A Thread for Small Questions XIX

[Winter's Knight]

In aDwD, when Dany meets Quaithe, she says: NO. Hear me, Daenerys Targaryen. The glass candles are burning. Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon. Trust none of them. Remember the undying. Beware the perfumed seneschal.

The kraken is Victarion, the Lion is Tyrion, the griffin is Jon Connington, the sun's son is Quentyn, and the mummer's dragon is Aegon. who is the dark flame?

I think it's the Red Priest travelling with Vick.

[Fantôme]

Is there evidence that Lyanna was younger than Benjen?

[hum]

Is there evidence that Lyanna was younger than Benjen?

I don't think so, if Lyanna was younger than Benjen, I think Benjen would have been involved in her rescue. There wasn't any mention about his involvement, so I assume he is the youngest of them.

[Quentyn the Blazed]

Is there evidence that Lyanna was younger than Benjen?

Theres evidence that Lyanna is older.

During the story about the knight of the laughing tree, Lyanna is the she-wolf while Benjen is the pup, "youngest of the four"

Also, in Brans wierwood visions, he see a girl who looks like Arya and a younger boy fighting with wooden swords. Its implied that its Lyanna and BenJen

[LuisDantas]

In aDwD, when Dany meets Quaithe, she says: NO. Hear me, Daenerys Targaryen. The glass candles are burning. Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon. Trust none of them. Remember the undying. Beware the perfumed seneschal.

The kraken is Victarion, the Lion is Tyrion, the griffin is Jon Connington, the sun's son is Quentyn, and the mummer's dragon is Aegon. who is the dark flame?

I thought it would be Melisandre, but as Winter's Knight pointed out above, it is probably Moqorro instead. Victarion even says that his crew has taken to calling him "the black flame" or "the dark flame" (I forget which) due to his garments made from a black greyjoy flag, or perhaps to the darkness of his skin.

[Fantôme]

Okay thank you.

[three-eyed monkey]

Well, Bran wanted to become a Kingsguard and nobody thought it was an unheard of precedent, so there you are.

The assumption that there are no knights in the North is a common misconception.

Correct. There are knights in the north, ser wylis manderly of white harbour and ser helman tallhart of torrhen's square, and ser roddrick to name but three. Knights are not a religous order as such but more a brotherhood who follow a strict code of conduct to protect and serve. Ideally this begins with squiring, earning your spurs, and being knighted in recognition of your deeds of valour by a knight. Some, like sandor clegane, did not deserve to have their shoulders touched but did for political reasons and this, according to people of selmy barristan's ilk, was a corruption of knighthood itself.

[Lebronn Jaime]

Knighthood in Westeros is a religious rite. Like any oath, you can say the words without meaning them, which is presumably what a Northern knight would do (if the Northern knights in the book are indeed adherents of the Old Gods and not followers of the Faith of the Seven).

There's this as well (from Martin himself):

Can someone who keeps to the old gods be made a knight too or is it a exclusive of the Seven?

The latter. Those who follow the old gods can be the northern equivilent of knights, but it's not quite the same.

Maybe the Northern "Ser" is just a style like "True Warden of the East". :dunno:

[King Doug]

Yeah I know what your saying. I wonder why the wealth of House Hightower is never talked about like that of the Lannisters?

So is House Florent like the second Largest Bannermen to House Tyrell, after House Hightower? Or would it be House Redwyne, or Tarly? Because if it is House Florent that would mean that House Hightower has about 30-40 men right? Because didn't the Florents have somewhere around 10-15 thousand men(most of them went to Stannis after Renly died), and Sam said his father always said House Hightower commanded three times more men than any other Tyrell Bannermen, and "even more if they count the cobblestones", is what the book says.

I am not sure how many men House Redwyne commands, I know they have 200 war ships in their fleet, and a thousand merchant ships, so maybe they are the second biggest Bannermen to the Tyrell's, next to House Hightower?

And I have no idea how many men are specifically under House Tarly. I do know that Randyll Tarly often commands a large part of the Tyrell army, but that's because he is an awesome war General, and not necessarily because they all are sworn to House Tarly. So it's hard to say how many men House Tarly has. I am trying to figure out the second largest Bannermen to House Tyrell, that way I can multiply that number by 3 or 4, and figure out how many men belong to House Hightower.

That's crazy though, I don't know how it escaped me on all my other rereads, but I just now caught that tonight, I had no idea House Hightower was so powerful.

I believe that House Florent would be the #2, no lower than #3. Mainly because they were so pissed when Aegon the Conqueror gave the Tyrells Highgarden. Also, when the Florents were dispossessed for following Stannis, Randyll Tarly was super pissed for not being given Brightwater Keep. That implies that the Florent lands are quite rich and powerful.

I don't know where you get the idea the Florents can field an army of 10-15000 though. No way any house (other than HIghtower or any house that is Warden) in the entire 7 kingdoms can field an army near or over 10,000 without sellswords. They can probably muster 2-3000.

If Florent isn't #2, then the Redwynes are. But I never got the impression that House Tarly was all that powerful. They are strong because they have a strong leader. If they were all that powerful the Randyll Tarly wouldn't have been that upset about not being given Brightwater Keep.

[Black Wolf Smith]

Is there evidence that Lyanna was younger than Benjen?

As already said The story of the knight of the Laughing tree has Benjen the youngest. Wiki of ice and fire shows Benjen in between Ned and Lyanna, but doesn't give a year of birth, I guess nobody changed it.

[Dragonfish]

Some, like sandor clegane, did not deserve to have their shoulders touched but did for political reasons and this, according to people of selmy barristan's ilk, was a corruption of knighthood itself.

