Seasick Drake Posted June 20, 2012 Share Posted June 20, 2012 Was there anything that you got surprised about/had forgotten about on a second read through? For me, I had completely forgotten that *spoilers* the first "Reek" we see is really Ramsay Bolton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crown Posted June 24, 2012 Share Posted June 24, 2012 I had a hard time understanding the Reek/Ramsay plot the first time I read it. I'm currently on my first re-read, almost finished Thrones, so I'm eager to re-read that part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerCrickard Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 The Reek/Ramsey thing really threw me off first time round. One thing that I completely didn't catch on to was the scenes in the HoTU. The RW was shown in one of the doors. First time I read it I totally didn't piece that together but knew right away this time round. There's so much to pick up on second time around! I'm currently on book 3 again, read the RW chapters a few days ago. Those Frey turncloak b*st*rds! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dianna1975 Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 My first time reading the series a few months ago, I spent about a book and a half after reading the scene Arya overhears in the KL "dragon" dungeons in GOT trying to figure out who those people were, and then after awhile I forgot about it.....And then when I picked up GOT for a second read about 3 weeks ago, I got to that first Dany chapter and when they describe Illyrio as having a yellow, forked beard I almost SHOUTED on the bus "That's HIM!!!!". So I flip forward to the Arya scene and read it through --- I assume the guy with him is Connington, right?As much I fight the desire to speed through again, its having little revelations like that, that make me sloooooowwww it down, and telling myself there are so many tiny details I missed.I'm pretty sure when I'm done I'll need to do a third re-read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 The Reek/Ramsey thing really threw me off first time round. One thing that I completely didn't catch on to was the scenes in the HoTU. The RW was shown in one of the doors. First time I read it I totally didn't piece that together but knew right away this time round. There's so much to pick up on second time around! I'm currently on book 3 again, read the RW chapters a few days ago. Those Frey turncloak b*st*rds!Now I'm really going to surprise you - many people do not believe the scene shown in the HoTU is the Red Wedding. Go back and re-read the description, and see if it matches the details at the RW. It doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Snowman Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 My first time reading the series a few months ago, I spent about a book and a half after reading the scene Arya overhears in the KL "dragon" dungeons in GOT trying to figure out who those people were, and then after awhile I forgot about it.....And then when I picked up GOT for a second read about 3 weeks ago, I got to that first Dany chapter and when they describe Illyrio as having a yellow, forked beard I almost SHOUTED on the bus "That's HIM!!!!". So I flip forward to the Arya scene and read it through --- I assume the guy with him is Connington, right?As much I fight the desire to speed through again, its having little revelations like that, that make me sloooooowwww it down, and telling myself there are so many tiny details I missed.I'm pretty sure when I'm done I'll need to do a third re-read.Wasn't the other guy he was talking to Varys? Or am I getting confused with the TV show. Im sure it was Varys talking with Illyrio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What Is Dead Already Died Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 It was Varys and Illyrio talking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonTargaryenW/Viserion4WIN Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Now I'm really going to surprise you - many people do not believe the scene shown in the HoTU is the Red Wedding. Go back and re-read the description, and see if it matches the details at the RW. It doesn't.I disagree...."...she came across a feast of corpses. Savagely slaughtered, the feasters lay strewn across overturned chairs and hacked trestle tables, asprawl in pools of congealed blood. Some had lost limbs, even heads. Severed hands clutched bloody cups, wooden spoons, roast fowl, heels of bread. In a throne above them sat a dead man with the head of a wolf. He wore an iron crown and held a leg of lamb in one hand as a king might hold a scepter, and his eyes followed Dany with mute appeal. "Sounds like RW to me. Especially the depiction of Grey Wind's head being sewn on Robb's body. And Robb had an iron crown also. To the OP: I hadn't picked up on Jaqen having the same description as the Alchemist. Makes me wonder about FM motivations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 I disagree...."...she came across a feast of corpses. Savagely slaughtered, the feasters lay strewn across overturned chairs and hacked trestle tables, asprawl in pools of congealed blood. Some had lost limbs, even heads. Severed hands clutched bloody cups, wooden spoons, roast fowl, heels of bread. In a throne above them sat a dead man with the head of a wolf. He wore an iron crown and held a leg of lamb in one hand as a king might hold a scepter, and his eyes followed Dany with mute appeal. "Sounds like RW to me. Especially the depiction of Grey Wind's head being sewn on Robb's body. And Robb had an iron crown also.There are threads on this topic.As I recall, the food is different, as is the crown. Amazingly enough, there are pages of arguments over these points. Including the fact the man has a head of a wolf, not a man's body with a wolf's head sewn on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dianna1975 Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 It was Varys and Illyrio talking.I read it back and forth a few times -- they take great pains to discuss what the other guy is wearing. And it says his face is scarred, and he has stubble, and a steel cap (like the Unsullied).Now, I recognize, Varys