Ramsay: The Washerwoman, Monsters and Maidens, The Changeling

[Bran Vras]

The Washerwoman

According to Celtic folklore, the encounter of unknown women washing clothes in a stream or a fountain is a sinister omen. Indeed such creatures are dangerous envoys of the faerie world. It's particularly true in the Breton folklore (the Kannerez-noz, or lavandières de nuit), but there are analogues among the Scotts (the Bean Nighe). The corresponding tales have many variations but they seem to follow most often this scenario: a man with a guilty conscience comes across one or several washerwomen, that he has never seen before, and he pays dearly for his sins as result of the encounter.

Here is the story of Ramsay's birth told by Roose to Theon (Theon, ADwD)

“Has my bastard ever told you how I got him?”

That he did know, to his relief. “Yes, my ... m’lord. You met his mother whilst out riding and were smitten by her beauty.”

“Smitten?” Bolton laughed. “Did he use that word? Why, the boy has a singer’s soul ... though if you believe that song, you may well be dimmer than the first Reek. Even the riding part is wrong. I was hunting a fox along the Weeping Water when I chanced upon a mill and saw a young woman washing clothes in the stream. The old miller had gotten himself a new young wife, a girl not half his age. She was a tall, willowy creature, very healthy-looking. Long legs and small firm breasts, like two ripe plums. Pretty, in a common sort of way. The moment that I set eyes on her I wanted her. Such was my due. The maesters will tell you that King Jaehaerys abolished the lord’s right to the first night to appease his shrewish queen, but where the old gods rule, old customs linger. The Umbers keep the first night too, deny it as they may. Certain of the mountain clans as well, and on Skagos ... well, only heart trees ever see half of what they do on Skagos.

“This miller’s marriage had been performed without my leave or knowledge. The man had cheated me. So I had him hanged, and claimed my rights beneath the tree where he was swaying. If truth be told, the wench was hardly worth the rope. The fox escaped as well, and on our way back to the Dreadfort my favorite courser came up lame, so all in all it was a dismal day.

“A year later this same wench had the impudence to turn up at the Dreadfort with a squalling, red-faced monster that she claimed was my own get. I should’ve had the mother whipped and thrown her child down a well ... but the babe did have my eyes. She told me that when her dead husband’s brother saw those eyes, he beat her bloody and drove her from the mill. That annoyed me, so I gave her the mill and had the brother’s tongue cut out, to make certain he did not go running to Winterfell with tales that might disturb Lord Rickard. Each year I sent the woman some piglets and chickens and a bag of stars, on the understanding that she was never to tell the boy who had fathered him. A peaceful land, a quiet people, that has always been my rule.”

The passage has been much commented in the Roose Bolton thread. Let's recall briefly the analysis.

Roose does appear to have been smitten "The moment I set eyes on her I wanted her". Observe that the erotic attraction vanishes after the rape "If truth be told, the wench was hardly worth the rope". When the woman reappears with the baby (and when she should have expected to have her baby thrown down the well), Roose spares Ramsay. Then he reinstalls the woman in the mill (an enviable situation for her). Finally, the washerwoman gets away with not respecting the agreement "I sent the woman some piglets and chickens and a bag of stars, on the understanding that she was never to tell the boy who had fathered him".

And there is another demand of the washerwoman satisfied by Roose.

No one could stand to be near [Reek], so he slept with the pigs ... until the day that Ramsay’s mother appeared at my gates to demand that I provide a servant for my bastard, who was growing up wild and unruly. I gave her Reek. It was meant to be amusing, but he and Ramsay became inseparable.

[...]

“The woman disobeyed me, though. You see what Ramsay is. She made him, her and Reek, always whispering in his ear about his rights. He should have been content to grind corn. Does he truly think that he can ever rule the north?”

I suspect that Reek was the servant expected by the washerwoman. Indeed, the miller's wife, Ramsay and Reek got along perfectly afterwards.