Sandor is not a knight.

[Black Wolf Smith]

I have seen over the last couple of days, people saying things like Tarly might go over to JC, YG, and the GC. Is there any thing to suport this? or a thread on the theory?

[King Doug]

I have seen over the last couple of days, people saying things like Tarly might go over to JC, YG, and the GC. Is there any thing to suport this? or a thread on the theory?

As far as I know it is just speculation because someone said (maybe Jon Connington) that Aegon has friends in the Reach. Many people speculate it could be Tarly. Personally, I agree Tarly is going to declare for Aegon because he is unhappy with the Tyrells. Tarly thinks he should have been given the Florent's house (Brightwater Keep) after the Florents were dispossessed because they still support Stannis.

[Black Wolf Smith]

As far as I know it is just speculation because someone said (maybe Jon Connington) that Aegon has friends in the Reach. Many people speculate it could be Tarly. Personally, I agree Tarly is going to declare for Aegon because he is unhappy with the Tyrells. Tarly thinks he should have been given the Florent's house (Brightwater Keep) after the Florents were dispossessed because they still support Stannis.

IMO I was thinking he would on my own. They way he is I thought He would see a trueborn Targ as the true king, He fought for them during Roberts rebellion, and even if thinks the children are Roberts he wouldn't think that Crown should be theirs.

[Stannis's Sworn Sword]

What was Lord steffon baratheon doing in "insert free citys name" when he found patchface? If i remember correctly, he was sent by Aerys to look for a bride for raehgar because he had no sisters.Are there Targs living in the free cities that Aeyrs & Steffon knew about?

[Lebronn Jaime]

What was Lord steffon baratheon doing in "insert free citys name" when he found patchface? If i remember correctly, he was sent by Aerys to look for a bride for raehgar because he had no sisters.Are there Targs living in the free cities that Aeyrs & Steffon knew about?

No, but there are Valyrian families in the Free Cities. If your follow-up question is "why not just marry one of the Valyrian families in Westeros?" then I have no answer.

[Rinso]

No, but there are Valyrian families in the Free Cities. If your follow-up question is "why not just marry one of the Valyrian families in Westeros?" then I have no answer.

My guess would be that he deemed them unworthy. After all, he refused to marry Rhaegar to Cersei because in his eyes the Lannisters were a servant's family; I'd guess that this attitude of his was valid for almost all families in Westeros.

[What Is Dead Already Died]

Also any free city family Steffon would talk to would be extremely wealthy. So how much do you wanna pay to put your daughter on the iron throne?

[Ghost714]

I believe that House Florent would be the #2, no lower than #3. Mainly because they were so pissed when Aegon the Conqueror gave the Tyrells Highgarden. Also, when the Florents were dispossessed for following Stannis, Randyll Tarly was super pissed for not being given Brightwater Keep. That implies that the Florent lands are quite rich and powerful.

I don't know where you get the idea the Florents can field an army of 10-15000 though. No way any house (other than HIghtower or any house that is Warden) in the entire 7 kingdoms can field an army near or over 10,000 without sellswords. They can probably muster 2-3000.

If Florent isn't #2, then the Redwynes are. But I never got the impression that House Tarly was all that powerful. They are strong because they have a strong leader. If they were all that powerful the Randyll Tarly wouldn't have been that upset about not being given Brightwater Keep.

The Florents, and many other House's can field more than 2-3 thousand men. The Frey's alone contributed 4 thousand men to Robb's army, and they are from the Riverlands, the Reach is much more populous and rich. Paxter Redwyne has 200 war ships, if those war ships have an average of 50 men each(likely more on each ship, considering some ships have over 200 men on them), then that's 10,000 men alone right there.

The Ironborn have the smaller ships, of like 50 people, but they use much smaller ships usually. So it's very likely Paxter Redwyne has over 10,000 on his 200 warships. That's not counting the 1000 merchant ships that Redwyne commands, that could potentionally be used for fighting. The Ironborn have to have somewhere around 20,000-30,000 fighting men, all sworn to House Greyjoy, to man all the ships they have been said to have. So there are definitely Bannermen in the reach that command more than 2-3 thousand men.

I was thinking the same thing, for why the Florents would be the 2nd biggest Tyrell Bannermen, because they always felt they should have been given Highgarden, so they must be pretty big and powerful.

And I got my number of the Florents having around 10-15 thousand men, because when Stannis gets a big portion or Renly's army, I believe he said it was mostly made up of Florents. When Stannis attacked King's Landing, he had 20,000 foot/calvary, and 200 ships in his fleet. If most of that is from House Florent, then that should put their House strength around 10-15 thousand. That's what I was thinking anyway, I am not saying its definitely true, but that's how I came up with that number. However I do know it's definitely true that some Great House's can field more than 2-3 men. Roose Bolton before the war had like 4,000 men, and they are not from the Reach. The Tyrell's command like 80,000 men, so it definitely stands to reason that their biggest Bannermen contribute more than 2-3 thousand men. All those men may not be directly sworn to House Florent, or Redwyne, but they are sworn to lesser Lords that are then sworn to those House's, and that's what I am talking about. I never meant that one House specifically has that many men directly sworn to them.

[King Doug]

<snip>

Yea, pretty good points. The only argument I might have is the Riverlands is pretty populous, and the Freys would be among the Tully's strongest bannermen.

But including houses sworn to lesser houses that are sworn to them, not out of the realm of possibility they could get to 10,000. Above that though.....I don't know. I was under the impression the makeup of his army (the one he gained after Renly's death) was a pretty good mix-up of different lords. After all, all the lords that were at Storm's End with Renly switched. But I'm sure the Florents did provide a lot.