Theons fate. What does he deserve?

[Nest]

He's been through quite a lot. I also think WoW is the end of the line for him. With Brans guidance through the weirwood network Theons sacrifice for House Stark will be his life for Jons. At the end of Dance we know Da Snowmans situation didn't look too good. But I think Jon will be healed by earth magic through the "old gods" via Bran, BR, and Val, and not fire magic from R'hllor.

I would prefer that to Jon being healed by Mellisandre as some have suggested.

[YTDN]

Uh... While I'm not one to hate Theon, I think Jeyne deserves way better. He's still in terrible shape and poor Jeyne has suffered enough. She should be in Winterfell after the Starks are restored, and I'm pretty sure Theon will not be there.

Theon is the only other person in the world who understands what Jeyne has been through. I don't see how being with him would be 'suffering' for her. And while she should be reunited with Sansa, I wouldn't be surprised if Winterfell is full of bad memories for her. I just think that Theon and Jeyne should be able to seek comfort in each other, after all they've been through.

[Sullen]

He's been through quite a lot. I also think WoW is the end of the line for him. With Brans guidance through the weirwood network Theons sacrifice for House Stark will be his life for Jons. At the end of Dance we know Da Snowmans situation didn't look too good. But I think Jon will be healed by earth magic through the "old gods" via Bran, BR, and Val, and not fire magic from R'hllor.

Killing the most interesting and well-written character to resurrect the most boring PoV would be damn criminal if you ask me.

I seriously hope that doesn't happen.

Theon needs to walk into the sea.

[Jojen Dayne-Reed]

Eta: man this turned out really long. Hopefully it's interesting enough to deserve the screen space. (No pun intended)

'Deserves' is a problematic word. What someone else deserves is such a loaded question that's it's practically unanswerable. But let's look at Theons crimes and punishments anyway (because I wouldn't be here if I didn't love over analyzing)

Crime: being born a Greyjoy.

Punishment: being a hostage most if his life.

Fair? Probably not.

Crime: living with the Starks most of his life.

Punishment: Ostracised by father. Ridiculed by other iron islanders.

Fair? Again probably no.

Crime: Sideing with father over Robb.

Punishment: Ramsey.

Fair? This is where I think most of the meat is in this argument. Yes he swore allegiance to Robb as king but then sided with his father (very Jamieesque of him). Robb always treated him more then fairly and was his best friend (if not brother in all but name).

But Robb was never Really his family and (at least according to his father) never his King.

Yes the starks treated him well but he was still a prisoner. Yes Robb trusted him and gave him power but even then he wasnt a stark. He was a hostage.

Plus This decision was made by someone woefully under equiped to make it. He was trying to prove himself to both Robb and his father. Unfortunately he wasn't smart enough to find a way to please them both.

So is Bolton a fair punishment for this person? Probably not.

Crime: killing the millers sons.

Punishment: Ramsey (and likely Stanis in wow)

Fair? Again. Very dicey. Theon was scared and angry and probably had no idea why he was so confused. This doesn't excuse murder but it does force us to ask what the purpose of justice is. Do we want to rehabilitate or punish Theon? Does he deserve equivalent treatment to the millers sons? Should we put him through a program, make him bend knee, and have an ally on the seaside chair (either Theon or a grateful Asha)?

So long story short: I don't think Theon deserves anything, good or bad. The world conspired against him but he wasn't strong enough to fight back.

It will probably be necessary for Stanis to behead him. But the necessary realities if criminal justice does not always equal actual justice.

[Sullen]

Yes he swore allegiance to Robb as king

Except he didn't.

Theon makes it very clear he sees himself as Robb's equal, not his subject/vassal/whatnot.

[YTDN]

'Deserves' is a problematic word. What someone else deserves is such a loaded question that's it's practically unanswerable. But let's look at Theons crimes and punishments anyway (because I wouldn't be here if I didn't love over analyzing)

Crime: being born a Greyjoy.

Punishment: being a hostage most if his life.

Fair? Probably not.

Crime: living with the Starks most of his life.

Punishment: Ostracised by father. Ridiculed by other iron islanders.

Fair? Again probably no.

Crime: Sideing with father over Robb.

Punishment: Ramsey.

Fair? This is where I think most of the meat is in this argument. Yes he swore allegiance to Robb as king but then sided with his father (very Jamieesque of him). Robb always treated him more then fairly and was his best friend (if not brother in all but name).

But Robb was never Really his family and (at least according to his father) never his King.

Yes the starks treated him well but he was still a prisoner. Yes Robb trusted him and gave him power but even then he wasnt a stark. He was a hostage.

Plus This decision was made by someone woefully under equiped to make it. He was trying to prove himself to both Robb and his father. Unfortunately he wasn't smart enough to find a way to please them both.

So is Bolton a fair punishment for this person? Probably not.

Crime: killing the millers sons.

Punishment: Ramsey (and likely Stanis in wow)

Fair? Again. Very dicey. Theon was scared and angry and probably had no idea why he was so confused. This doesn't excuse murder but it does force us to ask what the purpose of justice is. Do we want to rehabilitate or punish Theon? Does he deserve equivalent treatment to the millers sons? Should we put him through a program, make him bend knee, and have an ally on the seaside chair (either Theon or a grateful Asha)?

So long story short: I don't think Theon deserves anything, good or bad. The world conspired against him but he wasn't strong enough to fight back.

