will grow up ugly, Brienne is ugly, and the QoT is too old to appeal to most men in that way. They're not typical fantasy women (although characters similar to Brienne and the QoT do show up more than occasionally).

Of the others, Sansa and Myrcella are kids, and Sansa is particularly annoying. Gilly should have cut her father's throat when he was sleeping.

Shae acted pretty dumb. Maybe it's not fair, though, as Tyrion is so much smarter than most people, and in any scene she's in Tyrion is there too, but to see her desperately want jewels and pretty dresses to wear while the town was about to erupt around her didn't give me a good view of her character.

I like Margaery, and she doesn't seem like a tomboy. I think it's because she's plot relevant and not a kid.

Shireen is, IIRC, a kid, so I have no interest in her.

And to stick to the point of this thread, I don't like Dany. I didn't like the Targaeryens to begin with, but (other than sanity issues) she's somewhat worse. She has a tiny force; I think she might be a good queen as long as she doesn't try to cross the ocean. Maybe I was a dunce at her age, but I don't think it's reasonable that a 14-year-old girl be the best strategist in her army. What could she possibly use Tyrion for, if she's as smart as him?

[HyperVolk]

Good Lord, why on earth are you reading the books?

Ps: I also dislike Dany, though not on an epic scale or anything. I hate the idea of her sitting on the iron throne.

I absolutely love the books. They have a great plot, lots of twist and turns, Martin has no shame killing his characters at a drop of a hat, which is super rare.

But mostly because it gives me a secret pleasure that I'm not as much of a twit as most of the characters.

Also, the books are elaborate enough and a constructed enough world to imagine some pretty hot fantasies.

In fact, anyone know where some really bad/good fan fic would be located. Why didn't I think of this earlier.

[Bolton Bastard]

Nah, doesn't make you sexist. Some people just don't like reading about some characters and plots. Hell, I can't stand 90% of the horrors of slavery and oppression literature, doesn't make me a racist now.

As for Dany, I never disliked her, never liked her. I found her compatriots far more interesting and wish to see more of Grey Worm, and plan on laughing mercilessly when the dressed up merc she bribed betrays her.

[Ser_not_appearing_yet]

I absolutely love the books. They have a great plot, lots of twist and turns, Martin has no shame killing his characters at a drop of a hat, which is super rare.

But mostly because it gives me a secret pleasure that I'm not as much of a twit as most of the characters.

Also, the books are elaborate enough and a constructed enough world to imagine some pretty hot fantasies.

In fact, anyone know where some really bad/good fan fic would be located. Why didn't I think of this earlier.

There is none (to my knowledge). GRRM despises fanfiction, and has sworn to hunt down anyone who creates said fanfiction around his work.

Just to clarify, by 'bad' do you mean uninteresting and stupid, or of questionable sanity and bizarre?

[Bubba]

She was my least favorite character in the first book, but got better with each installment.