Cayrouse Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 For the same reason most Indians weren't fond of the British colonialists , they came in boats with ridiculous advantages and their stupid holier than thou values and just conquer the place with them ending tens of thousands of years of independence. The first men made peace with the cotf, the Andals eventually kinda Settled with a truce but no the next invasion had to be all blood and fire and 'plant no trees'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Stark-Targaryen Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 *opens door of the thread* Let's see... 1. "Madness." Check. 2. "Dragons." Check. 3. "Boo hiss Dany." Check. 4. "Boo hiss Rhaegar." Check. 5. "More evil/bloodthirsty/unjust than any other Westeros house." Check. 6. "Don't hate all Targs, just *inserts characters who were infants*" /thread Yes, pretty much covers the scope of discourse in any given Targaryen thread. I'm just glad GRRM likes them. That was apparent from TWOIAF, and after the series, we'll get Fire and Blood. For those who don't really care much for high fantasy, though, the Targaryens might really grate. But I like fantasy. I like dragons. I think George did a great job with all the weird quirks that made the Targs dragon riders. I actually think that if everyone aware of the series were polled, the Targs wouldn't do so badly, especially among casual readers. But we'll never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Stark-Targaryen Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Why do some people hate the Starks? Why do some people hate the Lannisters? Why do some people hate the Baratheons? Why do some people hate the... Well you get the idea. Pretty much. The only difference is that you wouldn't catch me in threads about the two Houses I don't care much for -- Greyjoy and Tyrell. I don't get those who love to hate characters or people or groups, but it's clearly a trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuncle Karstark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Well, people aren't usually fond of sister-fuckers who dance close to madness.We know of what, four insane Targs? Maegor was a prick, but not insane. It's really just Aegon IV, Aerion, Aerys, and Viserys.Incest sort of explains this, and we only get madness from the very inbred Targs. Anyway, what's wrong with incest? It's part of their culture, why be judgmental? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Darry Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Yes, pretty much covers the scope of discourse in any given Targaryen thread. I'm just glad GRRM likes them. That was apparent from TWOIAF, and after the series, we'll get Fire and Blood. He doesn't like them. In my opinion he is the biggest Targ hater. Btw, I am genuinely curious why so many fans think that GRRM likes them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuncle Karstark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 He doesn't like them. In my opinion he is the biggest Targ hater. Btw, I am genuinely curious why so many fans think that GRRM likes them.You both have a right to your opinion.I think he gives 0 shits either way. He neither favors them or hates them imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Sansa Stark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 The reason why I don't like them is because a majority of them have a superiority complex and that irks me a lot. With that said I also feel particularly uncomfortable that GRRM uses mental illness to portray them as 'antagonists' and/or villains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cayrouse Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 We know of what, four insane Targs? Maegor was a prick, but not insane. It's really just Aegon IV, Aerion, Aerys, and Viserys. Incest sort of explains this, and we only get madness from the very inbred Targs. Anyway, what's wrong with incest? It's part of their culture, why be judgmental? Because some cultures are stupid. Leaving weak children to die was cool to the Spartans but I'm glad that element culture died out, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby b's bobby Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 We know of what, four insane Targs? Maegor was a prick, but not insane. It's really just Aegon IV, Aerion, Aerys, and Viserys. Incest sort of explains this, and we only get madness from the very inbred Targs. Anyway, what's wrong with incest? It's part of their culture, why be judgmental? It leads to very serous defects and deaths which is doubly bad when Targs are the ruling family in a monarchy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Darry Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 The reason why I don't like them is because a majority of them have a superiority complex and that irks me a lot. With that said I also feel particularly uncomfortable that GRRM uses mental illness to portray them as 'antagonists' and/or villains. Yes! We often talk how his portrait of sexual violence is bad, but how about mental illness? what GRRM is doing is offensive and hurtful. He portrays mental illness in a stereotyped and unrealistic way. GRRM is reinforcing stigma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuncle Karstark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 It leads to very serous defects and deaths which is doubly bad when Targs are the ruling family in a monarchySo does smoking and hard drugs. I don't hate someone because they make certain choices with their body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Stark-Targaryen Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 The reason why I don't like them is because a majority of them have a superiority complex and that irks me a lot. With that said I also feel particularly uncomfortable that GRRM uses mental illness to portray them as 'antagonists' and/or villains. Rumors of Targaryen madness are greatly exaggerated, if you ask me. Also, not all mad characters were/are evil because Aerys II was. We have characters in other houses that deal with physical, mental, and emotional conditions... Actually, when put that way, most Houses in ASOIAF have a character or two like that. There's a full range, from Bran Stark to Willas Tyrell to Lysa Arryn. I disagree that GRRM's writing a story that's any more ableist than the Middle Ages actually were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuncle Karstark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Yes! We often talk how his portrait of sexual violence is bad, but how about mental illness? what GRRM is doing is offensive and hurtful. He portrays mental illness in a stereotyped and unrealistic way. GRRM is reinforcing stigma.Can you elaborate? I am genuinly interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby b's bobby Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 So does smoking and hard drugs. I don't hate someone because they make certain choices with their body. No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Darry Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 We know of what, four insane Targs? Maegor was a prick, but not insane. It's really just Aegon IV, Aerion, Aerys, and Viserys. Incest sort of explains this, and we only get madness from the very inbred Targs. Anyway, what's wrong with incest? It's part of their culture, why be judgmental? No, it doesn't. Targs with 'taint' have problems with delusions and lack of empathy. Neither is directly connected to incest. GRRM thought that it is more fun to write about delusions then about cognitive impairments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BricksAndSparrows Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Because they were overrated and couldn't hack it in Westeros without thier Dragons? No, it doesn't. Targs with 'taint' have problems with delusions and lack of empathy. Neither is directly connected to incest. GRRM thought that it is more fun to write about delusions then about cognitive impairments. www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=taint I have a taint but I don't think I'm crazy. Maybe I'm one of the lucky ones... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuncle Karstark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 No, it doesn't. Targs with 'taint' have problems with delusions and lack of empathy. Neither is directly connected to incest. GRRM thought that it is more fun to write about delusions then about cognitive impairments.Which Targs have the taint? And I don't really care how incest works in George's world. It doesn't have to follow modern genetics to the letter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Sansa Stark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Can you elaborate? I am genuinly interested. GRRM portrayal of mental illness is iffy because a good portion of those who have them in this series are often pretty violent and aggressive which enforces the stigma that people with mental illness are more likely to commit crime. This is most likely unintentional on GRRM part (same goes for the disturbing amount of sexual violence on women in this series), but ignorance does not excuse him in my opinion. He should have done some proper research before dealing with these highly controversial subjects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~DarkHorse~ Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 Beacause they think having dragons (or being linked to dragons) makes them Gods amongst men. They also deal in absolutes (Fire and Blood) but unlike Tywin, they have dragons so their evil is glorious and cool....I mean, what is cowardly about burning armies from the back of a dragon instead of fighting the battle yourself with the same odds. It is not a fair fight and much like butchering men at the dinner table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuncle Karstark Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 GRRM portrayal of mental illness is iffy because a good portion of those who have them are often pretty violent and aggressive which enforces the stigma that people with mental illness are more likely to commit crime.I really don't want to sound insensitive, but isn't that more fact than stigma? Targaryens seem to have a very specific mental illness.It's not like he's suggesting those with aspergers are twisted people who enjoy killing. The evil Targs are insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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