Ghost and Nymeria/Jon and Arya speculation

[Cymorococh]

First time poster, this is my first attempt at speculation and is therefore pretty vague. I searched for something like this but couldn't find any reference to it anywhere.

First, the facts/assumptions I have based this on:

- The synopsis that was leaked which revealed that GRRM originally planned for Jon and Arya to be romantically involved.

- Jon skinchanged into Ghost when he 'died'.

- Arya is still having wolf dreams.

- The Mercy chapter reveals that Nymeria's wolf pack is in a pine forest, this may indicate that it is moving northwards (Thanks History of Westoros podcast!).

- GRRM has indicated that the wolf pack will become more significant as the story continues.

Anyone think Ghost will join up with this pack, resulting in Jon and Arya sort of being reunited?

[The Bastard of Walton]

I think its highly likely that Jon & Arya will be reunited. Not sure there will be any love story anymore though. Also doubt Jon Snow is dead, but he doesn't have to be to warg into Ghost.

Looking forward to Nymeria's Wolfpack causing havoc in WOW, my guess is they will end the Freys.

[SevasTra82]

Question....does Arya know who was responsible for Robbs death? I know the Hound took her to outside the gates while the massacre was going on, but not sure if Arya knows specifically who was involved.

It would be pretty cool to see Arya kill the Freys while Warged :)

[lady jellybean]

As cool as that would be, arya has to come back to kill lady stoneheart. It will be sad to see arya have to kill her mother especially using needle to do so, but i think that is why she has been learning to give the gift of mercy

[Cymorococh]

I think its highly likely that Jon & Arya will be reunited. Not sure there will be any love story anymore though. Also doubt Jon Snow is dead, but he doesn't have to be to warg into Ghost.

Looking forward to Nymeria's Wolfpack causing havoc in WOW, my guess is they will end the Freys.

Wolf pack v Freys would be amazing.

I'm obviously hoping that the crows who attacked Jon didn't pull the same sh*t on Ghost that the Freys did on Grey Wind.

[The_lost_arryn19]

Just to add to your speculation; another small similarity I've always thought about that connects nimeria and ghost is that of the 2 they're the most feral of all the direwolves. Yeah shaggy is the most likely to attack but nimeria is wild and ghost has hunted in the woods and gone

Off on his own many times.all the other wolves spent most of their lives in a castle except grey wind who spent most of his life on a battlefield.

[The Bastard of Walton]

Wolf pack v Freys would be amazing.

I'm obviously hoping that the crows who attacked Jon didn't pull the same sh*t on Ghost that the Freys did on Grey Wind.

I'm thinking/hoping Mel has will let Ghost loose to help her save Jon.

[SerTonyStark]

I think its highly likely that Jon & Arya will be reunited. Not sure there will be any love story anymore though. Also doubt Jon Snow is dead, but he doesn't have to be to warg into Ghost.

Looking forward to Nymeria's Wolfpack causing havoc in WOW, my guess is they will end the Freys.

I've been wondering what the trigger for Arya's (hopeful & likely I think) return to Westeros would be. Perhaps a wolf dream where she recognizes Jon in Ghost through Nymeria.

[The Bastard of Walton]

I've been wondering what the trigger for Arya's (hopeful & likely I think) return to Westeros would be. Perhaps a wolf dream where she recognizes Jon in Ghost through Nymeria.

I definitely think that's a possibility. Jon or Sansa seem like the most likely reasons for Arya's return. If she sees what has happened to Jon, as you say maybe via Nymeria, it might make her realise that she has to be Arya Stark not no one.

[TheWhiteRabbit]

GRRM said the ending will be bittersweet. I hope that doesn't mean Arya will return to Westeros nick everyone off her list and when she's finally done taking care of business and decides it's time to meet Jon gets assassinated by the FM for leaving their faction. That's the very definition of bittersweet and would leave me royally pissed.

[Ghosts Lunch]

I actually think there might be some truth to it

Long story short I do reckon that Wolf pack comes into it, in this case once Lady Stoneheart destroys the twins the Wolf pack will hunt down the once abundant Freys and kill them all, men, women, children

GRRM will write this well though, it will be overly brutal firstly to take out the romance of any revenge fantasies people probably have. But also Lady Stoneheart is a precursor to Death Queen Sansa and the Wolves in the Riverlands will roam the wasteland that is the Riverlands supporting Sansa's Black reign of terror

a By-product of Lady's death being indirectly linked to the rise of of Nymeria's (Warrior Queen) wolfpack, it's actually quite brilliant, it signifies Sansa's transfer from Lady Sansa to Queen Sansa based on death