The washerwoman disobeyed Roose repetitively but obtained what she wanted every time: Roose spared the baby, he gave her the mill, he saved her from her brother-in-law, he sent her regularly money and food, he gave her Reek, he admitted Ramsay at the Dreadfort, he legitimized Ramsay. And, I shall add, he gave Ramsay the lordship of Winterfell.

The washerwoman had to be certain of herself, as the life of her son was at risk when she came to the Dreadfort. What happened to the cruel lord who would have flayed Arya Stark for spilling wine?

It seems to me that the woman has power over Roose, and that Roose does not realize he has been bewitched, and does not even realize the discrepancy between his actions and his words. But he is aware of the the influence of the washerwoman over Ramsay.

He professes contempt for Ramsay's mother and for Ramsay. Nevertheless he has made Ramsay his heir, is fatalistic about the death of Domeric (whether Ramsay killed Domeric is another question entirely), he expects with resignation the death of his future children with Walda Frey. He arranges Ramsay's marriage with the heiress of Winterfell, while being skeptical that Ramsay will be able to rule the North for long.

It's as if Roose gave Ramsay more and more power against his own judgement, while neglecting entirely Ramsay's education.

(About the education, compare with Domeric: trained as a squire, harpist, future knight, educated in history, while Ramsay is given as companion Reek and a band of vicious men. )

It's an open question to know if the washerwoman is still influential. Is she still at the mill? Is she still even alive?

It's hinted that Ramsay is fond of his mother. He tells Theon that Roose had been smitten by her beauty, and, when Roose says

Get the keys and remove those chains from him, before you make me rue the day I raped your mother.”

Reek saw the way Ramsay’s mouth twisted, the spittle glistening between his lips. He feared he might leap the table with his dagger in his hand. Instead he flushed red, turned his pale eyes from his father’s paler ones, and went to find the keys.

Ramsay barely controls himself.

Monster and Maidens

In ADwD, Theon reflects

In songs, the hero always saved the maiden from the monster’s castle, but life was not a song, no more than Jeyne was Arya Stark.

There is children game called "Monsters and Maiden" played throughout ACoK and ASoS. Bran, Rickon and the Freys, (Bran, ACoK)

After that, oddly, Rickon decided he liked the Walders. They never played lord of the crossing again, but they played other games— monsters and maidens, rats and cats, come-into-my-castle, all sorts of things.

Edric Storm, Shireen and Patchface, Davos (ASoS)

When the fool saw Davos, he jerked to a sudden halt, the bells on his antlered tin helmet going ting-a-ling, ting-a-ling. Hopping from one foot to the other, he sang, “ Fool’s blood, king’s blood, blood on the maiden’s thigh, but chains for the guests and chains for the bridegroom, aye aye aye.” Shireen almost caught him then, but at the last instant he hopped over a patch of bracken and vanished among the trees. The princess was right behind him. The sight of them made Davos smile.

He had turned to cough into his gloved hand when another small shape crashed out of the hedge and bowled right into him, knocking him off his feet.

The boy went down as well, but he was up again almost at once. “What are you doing here?” he demanded as he brushed himself off. Jet- black hair fell to his collar, and his eyes were a startling blue. “You shouldn’t get in my way when I’m running.”

“No,” Davos agreed. “I shouldn’t.” Another fit of coughing seized him as he struggled to his knees.

“Are you unwell?” The boy took him by the arm and pulled him to his feet. “Should I summon the maester?”

Davos shook his head. “A cough. It will pass.”

The boy took him at his word. “We were playing monsters and maidens,” he explained. “I was the monster. It’s a childish game but my cousin likes it.

Arya (ASoS)

She used to hide in the crypts of Winterfell when she was little, and play games of come-into-my- castle and monsters and maidens amongst the stone kings on their thrones.

(Note the foreshadowing of fake Arya pursued by Ramsay.)

Shae and Tyrion (Tyrion ASoS)

“You have to catch me.” Her voice came from his left. “M’lord must have played monsters and maidens when he was little.”

It appears that the game is about a maiden trying to escape the lair of a monster. It seems that in Dragonstone, it was a three players game, with perhaps the third player as the hero who saves the maiden.

