Dany's feminist conspiracy

[Battle Kitten]

Why is women supporting each other a "feminist conspiracy" but men doing the same par the course?  No shit, they now have power and want to make sure it isn't diluted by marriage. That logic, not a feminist conspiracy.  The content of the post isn't bad, but that title is just horrid.

[SerenityShip]

I was hoping this would be one of the rare GOT forums, that doesn't have people going on about feminist conspiracys. 

[LastManStanding]

On 6/21/2016 at 6:51 PM, VVSINGOFTHECROSS said:

 

Mainly the fact that in the six thousand years the Starks have ruled the north, they've never had a Queen Regnant. And the fact that Jon was named Robb's heir, coupled with the fact that Sansa was married to a Lannister and a Bolton, and the fact that northmen are incredibly xenophobic, hence why the Valemen being there, is going to be viewed with huge suspicion.

Lots of things that have never happened before are happening. How many Queens have there been of Bear Island? Jon being named Robb's heir is a nothing. No one had recognized it at all. Sansa being married is a nothing, one marriage was never consummated, the other guy is dead. 

[VVSINGOFTHECROSS]

30 minutes ago, LastManStanding said:

Lots of things that have never happened before are happening. How many Queens have there been of Bear Island? Jon being named Robb's heir is a nothing. No one had recognized it at all. Sansa being married is a nothing, one marriage was never consummated, the other guy is dead. 

There never was a Queen of Bear Island due to the fact that it was never an independent kingdom, it belonged to the Ironborn and then the Starks.

 

Considering there were lords who witnessed that, it is something.

 

Sansa being married is a something, she was married to two traitorous and enemy houses. Why would anyone trust her?

[LadyAlisande]

First of all, men can be feminists, and not all women are feminists. So your thread title doesn't jive with your content; a feminist alliance wouldn't necessarily be an all-women alliance.

Second, Dany doesn't ally with Yara just because she's a woman. It's a net benefit, but ultimately it's what Yara and Theon, and also Tyrion, have to say that convinces Dany it's the right move. Yara standing there flirting without a bunch of ships in the harbor and a promise that the Iron Islands will join the Seven Kingdoms and all the other elements of the deal, doesn't get the deal. 

I do think you're on to something that Dany will never marry a man or have any more children. She's a Queen Elizabeth I type now, she can see how a marriage alliance would only weaken her, and she won't bother. Nor does she have to, because she is strong enough without having to sell herself to any man. 

Will she also ally with Sansa, should Sansa become Lady of Winterfell; with the Sandsnakes if they become legit rulers of Dorne; with the Queen of Thorns after her family is burned to death in Cersei's finale explosions? Yes, probably. These are allies that she has a lot in common with, besides the fact that they're women; they're all super anti-Lannister, for one. So it may end up being an alliance between strong female rulers...which doesn't necessarily make it a feminist alliance, though you could certainly argue that all those women are feminists in some form.

[Morgain]

Feminist alliance I'll buy into because a list of female rulers who ally are fulfilling the two main requirements of feminist women:

- to be assertive and strive to achieve (may or may not include being bitches, that's optional);

- to link to other similar women with some recognition of common aims as women. These rulers would be prety stupid to ignore what they are all up against as women. I don't accept remarks above that Tywin, Robert Baratheon, or Stannis would accept women on merit. Tywin just wanted Cersei to use as breeder and bargain pawn for alliance. Robert Baratheon showed no respect for women beyond their traditional female role. Stannis used the Red Woman, and his wife was free to be a convert, but he never said his daughter was his heir.

I liked Dany and Yara because of the links they made around their yuk fathers, and other aspects of their common situation. The flirting was fun, especially as it had a humorous edge to it. I hope D&D don't try to 'develop' that with their childish understanding of women and dykes urrrrgh. Yara will replace Joarah for a while as sex tension on Dany, fine, but keep it light.

Sansa now. Jon has shown he's an excellent battle leader if up against straight strength, physical stuff, and magical awe. He's a piss poor battle leader up against head games (Ramsay) and he caused the massacre of the Northern army. I can't see Northern lords welcoming him as KotN based on that. But Sansa is still a Stark, and can now make it clear she made both her marriages under duress, as none of her family males could protect her at the time. LF has constructed a story Ramsay abducted her so she can use that. Plus Ramsay tortured her. She then brought in the Vale which won the battle. (When the young Mormont ruler spoke contempt at her about her marriages, Sansa had not then won a huge battle for the North.)