has shown he can change appearance, so I think it certainly could be him. Is this something that has been discussed a definite elsewhere? Plus Arya makes note of the fact he seems familiar somehow, but that could mean anything really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatrickStormborn Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 There are threads on this topic.As I recall, the food is different, as is the crown. Amazingly enough, there are pages of arguments over these points. Including the fact the man has a head of a wolf, not a man's body with a wolf's head sewn on. Foreshadowing is not supposed to be exactly specific. All that matters is that a king is slain at a feast, and the head of a wolf is attached to his body. He looks to Dany with 'mute appeal' -- she's the last hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SerCrickard Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Now I'm really going to surprise you - many people do not believe the scene shown in the HoTU is the Red Wedding. Go back and re-read the description, and see if it matches the details at the RW. It doesn't.Well, that is interesting but i don't think i'm convinced. The way i see it is that its a vision of (at that time) a possible future. IMO it wouldn't have to be depicted exactly as it will happen but your point is interesting. If not the RW, then what else could it be about?To the OP: I hadn't picked up on Jaqen having the same description as the Alchemist. Makes me wonder about FM motivations.Also, this. I haven't gotten as far as this on my re-read but i was talking to a fella about this on the set of the Blackwater battle (actually a board member, Giant of Lannister i think??) and he had mentioned this to me. He kinda prompted my re-read after that conversation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GameTheory Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 The Frey Pie totally took me off guard the first time. I completely missed it. Just completely. When I got on the forums I was so surprised to hear about the Frey Pie. I'm in the middle of AGOT reread, but I'm looking forward to getting to this part in the later books. As it's been said, there are so many little details you miss when you are just reading for plot that you can take the time to enjoy during a reread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty501 Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 I read it back and forth a few times -- they take great pains to discuss what the other guy is wearing. And it says his face is scarred, and he has stubble, and a steel cap (like the Unsullied).Now, I recognize, Varys has shown he can change appearance, so I think it certainly could be him. Is this something that has been discussed a definite elsewhere?Plus Arya makes note of the fact he seems familiar somehow, but that could mean anything really.This was Varys in his disguise as Rugen, the jailor. Varys has more disguises than Shagga has axes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Well, that is interesting but i don't think i'm convinced. The way i see it is that its a vision of (at that time) a possible future. IMO it wouldn't have to be depicted exactly as it will happen but your point is interesting. If not the RW, then what else could it be about?Sorry, finally had a chance to look this up, for your interest. I'll get the thread reference too.ETA: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/63754-hotu-showed-the-red-wedding-or-did-it/Posted 23 March 2012 - 07:08 PM - Apple MartiniTze, who's one of the smartest, most thoughtful posters on here and to whom you should all pay attention, made an incredible observation about the vision of the Red Wedding that Dany sees in the House of the Undying. Namely, that it wasn't the Red Wedding that Dany saw.To make my own contribution ... in Judeo-Christian mythos, lambs are a symbol of purity and innocence. If this vision does indeed pertain to Bran, might the lamb-leg "scepter" be a symbol of him losing his innocence on his path to being a greenseer? I know several posters subscribe to the idea that Bloodraven's/the Children's motives aren't 100% pure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dianna1975 Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 This was Varys in his disguise as Rugen, the jailor. Varys has more disguises than Shagga has axes.Good one :-)After hearing the evidence, it definitely makes sense. Plus the bit about Arya noticing how quietly the man moved -- that description is always used in reference to Varys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Manwoody Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Every time I re-read the books I find something I missed. This time...Gelmarr the Grim, Aggar, Gynir RednoseI just realized that Theon killed those men himself to make sure the truth about the boy corpses would not be told. Then he killed Farlen to punish the people in the castle for the deaths. In the paragraph about Farlen there are a couple of sentences...I had no choice, he wanted to scream at the corpse. The ironborn can't keep secrets, they had to die, and someone had to take the blame for it.Somehow I missed that when I previously read the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Manwoody Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 I also just realized that Elmar Frey's princess was Arya. Never caught that one the first time around either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBamBoo Posted July 7, 2012 Share Posted July 7, 2012 I have only just started a re-read from the beginning so I imagine there's going to be a lot I missed first time around.I remember being shocked by Jorah's betrayal of Dany later on in the series yet, in the first few chapter of GoT he is mentionned by Robert as someone who is feeding info to Varys. Completely missed it on the first read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasick Drake Posted July 8, 2012 Author Share Posted July 8, 2012 I was surprised, again, that it was Sansa who told the queen about Neds plan to leave Kings Landing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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