Fearsome Fred Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 What he told was top secret--his deepest secrets. Why would he then leave out that small bit of info?Because (1) it is also top secret; (2) there is no "all or nothing" rule with top secret information; (3) rather, the rule for top secret information is "reveal on a need to know basis"; (4) as already explained, he has particular reasons for not trusting her with this particular information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kephv Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Because (1) it is also top secret; (2) there is no "all or nothing" rule with top secret information; (3) rather, the rule for top secret information is "reveal on a need to know basis"; (4) as already explained, he has particular reasons for not trusting her with this particular information.4. He has no reason not to trust her with something like that. She wanted to crown Myrcella, but that was before she knew his plans for her and Dorne. It would make no sense for her to do so afterwards.Because travel is dangerous, royal people are big targets, and ambush / kidnapping / assassination are real possibilities.Except that she doesn't mention a third task. Only two tasks. So it does not fit.The second task is obviously the assassination of Trystane. There would be no reason to leave out such a small detail to the council such as retrieving Myrcella unless said plan involved the killing of Trystane.Doesn't take much to put the two together.Except with Fearsome Fred, who, when putting two and two together, always comes out with five. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nev yn Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Because travel is dangerous, royal people are big targets, and ambush / kidnapping / assassination are real possibilities.Then why does Swann stutter and panic when Doran suggests a sea voyage instead? It's faster, and less likely to be met by ambush. Less time for these people aiming for big targets to find out Myrcella is no longer in Dorne and must be heading to KL.Except that she doesn't mention a third task. Only two tasks.Poor Swann, even his fans think he's too dim to be able to chew bubblegum and walk at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearsome Fred Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 Then why does Swann stutter and panic when Doran suggests a sea voyage instead? It's faster, and less likely to be met by ambush. The best way to avoid ambush is to control your own itinerary. I'm sure Cersei does not trust Doran.Poor Swann, even his fans think he's too dim to be able to chew bubblegum and walk at the same time.If you must postulate that Cersei's "other task" is really a reference to TWO other tasks, both of which are secret, then you essentially concede that we only have Doran's word that Cersei is plotting Tristane's death.You are interpreting Cersei's words to fit Doran's words. Your interpretation works well enough, but it works the other way too. Cersei's words do not confirm anything. In the final analysis, all we have are Doran's words.In any event, we know that Doran (for whatever reason) has no intention of letting the expedition reach King's Landing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bran Vras Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 The theory that Myrcella is dead is intriguing. In particular because we know that she has a body double, Rosamund, and they have exchanged identities when they were in Braavos. Rosamund will play a role at some point.To return to the topic of Quentyn and the dragons. I'd like to advertise an interesting, little-noticed fact. When Arianne is emprisonned in the tower, she has at her disposal a large book on dragons (of the scientific type, not a collection of tales). We know from the Tyrion chapters in ADwD that books about dragons are rare and important. Correct me if I am wrong: there is no sign that Quentyn has ever heard about that book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The GRRumbler Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 In before this topic is closed.The thing is, Fearsome Fred, as you quoted yourself, we don't "see" Quentyn burning from someone else's perspective, we know, from his own pov, that he is, in fact, burning, he sees his whip burning, sees his hand burning, and him giving a scream:"When he raised his whip, he saw that the lash was burning. His hand as well. All of him, all ofhim was burning.Oh, he thought. Then he began to scream."All of him was burning! In his own pov! Do you really need more proof than that!!!???/thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 In before this topic is closed.The thing is, Fearsome Fred, as you quoted yourself, we don't "see" Quentyn burning from someone else's perspective, we know, from his own pov, that he is, in fact, burning, he sees his whip burning, sees his hand burning, and him giving a scream:"When he raised his whip, he saw that the lash was burning. His hand as well. All of him, all ofhim was burning.Oh, he thought. Then he began to scream."All of him was burning! In his own pov! Do you really need more proof than that!!!???/threadThanks for this. I was so struck by the absurdity of Balon getting punked by a fake Myrcella that I forgot what the original thesis was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The GRRumbler Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Thanks for this. I was so struck by the absurdity of Balon getting punked by a fake Myrcella that I forgot what the original thesis was.And the thing is, th first time Fearsome Fred quoted this same passage he removed the part that says all of him was burning, why would he do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark@heart Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 A mad man sees what he sees.Sorry, couldn't resist. :drunk: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Plantagenet Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Surely awards for longest and most optimistic post ever are in order. Quentyn failed. He died horribly because of it. Smiles didn't come easy to him in life, and were harder in death. He smiled because his lips were burned of. The resultant impression is of a grin. Its horrible thing to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Plantagenet Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Surely awards for longest and most optimistic post ever are in order. Quentyn failed. He died horribly because of it. Smiles didn't come easy to him in life, and were harder in death. He smiled because his lips were burned of. The resultant impression is of a grin. Its horrible thing to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearsome Fred Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 All of him was burning! In his own pov! Do you really need more proof than that!!!???You are being very literal. But if "all of him was burning," then his eyeballs were burning. And if his eyeballs were burning he could not see, nor would he be likely to think "oh" before he belatedly started screaming. So something is surreal about the passage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humphrey Plantagenet Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Surely awards for longest and most optimistic post ever are in order. Quentyn failed. He died horribly because of it. Smiles didn't come easy to him in life, and were harder in death. He smiled because his lips were burned of. The resultant impression is of a grin. Its horrible thing to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I'm to the point now where I think this person almost has to be a troll. Everyone is obviously free to do what they please and obviously I'm not a mod, but I humbly suggest ignoring this fellow — there's nowhere for this thread to go, the argument's been made and now it's just circular — and getting this thread buried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearsome Fred Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 And the thing is, th first time Fearsome Fred quoted this same passage he removed the part that says all of him was burning, why would he do that?My original post in this thread quotes it in its entirety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The GRRumbler Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 You are being very literal. But if "all of him was burning," then his eyeballs were burning. And if his eyeballs were burning he could not see, nor would he be likely to think "oh" before he belatedly started screaming. So something is surreal about the passage.LOL :lmao: obvious troll is obviouslook at the sequence, first he sees the whip, then his hand, then all of him, and at the point of the "all of him", he really doesnt need his eyes anymore to know he is burning, all of him.And afterwards there is actually a passage that says his eyes became pools of pus, so there's that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kephv Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 You are being very literal. But if "all of him was burning," then his eyeballs were burning. And if his eyeballs were burning he could not see, nor would he be likely to think "oh" before he belatedly started screaming. So something is surreal about the passage.He was caught from behind by Rhaegal. He also shields his eyes with the whip and his arm, which is when he notices he is burning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearsome Fred Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 He was caught from behind by Rhaegal. He also shields his eyes with the whip and his arm, which is when he notices he is burning.It's a delayed reaction no matter how you look at it. He gets caught from behind, turns, recites Rhaegal's name, raises the whip to strike, then notices he is burning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearsome Fred Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 look at the sequence, first he sees the whip, then his hand, then all of him, and at the point of the "all of him", he really doesnt need his eyes anymore to know he is burning, all of him.So you are suggesting that his hand (whether cloth, leather or flesh or all three) became hot enough to ignite before the air in front of his eyes became hot enought to force him to blink shut? Does not fit to me. As I said, it could be an unrealistic passage. But it could also be a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearsome Fred Posted February 3, 2012 Author Share Posted February 3, 2012 He smiled because his lips were burned of.Possibly yes. But Missandei noticed a difference, and she was there the whole time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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