I think Ramsay is playing a version of the game for real. The clearest description of Ramsay's "amusements" comes from Wyman Manderly in ADwD

“He is a great hunter,” said Wyman Manderly, “and women are his favorite prey. He strips them naked and sets them loose in the woods. They have a half day’s start before he sets out after them with hounds and horns. From time to time some wench escapes and lives to tell the tale. Most are less fortunate. When Ramsay catches them he rapes them, flays them, feeds their corpses to his dogs, and brings their skins back to the Dreadfort as trophies. If they have given him good sport, he slits their throats before he skins them. Elsewise, t’other way around.”

It appears that the hunt follows a regular pattern. Here is Ramsay, disguised as Reek, in Winterfell (Theon, ACoK)

The man laughed. “The wretch is dead.” He stepped closer. “The girl’s fault. If she had not run so far, his horse would not have lamed, and we might have been able to flee. I gave him mine when I saw the riders from the ridge. I was done with her by then, and he liked to take his turn while they were still warm. I had to pull him off her and shove my clothes into his hands—calfskin boots and velvet doublet, silver- chased swordbelt, even my sable cloak. Ride for the Dreadfort, I told him, bring all the help you can. Take my horse, he’s swifter, and here, wear the ring my father gave me, so they’ll know you came from me. He’d learned better than to question me. By the time they put that arrow through his back, I’d smeared myself with the girl’s filth and dressed in his rags. They might have hanged me anyway, but it was the only chance I saw.”

So Ramsay wears possibly his best clothes for a chase in the woods. I wonder about the significance of the ring given by Roose. Now Theon about his escape with Kyra, (Reek, ADwD)

He had run before. Years ago, it seemed, when he still had some strength in him, when he had still been defiant. That time it had been Kyra with the keys. She told him she had stolen them, that she knew a postern gate that was never guarded. “Take me back to Winterfell, m’lord,” she begged, pale-faced and trembling. “I don’t know the way. I can’t escape alone. Come with me, please.” And so he had. The gaoler was dead drunk in a puddle of wine, with his breeches down around his ankles. The dungeon door was open and the postern gate had been unguarded, just as she had said. They waited for the moon to go behind a cloud, then slipped from the castle and splashed across the Weeping Water, stumbling over stones, half-frozen by the icy stream. On the far side, he had kissed her. “You’ve saved us,” he said. Fool. Fool.

It had all been a trap, a game, a jape. Lord Ramsay loved the chase and preferred to hunt two-legged prey. All night they ran through the darkling wood, but as the sun came up the sound of a distant horn came faintly through the trees, and they heard the baying of a pack of hounds. “We should split up,” he told Kyra as the dogs drew closer. “They cannot track us both.” The girl was crazed with fear, though, and refused to leave his side, even when he swore that he would raise a host of ironborn and come back for her if she should be the one they followed.

Within the hour, they were taken. One dog knocked him to the ground, and a second bit Kyra on the leg as she scrambled up a hillside. The rest surrounded them, baying and snarling, snapping at them every time they moved, holding them there until Ramsay Snow rode up with his hunts-men. He was still a bastard then, not yet a Bolton. “There you are,” he said, smiling down at them from the saddle. “You wound me, wandering off like this. Have you grown tired of my hospitality so soon?” That was when Kyra seized a stone and threw it at his head. It missed by a good foot, and Ramsay smiled. “You must be punished.”

So the hunt begins at sunrise and horns are blown (what for?).

I conclude from all this that Ramsay is not purely satisfying his sadistic urges. He follows a ritual. Since that ritual has made its way into children games, it might refer to a myth, or to legendary history. The most obvious model I could find is in Old Nan's stories (I think the comparison has been brought up by Brashcandy):

Old Nan nodded. “In that darkness, the Others came for the first time,” she said as her needles went click click click. “They were cold things, dead things, that hated iron and fire and the touch of the sun, and every creature with hot blood in its veins. They swept over holdfasts and cities and kingdoms, felled heroes and armies by the score, riding their pale dead horses and leading hosts of the slain. All the swords of men could not stay their advance, and even maidens and suckling babes found no pity in them. They hunted the maids through frozen forests, and fed their dead servants on the flesh of human children.”