That's off-topic, I'm preparing my own thread but basically as far as Arya and Jon goes I reckon she will be able to detect him while he is in Ghost (and vice versa) during her wolf dreams, this will have a similar effect to Reek turning back into Theon and instead of no one she will become "Princess Arya" again

Basically it was the idea of Arya in peril that "woke the Dragon" (in Winterfell) in Jon Snow leading him to cast aside Jon Snow the bastard and begin the path to claiming Kingship, the other side of this coin is that Arya will leave her worship of death behind, ironically a process beginning while Jon Snow is "dead" or rather living a second life "like a King" in Ghost (aka his ghost is in Ghost...), so he attraction to Jon and coming back to him as he comes into his body again will be like the "gift" in reverse

Once you get past our obvious cultural yuck factor with incest, in this incestuous and polygamous ASOIF world the Jon and Arya romance actually makes some sense, they are obviously fond of eachother and are like an inverse Cersei/Jaimie or perhaps more loosely Viserys/Dany

Not sure what will happen with Arya and the HoB&W, depends if Arya goes beyond the "you can still leave us" stage and whether she gets kicked out for killing Raff the Sweetling. Not sure if "Cat of the Canals" and warging into Cats while her mother Catleyn is LS is a sign she will die or a sign of her persona growing into "no one" Arya, with Nymeria warging being linked to her suppressed Stark identity, plus HoB&W might have their hands full with some of the competitor institutions

[KINGpanther]

I'm thinking/hoping Mel has will let Ghost loose to help her save Jon.

i think Ghost will be ok. It's not like the Red Wedding where all of Ghost/Jon's allies are drunk.

[AryaNymeriaVisenya]

I actually think there might be some truth to it

Long story short I do reckon that Wolf pack comes into it, in this case once Lady Stoneheart destroys the twins the Wolf pack will hunt down the once abundant Freys and kill them all, men, women, children

GRRM will write this well though, it will be overly brutal firstly to take out the romance of any revenge fantasies people probably have. But also Lady Stoneheart is a precursor to Death Queen Sansa and the Wolves in the Riverlands will roam the wasteland that is the Riverlands supporting Sansa's Black reign of terror

a By-product of Lady's death being indirectly linked to the rise of of Nymeria's (Warrior Queen) wolfpack, it's actually quite brilliant, it signifies Sansa's transfer from Lady Sansa to Queen Sansa based on death

That's off-topic, I'm preparing my own thread but basically as far as Arya and Jon goes I reckon she will be able to detect him while he is in Ghost (and vice versa) during her wolf dreams, this will have a similar effect to Reek turning back into Theon and instead of no one she will become "Princess Arya" again

Basically it was the idea of Arya in peril that "woke the Dragon" (in Winterfell) in Jon Snow leading him to cast aside Jon Snow the bastard and begin the path to claiming Kingship, the other side of this coin is that Arya will leave her worship of death behind, ironically a process beginning while Jon Snow is "dead" or rather living a second life "like a King" in Ghost (aka his ghost is in Ghost...), so he attraction to Jon and coming back to him as he comes into his body again will be like the "gift" in reverse

Once you get past our obvious cultural yuck factor with incest, in this incestuous and polygamous ASOIF world the Jon and Arya romance actually makes some sense, they are obviously fond of eachother and are like an inverse Cersei/Jaimie or perhaps more loosely Viserys/Dany

Not sure what will happen with Arya and the HoB&W, depends if Arya goes beyond the "you can still leave us" stage and whether she gets kicked out for killing Raff the Sweetling. Not sure if "Cat of the Canals" and warging into Cats while her mother Catleyn is LS is a sign she will die or a sign of her persona growing into "no one" Arya, with Nymeria warging being linked to her suppressed Stark identity, plus HoB&W might have their hands full with some of the competitor institutions

Nothing about Nymeria is about Sansa. Just like nothing about Grey Wind means anything about Jon. Each wolf relates to its own 'owner'.

Arya is the one warging Nymeria, not Sansa. Arya is the one in the 'wild'. Arya is the one searching for her pack. Arya is the one who named Nymeria. 'Lady' was what Sansa aspired to be, the perfect Lady from the songs. No such thing exists, the dream was killed. Arya admired Nymeria from the songs she heard, a very different kind of woman. Lady and Nymeria are as contrasting as Sansa and Arya.

Lady is dead, Sansa doesn't get a second try by having her sister's wolf. Lady was half of Sansa. Nymeria is half of Arya,

[Hank of House Hutton]

As cool as that would be, arya has to come back to kill lady stoneheart. It will be sad to see arya have to kill her mother especially using needle to do so, but i think that is why she has been learning to give the gift of mercy

thats an interesting theory. why do you say that??