I can see the Northern lords backing her, and all the more so if she marries Robyn, as she will. Jon could still be battle commander under her, as it's mainly men's work to slash swords. But it's clear to all now that he needs a strong adviser. This is very traditional mediaeval pairing a strong male fighter and a strategic female adviser.

 

[Adam141414]

Even the Republican party are paranoid about it. With Hillary as potential President, & Warren as VP, & Janet Yellen heading the Federal Reserve. They are on the look out for 'feminist bias' in entertainment. Remember how mental they went when George W Bush's head was mounted on a spike next to Ned Starks. 

[Stag_legion]

On 6/21/2016 at 1:37 AM, Kiwi said:

Arrows and blades sure miss him, but succession laws don't. At least we've never seen him dodge one.

Even if he somehow gets the proof of being Lyanna's son, he's still Lyanna's bastard son. Also Rheagar's bastard son. Making his claim to throne a stronger claim than his claim to North.

This would be true in the books, but the show doesn't really concern itself with this stuff anymore.

I m calling it now, Jon will be declared King in the north in the season finale this week.

[Kiwi]

3 hours ago, Stag_legion said:

This would be true in the books, but the show doesn't really concern itself with this stuff anymore.

I m calling it now, Jon will be declared King in the north in the season finale this week.

I'm gonna cry if that happens.

[LastManStanding]

21 hours ago, VVSINGOFTHECROSS said:

There never was a Queen of Bear Island due to the fact that it was never an independent kingdom, it belonged to the Ironborn and then the Starks.

 

Considering there were lords who witnessed that, it is something.

 

Sansa being married is a something, she was married to two traitorous and enemy houses. Why would anyone trust her?

They still had Lords and such. It was an example of how things change. Not an abstract concept. Sansa was forced into both marriages. Being married previously doesn't mean that much. Being married also doesn't mean you lose trust in people. Insane logic. 

[VVSINGOFTHECROSS]

3 hours ago, LastManStanding said:

They still had Lords and such. It was an example of how things change. Not an abstract concept. Sansa was forced into both marriages. Being married previously doesn't mean that much. Being married also doesn't mean you lose trust in people. Insane logic. 

 

Welcome to feudal society. If she was once married to the enemy, and by their customs is supposed to be devoted to her husband, why would they trust her? Tbh, they missed a trick by not openly declaring for Rickon. Would've made it easier to gain support.

[website error]

On 6/20/2016 at 11:32 PM, robasp2 said:

Though Yara-Dany "Yay, we are sistas... women rule.. woohoo" was lame.

I'm pretty fine with women alliances. But for FVCKS sake I hope Dany does not form alliace with Ellaria. I hope Dorne is gone for ever.

Do not show "woman empowerment" by teaming up with a mad woman who killed their peaceful king or her pathetic bastards.

This!

The only thing I want to see of Dorne is the Sand Snakes being tortured to death while naked. If Cersei and Jamie were going to live/succeed there would be a reason to revisit Dorne. But the Lannisters (except for Tyrion) seem doomed. I just pray to the Seven that Septa Ulenna and the High Septon and Lancel meet entertaining and anatomically instructive deaths. Also, it's a dead cert that at some point we're going to see Ser Robert Strong's helm come off

[website error]

This show is not headed for a feminist conspiracy, a conspiracy is hidden. Rather, Dany, Yara, Sansa, Arya and Meera are going to have roles in the Big Battle (personally I hope Sansa learns to swing a sword!). Jon is one of the greatest sword fighters in Planetos. Thormund, Daario, and don't forget Jorah, these are all badasses and they'll get a chance to show it.

There needs to be some sort of female counterpart for Bran. That is, the ultimate power that chose him to get the visions etc. can't be an exclusively male power. I'm not talking love here. Maybe Meera turns out to be more than we've seen. After all, Benjen is pretty much a good wight at this point.

The show will do something the books won't do - put women up front in a horse opera. Something will come up that only a woman will be able to do.

[Dragonslack]

It's just winks to sjw as is in fashion. Quite simply feminism let us call it that sells. If they dont do it the reviews and forums start whining immediately.

As for the north they can do whatever they want like when they made Robb king and Jon is his heir by royal declaration.

