House Velaryon Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 No worries. Can't be helped at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Redfort Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 People not checked in/confirmed Healing Circle so far - Stark, Dondarrion, Kenning..I did check in, although if Stark is modkilled, we'd better change up the circle of life to reflect that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Velaryon Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 I missed it then, sorry and yes - good call on Stark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Velaryon Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 So who are your top three candidates right now Kenning? Apologies if you've outlined this somewhere, but the search by post feature just sucks balls. Just thought I'd ask since you're the only one hanging out right now.eta: or not. *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Targaryen Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 *sigh*It was brought to my attention that the rules post says we're playing according to standard rules. Since Stark has played in games here before, he should know about the twenty-four hour modkill limit. But anyway, if he has the flu, he'll probably thank us for being modkilled.Lord Gareth had been vomiting and coughing up blood for the past few days. In his delirium, he'd kept on mumbling about chainsaw defences. The nobles felt no pity for their host. Survival of the fittest, after all. Besides, he was the one who'd got them into this mess. They continued their convoluted attempts at fucking each other over, but unfortunately they didn't get very far before getting distracted. Maybe it was the threat of their imminent demise looming over them, or maybe it was being confined so close together in a small space, but they decided to overlook the fact they weren't all related, as well as the word "over" in the preceding sentence. First Tyrell suggested pairing up, but Cerwyn reminded him that one unlucky man would be left out. Kenning helpfully suggested a threesome instead. Finally, they agreed on a mass circle-jerk so as to share the love."This is boring," said King Wayne. "Less healing and more bloodshed!" He remembered that his host had gone missing for a while. Perhaps Wayne could harass him instead. When he opened the door to Lord Gareth's chambers, he began to cackle.On the bed, Gareth's cold corpse lay motionless. A reddish froth clung to his lips.No one mourned his death. They wasted no time at all in raiding his chambers for valuables. When they opened the door to his closet, their jaws dropped open. Inside was a lacy red-and-black negligee, several pairs of fishnet stockings, a platinum-blond wig, a heavily padded push-up bra, and six-inch pink pumps.Yes, Gareth Stark led a double-life as a drag queen! His stage name was The Bare Hand, and he worked night-clubs in the Village three evenings a week. It turned out his prejudice against homosexuals was merely an act. Society had progressed since the medieval ages, but due to his conservative upbringing and the burden of being an heir to the Stark line, he'd learned to be ashamed of who he really was. But on stage, when the lights dimmed and the chattering of the crowd died down to an excited hum and the opening strains of "I Will Survive" burst from the amplifiers, something happened to him. He became another person, free of society's rigid expectations. He became truly alive.Oh, but there were no murder weapons. Because Gareth Stark was innocent. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Connington Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 So Stark was innocent. The first thing that comes to mind is Cerwyn's insistence that she needed to analyze things today from the perspective of Stark being guilty. Cerwyn said this - And yes, I do seem to be tunnelled on Stark, but that's because he has displayed a plethora of scummy actions. He has a decent mound of evidence piling up on him for this early in the day, from the vote being actively swung away from him, to the night kill protecting him, and everything he said. Plenty of what he said that's showing him to be scum is a direct result of me hounding the hound. Why would I ease up and start looking elsewhere, when this line of enquiry is bearing plenty of fruit? If I decide to look at things with the idea that Stark is innocent, I have very little evidence on anyone, and even on re-read can't pick up that much in the way of damning evidence.I didn't like the underlined comment when I first saw it, and I like it even less now. You don't have to pick one path or the other, as in Stark = guilty or not guilty. You can take the time to consider both. To just seize on one without giving time to the other seems to be strangely careless for somebody like Cerwyn, who appears to be a very competent player.Beyond that, I also want to point out that the Circle of Strife has changed. Lannister now needs to heal me, and put her alternative heal on Tyrell. Stokeworth heals Lannister, or Martell if Lannister is lynched.Lannister heals Martell, or Tyrell if Martell is lynched.Martell heals Tyrell, or Tully if Tyrell is lynched.Tyrell heals Tully, or Dondarrion if Tully is lynched.Tully heals Dondarrion, or Stonetree if Dondarrion is lynched.Dondarrion heals Stonetree, or Kenning if Stonetree is lynched.Stonetree heals Kenning, or Cerwyn if Kenning is lynched.Kenning heals Cerwyn, or Erenford if Cerwyn is lynched.Cerwyn heals Erenford, or Yronwood if Erenford is lynched.Erenford heals Yronwood, or Stokeworth if Yronwood is lynched.Yronwood heals Stokeworth, or Lannister if Stokeworth is lynched.Lannister, please confirm that you have changed your night action so that you are healing me, or Tyrell if I'm lynched.Only 2 people who still need to check in on this are Dondarrion and Lannister (for the 2nd time). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Targaryen Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 It is day 2.11 players remain: Eadweard Dondarrion, Francesca Cerwyn, Jez Tyrell, Ronald Kenning, Rose Tully, Rupert Martell, Siobhan Stokeworth, Stevie Yronwood, Thomas Hunt Stonetree, Veronica Lannister, Victor Erenford.6 votes are needed for a conviction or to go to night.1 vote for Francesca Cerwyn (Victor Erenford)10 players have not voted: Eadweard Dondarrion, Francesca Cerwyn, Jez Tyrell, Ronald Kenning, Rose Tully, Rupert Martell, Siobhan Stokeworth, Stevie Yronwood, Thomas Hunt Stonetree, Veronica Lannister. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Connington Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Earlier Yronwood mentioned that Cerwyn seemed eager to shoot down Tyrell's plans. Something that a FM might want to do. The same can be said of Stokeworth -Tyrell, are you so sure we are allowed to give our points to each other? Why? I never asked mods, but I am quite sure I won't allow this in an individual game. And... could you stop suggesting plans and suggest a lynch instead? Who you think is better suspect than yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Dayne Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Sorry guys, the flu got worse I had to visit the doc again and he strongly suggested that I rest up :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Targaryen Posted December 10, 2009 Author Share Posted December 10, 2009 :grouphug:Get well soon, TBH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Connington Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 The other thing that stands out to me in light of Stark's innocence is how Tully agreed with Cerwyn's assumption that Stark was evil. Again, I don't think it's bad to consider the possibility, but Tully just jumps in the whole way, same as Cerwyn. She starts that with a vote early in the day, and then follows with this comment to Cerwyn.I've read through from the start of the more serious conversation, and I think your analysis is essentially solid. Kenning, in particular, seems to have played a key role in moving things away from Stark. I do think you need to be careful in letting people go just because they didn't push away from Stark hard. So, yes, Dondarrion and Kenning, but also Martell. He left himself open to voting Stark, but ultimately didn't, the rest could just be distancing.Also I might as well respond to Tully on another point-The FM will get points where they can, and deny innocents points where they can, but probably not at the price of looking suspicious. I see something like Erenford and Tyrell's game of chicken as a place where an FM might play for points if they think they can get away with it. They may even be aware that getting more innocents to vote innocent is a good thing for them. Generally playing to get innocents to vote innocent without voting themselves? That sounds like risky play to me.Why is it risky? Is it going to stand out that much if in the early part of the game they just have maybe 1 FM join the mob and the other 2 pursue other options? I don't know that we'd notice if they did it right.As for where to go with my speculation, well there are now 4 players remaining who weren't on the day 1 mob - Tully, Lannister, Stonetree, and Stokeworth. Odds are that one of you is guilty anyway, even without my theory and just based on percentages and normal FM vote distribution, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to find out 2 of you are evil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Redfort Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Of course, Donny and Kenny could be bad even with Stark being good. I mean, if one innocent is clearly target #1, then shifting the mob onto a second innocent would be a smart play, as it leaves the original target #1 as the focus for day 2.Especially if you kill someone who suspects them.Gah. I'm not WIFOMing my way to an innocent Stark! :-pSorry, maybe I missed something here, but isn't that what you were doing? After all, you started the suspicion on Botley (see all that stuff about chainsawing) and then decided to attack Stark. Then you were ok with the Botley lynch but still maintained Stark as a suspect on the second day. I'm confused about how your behavior is different from that of the people who you thought were either a) evil partners of Stark (now an impossibility, I will not hesitate to point out, so no drinks for you in spoilers), or B) evil and trying to set up Stark to look evil on Day 2.Need I point out that you were the one doing all the legwork to lynch Stark on Day 2?It's a good thing I don't actually suspect you, Cerwyn, or else you'd have my vote right now for sheer failure of self-analysis. :worried:Martell, I was working on a re-read of the day (uh, skipped back and took over an hour on and off reading, so I missed your post, but Tully is probably my #1 suspect. It would be Cerwyn if I didn't have a ridiculous (gut?) feeling that Cerwyn was innocent because someone evil would not have made an argument based on someone having symps on Day 1. That's really the only reason I have for Cerwyn to be innocent. Well, that and innocents can have spectacular logic failures just as easily as FM can, but I won't hold that against them. I'm going to re-read Dondarrion, because I can't remember anything they've done other than make it to 3 in Cerwyn's trifecta of evil along with, well, two innocents. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Mooton Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 What makes these 3 particular players, or their healers, stand out?Well, I mixed two things: 1) I'd target you, Erenford or Cerwyn as stong and unlynchable; 2) and I'd hope for a healer being egoistic. I didn't check who were these players' healers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Clegane Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Tyrell has 4 points, unless he used some last night. 