W.Kane Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 1.1 Not Guilty 1.2 Guilty1.3 Guilty1.4 Guilty2 Guilty3.1 Not Guilty3.2 Not Guilty3.3 Not Guilty3.4 Not Guilty4.1 Guilty4.2 Guilty5.1 Guilty5.2 GuiltyGuiltyDaenerys of house Targaryens , the Flames await you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walder Waters Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 1. Four Counts of Murder:-1.1 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully killed a godswife, Mirri Maz Duur, by ordering her to be tied to her husband’s funeral pyre, and then burning her alive.Mirri Maz Duur zombified Khal Drogo and murdered Rhaego. Although she was enslaved by the defendant a justification on behalf of self-defence does not apply. First of all Mirri Maz Duur did not act to defend herself, but take vengeance. Furthermore she acted in order to prevent that Rhaego will become a Khal himself. The latter is no justification neither as the circumstances for a pre-emptive defence were too inconcrete as of the time of the deed. Therefore Mirri Maz Duur was guilty of murder herself. Her position as godswife does not give her any immunity. As captive of the defendant the latter did have juristidiction in that case. The defendant therefore was justified to scentence Mirri Maz Duur to die. The concrete form of execution (burning her alive) is another matter, but shall be discussed under the charge of torture. innocent1.2 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully killed Kraznys mo Nakloz, a citizen of Astapor by instructing her dragon, Drogon, to burn him to death, which instruction was carried out.War against slavery is a valid casus belli. The Defendant is not justified though as she did not formally declare war previously.guilty1.3 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully ordered her soldiers to kill a citizen of Astapor, Grazdan mo Ullor, and to massacre the adult free male inhabitants of Astapor, which order was carried out.See above.guilty1.4 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully crucified 163 of the Great Masters of Mereen.See above.guilty2. One Count of Genocide.The massacre of the adult free males of Astapor, detailed in charge 1.3, amounted to the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national groupEven if the casus belli would apply the defendant could not be justified as a genocide is a war crime no matter whether the war itfelf is justified or not. If these people were guilty of slavery or murder itself she could have been justified, but as she did not give them a fair trial to investigate every single case. guilty3. Four Counts of Torture3.1 The burning of Mirri Maz Duur, detailed in charge 1.1, amounted to torture.Although the death sentence was justified the concrete form of execution (burning her alive) was not. Burning people alive is inhuman and motivated by vengeance not justice. guilty3.2 The crucifixion of the Great Masters, detailed in charge 1.4, amounted to torture.Same argumentation as above.guilty3.3 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully ordered two wineseller’s daughters to be tortured in front of her father, in order to procure information relating to the Sons of the Harpy.Torturing people in hopes of getting information is not justified. The defendant did not exhaust the possible methods of investigation.guilty3.4 The Defendant, intentionally and unlawfully ordered numerous unnamed inhabitants of Mereen to be tortured, on suspicion that they were Sons of the Harpy.See above.guilty4. Two Counts of Criminal Damage to Property.4.1 The Defendant unlawfully and intentionally set fire to the House of the Undying in Qarth, resulting in its destruction.Justified on behalf of self-defence.innocent4.2 The Defendant unlawfully and intentionally sacked the City of Mereen, resulting in millions of Dragons’ worth of destruction to property.There was a decelaration of war. War against slavery is a valid casus belli.innocent5. Two counts of Waging Wars of Aggression5.1 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully waged a war of aggression against YunkaiSee above.innocent5.2 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully waged a war of aggression against Mereen See above.innocentPSIMMUNITYAs Queen of the Andals, the Rhoynar and the First Men and Lord of the Seven Kingdoms by rights the Defendant has jurisdictional immunity. I vote not to withdraw this immunity as long as she is in office. A Great Council may decide whether or not the immunity shall be withdrawn, as it is a political and not legal decision.If her immunity will be withdrawn I sentence her to death, but grand her the option to join the Silent Sisters, as a man would have the choice to join the NW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 death to the mad queen The Court cannot accept that as a verdict. The only verdicts which are allowed are Guilty, Not Guilty, Innocent, or Charge Dismissed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 Do you wish to propose a sentence (NB, you are not required to?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hollowcrown Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 2. One Count of Genocide.The massacre of the adult free males of Astapor, detailed in charge 1.3, amounted to the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national groupThat was war, I want charges to be dissmissedNope...the Holocaust was during War....we're not giving Hitler a free card out of jail simply because he completed those atrocities whilst at war. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 Indeed. The Court does recognise that while some activities may well be justified in time of war that would amount to crimes in peacetime, war does not of itself permit the commission of crimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hollowcrown Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 1. Four Counts of Murder:-1.1 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully killed a godswife, Mirri Maz Duur, by ordering her to be tied to her husband’s funeral pyre, and then burning her alive.Not guilty.1.2 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully killed Kraznys mo Nakloz, a citizen of Astapor by instructing her dragon, Drogon, to burn him to death, which instruction was carried out.Guilty.1.3 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully ordered her soldiers to kill a citizen of Astapor, Grazdan mo Ullor, and to massacre the adult free male inhabitants of Astapor, which order was carried out.Guilty.1.4 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully crucified 163 of the Great Masters of Mereen.Guilty.2. One Count of Genocide.The massacre of the adult free males of Astapor, detailed in charge 1.3, amounted to the deliberate and systematic destruction, in whole or in part, of an ethnic, racial, religious, or national groupGuilty.3. Four Counts of Torture3.1 The burning of Mirri Maz Duur, detailed in charge 1.1, amounted to torture.Guilty. She could've given MMD a quick death.3.2 The crucifixion of the Great Masters, detailed in charge 1.4, amounted to torture.Guilty. Same reason as above. Just making needless suffering.3.3 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully ordered two wineseller’s daughters to be tortured in front of her father, in order to procure information relating to