R+L=D and B+A=J 2nd round

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

Why didn't you include this in your video? Could you be making it up as you go along? :)

The whole point of discussion is to help each other find answers together. We're all trying to figure things out as we go along. None of us have all the answers. Not even GRRM.

[SunflashJT]

I dislike all the theorist sand stupid nutjobs that misuse the word theory to give validity to their offshoots and hypoteses... A theory is something based on known facts and has been proved by different people under different circumstances. It's just offensive when you call theory ideas so dense as the dwarf race and this.

I'm pretty sure it had been settled in the last thread that the whole think it's just a lot of wishful thinking that disregards time, geography and common sense altogether, so please stop.

Also, the guy of those videos isn't the same one of the great dornish plan? Someone really needs to find a girlfriend and stop thinking so much nonsense.

Ever heard of a hobby? Do you even know the definition of Theory? Let me enlighten you, and pay close attention to the end of the definition. "Theory ~ a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained."

His THEORIES are just that, his theories and he is just trying to make you think.

Why didn't you include this in your video? Could you be making it up as you go along? :)

Perhaps it didn't occur to him until after the video was created. That is what is great about discussion, it opens your eyes to things you may have missed.

[JoeyBanana]

The whole point of discussion is to help each other find answers together. We're all trying to figure things out as we go along. None of us have all the answers. Not even GRRM.

I don't understand, isn't he the guy who writes the books?

Or is he just being warged by Bloodraven?

If so, what are BR's plans and why is there wildfire in my basement? Does that mean.. i'm a secret Targaryen?

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

I don't understand, isn't he the guy who writes the books?

Or is he just being warged by Bloodraven?

If so, what are BR's plans and why is there wildfire in my basement? Does that mean.. i'm a secret Targaryen?

But he hasn't finished the books. He is still figuring everything out.

[-Ghost-]

But he hasn't finished the books. He is still figuring everything out.

He knows all the endings for everyone, just not the entire journeys there.

[RoamingRonin]

The whole point of discussion is to help each other find answers together. We're all trying to figure things out as we go along. None of us have all the answers. Not even GRRM.

Through careful analysis and deduction. We are discussing your theory and I'm pointing out what seem to be flaws. You just seem to be flinging answers when pressed.

Perhaps it didn't occur to him until after the video was created. That is what is great about discussion, it opens your eyes to things you may have missed.

It should just occur to him to figure out what happened to Willem Darry and the remaining Targaryen loyalists. It should be part of his theory, not an after-the-fact addition.

[Hattori]

Through careful analysis and deduction. We are discussing your theory and I'm pointing out what seem to be flaws. You just seem to be flinging answers when pressed.

It should just occur to him to figure out what happened to Willem Darry and the remaining Targaryen loyalists. It should be part of his theory, not an after-the-fact addition.

That right there is just completely and utterly wrong

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

Through careful analysis and deduction. We are discussing your theory and I'm pointing out what seem to be flaws. You just seem to be flinging answers when pressed.

It should just occur to him to figure out what happened to Willem Darry and the remaining Targaryen loyalists. It should be part of his theory, not an after-the-fact addition.

Obviously, not all aspects of any subject can be addressed in 25 minutes of video.

And all theories should be open to additions and alterations.

What you're expecting is not reasonable or helpful. Do you want me to have all the answers to everything before producing anything? If I had all the answers, why would I want to talk about these things?

And then you want me to be rigid and uncompromising afterwards? Why? If I make a mistake or am insufficient in explanation, why shouldn't I want to improve a theory?

Not that we are necessarily academics, but academics have a process called peer review. Their peers point out holes and places where a theory is insuffient and the author alters and adds.

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

He knows all the endings for everyone, just not the entire journeys there.

So, he has some of the answers, but not all the answers. Just as I said.

[PirateVergo]

How about stopping this nonsense theory.

This is not possible, Jon is too young to be Brandon's son.

This theory make absolutely no sense.

R+L=J.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

So, he has some of the answers, but not all the answers. Just as I said.

If he has provided hints for it, he knows the ending for it.

If there are no hints for it, it can't be a vital part of a theory, it seems to me.

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

How about stopping this nonsense theory.

This is not possible, Jon is too young to be Brandon's son.

This theory make absolutely no sense.

R+L=J.

As explained, Ned is simply passing Jon off as younger. Passing a 15 month old as a year old or a year old as a nine month old is certainly possible.

The closer the Battle of the Bells is to the start of the war, the easier the task.

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

If he has provided hints for it, he knows the ending for it.

If there are no hints for it, it can't be a vital part of a theory, it seems to me.

Well, there was only one small hint for Joffrey attacking Bran with a whole lot of red herring.

The promise is what directs me to R+L=D. And Ashara is already suspected of being Jon's mom, so B+A=J is hinted at. It's not like there is nothing out there directing me to this conclusion.

[Rhaenys_Targaryen]

The promise is what directs me to R+L=D. And Ashara is already suspected of being Jon's mom, so B+A=J is hinted at. It's not like there is nothing out there directing me to this conclusion.

When there is mystery, and people think of multiple answers and solutions, you look at what fits best, and which of the possibilities has the bigger problems.

If Brandon and Ashara had Jon, then what is the blue rose about? R+L explains that perfectly, B+A doesn't. For example.