Something doesn't quite fit with the notion that Ramsay is imitating the Others. The Others hunted maids during the Long Night, but Ramsay's hunts take place at sunrise, as if Ramsay was an ally or an incarnation of the sun. (It's not said clearly that the escape happened under full moon, so I refrain from saying that Ramsay's hunt is about the sun chasing the moon.) Moreover the use of horns recall the warning practices of the Night's Watch. So I reserve my judgement concerning the real significance of the hunt.

This discussion is not purely academic. It seems other characters are aware of the symbolic importance of these hunts. When "Arya"'s escape is engineered by Mance and the spearwives in Winterfell, the spearwives insist that Theon flees with "Arya". It seems absurd, since Theon is phyically weak and indecisive. Why is he needed to play the role of the hero who saves the maiden from the monster?

If indeed there is a mythic origin in Ramsay's hunts, the wildlings seem aware of the significance. It seems that the original Reek has wildling roots. When Ramsay impersonates Reek in Winterfell he says (Bran, ACoK)

“I was born up north here. I know many a man, and many a man knows Reek.”

Moreover, Reek's particular way of speaking reminds me of Craster's (Bran, ACoK)

“Haven’t fucked no one since they took me, m’lord. Heke’s me true name. I was in service to the Bastard o’ the Dreadfort till the Starks give him an arrow in the back for a wedding gift.”

Here is Craster (Jon, ACoK)

“Had no good southron wine up here for a bear’s night. I could use me some wine, and a new axe. Mine’s lost its bite, can’t have that, I got me women to protect.”

(Meaning of the name Heke?)

The Changeling

The notion of changeling seems to have been introduced in these forums by Black Crow, or Jojen, in the 9th iteration of the Heresies, or perhaps earlier.

A changeling is a baby given by the faeries, most often as a replacement for an existing baby.

Let's look at the physical descriptions of Roose, Ramsay and the washerwoman. Here is Ramsay (Reek, ADwD)

Ramsay was clad in black and pink—black boots, black belt and scabbard, black leather jerkin over a pink velvet doublet slashed with dark red satin. In his right ear gleamed a garnet cut in the shape of a drop of blood. Yet for all the splendor of his garb, he remained an ugly man, big-boned and slope-shouldered, with a fleshiness to him that suggested that in later life he would run to fat. His skin was pink and blotchy, his nose broad, his mouth small, his hair long and dark and dry. His lips were wide and meaty, but the thing men noticed first about him were his eyes. He had his lord father’s eyes—small, close-set, queerly pale. Ghost grey, some men called the shade, but in truth his eyes were all but colorless, like two chips of dirty ice.

Now Roose (Reek, ADwD)

The Lord of the Dreadfort did not have a strong likeness to his bastard son. His face was clean-shaved, smooth-skinned, ordinary, not handsome but not quite plain. Though Roose had been in battles, he bore no scars. Though well past forty, he was as yet unwrinkled, with scarce a line to tell of the passage of time. His lips were so thin that when he pressed them together they seemed to vanish altogether. There was an agelessness about him, a stillness; on Roose Bolton’s face, rage and joy looked much the same. All he and Ramsay had in common were their eyes. His eyes are ice.

So no resemblance except the eyes. Now consider, Ramsay's mother, as seen by Roose

She was a tall, willowy creature, very healthy-looking. Long legs and small firm breasts, like two ripe plums. Pretty, in a common sort of way.

No resemblance either. So we can suspect that Ramsay is not Roose's son, but, if his mother is some sort of faerie, Ramsay might very well be a changeling.