[Quarkissnyder]

Bittersweet ending: Jon saves the world in Ghost's body, then is stuck in that body and nobody knows it.

I find the original idea of Jon and Arya falling in love incredibly skeevy. Whether they are cousins or half-siblings or no blood relation, they were raised as siblings. I know, I know, Lannisters, Targs . . . but with them it's considered a sign of decadence. Why put that on our heroes?

[AryaNymeriaVisenya]

Bittersweet ending: Jon saves the world in Ghost's body, then is stuck in that body and nobody knows it.

I find the original idea of Jon and Arya falling in love incredibly skeevy. Whether they are cousins or half-siblings or no blood relation, they were raised as siblings. I know, I know, Lannisters, Targs . . . but with them it's considered a sign of decadence. Why put that on our heroes?

Because this is 'A Song of Ice and Fire'? There is no such thing as a pure hero, he died in book 1.

[Sword of the Morgan]

I think, in general, these are the two Starks that have the best chance of seeing each other again.

[Ghosts Lunch]

Nothing about Nymeria is about Sansa. Just like nothing about Grey Wind means anything about Jon. Each wolf relates to its own 'owner'.

Arya is the one warging Nymeria, not Sansa. Arya is the one in the 'wild'. Arya is the one searching for her pack. Arya is the one who named Nymeria. 'Lady' was what Sansa aspired to be, the perfect Lady from the songs. No such thing exists, the dream was killed. Arya admired Nymeria from the songs she heard, a very different kind of woman. Lady and Nymeria are as contrasting as Sansa and Arya.

Lady is dead, Sansa doesn't get a second try by having her sister's wolf. Lady was half of Sansa. Nymeria is half of Arya,

Yeah but Lady dies in place of Nymeria and Nymeria lives and rules as Queen of her own pack, you have to consider what the flipside of that dynamic is, the ladylike virtue in Sansa starts to die there and she slowly transitions to a tyrannical Queen

Sure Nymeria is being warged by Arya and rightly so, the Hound replaced Lady, my point is about exploring the dynamics of the event and the patterns

Despite all of this, Nymeria's pack is still helping people affiliated with the Starks in the RL, eg they helped cover the Blackfishes escape

Nymeria's pack will help Sansa in the RL, it's an indirect relationship though, similar to how Nymeria dragged Cats body from the river. There was an earlier foreshadowing in the Jon and Arya Needle talk when they are discussing Joffrey combining the sigils of Lannister and Baratheon, and Arya makes a comment about how silly a Wolf with a fish in its mouth would look, yet when Nymeria drags Cat out of the River that is what is happening in effect

[Han Snow]

^ What the???

I still don't get how you managed to connect Nymeria with Sansa. If YOU think Nymeria being the AlphaQueenDireWolf, Arya's direwolf, has any connection with Sansa that is entirely on YOU. Your interpretation of the text, and I would bet my left hand, a completely wrong one.

[AryaNymeriaVisenya]

Yeah but Lady dies in place of Nymeria and Nymeria lives and rules as Queen of her own pack, you have to consider what the flipside of that dynamic is, the ladylike virtue in Sansa starts to die there and she slowly transitions to a tyrannical Queen

Sure Nymeria is being warged by Arya and rightly so, the Hound replaced Lady, my point is about exploring the dynamics of the event and the patterns

Despite all of this, Nymeria's pack is still helping people affiliated with the Starks in the RL, eg they helped cover the Blackfishes escape

Nymeria's pack will help Sansa in the RL, it's an indirect relationship though, similar to how Nymeria dragged Cats body from the river. There was an earlier foreshadowing in the Jon and Arya Needle talk when they are discussing Joffrey combining the sigils of Lannister and Baratheon, and Arya makes a comment about how silly a Wolf with a fish in its mouth would look, yet when Nymeria drags Cat out of the River that is what is happening in effect

Thematically, Lady dies because Sansa didn't defend her sister and the beautiful fairy tale queen of Sansa's dreams ordered it. Cersei wants blood, doesn't matter what wolf and she makes it clear earlier she wanted both gone. Had Nymeria been there both would have been killed for being 'too dangerous'. Its possible it foreshadowed Sansa being killed while in Kings Landing and Arya escaped like Nymeria as it was written at the time of GRRM's outline but Sansa grew from the original plan. I don't think they are interchangeable, I think we need to have another look at how we see both sisters based on those events.

I don't think Sansa is going to the Riverlands. She has no reason to.