1 post, 20 posts, hammer vote, and never changed his vote.So he should be able to just heal himself, and the rest of us can match up with each other.I like the plan. I actually also sort of liked the first plan, and was going to point out a few positive aspects to it, but got distracted by an awesome lunch. Not sure it's worth mentioning those points now, since it's probably best to just to stick with this plan, because if we can stop the FM from ever killing, it buys us a ton of time.If he heals himself he's still not PI, but I think his idea is pure genius, so I'm on board! The only thing I'm unclear on is whether or not to remove a suspicious player before we act. Tyrell is either innocent or intends to win the game by gaining everyone's trust and killing off his partners. If he were evil I think he would have saved this for later in the game, so I am happy to have him heal himself if we don't choose a suitable lynch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Corbray Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Oh, but there were no murder weapons. Because Gareth Stark was innocent. Sorry.Well poo. This sends me back to the drawing board and I really don't have time to do the reading I need to.The other thing that stands out to me in light of Stark's innocence is how Tully agreed with Cerwyn's assumption that Stark was evil. Again, I don't think it's bad to consider the possibility, but Tully just jumps in the whole way, same as Cerwyn. She starts that with a vote early in the day, and then follows with this comment to Cerwyn.Cerwyn and I have both obviously put ourselves in what is likely to be an uncomfortable situation now that Stark has turned up innocent, but I think that we only look bad in hindsight. I still contend that up until his modkill Stark was the most suspicious person in the game and that I didn't say anything unreasonable in going after him.Why is it risky? Is it going to stand out that much if in the early part of the game they just have maybe 1 FM join the mob and the other 2 pursue other options? I don't know that we'd notice if they did it right.As for where to go with my speculation, well there are now 4 players remaining who weren't on the day 1 mob - Tully, Lannister, Stonetree, and Stokeworth. Odds are that one of you is guilty anyway, even without my theory and just based on percentages and normal FM vote distribution, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to find out 2 of you are evil.It's risky because it requires the FM to push a lynch that they themselves don't want to vote for, which ought to be seen as fairly suspicious behaviour. If you simply mean that evils are less likely to pile on an innocent lynch at the end of the day then you may have a point, but you see where the assumptions start to come in? Usually we think that evil is more likely to join an innocent lynch, especially if they're trying to detract attention from an evil alternative.As far as Lannister, Stonetree, Stokeworth and I are concerned. You're right. There is a decent chance that there is evil among us. Gah, I need time to read and I don't have it.Lannister, please confirm that you have changed your night action so that you are healing me, or Tyrell if I'm lynched.Stokeworth also needs to update his secondary heal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Redfort Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Cerwyn and I have both obviously put ourselves in what is likely to be an uncomfortable situation now that Stark has turned up innocent, but I think that we only look bad in hindsight. I still contend that up until his modkill Stark was the most suspicious person in the game and that I didn't say anything unreasonable in going after him.I dunno. To me it seemed like you and Cerwyn both subscribed to the "Well, our Day 1 lynch was wrong, so therefore there's a higher than average chance of our second choice being correct, so let's try that one again." Tunnelvision much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Clegane Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Ok, I've sent in my PM to heal Stonetree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Corbray Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 I dunno. To me it seemed like you and Cerwyn both subscribed to the "Well, our Day 1 lynch was wrong, so therefore there's a higher than average chance of our second choice being correct, so let's try that one again." Tunnelvision much?Tunnelvision, perhaps, but the only logic I subscribed to was the "Well, the most suspicious person from day one didn't get lynched and since I left had only made himself look more suspicious so he's the lad I'll keep pursuing" line of thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Redfort Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Well ok. I actually re-read again and you came off looking a lot better, so now I need to re-read the people who I keep forgetting exist, like Stonetree and...um....the other one. :unsure:ETA: Lannister!ETA #2, meant to report on Dondarrion. I guess I don't really see what's suspicious about Dondarrion aside from the part where Cerwyn seems to base suspicion around Stark's guilt, which is not a given.ETA #3: Does anyone else hate the new "find all posts by this user" feature? The old one, with actual post text, was soooo much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Mooton Posted December 10, 2009 Share Posted December 10, 2009 Stokeworth also needs to update his secondary heal.Confirm.Heal Lannister or Martell if Lannister lynched.By the way, do we want to lynch Lannister? Six posts only and totally under radars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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