[Leticia Stark]

16 hours ago, Stag_legion said:

This would be true in the books, but the show doesn't really concern itself with this stuff anymore.

I m calling it now, Jon will be declared King in the north in the season finale this week.

Jon will be king in the north for sure, they even foreshadow in the last episode with that conversation between Davos and Tormund where they say Jon is better than Mance and Stannis because he's no king. The irony.

[Stag_legion]

7 minutes ago, Leticia Stark said:

Jon will be king in the north for sure, they even foreshadow in the last episode with that conversation between Davos and Tormund where they say Jon is better than Mance and Stannis because he's no king. The irony.

Yeah according to D&D everyone except Jon, Dany and Tyrion sucks, and everyone should be on their knees worshiping the three. Jon's divinity was probably why no arrow dared approach him in the last episode.

[Leticia Stark]

2 minutes ago, Stag_legion said:

Yeah according to D&D everyone except Jon, Dany and Tyrion sucks, and everyone should be on their knees worshiping the three. Jon's divinity was probably why no arrow dared approach him in the last episode.

Well, Melisandre said that the Lord of Light brought him back for a reason, so he was probably protecting him during the battle lmao

[Stag_legion]

There is no feminist conspiracy in the show, its just some tokenistic girl power scenes whichare not only unbelievable and out of no where, but its also still pretty sexist because it potrays supposed "feminsim" as women show being mean and aggressive. There is a difference between being assertive and not letting others push you around (which is real feminism), and bullying other people which D&D think is feminism. The show is still full sexist material in spite of all of this.

[Kiwi]

11 hours ago, Stag_legion said:

There is no feminist conspiracy in the show, its just some tokenistic girl power scenes whichare not only unbelievable and out of no where, but its also still pretty sexist because it potrays supposed "feminsim" as women show being mean and aggressive. There is a difference between being assertive and not letting others push you around (which is real feminism), and bullying other people which D&D think is feminism. The show is still full sexist material in spite of all of this.

I hope you're talking about Dorne here, because otherwise I really don't see how this relates to the topic.

[robasp2]

On 6/23/2016 at 3:36 AM, LadyAlisande said:

First of all, men can be feminists, and not all women are feminists. So your thread title doesn't jive with your content; a feminist alliance wouldn't necessarily be an all-women alliance.

Second, Dany doesn't ally with Yara just because she's a woman. It's a net benefit, but ultimately it's what Yara and Theon, and also Tyrion, have to say that convinces Dany it's the right move. Yara standing there flirting without a bunch of ships in the harbor and a promise that the Iron Islands will join the Seven Kingdoms and all the other elements of the deal, doesn't get the deal. 

I do think you're on to something that Dany will never marry a man or have any more children. She's a Queen Elizabeth I type now, she can see how a marriage alliance would only weaken her, and she won't bother. Nor does she have to, because she is strong enough without having to sell herself to any man. 

Will she also ally with Sansa, should Sansa become Lady of Winterfell; with the Sandsnakes if they become legit rulers of Dorne; with the Queen of Thorns after her family is burned to death in Cersei's finale explosions? Yes, probably. These are allies that she has a lot in common with, besides the fact that they're women; they're all super anti-Lannister, for one. So it may end up being an alliance between strong female rulers...which doesn't necessarily make it a feminist alliance, though you could certainly argue that all those women are feminists in some form.

I dont agree with the feminist garbage thrown out there. To me feminism is women seeking equality and in many cases superiority. But they never care of inequalities men face. So..one sided. I dont care what the word meant when it started, but I judge it by what it means now.. I prefer equalist..

Anyway, its my opinion, I aint gonna change it. Lets peacefully ignore that.

The part I agree with you is that Dany didnt agree with her just because she was a woman. Its because Dany believed every kingdom was free as long as they followed some basic set of rules. Even Yara had to compromise. It was just a coincidence that the good leader was a woman and the bad leader was Euron, a crazy cruel man.

Without the above said I would have been very much disappointed. Just thrown in the face to compensate for S05E07. But this I liked. Possibly the 2nd time I ever rooted for Dany (first being abolishing  slavery)

So yeah, it was NOT a "feminist conspiracy".

PS: But again, cmon... The girls who usurp the Dorne throne and kill family (no different than Ransey) are supposed to be leaders. No..I hope Dany chops them off "one finger at a time"