However, there is a character who resembles Ramsay. Here is Craster (Jon, ACoK and ASoS)

Craster’s sheepskin jerkin and cloak of sewn skins made a shabby contrast, but around one thick wrist was a heavy ring that had the glint of gold. He looked to be a powerful man, though well into the winter of his days now, his mane of hair grey going to white. A flat nose and a drooping mouth gave him a cruel look, and one of his ears was missing.

[...]

Craster was a thick man made thicker by the ragged smelly sheepskins he wore day and night. He had a broad flat nose, a mouth that drooped to one side, and a missing ear. And though his matted hair and tangled beard might be grey going white, his hard knuckly hands still looked strong enough to hurt.

So Ramsay has the broad nose, the thick bones of Craster (I think Craster has close-set eyes also, but I can't find the reference again). In the eleventh iteraton of the Heresy thread, Black Crow has suggested that Ramsay is a changeling. And Lummel finally said it: Ramsay could be Craster's son. I can't say it better than he did.

Ha, just as I was reading your post Bran Vras I thought 'that sounds a bit like Craster'! I think the lips and broad bones are also traits that both share.

Now that would be something, if Craster was giving his sons to the white walkers and they were giving them out to...well to who? Did the miller's wife pray to the old gods for revenge - was the changeling a gift from them to her for vengeance?

The connections between Craster and Ramsay have been discussed at length in the Roose Bolton thread. I might recall the details downthread, in particular there was several remarkable observations of Brashcandy about the resemblance of baby Ramsay and Gilly's son.

Whether Ramsay is Craster's son matters little after all. I had the impression reading ADwD that Roose has neither love nor respect for Ramsay, and that he does not expect him to rule the north eventually. (And I believe that Roose has plans of his own that we have not seen yet.) Now, I have come to suspect that Ramsay is someone else's pawn to rule the north.

[Babeldygob]

Intersting, very interesting. What would the purpose of this switcharoo be though?

[kwvapor]

Where is Ramsay's mother now?

[Ragnorak]

When Mance shows up as Abel he presents the spearwives as washerwomen. They certainly make some men with guilty consciences pay dearly. They also perform a switch of sorts though not with a baby. Any other connections you can think of? If Ramsay's mom as a washerwoman was an intentional reference there must be significance to the spearwives.

[Black Crow]

Intersting, very interesting. What would the purpose of this switcharoo be though?

Long story, have a look at the current Heresy thread where its discussed in some depth, but basically its down to the Others/Sidhe

[Lummel]

Just a couple of observations, Ragnorak - in folklore the washwomen foretell deaths but don't (directly at at rate) cause them, think of the three witches in Macbeth.

Bran Vras, when Ramsey pretending to be Reek says he's well known in the North he's talking to Theon so it could mean I'm a local, it doesn't necessarily imply that he has connections north of the Wall, although I agree that there a double meaning for us to see. Actually this kind of bargain is starting to take on a new significance to me particularly if we contrast it with Arya in Harrenhall. In stories if you make a deal with a fairy or the Devil or whatever - isn't it always barbed? The threat is that you end up having to pay more than you bargained for and the hero has to wriggle out of the deal through some kind of cunning. Arya succeeds, but Theon doesn't...

It's often said that ASOIAF is low magic, but I think the 'realism' of the political side of the story distracts us from what is, when you poke around a bit, a very rich layer of folklore. One way of looking at Beyond the Wall is that it is a zone in which things that we are familiar with from folklore are literally true: changelings, creatures that can only be killed with a certain material, transformation into animals...

[Direwolf Lager]

i was interested.. but then i saw how long this post was

[bemused]

The women by the stream are a later representation ( or devolution) of the Morrigan , triple goddess of prophecy , battle , death ... she appears as a beautiful young woman ,often by a stream ( but not always washing ) and usually makes a prophecy in this appearance ( often of death to come) ; she also appears as an older woman or crone urging men on to battle ; and last , as a crow or raven on the battlefield in the aftermath of battle.

[Vic-tarion Rattlehead]

Could this miller's wife been the same one whom Theon's men killed later to skin her children faces?

