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Why did Ned allow Jon to join the Night's Watch?


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11 replies to this topic

#1 The Taxman

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 01:32 AM

Given that R+L is true (it is), why did Ned allow Jon to join the NW so easily? It's been awhile since I have read the first book but it seemed like he didn't care much or think about it at all. Why would he let his sister's only living offspring Jon join when he knows of Jon's lineage? 



#2 yokosmom

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 01:50 AM

Two reasons. First, didn't Cat tell Ned that she couldn't guarantee Jon's safety after Ned left for KL, or words to that effect? Second, Ned may have thought that it was the one place where Jon might be safe if his true heritage ever was discovered. After all, he wouldn't be the only Targ at the Wall.

#3 Eli Stark

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 02:01 AM

Just cause Ned promised to raise his nephew, doesn't mean Ned ever intended to sit the kid on the throne. He rebelled against the Targaryen's and his best friend was the king. Ned viewed the Baratheon's as the rightful royal family by right of conquest.

#4 JonCon's Red Beard

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 02:07 AM

Because he never intended to tell him the truth, maybe. There is no way Ned could have foreseen a war for the throne or Targaryen from Essos returning to Westeros to claim the throne. Robert was the King, and then, Joffrey, and they, Joffrey's future kids. Jon had no business knowing who his real parents were.



#5 Wise Fool

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 02:07 AM

Given that R+L is true (it is), why did Ned allow Jon to join the NW so easily? It's been awhile since I have read the first book but it seemed like he didn't care much or think about it at all. Why would he let his sister's only living offspring Jon join when he knows of Jon's lineage? 

Good point, why would he do that? Perhaps because R+L=J is false. Problem solved!

 

;)



#6 Fanless Mace

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 02:08 AM

Safe place, Ned knew uncle Aemon would keep an eye on Jon, plus Ned had great respect for the NW and their mission. His ancestor built the wall, his brother served the wall...and there's some magic connecting the crypts to the Wall, I'm sure.

#7 Fanless Mace

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 02:08 AM

Because he never intended to tell him the truth, maybe. There is no way Ned could have foreseen a war for the throne or Targaryen from Essos returning to Westeros to claim the throne. Robert was the King, and then, Joffrey, and they, Joffrey's future kids. Jon had no business knowing who his real parents were.


And yes, this.

#8 Maester Feelgood

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 02:11 AM

Also, Ned had no intention of crowning Jon. At that point his daughter was to be queen with who he thought was Robert's true born son and heir. When Ned found out about Joffrey and Robert died he tried sending word to Stannis (who was and is the rightful heir by conquest) because Jon was not (despite his claim) the rightful heir. He just wanted Jon to live in safety as he most likely promised Lyanna. I doubt in her death bed she was like "promise me, promise you'll over throw your best friend and stick my baby on the ugliest sharpest chair i can think of". Besides, Ned didn't even think being queen was good for Sansa when Robert first asked, she basically begged for it. Lyanna probably said promise me you'll hide him far and keep him safe. The Nights Watch may be a lame lack luster life but not including the Walkers it pretty safe. If he went to Kings Landing with Ned, people would start speculating about the bastard of Winterfell and nothing hidden or safe would come of that. Plus, Jon wanted to go badly and there IS honor in the Nights Watch.

#9 Errant Bard

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 02:16 AM

Given that R+L is true (it is)

It potentially is, but is not yet.

why did Ned allow Jon to join the NW so easily? It's been awhile since I have read the first book but it seemed like he didn't care much or think about it at all. Why would he let his sister's only living offspring Jon join when he knows of Jon's lineage?

Why wouldn't he? Being in the Watch is an honourable calling, to him, and his own brother is there.

Feels strange to see you invoke Jon's "lineage" just after "his sister's only living offspring", by the way, like you know Ned is more attached to the link to Lyanna but for some reason you want that to mean he should care for the other side of Jon's family and its potential implications. Ned does not care one fig for restoring Targaryens to power.
 
 

Two reasons. First, didn't Cat tell Ned that she couldn't guarantee Jon's safety after Ned left for KL, or words to that effect?

No, Catelyn said she wouldn't have Jon in her house*. Ned whined that if he came with him to KL Jon would be bullied. Master Luwin then told him that Jon had publicly declared he wanted to join the watch. Ned agreed it was a good solution. Note he thought having him "bullied" in KL was "damnably cruel" while sending him to the wall was not, I'm not sure he wasn't on fumes.

*A father buggering off and leaving his illegitimate son to his wife's care is not a great move even in our society.

#10 belladeuil

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 03:12 AM

There were several reasons. Firstly, Jon Snow, for all intents and purposes, was an illegitimate son who had to be provided for by a father who had already two younger trueborn sons. Secondly, Lord Eddard was leaving for King's Landing and Lady Catelyn refused to have him under her roof while Lord Eddard was away. Lord Eddard felt Court was no place for a bastard, where bastardy was much more of a setback then it was in Winterfell, therefore, Lord Eddard did not want to take Jon Snow there. Thirdly, Jon Snow wanted to go. Fourthly, Lord Eddard had a high regard for the Night's Watch.



#11 Petyr Patter

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 03:37 AM

I've read several persuasive posts and threads arguing Aegon (Young Griff) is not actually the son of Rhaeghar.  At the same time, I've stated it doesn't matter, Aegon believes he is Aegon, Connington beliefs he is Aegon, and if Arriane beliefs (or at least claims) he is Aegon... does the truth actually matter anymore?  He is, effectively, Aegon son of Rhaeghar.  For this reason, I almost always refer to him as "Aegon the Maybe." 

 

Eddard chose to raise Jon as his bastard son.  This is a "truth" he's told his entire family (except possibly Benjen), including Jon himself.  Eddard is famous for his honesty and honor.  If Jon is not his bastard... than Eddard is a liar.  A paradox, of sorts. 

 

So, what I'm saying, is R+J has absolutely no bearing on Eddard's plans (or lack of them) for Jon.  He chose a "reality" and committed to it.  In that reality, R+J never happened.  Eddard himself fathered a bastard on an unknown woman, acknowledged him, and raised him as a lord's son in Winterfell.

 

Of course, he was a bastard outside the lines of inheritance, which means he had no reasonable expectation to inherit anything.  Hence, the Wall where he could serve with an uncle seemed like the best he could hope for.  Eddard saw the necessity and the honor of the Wall, and let Jon go.



#12 The Doctor's Consort

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Posted 01 March 2014 - 05:33 AM

I have seen that again but I don't see what this supposed to mean. Why should Ned care about the Targ line? How could Ned endanger Jon by making his lineage known to everyone? How Ned could make Jon King? How could Ned make Jon king when he didn’t support the Targs?