Runaway Penguin Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 Bah. Magic caves/barriers are boring. He is experienced ranger, if he survived, then rationalist in me hopes he survived due to his skill and mind, not due to magic ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artos Stark Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 I think for sure Benjen is alive and will return at some point in the book. I also agree that he is the logical person to serve as Castellan of House Stark until the heir comes of age. It just doesn't make sense to me that he would have been killed and turned into a wight with the rest of his men and not have returned with the rest of them if they had died together. Benjen must have escaped the attack. As to where he has been this whole time, I have absolutely no idea, he would have been with the Children of the Forrest or he could have went South to Last Hearth, I don't know. I guess we'll find out soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaegrM Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 Benjen took The Black.Why the hell do you all seem to think he'd inherit WF ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butterbumps! Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 I actually don't think Benjen is dead. Only Othor and Flowers returned from Benjen's party of 7; Benjen and 4 other riders are still missing.On Othor and Flowers, I don't believe they died anywhere near the Wall; I think they were killed much farther away and walked to the Wall themselves. They were discovered in the daytime, and I think we're given more than a few hints that the dead only rise at night (which is the only time the Others emerge as well). It seems like daylight is the factor that made it appear these wights were dead when they were found.Benjen's party had originally been sent out to find Waymar Royce's party from the Prologue. We know that the 3 in Royce's party has passed through Craster's, but Craster tell us that he hasn't seen Benjen in over 3 years as of aCoK. We know that from Craster's Keep the Royce party was in the haunted forest, 8-9 days out (I estimate 400-450 miles out from the Wall based on a pace of 50 miles/ day). It strikes me as odd that Benjen would not have made a stop at Craster's if he was truly seeking Royce's party, considering this was the main outpost for NW members. I think Benjen had a different purpose in mind from the outset and that chasing down the Royce party was a cover of sorts. We get something interesting from Mance in aSoS. Mance tells Jon about his last trip to Winterfell when Robert showed up. He says: "I wanted to see this Robert with my own eyes, king to king, and get the measure of your uncle Benjen as well. He was First Ranger by then, and the bane of all my people. So I saddled my fleetest horse, and rode.” I think Mance has more knowledge of the winter situation than he lets on, and I think it's possible that Mance may have spoken with Benjen more directly than he lets on to Jon. Mance and Tormund take the position of there being a common enemy to both wildlings and the NW, and I find it plausible that Mance could have approached Benjen about something. Anyway, I find it plausible that he's alive up North somewhere on an extended ranging up the Milkwater without being revealed in one of the CotF's caves or anything like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tyrion VIII Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 Nice post Butterbumps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butterbumps! Posted January 19, 2013 Share Posted January 19, 2013 oh, I nearly forgot. One more issue that may support the idea that Benjen may have been on a covert OPs from the get-go (under the cover of searching for Royce's party), is the fact that Gared was beheaded by Ned for deserting just prior to Benjen's visit. Benjen may not have needed to stop at Craster's to inquire about Royce's party, because there's a chance Benjen already knew where to look from Ned, who had questioned Gared before executing him (in Bran's POV, Bran notes that questions were asked and answered, but that he doesn't recall what was said). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castellan Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 No-one in Westeros could guess poor Bran has been picked for a key role as a telephone exchange/tree in the war on the others (my interpretation) so equally, Benjen could be on some covert or unguessable business which has to do with reviving needed old knowledge/spying on the Others/whatever.Ned might have confided Jon's parentage to Benjen. He might trust him more than Catelyn in keeping a secret to do with his sister's child - its family business. so maybe Benjen can resolve this at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castellan Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Bah. Magic caves/barriers are boring. He is experienced ranger, if he survived, then rationalist in me hopes he survived due to his skill and mind, not due to magic ;)So do I but I am afraid I am going to have to read a lot about magic as GRRM wraps up the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Mac Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 oh, I nearly forgot. One more issue that may support the idea that Benjen may have been on a covert OPs from the get-go (under the cover of searching for Royce's party), is the fact that Gared was beheaded by Ned for deserting just prior to Benjen's visit. Benjen may not have needed to stop at Craster's to inquire about Royce's party, because there's a chance Benjen already knew where to look from Ned, who had questioned Gared before executing him (in Bran's POV, Bran notes that questions were asked and answered, but that he doesn't recall what was said).Thats a very nice catch.I'd say Benjen is fully alive (meaning not undead). It would be very anticlimactic if he was just plain dead. However, all theories as to where he is have equal merit as there is absolutely no evidence to his whereabouts. I do not think he is the HM, nor Coldhands though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ObsidiaNPhoenix Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 I have some feeling that Benjen has to be alive in some state. If he is considered such a significant character, he has yet to contribute anything to the story really beyond being motivation to move beyond the Wall. I believe he has more to do in the story, but we just do not know where he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_nights_baron Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Just a random theory but is it possible that Benjen is immune (for want of a better word) to becoming an Other due to his Stark heritage (which also links to the other theory that the Stark blood is mingled with the Others as much as the Targ's blended with dragon's ) is it possible he may have some sort of control or relationship with the Others (as they are not just mindless zombies, like the wights, but as Martin states are a sentient being).Alternatively there is also the possibility the Benjen has accessed the tunnels in the gorge near the Bridge of skulls which I believe link up underneath the Wall and the north through to Winterfell. (The problem with this being it looks like Bran and Co. took the long way ;) ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chequered Raven Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 De facto patriarch, not de jure. Yes, Bran, Rickon and the rest would come ahead of Benjen in succession, but as they are way off from being an adult, Benjen would make all the decisions for a decade.About ruling the North?He's a sworn brother of the Night Watch!IIRC, there is a certain line in the vow concerning the holding of lands and titels... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dragon King Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 About ruling the North?He's a sworn brother of the Night Watch!IIRC, there is a certain line in the vow concerning the holding of lands and titels...Hence the "de facto" bit. The North is vital to the Night's Watch, I could see the commander giving Benjen leave to attend to business at Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TinHouse Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Benjen took The Black.Why the hell do you all seem to think he'd inherit WF ?Pretty much this. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 About ruling the North?He's a sworn brother of the Night Watch!IIRC, there is a certain line in the vow concerning the holding of lands and titels...That holds true for Jon as well (or more as he is Lord Commander). Nevertheless it's brought up time and again in these threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 And what if he returns from his business north of the Wall, sees the ruins remaining of his house and castle, the old connection of the Starks and the Others in him comes alive and Benjen is the one to lead the Others across the Wall to terrorize Westeros for vengeance and to restore the legitimacy (and political influence) of his house by brute undiscriminating force? This might have been the very way which earned the Starks the original respect they enjoy throughout the North. It would surely surprise the readers who expect the Stark kids to be the key point in the Stark restoration and we know that Martin likes to surprise his readers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tyrion VIII Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 Benjen took The Black.Why the hell do you all seem to think he'd inherit WF ?Jon was named in Robb's will after he had already joined the Night's Watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoamingRonin Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 Would be hilarious if he was hiding out in one of the abandoned NW castles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northernmonkey Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 He's definitely alive, but I don't see him setting foot south of the wall again. Talk of him playing a role in the Stark family seems unlikely.His fate is almost certainly connected with the others. He might be scouting them out, deep in the Land of Always Winter. He might even be living with them, either as their prisoner or voluntarily. My guess is that we'll be reunited with Benjen at the end of WOW, and he'll explain what the others' real motives are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Dayne's Honor Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 At least Dr. Pepper hasn't showed up here yet spouting all this nonsense about Benjen being an evil person Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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