[Lummel]

probably not, you've got the length of Ramsey's life between Roose meeting his miller's wife and Theon taking a tumble in the hay with his. The North is a big place, I think there is more than one miller there :)

[Ferrous]

Could this miller's wife been the same one whom Theon's men killed later to skin her children faces?

Theon was in Winterfell.

Bolton was in Dreadfort lands.

Not to mention that Ramsay actually does have affection for his mother and probably wouldn't kill her children.

[brashcandy]

I like the idea that Ramsay could be a changeling. Roose accepts the child as his because he has the same pale eyes, but we constantly see even Roose seeming somewhat surprised and alarmed by Ramsay's cruelty and stupidity, and questioning whether he truly is his son:

Get the keys and remove those chains from him, before you make me rue the day I raped your mother.

Roose made a face, as if the ale he was sipping had suddenly gone sour. "There are times you make me wonder if you are truly my seed. My forebears were many things, but never fools.

"You are mistaken. It is not good. No tales were ever told of me. Do you think I would be sitting here if it were otherwise? Your amusements are your own, I will chide you on that count, but you must be more discreet. A peaceful land, a quiet people. That has always been my rule. Make it yours."

Perhaps Roose is using Ramsay as a scapegoat for the murder of Domeric and the sons that Fat Walda will give to him, along with using him to consolidate his hold on the North, but there's a fundamental conflict between father and son and how they function in their daily lives and political activities. According to Roose, Ramsay needs to be leeched of his bad blood:

"His blood is bad. He needs to be leeched. The leeches suck away the bad blood, all the rage and pain. No man can think so full of anger. Ramsay, though ... his tainted blood would poison even leeches, I fear."

It's strange that Roose hasn't already insisted that Ramsay be leeched, given his own fascination with the practice, and even though he suggests this as a remedy to Theon for Ramsay's madness, he seems to have given up on the idea as useless.

Lummel, on 12 May 2012 - 01:07 PM, said:

Ha, just as I was reading your post Bran Vras I thought 'that sounds a bit like Craster'! I think the lips and broad bones are also traits that both share.

Now that would be something, if Craster was giving his sons to the white walkers and they were giving them out to...well to who? Did the miller's wife pray to the old gods for revenge - was the changeling a gift from them to her for vengeance?

If the Others are giving away the babies, perhaps it's connected to Ramsay's ritualistic impulse to play monsters and maidens? The Others might be slowly ensuring that the practices of the Long Night are gradually reconstituted into Northern society in preparation for their return...

[jarl the climber]

The concept of Changelings or an ability to change ones appearnce is introduced to us in this series most strongly by the Faceless Men. The Many Faced God is the bastard of a thousand different religions. We do know that slavers have historically been active in the North, having gone so far as to having conquered present day White Harbor at one point. There are some indications of the Old Gods having some influence on the Faceless Men. Most notably the use of Weirwood in some areas of their temple and the Weirwood masks on the back of chairs.

We also know that the Children are able to disguise themselves and move around in the world of men. The one named Leaf admited to having done this but we do not know the process she uses. I have speculated before that they might use a process similar to the Faceless Men as opposed to a glamor which could be detected. My theory is that the Faceless Men learned their technique from Northernors or even Children disguised as men or women who were taken as slaves.

The Bolton have a reputation for flaying and skinning their enemies and Ygritte says that one skinned a Stark and wore it as a cloak. An interesting choice of words, cloak can also be meant as an effort to conceal something. I feel that there is more to this flaying than simple cruelty on the parts of the Boltons and neither is it a primitive attempt to replicate the skinchanging ability that some of the Starks might have had. Basically I see the Boltons as being heretics of the Old Gods religion rather than in league with the Others all though there dissident status might make them open to being allies with them but this remains to be seen.

[Bran Vras]

When Mance shows up as Abel he presents the spearwives as washerwomen. They certainly make some men with guilty consciences pay dearly. They also perform a switch of sorts though not with a baby. Any other connections you can think of? If Ramsay's mom as a washerwoman was an intentional reference there must be significance to the spearwives.