It will probably be necessary for Stanis to behead him. But the necessary realities if criminal justice does not always equal actual justice.

Or, in the words of Cersei in the TV series, "Start trying to work out who deserves what and before long you spend the rest of your days weeping for each and every person in the world."

[FloridaAg]

He has already suffered worse than death in my opinion. So I think he has more than paid the price for what he did. I expect he will either ultimately join the NW, or die in the effort to do something decent.

[daario's man]

Killing the most interesting and well-written character to resurrect the most boring PoV would be damn criminal if you ask me.

I seriously hope that doesn't happen.

Theon needs to walk into the sea.

I agree that Theon is a much more interesting character than Jon, but if he can survive Jon's story has legs. Having come back from being Reek Theon's story has probably done all that it can. I don't see him living to the end of WOW.

[Sullen]

I agree that Theon is a much more interesting character than Jon, but if he can survive Jon's story has legs. Having come back from being Reek Theon's story has probably done all that it can. I don't see him living to the end of WOW.

Asha wants to use Theon to call another Kingsmoot.

His story still has somewhere to go.

[The Wolves]

He deserves death and I hope it's coming for him really soon. His whole ark has become tedious and gross. I hope he dies sooner rather than later in WOW he's annoying.

[circularlogic]

He deserves a path for redemption like Jamie, will he get it?

I think not, Theon's character is truly a tragic one. Forced to choose between his own family, and the family that took him in as one of their own. He's been through enough already. The best thing that can happen for Theon is an end to all of the misery he's been through. I'd like to see him play a part in Ramsay's/Roose's downfall though, if GRRM is kind (wouldn't hope on it though).

Dont get a lot of the Theon hate on here.

[Derick Bondarion]

Well he certainly didn't deserve to be torturted as bad as he was. Only a few people in the series deserve that, such as Ramsay and Roose and Walder Frey. He probably should just be beheaded and end his suffering.

[Jon of the Dead]

He deserves to die in his own bed, at the age of 80, with a belly full of wine and a girl's mouth around his...oh, wait

Seriously though, he deserves to be given the chance to take the black as Luwin advised him. It would be a fitting end: Theon who was always so proud of his name and claim must resign to all his rights to join the watch. Plus, it would be karma for kicking Gared's head in the first chapter.

Killing the most interesting and well-written character to resurrect the most boring PoV would be damn criminal if you ask me.

I seriously hope that doesn't happen.

Theon needs to walk into the sea.

:bowdown: If GRRM brought Theon back to the story, put him through all that damn torture, and make him escape out of Winterfell just to be beheaded to bring Jon, I won't stop reading the books but I would lose a LOT of respect for GRRM as a storyteller. You just don't sacrifice your best written and unique character to resurrect a cliche that I've seen millions of times.

[Sullen]

Well he certainly didn't deserve to be torturted as bad as he was. Only a few people in the series deserve that, such as Ramsay and Roose and Walder Frey.

Walder doesn't deserve it.

Walder doesn't enjoy inflicting pain, in fact, as far as we know he never tortured anyone or kill any "innocents" the way Ramsay or Roose did.

[WildBlood]

I think he will die soon, but he is going to have a part to play first

[circularlogic]

Walder doesn't deserve it.

Walder doesn't enjoy inflicting pain, in fact, as far as we know he never tortured anyone or kill any "innocents" the way Ramsay or Roose did.

Breaking guest right doesnt deserve torturing?

IIRC the Frey's were also Bannermen to the Tullys, breaking oaths doesn't deserve punishment?

[xSilence]

Somehow I would like to see Asha and Theon ruling together the Iron Island but we're talking about GRRM. I think Theon's fate will be sad, maybe he's sacrificing himself for someone he likes or to redeem the things he had done.

[Garlan Marius]

Theon is the most tragic character in the story. He isn't getting a happy ending, but he "deserves" a heroic death.

[The Frosted King]

He deserves to die for his brutalities at Winterfell.

Not for siding with his father, but for rapes, murders and flaying.

It's insane to me that people really think the fact that he was tortured, in a mess of entirely his own making(ala queen bitch Cersei) warrants a peaceful resolution. As if a few missing fingers, teeth, penis and toes negates the murder of Mikken. The murders of the two children merely to cover up his pride.

Yes, they weren't Bran or Rickon, but they had every right to life themselves.

And he still only grumbles over the lie, rather than the actions taken to support the lie.

Fuck Theon.

Interesting storyline, but he could've spent time with ten Ramsay's, and to me it still wouldn't absolve him of his enormities.

Give him a noose, he's unworthy of a sword.

[WildBlood]

He deserves to die for his brutalities at Winterfell.

Not for siding with his father, but for rapes, murders and flaying.

It's insane to me that people really think the fact that he was tortured, in a mess of entirely his own making(ala queen bitch Cersei) warrants a peaceful resolution. As if a few missing fingers, teeth, penis and toes negates the murder of Mikken. The murders of the two children merely to cover up his pride.

Yes, they weren't Bran or Rickon, but they had every right to life themselves.

And he still only grumbles over the lie, rather than the actions taken to support the lie.

Fuck Theon.

Interesting storyline, but he could've spent time with ten Ramsay's, and to me it still wouldn't absolve him of his enormities.

Give him a noose, he's unworthy of a sword.

I enjoy reading Theon chapters but I agree with this. :thumbsup: