pixelchild Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 does not showing the battle diminish your overall enjoyment of the show? do you feel like it needed it to sustain a segment of the viewership's interest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tourniquet Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 does not showing the battle diminish your overall enjoyment of the show? do you feel like it needed it to sustain a segment of the viewership's interest?I wish they showed Jaimie's capture in the WW.I'm glad they changed the show to not have Tyrion take part in the battle as that never sat well with me.I think it did diminish the purpose of putting the texts on screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferthepoet Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Unfortunately yes, I think lots of people, specially non readers where expecting more action and may lost interest if they find out they are not getting any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SergioCQH Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 The lack of battles does not affect non-readers at all because they have no expectations. I've only heard that complaint from book readers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ingsve Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Hopefully it can change for season 2 when they are going from having just a couple CGI artists to having a team of over 20. I think part of the reason they skipped it is also that the details of these fights aren't really that important so it would be just for visual reasons they would ever show it and at this point it wasn't worth it. In season two you have more elements that are important to show for plot reasons on the Blackwater, like the effect of the wildfire and Tyrions chain and Tyrion almost getting ganked by the Kingsguard etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robb_ Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I don't think so. I think the majority of people that hadn't read the book will have tuned in just to see what the show was about, and if they've stuck around for the first 8 episodes which have had no battles then they are obviously interested in the story, and not showing a battle isn't going to disinterest them from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Island Daughter Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I can't speak for others, but for myself I can say this actually makes me enjoy it more. I've gotten to the age where I fast-forward whenever battle-scenes appear in tv/movies, because usually nothing in the specifics of the battle advance the plot. Just a lot of shaky camera and actors jumping around. To GoT credit, the few fight/battle scenes they have shown so far have been riveting and felt plot-relevant, so I couldn't be more delighted with their handling of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The King of Ashes Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I think it's definitely gonna put people off, and rightly so. If I wasn't such a fan of the books, I'd be really annoyed considering even Camelot has tried to put in convincing battle scenes. What really bothers me is the lazy way they dealt with it all, I would never expect them to film the whole of the Green Fork clash but just a couple of minutes of battle before Tyrion was knocked out would be more than fine. Also, it wouldn't be expensive in the slightest to film Jaime cutting down Stark bannerman in the Whispering Wood before being captured. I just wasn't a fan of the direction they went with it. If you're not gonna use the visual medium of television to it's fullest, why not just leave the series as books? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frey Pentos Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 The disappointing thing was that we didn't see or get a good description of the execution of Robb's battle plan. A plan which outwits Tywin and captures Jaime. We didn't get to see his tactical brilliance nor the reason why he left the Lannister scout go free in the previous episode. Clunky storytelling imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I don't think so. I think the majority of people that hadn't read the book will have tuned in just to see what the show was about, and if they've stuck around for the first 8 episodes which have had no battles then they are obviously interested in the story, and not showing a battle isn't going to disinterest them from it.Agreed 100%. The characters are the drawing factor, not the battles.The disappointing thing was that we didn't see or get a good description of the execution of Robb's battle plan. A plan which outwits Tywin and captures Jaime. We didn't get to see his tactical brilliance nor the reason why he left the Lannister scout go free in the previous episode. Clunky storytelling imo.Is that a critique of the HBO show, or GRRM's novel? Because it applies to both... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asharak Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 After the build up of the conflict between the Lanisters and the Starks for 8 episodes, and hearing constantly about the threat of a possible war, it really felt like a cheat that they simply decided to skip the climax of the main conflict in s1. It feels very unsatisfying to have so many episodes of build up, and then skip the event that was built up to.What hurt the most was that my expectations were built up from this entry in the FAQ at www.winter.is-coming.net:"...The show runners have confirmed this approach, saying that while the battle scenes cannot be comparable to those in Lord of the Rings, they will not be taken as lightly as the ones in the first season of Rome, and we should be pleased by the looks..."This gave me the expectation that we would get to see a satisfying amount of the battles, but instead they did it exactly like s1 of Rome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenophon Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I doubt it will affect viewership at all in terms of losing current viewers. If you're still watching the show at this point, you're going to keep watching regardless of battles. There might be some potential viewers who didn't like the show, but would be drawn in by good battles, but I doubt that's a large group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talleyrand Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I'm not dissapointed, as others have said non book readers have not stuck with it for the hope of a battle, that being said i wouldn't turn down a battle scene. IMO the way the whispering wood is done in the book would be a great way to show it on the screen. But i'd rather them not risk it than come out like half the stupid battle scenes that Tv shows try and do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr. peasant Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 The disappointing thing was that we didn't see or get a good description of the execution of Robb's battle plan. A plan which outwits Tywin and captures Jaime. We didn't get to see his tactical brilliance nor the reason why he left the Lannister scout go free in the previous episode. Clunky storytelling imo.It was spelled out quite well, I thought. The previous episode had Robb telling the spy to send word that his 20,000 men were marching for him; when he instead only send 2,000 while the other 18,000 went after Jaime.As for the lack of battles affecting viewership, those who started watching the show expecting 'Lord of the Rings' the TV series would have long since been converted or given up in confusion over the intricacy of the politics; which is the main draw. For those watching the show for what it is (court intrigue), the battle scenes are simply bonuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julandro Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Come to think of it, deserved to see the battle scenes. Have bothered to put the scene of Tyrion and the prostitute. If HBO wants more espectadoros should throw more fireworks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