the Sons of the Harpy.Guilty. Innocents were harmed.3.4 The Defendant, intentionally and unlawfully ordered numerous unnamed inhabitants of Mereen to be tortured, on suspicion that they were Sons of the Harpy.Guilty. She could've harmed innocents on circumstantial evidence.4. Two Counts of Criminal Damage to Property.4.1 The Defendant unlawfully and intentionally set fire to the House of the Undying in Qarth, resulting in its destruction.Not guilty, self defence.4.2 The Defendant unlawfully and intentionally sacked the City of Mereen, resulting in millions of Dragons’ worth of destruction to property.Guilty. No need to sack the city.5. Two counts of Waging Wars of Aggression5.1 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully waged a war of aggression against YunkaiNot guilty, Yunkai seemed aggressive to her.5.2 The Defendant intentionally and unlawfully waged a war of aggression against MereenGuilty.Overall Dany is guilty of most charges. Her willingness to torture and kill people in a gruesome manner, and punish people in a vengeful fashion means she must believe in "you reap what you sow". Therefore she should be sentenced to death by crucifixion, or if that's not an option, flaying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 This Court considers crucifixion to be cruel and unusual punishment, and will not impose such a sentence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Sansa Stark Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 This Court considers crucifixion to be cruel and unusual punishment, and will not impose such a sentence.But, death by flaying is perfectly fine? :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 Death by flaying is a traditional punishment for capital crimes in much of the North of Westeros, and is thus accepted by the Court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pootie Tang Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Death by flaying is a traditional punishment for capital crimes in much of the North of Westeros, and is thus accepted by the Court.That is crazy. Death by flaying surely is 1. more torturous than crucifixion and 2 less common. And just to reiterate, any court that accepts any form of torture as a viable sentence all awhile charging people for the same thing should be examined by its own jurisdiction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hollowcrown Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Death by flaying is a traditional punishment for capital crimes in much of the North of Westeros, and is thus accepted by the Court.I thought death by flaying was outlawed by the Starks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erudain Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Can she plea not being responsible for her actions....saying that she's just a little girl who know nothings about such matters? :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dreadwolf Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Death by flaying is a traditional punishment for capital crimes in much of the North of Westeros, and is thus accepted by the Court.Traditions are always a good thing to consider. So let then make it in the old Aerys way. Trial by combat with the Fire championing Daenaerys. Ooops. :devil: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danm_999 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Mirri Maz Duur zombified Khal Drogo and murdered Rhaego. Although she was enslaved by the defendant a justification on behalf of self-defence does not apply. First of all Mirri Maz Duur did not act to defend herself, but take vengeance. Furthermore she acted in order to prevent that Rhaego will become a Khal himself. The latter is no justification neither as the circumstances for a pre-emptive defence were too inconcrete as of the time of the deed. Therefore Mirri Maz Duur was guilty of murder herself. Her position as godswife does not give her any immunity. How did she murder Rhaego? She specifically told Daenerys not to let anything living inside the tent. Daenerys and Jorah ignored this advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Sansa Stark Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 I thought death by flaying was outlawed by the Starks?Yes, I think so. Only the Boltons still practice this, and not even just as a punishment. Besides, apparently, death by crucifixion is also accepted as punishment in parts of Essos.That is crazy. Death by flaying surely is 1. more torturous than crucifixion and 2 less common. And just to reiterate, any court that accepts any form of torture as a viable sentence all awhile charging people for the same thing should be examined by its own jurisdiction.Indeed. One could say that death by noose, or the sword, does rarely amount to torture, but death by flames and flaying surely does. Hence why I always sentence a guilty man or woman to death by sword, no matter their grievous crimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 That is crazy. Death by flaying surely is 1. more torturous than crucifixion and 2 less common. And just to reiterate, any court that accepts any form of torture as a viable sentence all awhile charging people for the same thing should be examined by its own jurisdiction.Flaying is very messy, but it's a good deal quicker than crucifixion (one can take days to die). And, it is quite in order for the Court to impose a tortuous punishment, following due process, while punishing acts of torture that have been carried out without due process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 I thought death by flaying was outlawed by the Starks?It has however, been revived by the current Warden of the North. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alester Florent Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 While I don't necessarily agree with the range of sentencing options on offer, it has been ever thus.Perhaps an argument could be made to add crucifixion to the list, although, to be honest, I'm always rather alarmed in these threads at how readily people will call for a sentence of death by flaying (or, to an only slightly lesser extent) burning, anyway. Often for relatively minor crimes in the grand scheme of things, too.Indeed. One could say that death by noose, or the sword, does rarely amount to torture, but death by flames and flaying surely does. Hence why I always sentence a guilty man or woman to death by sword, no matter their grievous crimes.Likewise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 While I don't necessarily agree with the range of sentencing options on offer, it has been ever thus.Perhaps an argument could be made to add crucifixion to the list, although, to be honest, I'm always rather alarmed in these threads at how readily people will call for a sentence of death by flaying (or, to an only slightly lesser extent) burning, anyway. Often for relatively minor crimes in the grand scheme of things, too.Many members of this community are really quite imaginitive in the suggestions they make. On one thread, it was variously suggested that Robb Stark should have executed his mother, or had her stripped naked and publicly flogged, or made to undergo a Walk of Shame, or chopped her hand off, for releasing Jaime. None of the last three punishments are available in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.