Also, that Ashara has been opted (by people who totally weren't present for any Jon related event, and who were all retelling 14 year old rumours) to be Jons mom, does not mean that Brandon is hinted at as his dad. Brandon has not been connected to Jon on any occasion.

A bigger problem with the theory is the timeline. You try and try to place the Battle of the Bells as early as possible in the war. I have listed at several occasions in the previous version of this thread what all occurs between the start of the Rebellion, and the Battle of the Bells.. all of Roberts movements, which will have taken multiple months..

Robert fighting at Gulltown

Robert traveling from Gulltown to Storm's End

Robert calling his banners

Robert going from SE to Summerhal

Robert returning to SE

Robert going from SE to Ashford

Robert going from Ashford to Stony Sept.

All of this will have taken plenty of months. And Brandons death occurred before all of this, and his arrest even weeks earlier. Making the time between he conception of Jon, according ro your theory, and the conception of Robb, bigger and bigger.

[RoamingRonin]

Obviously, not all aspects of any subject can be addressed in 25 minutes of video.

And all theories should be open to additions and alterations.

What you're expecting is not reasonable or helpful. Do you want me to have all the answers to everything before producing anything? If I had all the answers, why would I want to talk about these things?

And then you want me to be rigid and uncompromising afterwards? Why? If I make a mistake or am insufficient in explanation, why shouldn't I want to improve a theory?

Not that we are necessarily academics, but academics have a process called peer review. Their peers point out holes and places where a theory is insuffient and the author alters and adds.

Willem Darry and the remaining Targaryen loyalists were of part Dany and Viserys's childhood. If you want to suggest that Dany wasn't born on Dragonstone then you need to account for them. It's that simple.

Not acknowledging them would be like not acknowledging the kingsguard at the Tower of Joy or Dany's handmaidens being present for Rhaego's birth. If you're going to dispute her origins then you gotta account for everyone involved in her childhood. I don't think I'm being unreasonable for suggesting so.

You say you're open to criticism but you argue when presented with sound evidence. So, no, I don't really buy the the whole "peer review" bit.

[Game Of Thrones]

So WHY exactly did Lyanna name her daughter 'Daenerys'?

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

When there is mystery, and people think of multiple answers and solutions, you look at what fits best, and which of the possibilities has the bigger problems.

If Brandon and Ashara had Jon, then what is the blue rose about? R+L explains that perfectly, B+A doesn't. For example.

Also, that Ashara has been opted (by people who totally weren't present for any Jon related event, and who were all retelling 14 year old rumours) to be Jons mom, does not mean that Brandon is hinted at as his dad. Brandon has not been connected to Jon on any occasion.

A bigger problem with the theory is the timeline. You try and try to place the Battle of the Bells as early as possible in the war. I have listed at several occasions in the previous version of this thread what all occurs between the start of the Rebellion, and the Battle of the Bells.. all of Roberts movements, which will have taken multiple months..

Robert fighting at Gulltown

Robert traveling from Gulltown to Storm's End

Robert calling his banners

Robert going from SE to Summerhal

Robert returning to SE

Robert going from SE to Ashford

Robert going from Ashford to Stony Sept.

All of this will have taken plenty of months. And Brandons death occurred before all of this, and his arrest even weeks earlier. Making the time between he conception of Jon, according ro your theory, and the conception of Robb, bigger and bigger.

Absolutely, it's ridiculous, but B+A=J/R+L=D relies on the same basic timeline as R+L=J, which means the Battle of the Bells is in the 3rd month. The Robert's Rebellion timeline is just silly - its almost makes me want to think Jon is Ned's bastard.

After all, if we assume R+L=J, the latest the Sack can be is 11.5 months into the war ("The war had raged for close to a year"), which means Dany is conceived 11 months into the war, which means Jon is conceived 3 months into the war, which means Ned and Cat are married 2.5 months into the war.

B+A=J/R+L=D places all the events at the same time, but shifts Jon and Dany's births 3 months backward in time.

By the way, I did want to thank you for your timeline work and our back and forths. The timeline stuff was a big part my Tower video and Dornish Master Plan video.

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

Willem Darry and the remaining Targaryen loyalists were of part Dany and Viserys's childhood. If you want to suggest that Dany wasn't born on Dragonstone then you need to account for them. It's that simple.

Not acknowledging them would be like not acknowledging the kingsguard at the Tower of Joy or Dany's handmaidens being present for Rhaego's birth. If you're going to dispute her origins then you gotta account for everyone involved in her childhood. I don't think I'm being unreasonable for suggesting so.

You say you're open to criticism but you argue when presented with sound evidence. So, no, I don't really buy the the whole "peer review" bit.

Only Darry was part of Dany's childhood. The others (perhaps they are Connington's crew) are a mystery. Alas, we don't have Darry's testimony on what happened because he died.

Arguing and discussing is part of the process of figuring out what really happened. I'm happy to talk about it. In fact, that's what we're doing.

[Hattori]

So WHY exactly did Lyanna name her daughter 'Daenerys'?

Daenerys was a princess bethroded to a Dornish prince, in order to create an alliance between the Martells and Targaryens, finally ending their dispute, but she loved Daemon Blackfyre, and so a rebellion by Daemon was started that ended in his death. Thats the only reason I would see Lyanna calling her baby Dany.

Wow, I cant believe I just gave more sense to this wacky theory

[Game Of Thrones]

Then Lyanna herself would be Daenerys not her child.

And why wouldn't Lyanna give her child a Stark name?