So1ar Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 i doubt it will affect viewership. if anything ned dying will affect viewership. but like i said in another thread, if they wanted to go this route(not showing the battles) there were several other ways to do it instead of it coming across rather rushed and chaotic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus Adler Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I cannot approve of skipping the entire battle scene for both Tyrion and Robb's debuts as martial leaders. Even a short, under-budget battle would have been better than nothing. If the battles had been done very badly, I'd have said "the battles were a little disappointing, but the episode was still very good." With no portrayal of the battles at all, however, I have to say the episode was one of the biggest disappointments of the entire series, since dragging out the over-done arguments and "drinking game" scene weren't really necessary. The drinking scene was too long (and by far too awkward) and the scenes with the Dothraki were a bit too long as well. The episode had its high points (we finally see Jorah's strength and Walder's characteristics) but those attributes alone do not justify the underdevelopment of Robb and Tyrion. A friend of mine said it best: "In the books, I liked Tyrion more than almost all of the other characters. In the television series, I by far like Bronn better. Peter Dinklage does a great job of portraying Tyrion, but he has far less material to work with. Bronn has more action, better lines, and better overall material. Compared to the books, Tyrion is underdeveloped." And I have to agree -- the battle in the Mountains of the moon is supposed to be Tyrion's first trail at arms. With the wildmen, he is green, but struggles tremendously and shows his valour. By the time we reach the Blackwater, he is no longer green -- he merely has his small stature to overcome, which in itself makes him a more likeable character because, in spite of that stature, he manages to accomplish something. Instead we limit Tyrion to a single moment where he is wounded, instantly, and otherwise avoids the struggles that we watch him overcome in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hyper Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 I cannot approve of skipping the entire battle scene for both Tyrion and Robb's debuts as martial leaders. Even a short, under-budget battle would have been better than nothing. If the battles had been done very badly, I'd have said "the battles were a little disappointing, but the episode was still very good." With no portrayal of the battles at all, however, I have to say the episode was one of the biggest disappointments of the entire series, since dragging out the over-done arguments and "drinking game" scene weren't really necessary.I'm sorry, but I find that hard to believe. A short poorly done battle would have just elicited this common response: "If they can't do it right, they should just skip the battle". It's a clear no-win scenario for them. "Damned if you do, damned if you don't". :read:That being said, I do hope we see more in season 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shouldbedoingsomethingelse Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 does not showing the battle diminish your overall enjoyment of the show? do you feel like it needed it to sustain a segment of the viewership's interest?as a non-reader, who only knows the series via the tv show, i thought how the battle was covered, by just the beginning and the ending, was quite clever--there is only an hour in each episode and there is a lot to cover with a lot of different characters and locations.rob's genius with regards to letting the spy go and then splitting the troops into a small diversionary group and a large group that captures jaime was very clear and well done i thought. i have never read the books and had no idea what he did or why until the end of the episode, but it was clear and effective. HBO viewers are not your normal tv viewer;, we are used to subtlty and complexity. you don't have to hit us over the head with the laugh tracks and explanation that people who watch two and half men and american idol need. also, there is usually little value story-wise to depicting massive battles on tv (or in movies for that matter)--even in band of brothers and the pacific, the battlefield imagery was limited to what was necessary to depict what the men where going through. hbo has lot of experience doing this, i don't think you need to worry that it will be done well (though you will probably be unhappy because it won't be exactly like the book).regarding ned, i don't understand why you all think we'd abandon a show just because a key character dies. john goodman's character on treme committed suicide last season and the show is still doing well(it's my favorite on the hbo right now). i was more shocked by ned giving a false confession, than his being beheaded for treason (it doesn't appear, for all the talk that this land is based on medieval england, that they have acts of attainder in westeros, or ned would never have confessed to treason and attainted his blood). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Anti-Targ Posted June 13, 2011 Share Posted June 13, 2011 Although I wanted to see some battle action in Ep9 I can totally see why they didn;t go to the expense. GoT was an unknown quantity so they needed to keep production costs within reasonable limits. Battle scenes are a time luxury in that they soak up time without necessarily moving the story forward a great deal (unless someone important dies). They add to the overall quality of a show and they are definitely nice to have time and money permitting.So for season 1 I can accept them not showing either of the 2 battles. For season 2 I expect them to be a bit more generous in terms of budget (they know the level of popularity, and DVD/Blu-ray sales will also provide them with both income and indications of how much audience carry forward there will be), and with slightly less character development needed they can be a tad bit more extravagant with time. Battle of the Blackwater Rush is going to be gimped no doubt, but they can't do away with it entirely and only have people talk about it before and after.The good thing about the climatic battle in CoK is that it is much more amenable to reasonable cost CGI, because CGI ships and flames are much easier to do than CGI people/horses. Distance shots in that battle can be just ships. Close quarters can be really close up which means no need for expansive sets and expensive CGI...and no direwolves.So despite my qualified disappointment in this season I have qualified hopes for Season 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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