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Vanadis

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About Vanadis

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  1. Wow. ... I just wish to say that I wholeheartedly support any actor on this show who ever comes out and says that they didn't quite understand their own character. To me it's a sign of intelligence. And I would be very surprised if Emilia was the only one.
  2. Well, my argument is that at some point they moved from a character orientated story to plot oriented story, and that the characters (not just Dany) became bleak shadows of themselves in the process.
  3. And I think you are mistaken, if I may be so bold. I think those people who point out that this is not consistent with all her traits, are correct, and that those like you who say the show proved that they were wrong all along, are wrong. All the show proved was that they stopped caring about who characters are and forced the plot forward, whether it made sense or not. It saddens me that people use this ending to say "I told you so" to Dany supporters, and I wasn't even a big Dany supporter. (But I like to think I "support" all the characters.)
  4. All this tells me is that some people are unable to see Dany's warmth. I guess the show didn't get across that point about her character across very well, then. They seem to have failed in portraying her as a complex, believable person to some people, as opposed to a standard fantasy villain. But, they did so many mistakes, so this is not a surprise.
  5. I don't know, this sounds to me like exactly what good story tellers should try to avoid. Don't force morals down people's throats. It's not why we gathered to watch Game of Thrones.
  6. Yes, they should have shown her perspective during the slaughter as well as the perspective of the innocents she killed. Because she lost a struggle, and we needed to see it. They could have shown her face first horrified at having made that decision, then more and more determined. Or something else. But it needed to be there. Of course, in addition to the ground perspective. But I strongly disagree that most viewers were oblivious. It's not about that. It's about whether or not the story had done what it took to deserve that turn. And they hadn't. Like I said in a different post: Compare it with Oberyn. The story deserved to let him die because they showed how a character trait that seemed to be a strength, confidence, also became a weakness. They had not introduced a different character trait, alertness, to be an opposition to the first trait, and so, we did not ask "Why wasn't he more aware of the Mountain on the ground?" They have introduced the character trait "warm" in Dany, in opposition to "ruthless". Then they want to show ruthless turning into cruel. And that setup just doesn't work. Dany's change is not implausible, but in that moment it was improbable. But, like I've said before, they could have made it work.
  7. Varys was one of the many people who tried to kill Dany, as in using violence, in order to reach a goal. So in that case, the message is: Violence is okay as long as you're right and they are wrong. (I'm fairly certain he was about to try to poison Dany at the end, I'm disappointed that they didn't make that more clear.) Varys was also one of the many people who seemed to change their minds about things without us going through a process with the character to see why on earth they changed their minds. He worked to put Dany's brother on the throne in the beginning. We could have seen Varys slowly learning that this was not the right way, to see true anguish. Some awesome scenes of real inner drama. What a waste of a potentially interesting character.
  8. I think Game of Thrones first few seasons is something entirely different than Game of Thrones last few seasons. The last few seasons is Game of Thrones turned into Narnia with the Ice Queen (only with dragons and fire) as the final boss. Then the heroes get their happy Narnia ending, going on new adventures or becoming king and queen. The show may say it wants us to question Dany, as an explanation of why it so abruptly shifted gear, but it actually does not really want us to question anything at all. It all turned out to be a children's fairy tale after all.
  9. Well, it's not a matter of whether or not they showed the result of her destruction. It's good that they did. The reason for the criticism is that this was the first time they showed her losing the struggle between the ruthless side of her and the goodhearted side. And *that* is the story they were telling in that moment. It's certainly a story worthy of being told. They should not have cut that part out. But even more than that, they should have shown the struggle a long time before. How it affected her. How it affected people around her. They should even have had conversations about this. Dany should have said: I'm afraid of what I'm becoming. Am I wrong? Like Jon did. Only her saying it would have given the question a real impact. There could have been so many good scenes and twists and turns because of her struggle. But they saved it until the very end. What a wasted opportunity of a potentially interesting character.
  10. We will have to agree to disagree To me, it seems like we started watching a complex GRR Martin story and finished watching a fairytale for kids... And in the shift, all the characters suffered. I'm so grateful to the actors though who truly stuck with it to the end and gave excellent performances.
  11. Killed Olly. I don't think it subverted expectations, it just felt cheap. I think the problem is with how they tell stories, at least in the last few seasons. They try to hide who characters are, or give us reason to believe that other character traits are stronger, so that they can reveal the true nature of the character in a surprise moment. I feel the last seasons are full of that type of storytelling. An example of this: Jon says he wants to support Dany even after the horrors she has brought. Tyrion has a long speech about why killing her is the right thing to do. When Jon leaves, he says something about how she is the queen or some such thing. Why? To attempt to hide his intention from the viewer. When he goes to meet Daenerys, we are supposed to think that he will not kill her after all, since she is his queen. Then he takes her in his arms and repeats that she is is queen. And only then does he stab her. I would have preferred that they didn't try to hide his intention. Don't hide who he is until the very last moment. It would have been much better if he had walked into Tyrion's cell and started the conversation saying "Tyrion, I know what I have to do but I don't know if I can do it." We don't need surprises. Gods, it's as if surprises is the only tool in the storytellers' toolbox.
  12. The finger should be pointed at everyone, but in my eyes they failed to do that. What's more, there should not only be finger pointing, the resolution should be complex and not simplified. It's called a Song of Ice and Fire but it shouldn't be reduced into a Tale of Black and White. And what's more, I thought one of the concepts of Game of Thrones was that the person with the biggest physical force not necessarily is the most powerful person anyway - as seen by the whole concept of a "game". Who knows what, and why, and where, and how, and how they influence each other, that used to be the foundation for all the stories in Game of Thrones. What we have now, is a very simplified story: "Dany is the most powerful by physical means, so let's turn her into the Ice Queen from Narnia, only with fire, and let's have Jon fall in love with her because it worked so well with Edmund."
  13. Sure. But so did everyone else's ruthlessness. In the last scene, they could have swapped Dany with any other character - Tyrion, Arya, even Jon - and we would have had the same discussion about them. "Yes we cheered on Tyrion when he was ruthless, even though it was disturbing, but come on, the Tyrion I have come to know would not have murdered thousands of innocents after the city surrendered." "Oh? What about that time he threatened everybody at his trial?" Etc. In other words, singling Dany out in order to make a moral point seems random. A story just shouldn't be random.
  14. I skimmed through some posts from years back, from the episode when Ned was beheaded. It was fun. Most people seemed to love the episode, but some were so pissed that there had been no battles the whole season that they seemed ready to quit the show. I didn't spend much time reading the posts, but I didn't see any complaints about the writing. It was very refreshing.
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