I think that what you suggest is accurate. Rowan accuses Theon of kinslaying, promises him a painless death, denies him the right to pronounce the Stark's motto, and repeats all sorts of accusations against him (turncloak etc). In short, she speaks like Theon's bad conscience. But I haven't seen Abel's washerwomen discussed in detail in these forums yet (for instance how they differ from each other).

Bran Vras, when Ramsey pretending to be Reek says he's well known in the North he's talking to Theon so it could mean I'm a local, it doesn't necessarily imply that he has connections north of the Wall, although I agree that there a double meaning for us to see. Actually this kind of bargain is starting to take on a new significance to me particularly if we contrast it with Arya in Harrenhall. In stories if you make a deal with a fairy or the Devil or whatever - isn't it always barbed? The threat is that you end up having to pay more than you bargained for and the hero has to wriggle out of the deal through some kind of cunning. Arya succeeds, but Theon doesn't...

Yes, Lummel, that passage does not prove much, if anything at all. But Reek is a mystery to me. He smells horribly, while being clean. He eats perfume, and put flowers in his hair, while being necrophiliac. And the washerwoman made him Ramsay's best friend, mentor, and master at arms, with the acquiescence of Roose. The maester describes Reek as sick, but he is strong as a bull. Roose describes him as dim, but suggests that Reek incited Ramsay to claim his rights. Even Reek's death is bizarre: an arrow in the back while he was impersonating his lord (on a fine horse, with fine clothes and even with the ring of the heir).

Otherwise, I did not catch the striking idea that Theon was damned by his deal with Ramsay. Is it a presage that all people who think they can use Ramsay, will be damned in turn?

Could this miller's wife been the same one whom Theon's men killed later to skin her children faces?

Probably not. But it's remarkable that Ramsay decided to kill, of all people, a miller's wife and her children, as he grew up himself in a mill.

It's strange that Roose hasn't already insisted that Ramsay be leeched, given his own fascination with the practice, and even though he suggests this as a remedy to Theon for Ramsay's madness, he seems to have given up on the idea as useless.

If the Others are giving away the babies, perhaps it's connected to Ramsay's ritualistic impulse to play monsters and maidens? The Others might be slowly ensuring that the practices of the Long Night are gradually reconstituted into Northern society in preparation for their return...

Brashcandy, that reminds me of your suggestion that the leeching habit is a trace of a practice to hide one own's warm blood from the Others.

[Humphrey Plantagenet]

Roose’s strange apathy to the fate of his children and openness about Ramsay’s guilt is odd. Maybe he’s pulling a Craster in terms of sacrificing his offspring. Or is planning to. And using Ramsay as a helpful way of covering up. Winter is underway and perhaps Roose is aware of the potential benefits of sacrificing the castle full of children his new wife will be producing. And pointing out Ramsay’s guilt in advance is a good way of avoiding suspicion. There’s got to be a reason for him advertising Ramsay’s culpability for future crimes.

Reading the description of Roose above, it’s striking how ageless he is. Unmarked by the passing of time. And bearing no scars. His leeching is well known, but what else might Roose be doing to maintain himself? The Old Gods are the gods of Winter, their power is waxing. The Boltons are an old family of the North so maybe their “Old Ways” will “come out” just like those of the Starks have with the Warging etc.

[jarl the climber]

Another clue given to us possibly by the Faceless Men. The faces they use are more or less offerings by the people who die at the temple. We do not know how it works with the Children, people are given as offerings to the trees more or less unwillingly. All though there are a great deal of skeletons in the Childrens lair that Bran is in, we do not know how they are skinned or if they are simply eaten. The trees do remember however. The Boltons seem to skin these people why they are alive sometimes, Ramsey does this to the ones that fail to give him sport.

The Faceless Men seem to imply that Arya is unsuited to be one of them because she is female. That she can not bring life and death into the world. That a long term consequence could be an inability to reproduce, she would have to give that up to the Many Faced God. If Roose is indeed older than he looks, and he and his offspring are afflicted by some kind of curse, it could have something to do with this.

Strangely Ramsey shows some level of mercy to those who give him good sport. He only rapes them before killing them and then skins them when they are dead. He also only names his dogs after the brave women in effect giving them a second life. Ramsey has an instinct I beleive whereas Roose has certian knowledge. Ramsey seems to have a preference for skinning women, his dogs are females. Perhaps this is just the result of his sociopathic personality. Does this in some strange way mirror the strange feminine traits that the original Reek had. His fondness for wearing flowers in his hair and his interest in perfume? Yet as been noted above, Reek was a necrophiliac, who gave his seed to the dead. Ramsey gives his seed to women then kills them if he is inclined to show mercy. Is this meant to be a sacrifice?

Was Reek somehow a woman wearing the skin of a man?

[brashcandy]

Ramsey has an instinct I beleive whereas Roose has certian knowledge.

This speaks to a sense that I was getting as well. Roose readily admits that Ramsay is brutish, careless and untrained, but there also appears to be a curious unwillingness on his part to discipline Ramsay too harshly (at least not yet). Since Ramsay's birth, as Bran Vras noted in the OP, Roose has been willing to put up with behaviour from the washerwoman that would otherwise get another person flayed alive. He's also lost his one trueborn heir, and whilst blaming Ramsay for this, is strangely resigned to his other trueborn sons suffering the same fate. Everything that Roose does - the leeching, making sure to keep a "quiet land" etc - suggests someone who is applying learned knowledge/experience to achieve a particular end, but Ramsay on the other hand is wild and dangerously sadistic and volatile. Yet, Roose allows him to have his "amusements" and quickly dismisses the idea that he will benefit from leeching.

[Theo1]

Anyone recall what Roose does with the leeches with his bad blood in them?

[Lummel]

The Bolton have a reputation for flaying and skinning their enemies and Ygritte says that one skinned a Stark and wore it as a cloak. An interesting choice of words, cloak can also be meant as an effort to conceal something. I feel that there is more to this flaying than simple cruelty on the parts of the Boltons and neither is it a primitive attempt to replicate the skinchanging ability that some of the Starks might have had. Basically I see the Boltons as being heretics of the Old Gods religion rather than in league with the Others all though there dissident status might make them open to being allies with them but this remains to be seen.

You can't have heresy without orthodoxy, I don't think there is any reason yet to believe that the Boltons are in league with Evil, but rather that the old religion covers a spectrum from 'listen to the trees!' to hanging peoples' guts in them as a thanksgiving. There seems to be a lot of darkness in their faith in any case. We don't know if the cold gods of Craster's daughterwives are separate from or a sub-set of the old gods as a whole. If Roose suspects that Ramsey is a changeling he might well think that because he is from the old gods that he can't discipline him sharply.

...Strangely Ramsey shows some level of mercy to those who give him good sport. He only rapes them before killing them and then skins them when they are dead. He also only names his dogs after the brave women in effect giving them a second life. Ramsey has an instinct I beleive whereas Roose has certian knowledge. Ramsey seems to have a preference for skinning women, his dogs are females...

The dog business seems like a perversion of the second life idea. In the second life the consciousness persists, in Ramsey's version the person who suffered and was degraded at his hands in life is made into his bitch to serve him and adore him in her second life. It's another form of punishment, one that you can't escape even through death.

[Black Crow]

... Reek is a mystery to me. He smells horribly, while being clean. He eats perfume, and put flowers in his hair, while being necrophiliac. And the washerwoman made him Ramsay's best friend, mentor, and master at arms, with the acquiescence of Roose. The maester describes Reek as sick, but he is strong as a bull. Roose describes him as dim, but suggests that Reek incited Ramsay to claim his rights. Even Reek's death is bizarre: an arrow in the back while he was impersonating his lord (on a fine horse, with fine clothes and even with the ring of the heir).

The symptoms of a changeling includes unpleasant traits in the body, paleness, a green tint, bad temper, and/or a voracious appetite. "Positive" traits include an extensive vocabulary at a young age, which signified the changeling's intelligence.